What charachter should be the STAR of the movie?

[Syvan]

I agree the star should be a vagabond. But towards the end you find out the vagabond is actuallly a hatchling dragon - a true Rifts twist where anything can happen!

[Kagashi]

Yeah,

A juicer should be in the movie to be the big bad @ss, like Darth Maul was in TPM, but thats not a good canadate OCC to be the main character.

Depending on if its through the eyes of what super powered nation, I would say a LLW or even some kind of CS dude to be the main character. you have to keep it simple for the Non-Rifts fans who will go see the movie just cause it looks like a good action flick. Kinda like how Resident Evil was done. I have never played the game, but I liked the movies cause i could follow along with it and I did not have to know everything about it in order to enjoy the movie. Im sure the game goes into mountians more detail that Resident Evil fans are super critical about the movies, just like we will be when the Rifts movies come out.

[Agent_gir]

If the star of the movie is erin tran I'll refuse to watch it... I hate her so much

[Immortalis]

I think the first rifts movie should be about....

Julian Amici

Thats right, the famed juicer assassin who puts James Bond to shame. It would be like a crazy futuristic action packed thriller where Julian can explain things about stuff as he has to try and defeat or avoid them in pursuit of his mark. Not to mention the special effects you could fit for that would be delicious.

Anybody see Cowboy Bebop? The Bloody-Eye effect but in full real time. Newer level of Matrix fun, everybody moving in slow motion cept the Juicer has full freedom.[/u]

[Gazirra]

How about a guy dressed in the Boba Fett armor, a cyber-knight, and a shiny golden android? ^_^

[Toc Rat]

How about a guy dressed in the Boba Fett armor, a cyber-knight, and a shiny golden android? ^_^

The Lucas Thought and Copyright Police would be all over that!

[Gallahan]

- A fallen cyberknight who regains his honor
- One of the daughters of a royal family betrayed and left for dead in a fierce power play
- A mercenary pilot with no real cause for anything but wealth
- A dogboy
- A young coalition soldier who realizes he's on the wrong side
- A chef/bard who always seems to save the day and has profound insight

[Overlord Rikonius]

- A fallen cyberknight who regains his honor
- One of the daughters of a royal family betrayed and left for dead in a fierce power play
- A mercenary pilot with no real cause for anything but wealth
- A dogboy
- A young coalition soldier who realizes he's on the wrong side
- A chef/bard who always seems to save the day and has profound insight

Only if the latter is played by Isaac Hayes

[bar1scorpio]

I think the Glitter Boys are predominatnly what audiences would be able to identify with. Juicers? You got the problem with drug use for combat purposes.

Truth is, you'd have to find some way to intro the "party system" add a cyborg & pilots or such.

[Gallahan]

Who on Rifts Earth is Isaac Hayes?

[Razzinold]

I think that a cool main character would be a pis-slinger. Human enough for people to relate to, but still a little different. Or possible a Cosmo Knight or any juicer, that why NPC's watching the movie would just think of them as "super heroes" A GB would be neat but most people don't like "robots", for those of you old enough (like me) reminds people too much of the old movies of guys in suits waling around cardboard buildings. Plus some people just plain don't like them. I know people who play Rifts and still hate Cyborgs and Robots. The other problem is you can't make the character too "normal", once you combine that with the old "post apocalyptic setting", it might come off as a Mad Max ripoff, with better effects. Once again, in my opinion if your movie is going to look like a Ripoff at least it would look like it's ripping off a good movie.

[dbh1973]

I think Erin Tarn, played by Dame Judi Dench and her awesome British accent, would be an excellent main character for the movie.

I agree that a Glitter Boy should also be involved in the main plot. A burser would be a cool character. And just think, what kind of cool effects they could come up with an Antlantean Tattoo Warrior?

I wonder if Peter Jackson is available after Kong....

[finn69]

how about a techno-wizard? Psi-Stalker and dog pack? how about a shifter for the villian?

[kdyal]

Main party:
- Dog boy and Coalition Psi-Stalker gone rogue
- Aging juicer (obviously dying - at the end of his life expectancy)
- Glitter Boy
- Mind Melter or Burster
- TW
- Baby dragon
- Crazy

Who's the main character? That I haven't figured out yet...

[Captain Shiva]

I would personally like to see Colonel Larsen be the main character,ideally played by Bruce Willis.

[Capt. Meschievitz]

Yeah Bruce Willis but has a commander in the ISS or CS...

Ray Park as a Juicer...the Psyko Stalker from hell

[Display-Name-Alpha]

as a main story focus, id like to see some kind of high action person, preferrably like a battle mage. Or something like Nexus Knight... possibly a Cyberknight. A Juicer would be Ideal becasue of the gruff actiony nature. But id like to see some heavy magic combat.

[Wild Card]

I don't know about Larsen, Erin, Prosek and them, I mean the movies should be about nobodies who are sought after by both sides of the real problem coming. The oncoming invasion of the Xiticx that is going to be coming soon.

Possibly make the movie set in the the Chaos Earth setting.... The founding of the Silver Eagle and Chromium Guardsman. The battle of NEMA vs. The World Slayers.

Of course I would personally like a Gunslinger from the New West... who gets arrested by the CS and proceeds to give them hell.

There are just to many possibilities. I just look forward to it as long is it isn't another D&D movie failure....

