batlchip wrote:*T-woman looks right at the bespectaled man taps her eye patch and smiles.She then looks at the LT COl.*I once was assigned a LRV-588.On a support mission of cyclones.I recall we lost alot of good people because we couldn't outrun the Invy.We had to call in a squad of Legios to save us.After that I refused to use any of the mecha under 16 feet tall. Almost all of the Invy mecha fly faster then the cyclone.So ya better hope your in a forest or a cave.
ooc:I'm not really bashing the cyclone I think its a awsome design I just wish it was alot faster that's all.
"And yet if you could poll any of the Invid lower-stages, they'd agree that the Cyclones were one of the biggest pains in the ass of the Invid...Veritechs couldn't move without lighting up on our sensors...but Cyclones could remain hidden and still move on those dual-fuel propulsion systems of theirs...Not that the REF often used that capability until they were stranded back on Earth...and though their armaments weren't terribly heavy compared to your larger mechas', were well suited to close-quarters, 'bare-knuckle' fighting of the sort your species was so good at..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
"And those rumors of Cyclones exploding when using Garudan moonshine as a back uop fuel?"
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
:::looks up at the mentioning of the cyclones exploding when moonshine is mentioned. Makes several notes and then quickly sketches a cyclone from memory and diagrams it. Then makes notes on how to improve it's overall proformance.:::
"Your Grace," she said, "I have only one question. Do you wish this man crippled or dead?"
"My Lady," the protector of Grayson told his Champion, "I do not wish him to leave this chamber alive."
*T-woman begins to hum Gary Owen.RDF LT Com pulls out a lighter and lights up.*You know its the instructers job to make sure their recuits are trained right.Unlike you other spec ops guys I took time to teach my greenies some of the tricks of the trade.*Looks at LT COl.*If you know something that can save lives you should pass it on regs be d****.I rather be called on the carpet for breaking the rules then let good people die.I tended to use the gallent as a trap it was usefull in getting Invy to walk into ambushes on clear and control missions.
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
"Now, now the Gallant isn't totally useless except as a trap. You can use it open your rations and start a campfire." :::Smiles and continues taking notes and putting notes on an extremely accurate Cyclone drawing noting modifications.:::
"Your Grace," she said, "I have only one question. Do you wish this man crippled or dead?"
"My Lady," the protector of Grayson told his Champion, "I do not wish him to leave this chamber alive."
batlchip wrote:*T-woman begins to hum Gary Owen.RDF LT Com pulls out a lighter and lights up.*I tended to use the gallent as a trap it was usefull in getting Invy to walk into ambushes on clear and control missions.
"I remember THAT! I also remember setting up a counter ambush...then somebody...I forget which side it was on...blew cover and BOTH sides realized the other was on to them....We traded fire from the hip for a minute or so, and then both sides retreated like mad, convinced the opposition had reinforcements coming up on the flanks....Since we never found any debris or bodies later when we returned to the site, we assumed we'd missed hitting anybody, which was just as well, since we hadn't taken any critical hits either...
Sadly, there were damned few battles like that....Somebody always wanted to fight to the death.."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
*T-woman stops humming,turns pale and stares at the Invy pair.Mr RDF grabs her shoulder.*Now,now Zara it might not be them.Ummm...what did you Invy think of the hover tank?Have you ever fought any personaly.
ooc:I wasn't aware that the sent's had more powerfull lasers then the REF.
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
batlchip wrote:*T-woman stops humming,turns pale and stares at the Invy pair.Mr RDF grabs her shoulder.*Now,now Zara it might not be them.Ummm...what did you Invy think of the hover tank?Have you ever fought any personaly.
ooc:I wasn't aware that the sent's had more powerfull lasers then the REF.
"I know, I know...'you've seen one 'Slug' you've seen them all'....Butthe HOvertank? Remember, as a species we went from slogging to anti-grav virtually overnight, thanks to the Regis picking Zor's brain....NO wheel in-between...and no ground vehicles as you Terrans are so proud of....The Masters emphasized air mobility, and the Zentraedi...where they could jog with their long legs, they took a mecha or a Re-Entry Pod...so we had no real experience with ground vehicles.....so HOvertanks were like seeing sliding bricks...We couldn't figure out what they were at first, and their firepower frankly daunted us...thing in tank mode looked almost like a Shocktrooper, but hit like a capital ship battery...And the Resistance Earth-side made good use fo both factors...