[bensattva]

[quote="Beatleguise"]A Wilderness Scout as the main character, as a wanderer he would be perfect. His travels would make it easy to show many aspects of the RIFTS world.

Obviously he would have some companions, or pick them up along the way. A Cyber Knight, A Ley-Line Walker, A Borg.

A Necromancer or Elementalist as a bad guy with a main henchmen Juicer.
[\quote]

I'd tweek this jst a tad and use a CS Ranger instead of a Wilderness Scout. They're virtually the same but you could play that out with reports to the Coalition that build character development of this main character through his views of/dealings with the people he encounters and has to work with to accomplish his reconaissance mission vs. his sentiment toward the CS anti-DBee policy and his duty to make reports to higher about the area he or his team is scouting. That's just a small taste..Just like the game there truly are endless possibilities.

I'd really like to see the focus be on a more "regular joe" type of character though. Definitely something that someone could identify with. Nothing too outrageous for the lead but definitely LOTS of out of this world things happening to that character.

A Chaos Earth setting would end up a lot like War of the Worlds IMO. Lot's of random catastrophic damage with little storyline to go with it.(Only this time the invaders don't die at the end

This really has great cinimatic possibilities and I really hope that it's done right and it appeals to more than just us hardcore fans of the actual game at the box office. No matter what I'm gonna be seein it

[Alpha 11]

Ya, that would be cool. Or like some others have said, and the person finds a Glitter Boy. Now that would be cool too! But also a must, there has to be one big battle, with magic, and tech. going all over the place. In that senting, I would want the main charactor in a Glitter Boy with the Boom Gun BOOMING .

[Captain Shiva]

how about Ian McKellen as Emperor Prosek?

[Tricky]

The guy that was Shaun's stepdad in Shaun of the dead, and the head Vamp in Underworld, would make a great Emperor Proseck.

And, not to beat a dead TW horse, your main character is gonna have to be someone whom the audience can learn about the Rifts world through and identify with. So City Rat, young rogue scholar, Cyber-knight apprentice (might be too 'AotC for Lucas's legal team), and maybe a young CS grunt.

[Lagos]

Personally i think it should follow the story of some Vanguard Member, having to fight the darkest parts of evil that are flung at them while at the same time defending a people that hate them beyond all other aspects and reasoning. But theres always the fun idea of some teen getting rifted from a peaceful dimension and time and dropped into the nightmare of Rifts and seeing the violence from the middle and not knowing which side and thorugh some hollywood mogic unites the masses and peace shall reign ...sounds cheesy.

[SoulofThunder]

The guy that was Shaun's stepdad in Shaun of the dead, and the head Vamp in Underworld, would make a great Emperor Proseck.

And, not to beat a dead TW horse, your main character is gonna have to be someone whom the audience can learn about the Rifts world through and identify with. So City Rat, young rogue scholar, Cyber-knight apprentice (might be too 'AotC for Lucas's legal team), and maybe a young CS grunt.

he already played a vampire lord in Underworld , but its still a good casting choice. too bad someone beat ya to it.

[SoulofThunder]

i agree with a juicer concept. the character would have to be a juicer for some sacrificial reason though. for her family (not revenge, overdone) . perhaps joining a militia to get money for some greedy mage to heal the disease of her 6 year old brother. thats half of a movie right there.

the kid that becomes a hero is too star warsy and should be avoided for atleast 20 years. especially one that would become a cyberknight.

[Gridlock]

Me and my frined belive that it should be like saving private ryan or enemy at the gates,because thats all that rifts is, its just military conflict, as my frined said "there is no ultimate hero" its all about who can smash the other into the ground faster. so it should be a war and nothing but all out war, none of this love crap they have been putting in recent movies. just get to the killing, have it be the CS against the CCWor why not make it interplanatary war, or something like CCW and TE or something like that, just make it brutal and awesome, AND MAKE SURE THAT THE HUMANS DONT COME OUT VICTORIOUS, come on man, i mean humans defeating kreeghor, and wolfen, i mean jesus, at least make alot of humans die before one kreeghor goes down.

there that is my response on the movie, hope my input helps you think of something to do it on

[runebeo]

I loved the novels that came out. They cover the basics and get things rolling good. Add some more creatures & rifts to show the limitless possibilities of Rifts Earth. A pack of wild vampires are a must.

[runebeo]

How cool would the cover of rifts core book be on a movie poster. Life sized on the theater thats my dream.

[VenomousDuck]

1 word....Crazy. That's what I want to see. Some nut job who wets himself whenever someone shoots a gun.

[runebeo]

A CS Squad commander and a cyber knight. Two sides with bolth changing their views on D-bees, magic and coalition.

[Justin Time]

This is Rifts, it supposed to be limited by your imagination. There in lies the problem of making a movie about it. IMHO Bruckheimer should take a risk and film and release 2 movies simultaneously. One with a LLW or mystic as star and one from the point of view of CS Grunt.
Could be 2 Brothers separated at birth.
I would make the love interest of the non-cs brother a cyber knight.
Have the story take place in the backdrop of the invasion of Tolkeen.
Eventually have 2 trilogies. It would be interesting to have the 2 movies "compete" against each other at the box office.
Just an idea.

[Madcat1138]

You wouldn't need two seperate films to present a broad view of Rifts Earth. If the script is handled properly then you could simply have two groups, say a Lazlo expedition and a CS special forces team both going after some recently unearthed Pre-Rift facility wherein lies some acient terror. If the film is given a decent enough running time and there isnt alot of time wasted trying to show eye candy then you could get to the heart of the charecters ideals and beliefs and allow the viewer to decide who is the good guy and who is the bad guy.

Two movies with a CS and Magic good guy doesnt really challenge the viewer to make a choice between ideals. A well done Rifts film should be able to challenge a viewer on subjects like racism, political choices and war while still being able to deliver an entertaining and visualy stunning peice of film work.

[Immortalis]

I have to say it again, the original Julian Amici.

People are not going to see the Rifts movie to learn about RIFTS, theres no need to try and draw them in and explain everything. No, it would be far more fun to simply have a movie about a specific character and their piece of the world. There could be many movies made focusing on different areas and conflicts. Thing is, in order for that to happen the first needs to be succesful... to do that I think they need to capitalize on one of the few really amazingly unique concepts; ie the Juicer. The only other character anyone has probably heard of with similar traits is perhaps Bane, from DC comics.

A high tech computer controlled drug dispenser that delivers super chemicals anytime their needed to make the juicer into a super-soldier of astounding ability in an instant. If anyone has read that story in Juicer uprising describing the juice kicking in and the world slowing to a crawl as the Juicer can count the hairs on his opponents face and still have time to slash his throat if he so wanted to... thats awesome!

The effects have already been pioneered in the Matrix, it would be a really awesome way to use some of those really great effects and action sequences without seeming like just a cheap rip-off. At the same time, we have a hero who know's he's going to die and yet here he is working against the coalition. Trying to assassinate key officials in order to free the d-bees from their oppression.

Trying to make some elaborate random average person in rifts into the hero of the story is just going to waste a lot of time on introductions and explaining things... instead of just showing a juicer and his abilities kicking asses. He'll pick up some companions and they can explain about a few things while the Juicer owns them.

[Capt. Meschievitz]

I'd have to say a SAMAS pilot that, partway through the movie, starts having questions about the way things are. I'd limit Emperor Prosek to one, maybe two screen appearances max, and neither of them very long. Just long enough to give the audience a feel of what a diabolical, evil SOB he really is. Maybe the first scene being where he gives a speech at said pilot's graduation? Then one more about midway through.

This also would be a bad ass plot, or even a CS Army Special Forces Soldier

thats not a bad call Col., However make him more well it's a nessecery evil that he must do towards the end of the movie, I would say make so the world ends off where it started off but a slightly different angle on life.. something is different....

[beatobur]

I think the main character should be a burster. I think it should be someone who otherwise is normal, but something awful happens to their community (by the CS or anyone else) and he or she survives through their awesome pyrokinetic abilities. And then have the character deal with and learn how to use their abilities whether with the Coalition Psi-Squad, a group of normal adventurers, or Psyscape I think it'd be great.

[TechnoGothic]

The Star should be a Glitterboy Pilot for many reasons. It is what inspired RIFTS afterall.

A Man, a Down and Out sort (Might be a vagabond) used to be a Glitterboy Pilot. He lost his GB in a battle years ago trying to defend a village from Demons or the CS (either would work).
He gets involved with Merc Soldier, a Robot Vehicle Pilot and a few eggheads types.

Towards the end of the movie they come across a place with a "new" Glitterboy in storage. For whatever reason he has not told them about his old life...(he might be ashamed of his failure).
The Group is attacked by whoever...
...Just when it seems they are lost the GB Pilot jumps into the GB and tears up the enemy. The RV Pilot can comment on how it requires special training to use one of those like that...We see the GB doing very cinematic attacks (Jump Kicks, Puches, and Thows). Then when the close enemies are taken out, the GB Pilot diggs in and Fires the Boomgun, tearing into the enemy at a distance over and over again. When he stops shooting the BG is red Hot but cools fast...
At least one arm on the GB should look torn up though after the battle...

[Lenwen]

In my honest opinion think about it Rifts came into being with multiple things that happened all over the world at precise moments in time all in sync .. Let the comming of the rifts itself be the Very star of the movie first an formost like the storm in day after tomarrow .. only instead of rescueing peeps after its burned out simply bring on the various demons show for instance HOW splynncryth took over atlantis hell show how atlantis came back lol how sweet would that be not to mention the complete reshaping of the entire world new coastlines all across the world the huge rift that bonded with the St. Louis Gate ? Show the comming of the /xitixic beings .. this would open a whole new side story lol just my two Cp's .
-Lenwen.

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

Cyber-knight.

Played by Eric Bana

villain-Necromancer or Shifter

Played by Christopher Walken

Omhwtfbbq i love you so much for that. but better, christopher walken as emporer prosek

[Rathorc Lemenger]

Well, let's see here. Character wise: Definantly our Favorite woman of all Rift time, Erin Tarn (played by the actress that played the elemental woman in Chronicles of Riddick). Or for a male: Victor Lazlo played by Tom Hanks.

Signed,
Rathorc Lemenger.