However, all the real firepower was in its tank mode, and all the mobility in hover mode....and despite the refits, that exposed cockpit meant vulnerability....Once the Regent's forces began holding back Hellcats laying doggo in concealed positions for the hovertank charge , once your veritechs had struck, it was a relatively simple matter to perform a leaping ambush that at the very least would break up unit cohesion and slow down a hovertank unit until they coudl pry the Cougars off...And Hellcats were CHEAP for their effectiveness...
The Regis didn't have Hellcats, of course, and her few improvisations came rather late...too late, as the emphasis began shifting from ground mecha to Cyclones and airborne ...but then again, there really weren't that many HOvertanks left operating on Earth to form the sort of cohesive squadrons we saw during the Sentinel wars..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
*Zara looks closer at the Invy pair.She suddly gives the pair a feral grin*Yeah you Invy got wise real quick but ya' dinna have a answer for every tin.*RDF guy looks over at Fury and uses the hand signal for watching Zara*speaking of the inorganics I heard some reports of scrim using our weapons against us.I also heard that the Odeon Tri-Finger Laser was usless against us why was they issued to the Odeon?
ooc:I mean no offence Taalismn I'm just going with the flow.
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
(OOC: sorry about the wait guys. finals ended 4 days ago, but i still had to pack up and move out of the dorms for intersession. now i'm staying at my parents place for the next 2 weeks.)
alright class, we're going to start our next session now.
the Beta fighter is another fighter that you absolutely have to know about, as they are still in use through human space. designed at the same time as the alpha, the Beta began life as a design for a simple unpiloted booster and weapons module for the Alpha. originally it was not even going to be transformable, but that idea didn't last long in the design process. along side the Legios design project was a heavy strike fighter/bomber project. when the SDF-3 construction ran into some resource troubles, the bomber project was cancelled and its resources redirected to other design projects to streamline the budget. most of the design team wound up working on the Beta component, and the Bomber requirements were rolled into the Beta's booster and weapons platform role. the result was an effective, if a bit eccentric craft.
this is why the beta seems to be designed by committee, 'compromised until all sides were disappointed equally'. under normal drives it is barely faster than an Alpha, but a set of high powered boosters were included that allowed it to punch its way up to orbit at nearly twice the thrust of the old VF-1. it packs on an absurd amount of firepower, but has very thin armor for its mass. and to top it all off, a small bomb bay was somehow squeezed in, capable of carrying various guided and unguided deadfall munitions. and then a cramped cockpit was crammed in almost as an after thought.
one has to wonder what the Beta might have been had the varied and conflicting design requirements not been forced onto the project, but on that we can only speculate.
for all the speed the Beta brings to the legios team, its real contributor is in sheer firepower. unfortunately the Beta shares the same issue there as the Alpha, that of depletion. the Beta is built entirely around disposable munitions. first up is the MM-40S "super multi-missile system", a pair of 40 shot short range missile racks built into each 'chest'. the name is somewhat of a misnomer though, as each rack is actually a set of five 8 missile racks, one behind the other. as one row is fired, the next row is shifted up to the front for use. so your total firepower from both racks is a mere 16 missiles at a time. but given that the reload rate is high, it is easy to shoot through your entire payload of 80 missiles in under a minute. when joined with a alpha, the missiles are a bit hard to use, as they sit directly behind the alpha's wings. there are avoidance programs built in to allow the missiles to be used without cooking the tail of your partner, but i never trusted them, nor did any other pilot. so usually the MM-40's sat unused until seperation.
more short range missiles are built into each leg, a ten rack per. these were mounted inside the upper leg, and were the typical defensive system used in joined mode, as the fired downward in fighter mode. thus you were less likely to hit a friendly.
a set of medium range missiles were built into a flip up launcher towards the back of the craft, providing some decent mid range punch,although the weapons could easily outrange the sensors of the firing unit. typically these were used more as an artillery MLRS than the anti-mecha it was designed for, you just couldn't make use of their range otherwise.
a pair of long range missiles were stuck in, probably as a token anti-shipping weapon, but the problems of the MRM's were magnified in these. the LRM is basically a cruise missile, able to strike targets well over the horizon. the Beta's sensors couldn't even reach the horizon, so unless programmed like an artillery weapon, the long range firepower was worthless.
i've already mentioned the bomb bay, which i always considered a waste of space. for the same mass as those 16 dead fall weapons, the designers could easily have fitted in better armor, more missiles, or a much superior sensor suite. the only advantage the bomb bay had was that it was unexpected, and flights of Beta's showering their targets with iron bombs tended to throw the enemy for a loop. particulary the Invid, who had never really experienced the use of unguided munitions in hive assaults. frankly though, the Beta's payload is insufficient to make full use of unguided munitions. for that you need enough bombs to turn the landscape in to a moonscape, which requires B-52 levels of payload, hundreds of bombs. the bomb bay did have one redeeming feature. although not designed for it, you could cram in a half dozen troops and their gear, turning the Beta into a battletaxi capable of dropping spec ops teams well behind the lines. fitting in the teams cyclones made the trip a little cramped, and it was hardly comfortable, but it beat using a full Horizont or ASC shuttle for the role. plus the teams could deploy inflight, using the Cyclones jetpacks to get to the ground. you could also fit stretchers to the bombracks, turning the Beta into a makeshift Medivac craft. you could fit almost a dozen wounded in that way.
the last weapon is the chest mounted GU-XX gunpod. basically the exact same weapon as on the Alpha, just built into the plane and not pod mounted. more or less impossible to use when joined, as the Beta's cockpit swings down over it when the alpha joins up. luckally they remembered to install a lockout feature, so you didn't accidentally commit suicide in a fight.
as with the Alpha, the sensors were the biggest flaw. they had the same performance as the 6C alpha. you might think that this was the reduce costs, sharing parts with the alpha, but the systems are totally different. personally i'd guess the long range weaponry was tacked onto the design well after the sensors were finalized, but looking at some of the other design flaws in contemporary mecha, simple ignorance can't be counted out.
the Beta only had one official variant, the 1S. his was a a shadow variant, adding a shadow device to the standard 1A. otherwise, it was exactly the same, much to pilots disappointment.
if you encounter the Beta, try to outfly it. it can out run you, and out gun you, but the thing maneuvers like a brick. it has the aerodynamics of a brick, and only flies through the use of absurd amounts of thrust. so if your in a lighter and more manuverable craft, try to pull round behind it. its armor is easy to beat, so any shots you score should do some damage. if your in a heavy and less manuverable craft, odds are your carrying comparable firepower, to which i recommend just being faster on the trigger.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
Um, excuse me LT.; But you said the Beta has a tiny bomb bay. But as far as I can remember it can carry up to 16 drum bombs which are the most powerful non-nuclear explosive the REF/ RDF/ ASC ever fielded. What do you say about that? Please! :::Smiles pleasantl while preparring to jot down amssive amounts of notes.:::
"Your Grace," she said, "I have only one question. Do you wish this man crippled or dead?"
"My Lady," the protector of Grayson told his Champion, "I do not wish him to leave this chamber alive."
actually, i beleive you are probably working off mixed up info, not uncommon i'm afraid.so much of this stuff was classified until recently, so Jane's still hasn't fixed everything. the Drum bomb mounted on the MAC-III is fairly large. you would only be able to fit a single drumbomb into the beta's bay.
the bombs carried by the Beta are comparable to the medium range missiles used in other mecha, but closer in size to the short range missiles due to the lack of a drive.
Last edited by glitterboy2098 on Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
5. The Beta Can also drop Bombs Primary Purpose: Ground Assualt Missile type: The Bombs are equal to Short and medium range missiles usualy fragmentation or high explosive Mega damage: varies with type of bomb Rate of fire: volleys of 2, 4, 6, and 8 Payload: the bomb bay can hold up to 16 bombs note: these are bombs not guided missiles. as such they are -4 to strike a stationary ground target, -6 to strike a moving target, and -10 to strike a small moving target like invid scouts or vehicles. bombs are usually used against large stationary targets
no mention of drumbombs. the drumbomb entry on pg 65 under the MAC-III only talks about how the drums are used by the MAC-III. and if you look at the illustration, the drums are a sizable portion of the MAC-III. and with the mac being 50 feet tall, those drums have to be a good 10 feet in diameter.)
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
batlchip wrote:*Zara looks closer at the Invy pair.She suddly gives the pair a feral grin*Yeah you Invy got wise real quick but ya' dinna have a answer for every tin.*RDF guy looks over at Fury and uses the hand signal for watching Zara*speaking of the inorganics I heard some reports of scrim using our weapons against us.I also heard that the Odeon Tri-Finger Laser was usless against us why was they issued to the Odeon?
ooc:I mean no offence Taalismn I'm just going with the flow.