[Lenwen]

I would actually make the various events leading up to the actual tearing of the space/time continuem happen in the first several minutes of the movie an then show the actual rifts Flaring from one of the orbiting space stations an then show it as it is just as the world book 1 begins . The Slow rise of humans out of the darkness an then Show CS Chi Town , as a backdrop with some words.. couple hundred years later ... some dramatic way/fashion to show that magic an psionic's are now very much REAL in this world with out givin to much away . Perhaps like a CS squad fighting a tolkeen grp (remember this is before the Siege on Tolkeen) I wouldent show the stars of the show untill like a solid 15 to 20 minutes into the show . I personally would make the Splugorthian Slavers the first arch enemy simply because when you think of rifts .. the VERY first thing you ever seen from thier books was exactly that . A Splugorthian Slaver . I would also make the Lead Good guy either a Rogue Scholar OR a Rogue Scientist . Juicer should definatly be a supporting Class as well as a Line Walker introduced later , and heh well lets just say I have a whole slew of idea's about the rifts movie . I just hope that this is an actually something that comes to fruition .

-Lenwen.

[Alpha 11]

There are too many great characters in rifts to pick just one!

I say go for an adventuring group that represents some of the best. Like this sort of thing...

Opening scene...

An attractive woman wearing dirty travellers clothes and a communications headband is anxiously and frantically hiding behind rocks/bushes etc in a wilderness type setting. In the back ground you hear a very subltle whooshing/whirring type sound. All of a sudden a big floating eyelor eye appears and stops, just above where the woman is hiding, it looks back and forth, then rushes back out of sight.

Then the slave barge enters the scene, complete with it's complement of warrior women, and stops.

Suddenly another eye of eyelor rushes past and catches sight of the woman hiding, and of course the barge springs into action!

The woman runs toward it, dodging magic and lasers blasts, and says into the the com-band "Now."

Just as she gets to the barge she metamorphs into a large fire dragon hatchling, takes a couple of direct laser blasts/tentacle strikes and attacks, one claw swipe sending an altara woman flying!

We switch to a scene of a full conversion borg complete with arm mounted mini-gun etc. running full speed through the woods/terrain, ignoring and smashing through whatever is in his way! He gets to the scene and comes to a stop from a 50mph run, tearing up terrain etc. and opens fire on the sploogie big time!!

Add 1 or 2 more characters into the scene, a magic user, and some kind of techie like a robot pilot ( show inside cockpit to differentiate from the cyborg) and you should have a good idea of what rifts is all about!

The coalition characters come in later in the movie, and of course interact with this first group to create the storyline.

I like the ideal. A nice diverse group of people, and any charactors they do have should stick to the main book just to keep things simple.

[Prince Artemis]

If you want to follow the standard fantasy formula, you need someone that knows very little of the outside world, so that the characters can explain to him (and through him, the audience) what is going on, who's who, ect. That's basically what they did with Luke Skywalker, and pretty much every successful fantasy/sci-fi. I suggest a city rat type of character. most of his or her skills would be easily decyphered by people now a days and he'd need things like magic and what not explained to him

[Alpha 11]

If you want to follow the standard fantasy formula, you need someone that knows very little of the outside world, so that the characters can explain to him (and through him, the audience) what is going on, who's who, ect. That's basically what they did with Luke Skywalker, and pretty much every successful fantasy/sci-fi. I suggest a city rat type of character. most of his or her skills would be easily decyphered by people now a days and he'd need things like magic and what not explained to him

Ya. That person, a mind melder or something along those lines, and the group above. That would make 6, and maybe a techno wizerd, for 7.

[Daikuma]

I still maintain that Rifts will not work very well as a single film. Too much backstory to be delivered correctly and still maintain a good flow. Even as a trilogy, Rifts is more diverse and character dense than LotR, and even as a classic of fantasy literature LotR took forever to get made correctly and budgeted right. Simply put: It's too damn big!

Now as a regular television series, Rifts has far more hope. The introduction of material can be metered, with recurring characters and story arcs that link whoever becomes the "main character" throughout the gaming world and eventually offworld and out of the dimension (if need be). In this concept, you can even take the direction that Heroes is heading in: series regulars that may indeed be killed in just about any episode, recurring guests (good and bad) that can act as both story protagonists/antagonists and sages, and the "library" of information that a viewership would need to appreciate a feature film a few seasons in.

The best analogy I can make is Star Trek: TNG. That product would never have worked with a single film start. Too many characters, too many new aliens, too much new technology, and to say nothing of backstory, even with just what connected TNG to the older series.

Now after 5 seasons of the show (or whatever it was) the audience was ready for a bigscreen adaptation, and as a result, the films (with the exception of Nemesis, I think) were fairly well received.

Similarly, if Rifts is first presented as a regular serial (TV show), then all of the backstory and characterization can be established early, and so when the product moves to the big screen (which I think it eventually should, don't get me wrong here) the audience has a lot more to work with, and perhaps characters that are developed enough to be delivered in a fluid and familiar way.

In the event it was played out more sensibly, with this type of a time frame and story evolution, then the main character could be anyone, but definitely a lesser powered being (A rogue scholoar is an obvious choice, but better still (IMHO) either an extradimensional human or very humanoid D-Bee, or someone time shifted in from our own time (Victor Lazlo, maybe?) traveling with a group of adventurers as they make their way through Rifts Earth, in search of wealth, glory, freedom, or simple survival or any combination thereof.

I especially like the idea of throwing in the group from Machinations of Doom as the companions of the main character, since they were so well put together in the first place (Kudos to Ramon Perez). Maybe an eventual guest shot of Caleb Vulcan from the Hammer of the Forge serial in the Rifter.

Oh, and while we're at it, set it about 3-4 years after the Seige on Tolkien storyline, so we can get "canon" out of the way and finally let the story of the world evolve a little more naturally [sorry KS, SoT just always felt a little "Forced" to me for a fluid gaming world, no offense...]