"Hardly ineffective....it was a low cost weapon, and, you may note, one of the few non-integral weapons systems we ever produced...though the 'bowling ball grip' made it pretty useless to anything other than an Inorganic....I can't say for certain about its history, me being a mere Stage One at the time of the expansion into the Local Cluster and all, so I wasn't exactly privvy to command and procurement decisions, but at the time the Regent was giving thought to the occupation and policing of the former satrapies of his most hated nemesis, the Masters....Having a weapon that could be cheaply enough fitted to existing Inorganics, replaced and upgraded if necessary, and yet specifically designed so that it couldn't easily be taken away and used by an enemy was very much on his mind...Though the latter precaution was something of a flop...IN an effort to save logistical complexity, the Brain on Karbarrea had the Karbarrean manufactories churning out laser-pods...and the bulk of Odeon that the REF faced in the early stages of the Sentinels War were indeed outfitted with Karbarrean-made lasers....Of course, being in charge of producing them, the Karbarreans could easily divert a portion of the production from the assembly lines BEFORE the trigger mechanisms were built on, and thus could reconfigure them in cottage workshops easily enough...Even with bulky external power packs, they made effective weapons, especially when fitted to a Karbarrean....what did you people call them? Ah yes...'technical...improvised armored cars...An adult Karbarrean COULD carry one and fire it, but if not connected to a mecha, he'd have to have a colleague beside him lugging a battery pack if he didn't want to run out of power real fast..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
glitterboy2098 wrote:if you encounter the Beta, try to outfly it. it can out run you, and out gun you, but the thing maneuvers like a brick. it has the aerodynamics of a brick, and only flies through the use of absurd amounts of thrust. so if your in a lighter and more manuverable craft, try to pull round behind it. its armor is easy to beat, so any shots you score should do some damage. if your in a heavy and less manuverable craft, odds are your carrying comparable firepower, to which i recommend just being faster on the trigger.
"That's EXACTLY how I survived running into a wing of the things....Missiles thick enough to walk on! Of course, they were so eager to pursue me, they rammed right past me and into the next HIve's jurisdiction before they could circle back to try to finish the job..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
batlchip wrote: ooc:I mean no offence Taalismn I'm just going with the flow.
OOC: Don't worry; I know your character's just a traumatized ex-pawn of of theMasters...notice nobody's stepped up to present the MASTERS' point of view?...That would result in somebody BOTH the Invid and Zentraedi could beat on in the parking lot...
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Lt Colonel Fury wrote: OOC: My character wouldn't be opposed to cracking a few Masters' skulls either (not to be confused with Tirol civies). He received word at the beginning of the campiagn that his only surviving relative, his older brother, was killed in the Masters' opening assault. There's also the fact that he's 1/2 Zent.
Or just punch them in the heads...Don't those big chins on the upper-caste Clones just scream 'haughty attitude, glass jaw, I'm not Jay Leno, so SOCK IT TO ME!!!'?
That may be why they developed telepathy...it's easier to communicate when your jaw's wired up...
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
*Zara gets up.*I'll be right back.*RDF guy watches her as she leaves*.If I'm not mistaken LT.Didn't the Mars Divsion have unpiloted Beta's that crashed during their assault on earth?
ooc:Zara is a female zent who would love to punch a tirolian and steal their lunch money to.
P.S:
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
We had a Shadow Beta during the occupation. Pilot by the name of "Ranger" flew it. Great at dropping a team into a area. Suprised a RCB once. It thought it was only up against a old Commanchero and five cyclones. Then the Beta flew in and blew up the Invid before it even realized it was there. The Beta was a great asset for us. We also used it to ferry supplies from our mobile HQ to our resistance cells.
yes, Mars division did have a large number of unpiloted Beta fighters attached to it. as did Jupiter division. this was primarily due to the lack of personel the REF could afford to spare for the fleets. with a few Exceptions, the Sentinels races were unwilling to supply sufficient numbers of troops and pilots to fill out the earth reclamation fleets. understandable, as they were in the process of rebuilding their homes after the Regent's domination, and their populations were never high to begin with. so the fleets were primarily human crewed. uh, sorry miss. Zentreadi comprised a large percentage of the fleets, but since zentreadi are genetically human...
ah, anyway, so the Fleets were understaffed. most of the pilots were fresh out of flight school, and a lot of the troops right out of boot. the Sentinels were very good at producing the amounts of mecha and munitions we needed in their factories, but that just made the personnel issue worse. there were enough pilots for all the alpha's, but not quite enough for the beta's. so the few beta's that were assigned to the fleet were used as booster and weapons platforms for the Alpha's, exactly as the original design specs intended. frankly, i think that had their been sufficient pilots to man every Beta in that fleet, more pilots and troops would have survived to reach the ground.
the whole mission was FUBAR to begin with, but with more pilots and more combat experience for every one involved, the slaughter would not have been as complete as it was. well, that and actually building the transports with sufficient point defense. the regent used very zentreadi like tactics with more emphasis on fleet actions, so command didn't expect the living wave swarms the Regis hurled at us.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
you know, i really have to have a talk with the guys over in Holoeffects 101. their practical jokes just get a little out of hand. they make great movies though, and they managed to make the simulators so real you swear your going into VR when you step out, so the dean lets them get away with things.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
*Zara walks back in wearing urban camo colored CRV-3 armor.She gives the Invy another feral grin and sits down.*Now I feel better.*RDF guy looks at bespectaled man and gives him a shocked look.Then he recovers and flicks his cigar.* You know you'd think that people would get the hint and leave them girls alone.You could't even ask any of them girls out,unless you were wiling to be but in hospital.I know I was for a week.
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
AdmTolval wrote:We had a Shadow Beta during the occupation. Pilot by the name of "Ranger" flew it. Great at dropping a team into a area. Suprised a RCB once. It thought it was only up against a old Commanchero and five cyclones. Then the Beta flew in and blew up the Invid before it even realized it was there. The Beta was a great asset for us. We also used it to ferry supplies from our mobile HQ to our resistance cells.
"Even with local air superiority, we had only two choices for tactical air logistical support.....carry it cargo-netted between Troopers, or fly it by Mollusk-ship...The troopers weren't the fastest of carriers, and the Clams? NO armament to speak of, plus the Resistance typically saved their remaining LRMs for potshotting them on the busier travel lanes..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
glitterboy2098 wrote:you know, i really have to have a talk with the guys over in Holoeffects 101. their practical jokes just get a little out of hand. they make great movies though, and they managed to make the simulators so real you swear your going into VR when you step out, so the dean lets them get away with things.
"Thank you for clarifying that...for a moment there I thought somebody was messing around with Flower of Life pollen again or I was having a bad reaction to lunch..."
(The Enforcer still looks rather goggle-eyed for a being with a mono-eye...)
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
glitterboy2098 wrote:you know, i really have to have a talk with the guys over in Holoeffects 101. their practical jokes just get a little out of hand. they make great movies though, and they managed to make the simulators so real you swear your going into VR when you step out, so the dean lets them get away with things.
Like the "panty raid" they tried pulling on the Praxian dorms 3 semesters ago. Sadly we still haven't been able to identify all of the remains except to say that they were human and had bad acne.
"THAT was actually one of their more spectacular and viscerally moving performances...what I could see of it from my apartment window...And I though packs of wolves were savage...Eh? You mean that WASN'T a simulation....?"
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Lt Colonel Fury wrote:They were trying to get away with an anciet Earth custom among nerdy college students. They were trying to sneak into their dorm in an effort to steal their undergarments. Tragically , for them, they were caught by the Praxians. They'd of been better off it it were security.
"We're rather familiar with the term, after we encountered reference to 'panty raids' as a way of calling special ops raids into Invid Hives....The problem was misintreptation later when Stage Five females who elected to stay behind on Earth caught wind of humans planning the same with them....and assuming that the Terrans meant to show up in combat gear and mecha, dressed...accordingly...
I have NEVER seen anybody retreat so fast or in such disorganization as I have those 'raiders'"
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
for a moment there I thought somebody was messing around with Flower of Life pollen again
I actually had a 2nd Lt. in my command eat the flower before a planning a raid. Everyone thought he was out of his mind for awhile with what he was saying. About a week later during that raid, the group he was in attacked a protoculture farm and all hell broke loose. As soon as the group came back in, they realized everything he said about the raid had came true.
*RDF guy pulls some thing white out of his pocket looks at it and puts it away.He pats the pocket and looks at the WO1 and smiles.*Thats what happens when your clumsy.*Zara rolles her eyes*I never did like Khyron or Azonia.I thought they where fools especialy when I found out Khyron was eating those stupid flowers.I mean come on Dolza shows up wanting to kill us all and he doesn't want to fight?I mean what was that all about?