Scene openings could take place with a running narrative from a handheld digital copy of Erin Tarn's Guide to Planet Earth, explaining to the character (and the audience) what each new place is and what importance it has to the storyline. Then situations that arise and responses from the main characters have a context in which they can "live and breathe", as it were...

Ok, you may now burn me down with your fiery breath for my insolence.

Rolling! Sound is Up! Background! Action!

Daikuma
Filmmaker, Screenwriter, & Reluctant Actor
In the Shadow of the Writer's Strike
Los Angeles, CA




P.S.> Because Windrider asked so nicely...

What the bloody hell is a hot cake anyway, I've heard different descriptions....)

From Wikipedia:

Pancakes are a type of flatbread prepared from a sweet batter that is cooked on a hot griddle or in a frying pan. They exist in several variations in many different local cuisines. Most pancakes are quick breads, although some are also made using a yeast-raised or fermented batter.

American or Canadian pancakes contain a raising agent, usually baking powder, and contains different proportions of eggs, flour, and milk or buttermilk, which create a thick batter. Cinnamon and sugar can be added. This batter is either ladled or poured onto a hot surface, and spreads to form a circle about ¼ or ⅓ inch (1 cm) thick. The raising agent causes bubbles to rise to the uncooked side of the pancake, at which point the pancake is ready to be flipped. These pancakes, very light in texture, are often served at breakfast topped with maple syrup, butter, peanut butter, jelly, jam, or fruit. In England pancakes are usually made differently, and those made as described here are called American pancakes.

North American pancakes can be made sweet or savory by adding ingredients such as blueberries, strawberries, cheese, bacon, bananas or chocolate chips to the batter. In addition, some recipes call for the addition of spices such as nutmeg or cinnamon, or flavoring agents such as vanilla extract. In the U.S. pancakes are also called hotcakes, griddlecakes, or flapjacks. A "silver dollar" pancake refers to a pancake about 3 inches (7 cm) in diameter - these are usually served in portions of five or ten.

[Daikuma]

Respectfully, I disagree. I'd rather see a movie trilogy.

Now as a regular television series, Rifts has far more hope.

Yes, because great science fiction/fantasy series are always exceedingly popular, and never get cancelled prematurely. Especially the ones with extraordinary settings and terminology with which the audience is unfamiliar. Without taking the time here to count up which shows were "hits" and which were "misses," I would definately say that half of (probably less) scifi/fantasy TV shows which get made are good.

I never said that TV shows don't get cancelled regardless of their popularity. I said it has more hope to succeed because there is more time to inform the audience of the "way of the world" then is provided in one of those cheesy voiceovers they add to films to make up for being poorly made film.

In this concept, you can even take the direction that Heroes is heading in

Heroes is a great TV show, but most of the main characters in Heroes aren't really 'together.' They don't live in the same areas and they hardly know eachother. Their stories intwine every so often, but it would be a stretch to even consider them friends. I'd rather see a Rifts TV show that looks more like Firefly. Lastly, Heores and Rifts are pretty much on opposite ends of the scifi/fantasy scale, with Rifts being extremely fantastic and Heores being more moderately so.

Umm...actually Rifts and Heroes have way more similarities than differences. You have super powered characters in both works, most of whom do NOT know each other (they've repeatedly said on this very board that player characters are supposed to be RARE, not run of the mill as many players have interpreted the world to be) but come together as the storyline builds.

I think that Firefly is an excellent example of the direction a Rifts TV show would go (hell, Firefly is mostly Rifts: New West combined with Mutants in Orbit and a dash of Aliens Unlimited for flavor), but it also proves my point: Serenity only got made because the fan base for Firefly were so die hard about seeing it go further (it had awesome fan response as a show, and only got cancelled because the folks at Fox had no idea what to do with it - trust me when I tell you that the marketing folks in my industry by and large got their jobs through nepotism, not training).

And actually, Serenity failed, not because it wasn't a good film, but because there was just not enough of a pre-established fan base to make up for the poor marketing. Rifts fan bas is TINY on the big time scale of media - it needs to be in folks ears before it is released as a film, or it will flop. Too much, Too Fast, for your average movie viewer.

I still maintain that Rifts will not work very well as a single film. Too much backstory to be delivered correctly and still maintain a good flow. Even as a trilogy, Rifts is more diverse and character dense than LotR, and even as a classic of fantasy literature LotR took forever to get made correctly and budgeted right. Simply put: It's too damn big!

All the more reason for a movie as opposed to a TV show. Plus, there's no amount of backstory that can't be eliminated by a sufficiently breif and dramatic monologue or montage. Star Wars wasn't too big to be made as a movie trilogy. Neither was LotR. Plus, I don't think "budgeted right" would be a problem with a Jerry Bruckheimer movie.

Actually, it is that MELOdramatic monologue that tends to choke a film's momentum. There is way too much material in Rifts to do it that way. We're not just talking about a film covering North America (frankly the CS vs. everyone storyline is stale by itself, I don't think any Rifts group i have ever played with actually plays North America with the exception of New West - we don't play in Nazi America, thanks) we're talking (or at least should be) about film or films that covers Rifts across the planet, because it is such an expansive amount of content, that to ignore it is to make a film that will let down a good portion of the fans. To do that you need story development, and two hours cannot do that well without some sort of preamble on a scale such as this fictional product.

Understand the amount of material we are talking about here. More writing exists covering Rifts storyline and background than covers all of Star Wars, all of Firefly, all of Mad Max, etc. etc. The amount of info on Rifts Earth is as encompasing as an abridged version of the Encyclopedia Britanica.

Look at films that tried to encompass so much in so little time (and failed): Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy - colorful and pretty much lacking 90% of the storyline or interesting background; Most films by Marvel (did you know that one of the characters killed in the third X-Men movie was supposed to be Psylocke?? A major character through most of the 80's storylines and she is eliminated as an afterthought, running next to Archlight and Quill - two characters with next to no coverage in the comics), and what the heck was that attempt at the Hulk?

If you try too hard to shoehorn too much story into to small a time frame, you then have Hollywood re-writing your material, and the people out here are by and large wage slave writers who often do NOT understand the material, or have their own take on it that is not very inspired.

As far as budgeting, JB can get boatloads of dough for whatever he wants to work on, but the material has to be there to warrant it (remember, this is also the guy who did Kangaroo Jack - everybody gets a lemon and nobody wants more than one). None of his films are "Dramatic Monologue" fare, but are in fact action flying at your face from the word go. Storyline is explained en route, and as such needs to maintain a fast pace and usually explodes with revelation as it progresses.

Now, have him take the option and develop it as television: PERFECTO! He's responsible for Without a Trace, Cold Case, and all the CSIs for Pete's sake! He knows how to make successful dramatic television with powerful storylines and great production values. If anyone could take this as, let's say, a three season starter package, and then move it to the big screen successfully, he can, and the material would be an all around win, vs. the very high risk of a relatively unknown product like Rifts, especially after such big wins like the Pirates films. Hollywood doesn't take risks, it makes investments.

Oh, and Star Wars (in the vein of the original series) would never get made or if it did go nowhere in today's film market. It was so well received because it was groundbreaking, and the second trilogy only got made because such groundbreaking material stays in our collective consciousness and because Lucas would have put up his own dough (and did) even if Fox didn't want to do it. Look how poorly the second trilogy has been received if you need proof of that.

In other words, I expect a Rifts film trilogy to be nothing less than Lord of the Rings, Pirates of the Carribbean, Star Wars, Spiderman, and the Matrix all combined. Anything less is a failure.

What you expect, in trying to do as well or outdo the films combined, as you mentioned above, is a RECIPIE for failure if done as a single film or even film trilogy without something to establish it in the viewers mind beforehand. You know Rifts intimately, as does everyone on this board. Most people who buy (overpriced) movie tickets have no IDEA WHAT WE"RE TALKING ABOUT, and they will relegate the product to "Dragon Wars" status in a heartbeat unless you give them a reason not to.

The way to ensure failure in film is to make a product that you know will be perfect for a tiny portion of the population and confusing to everyone else, especially when it is the money of "everyone else" that you count on to judge success or failure of the product.

[Daikuma]

I think we're both wrong. The debate we're having seems to be about whether a TV show or a movie would be a better way to introduce an audience to the immensity of Rifts Earth. However, the best way to explain a world as complex and diverse as Rifts is to write 70 books about it. Movies and TV shows shouldn't be centered around settings. They should be centered around characters.

Ok on this I am in complete agreement with you. Most every good piece of AV media should be Character-centric and situationally motivated (man vs. challenge of some sort).

If you have real characters (even if they're cyborgs or crazies) and an interesting plot, then you don't need to explain every little detail to an audience. How much time did LotR spend explaining to its audience all of Tolkien's complex mythology and history behind Middle Earth? It really didn't. There was enough backstory about Sauron and the Ring for us to know what was going on, but the movies were about the characters and their stories.

I also agree here, although one of the main complaints I have heard about LotR is that the short haul intro given in those films was not enough to satisfy the average (read: non-Tolkien reading) viewer. The phrase "Muddle Earth" has met my ears more than once, because a lot of my non sci-fi friends say "I liked it, but it took me while to figure out what was going on" (admittedly, not the sharpest tools in the shed, but the avg. person is who buys the most tix in our world, so...)

The other thing that concerns me here, is that JB's films usually have little to no backstory elements, except for what is revealed in the (extremely fast paced) course of the storyline. I think part of what I am afraid of is that to reveal it at that pace people will miss it and leave the theatre with a "Huh?" rather than a "wow", the opposite, and equally confusing end of that spectrum, of course, is Matrix: Reloaded, which made people want to hit themselves in the head with a shovel just to dislodge the blather spewed out by The Architect.

You're right to say that a TV show has more time to explore all the details, to visit every continent on Rifts Earth, and to teach the characters (and through them, the audience) how all the magic and technology of the Rifts world works. 50 episodes of a TV show would have a MUCH longer runtime than a movie trilogy. However, what I'm saying is that we don't need to know everything's name and why it's called that and where it came from and how it works. If the Rifts movie (or TV show) exists solely for the purpose of introducing the audience to the world of Rifts, it would just be a documentary. Better yet, why not just put a camera in KS' office and have him read RUE to us? I'm just kidding, of course.

And I'm not saying that either. It isn't the aspect of introducing the books to the world, but the basic premise of a good action / sci-fi film covers the Who / What / When / Where / Why (and especially) "How" of the story.

Weak films in action / sci-fi have a really bad habit of "We may never know" syndrome, and if you aren't M. Night Shyamalan, that never works very well. I'd say a action content that rivals LotR with a backstory revelation that progresses like the FIRST Matrix film (the other two were just too confusing for most people) is ideal, but will be a trick to pull off.

My point is this: a good story (movie or TV show) should be about characters, first and foremost. The setting is not nearly as important. An entire 2-hour-long movie could take place entirely in one single room and still be a good movie.

Watch Two Girls and a Guy with Robert Downy Jr.: One Room, Two Girls, One Guy, RDJr at his acting finest (not sci-fi, but a good !@#$%^ film nonetheless).

I'll use the same example you did, the quality of the Star Wars prequals. We got to see all the cool buildings of Coruscant and walk around in the Jedi Temple and we saw the Senate chamber and travelled to interestsing places like Mustafar and Felucia, but I'll take the Original Trilogy (which showed us less of the diversity and immensity of the Star Wars galaxy) any day.

I did compare those two it's true, but that isn't the comparison I meant, exactly. The prequals are a prefect example of what can happen when too much backstory is revealed too fast, but that is all you are focused on. There was no character development (really) to speak of in the prequels.

We all knew Anakin becomes Darth Vader (no surprise there) but we never got to like the character before he already was not very interesting (Jake Lloyd was Ok, but not "Gee that's a cool little kid") enough for the audience to feel all that bad when they fail to show any progression of him from the first to the second films.

Then they hop right to Hayden Christensen, and already you know you are not gonna care that he becomes Darth Vader because "Teen Angst Too" is more whining than most can handle.

The backstory delivery on Palpatine was far more interesting, and yet nowhere do we ever learn really anything about where he comes from. The same "I'm gonna be mysterious so you want to more about me" that Lucas tries turns into "I'm a geeky wallflower who you don't care about" because he has hidden too much.

And Obi-Wan could not have been more boring (hats off to Ewan for the performance, he did the best he could with what he was handed...)

The first trilogy was far better, again mostly, because the American viewing audience had never seen something so masterfully assmbled in a technical sense. The "old broken down" version of Sci-Fi had NEVER been seen before, and because super post modern was rendered "old hat" for the characters, it took the setting out of the forefront and let the characters shine. Films since that time that have tried it (Ice Pirates, Screamers) have not done so well (with an exception of Blade Runner, and even that bombed at the box office, but has found cult classic status over time).

I will make a caveat, however: if the setting of the film (films?) can be kept moving and still tell the backstory, then I may be proven wrong yet. I also hope that JB can acheive what he did with the PotC series (2:23, 2:30, and 2:48, Run times, respectively) and deliver good Long and Full films, with solid extended DVD editions (for those of us who like our Epic scale films to have real Epic length movies connected to them), then I will be impressed. Moreso if the development of the films leads to development of a series that takes the Rifts Megaverse and runs with it.

It has too many stories not to try and tell them all (sooner or later).

[Daikuma]

I totally agree. However, the difference between that and Rifts is that in LotR they were adapting a story and leaving parts and backstories out, which led to some people being confused. The difference is that Rifts isn't a novel, so even though they are both complex worlds the things being left out of the Rifts movie won't be necessary for the audience to understand what's happening or why the characters are acting the way they are.

To a degree I can go with that (although I was referring to those who had not read the books in my original statement). We don't need to know all of the motivators involved, but there has to be an aspect of that so the audience understands that there is an emotional undertone to the character's actions, and in Rifts Earth, some of those hatreds are older than "they killed my whole family" or some such generic answer.

I'm not so sure the "how" is the "especially." Granted, a good episode of Star Trek TNG was 40 min. of Data and Jordi explaining to Picard exactly what's happening and how.

I don't know about a "good" episode being 40 minutes of that, seeing as they are only about 43 minutes long after commercials are taken out. Also, it's not the technical answer I'm thinking of, so much as a societal one: how did we fall so far from such a height, even with a war and a new dark age?

I do think at some point they need to actively describe certain things, but as well timed dialogue (as we saw in PotC, with the characters of Gibbs and Tia Dalma) during the course of the movie.

In fact, as opposed to the "History Lesson Sleeper Crawl" as jackylcale described above (sorry jackylcale, but I was going out for popcorn and maybe to theatre hop on your third paragraph - tooooooo long for one sitting) they could work with that talking datapad idea I'd mentioned a few posts back, even make it an interactive copy that a lead character (or perhaps a comic relief character - that out of time personality that keeps showing it's head in the posts: Arthur Dent meets Rifts and someone gives him the interactive copy of the Erin Tarn Guide to Rifts Earth) is listening to and whatever he is learning about is punctuated with an explosion or the like.

[feel like I'm giving away the farm here for ideas - I gotta submit a sceenplay to JB's people, see if I can't hop on board - Hey, if you're reading this JB, I'm available for anything on this!!! I know the material and can work on it right now even, seeing as I'm (cough cough <nonunion> ]

But I just the other day listened to Joss Whedon's audio commentary on Serenity and he said something to the extent that "the audience really wants you to give them just enough of an explaination." I think he was referring to where they discharge about 5-6 beer-keg-looking devices to throw off the Operative while they made an escape. He meant it in a slightly different way, but I think I agree with his line of thinking that you don’t always need a Trekkie-proof technobabble explanation for everything. Explain the “how” enough for the audience to not be completely lost but don’t let the story get bogged down because Data has to explain that he had to reverse the polarity of the blahblah array with the whatchamadinger.

Didn't say that, Didn't imply it. Don't care how the Glitterboy does what it does or why magic works the way it does, only how such things came to be. It can be delivered as simply as a line during combat, when a veteran explains (shouts) to a rookie why they have to use plasma and heavy weapons against Glitterboys, as the rookie sits their dumbfounded while the [SILENT And INVISIBLE Laser Beams!!!] merely making the incoming power armor shine really brightly ("Shiney!") and then just ignore the most of the damage they should be taking. Simple. Quick. Action Packed. Not sleepy-nighttime-story-as-the-movie-starts, but fast fast FAST!

We could even put "Little Timmy" in there, shooting a sorcerer type in the face with his wrist rocket slingshot so that the fireball fizzles, and the mage spouts as he recovers with a welt on his face "Gods, how I hate that kid" as a nod to the GMs and players who have encountered him at the most inopportune (but funny) times. Not a full explanation of distraction during magic, but an obvious one.

True, but I once again worship at the altar of Whedon:

All hail the Whe-Don, Awesome Creator of Worlds and Saint of Mostly Unappreciated Types everywhere!!! I personally think he should've been tapped to write this anyway, as anything with both Bruckheimer and Whedon on it would be sci-fi Hollywood GOLD!

It wasn’t until the beginning of Serenity that it was actually explained to us what happened to “Earth-that-was” or where exactly the show was set (or, for that matter, that it was all in one solar system as opposed to the whole galaxy or something). We didn’t need to know all of that because the story wasn’t about that. It was about Serenity and her crew.

On Serenity, taken by itself for its own right, I agree wholeheartedly (though I know I'd love to see more and likely never will).

In other words, all I’m saying is that I understand how complicated Rifts is, and I think it can be made into a great movie without explaining hardly anything about the history or the details of the governments and societies our characters find themselves in. It doesn’t take much at all, just the briefest of explanations, to convince an audience to suspend their disbelief and accept that this is the way things are in this movie. And, the better the action and characters, the less turned off the audience will be even if they have questions that never get answered.

On this, as I said, I'll need to see it to be convinced. I'd like to see it go somewhere, and not just have a first film in the theatres that does so-so, and a second film that goes straight to Sci-Fi channel.

By the way, that is a halfhearted dig on Sci-fi, I admit, but I love their shows, and hate their films, and I want to say I'm a fan and I can't because of it. Sorry, enough about my own therapy...

There’s no way you’re going to get a Rifts movie (or even TV episode) for every book Palladium has written. And even if they were to do that, each one would barely scratch the surface of the setting.

Again, not looking for total coverage, I just want more than an Hors d'œuvre...I remember the attempt at a Dungeons and Dragons film only too well, and the aforementioned shovel was used to bury it in the deepest recesses of my mind because it sucked so very bad.

You can’t try to incorporate too much of Rifts into a Rifts movie or TV show because there is just way too much, and you’ll only end up making a movie about a setting rather than a telling a story.

If you tell a story that properly incorporates the setting, especially if you don't dump it all on the audience at once, but spoon feed it to them, you can keep them coming back for more through long story arcs. Babylon 5 was a great example of this.

That’s why I say forget about trying to explain a lot of the setting and backstory and just kind of jump right in, explaining to the audience only what’s absolutely necessary, and even then in the most brief and entertaining way possible. I don’t want the Rifts movie (or TV show) to try to show me the whole Rifts world because it will either 1)bring up too many questions it doesn’t have time to answer, or 2)answer all of the questions but sacrifice story and character development to do it.

If they go the route of television, it won't do either of those things IF they approach it with the right balance: Long story arcs, with a gem or two of backstory in each episode, and plenty of well created action and obvious character development. This kept the Stargate programs on the air for 14 SEASONS now (including the spinoff overlap), with only a few speedbumps (the network hop). Look how well CSI has done.

Now apply simple math: {[(Stargate Formula) + (Bruckheimer Production Value)] x Reams Upon Reams of Pre-Established Storyline & Characterization; aka Reference Material} = Potential Decade Long Run and Revitalization of the Tabletop RPG industry as well as MMORPG Tie ins and massive spin-off / merchandising campaigns.

Rifts Immortality Assured!

[glitterboy2098]

plus you have the advantage of taking the "time honored traditions" (read: movie stereotypes) and turning thme on their heads. dragons, aliens, cyborgs, ect as the hero's and not to villans.

which is one reason to include both a ley Line walker and a technowizard. the LLW will be familiar enough to "movie style wizard" to most movie goers to go "look, a wizard", even when you add the whole gasmask and robes thing.

but then you have the guy in the leather flight helmet, flight goggles, leather jacket and white scarf. who is also slinging spells, albiet by whipping out odd mixes of circit boards and crystals.

[Syndicate]

Cyber-Knight

Done...

[LostOne]

I think it needs to be a main book class. It needs to be someone that can identify with the audience. While I think a coalition soldier would probably identify with the audience in a kill-the-aliens/monsters kinda way, it might also limit scenery. Whereas having the main character be a ley-line walker or burster, while more exotic, will also let you see more exotic locations that will have a lot of unusual architecture, sights, creatures, etc. The kinda eye candy you see in Star Wars when they go to a new place.

Actually I think having the CS be the bad guys would identify well. Play them up like Nazis, everyone in the US loves to hate the Nazis.