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
*Zara leans back and crosses her legs*Speaking of getting rid of fools I read the stage five Invy Corg was a nut job too.So was Dolza I can't seem to understand why you males tend to go mental.I mean loo-*RDF guy blows smoke in her face*Anyway what's the deal with the horizont and why doesn't have any defensive weapons?*Zara just looks him coldly*
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
i would like to point out that this class is not a forum for rumors about historical commanders, friendly or otherwise. so i would prefer that you do not provide commentary on a commanders actions or mental state.
as for the Horizont, it lacks weaponry because it is not a combat unit. much like the C-5 galaxy of the global war era, it is a pure transport.
the horizont was never intended to do hot drops into a combat zone, and when it is forced to do so by the strategic situation, it requires a substantial escort to ensure its safety. and considering that the Horizont was designed in a period when the expected enemy was the Zentreadi or the Masters, the mecha swarms of the Invid had not been considered. otherwise a point defense array might have been included.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
*RDF guy sits up,at the same time a small object just shows up in his hand*You know threating a fellow officer is bad isn't that right Admiral?*Zara waves him down* Forget it this isn't the time to be hostile to each other.*She looks at the Invy pair*So why didn't the REF change the design once they incountered the Invy?They could've at least put a missile system on them.My unit refitted our Horizont with 2 RDF Spartan missile pods and several mini-missile pods.
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
i'm not sure. i presume that designing an armed version and retooling the facilities to produce it may have required more time than the REF was willing to devote to a transport. in addition, most of the Horizonts were churned out in bulk by Karbonarian factories, so by the time the flaws were noticed, there may well have been too many already in service to replace with a better defended model.
with the Invid posing little threat at the moment, it is unlikely that a new model is high on the development list.
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
:::Looks at the pair arguing and shakes his head. And then looks at the Lt. Col for blasting his sonic screw driver. His face brightens as he pulls another opne from his pocket!::: Mutters quietly to himself, "good thing I had time to make one on my short jaunt a short time ago. Got to remember to give that nice Lt. Col and intitation to tea from Rick and Lisa!"
"Your Grace," she said, "I have only one question. Do you wish this man crippled or dead?"
"My Lady," the protector of Grayson told his Champion, "I do not wish him to leave this chamber alive."
*You know threating a fellow officer is bad isn't that right Admiral?*
*looking through a notebook and not seeing the Gallant being handled*
Bad? Yes. I don't recommend it for anyone under Col. rank.
The best part of the Horizonts were the bunkers. Even if the Horizont got blasted away, more than likely, the bunkers survived. Finding a bunker with supplies was like a gold mine to us in those days. A Lt. from one of my squads actually found a mostly intact Horizont once. We refitted it installing a fold generator in one of the bunkers. His squad leader volunteered them to fly it into space to contact the REF. We lost contact with them after they achieved orbit. A year later they reappeared. The fold drive had a mishap and they crashed on another planet.
for a moment there I thought somebody was messing around with Flower of Life pollen again
I actually had a 2nd Lt. in my command eat the flower before a planning a raid. Everyone thought he was out of his mind for awhile with what he was saying. About a week later during that raid, the group he was in attacked a protoculture farm and all hell broke loose. As soon as the group came back in, they realized everything he said about the raid had came true.
"Never did a **** thing like that for us, the Flower....Otherwise the Regis mighta seen what Zor was bringing down on us, eaten every Flower in sight, and convinced the Tirolians the planet had nothing to offer...Then again, I am sitting here at this lecture, listening to representatives of at least four different planets, knocking back a latte, rather than wiggling on a slug-belly, wondering why water is wet..."
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
glitterboy2098 wrote:i'm not sure. i presume that designing an armed version and retooling the facilities to produce it may have required more time than the REF was willing to devote to a transport. in addition, most of the Horizonts were churned out in bulk by Karbonarian factories, so by the time the flaws were noticed, there may well have been too many already in service to replace with a better defended model.
with the Invid posing little threat at the moment, it is unlikely that a new model is high on the development list.
"Ironically that was one of the few cases where the Invid counterpart was the superior vehicle....The Horizont was unarmed, the Clam-Mollusk was unarmed, both were transports....but the Clam was faster and had more in the way of defenders...AND we used what learned of Tirolian anti-gravity generation....It was in many ways our equivalent of the Zentraedi re-entry pod.
The armored bunker pods may have been a good idea for establishing quick bases during the Sentinels campaigns...and certainly I heard of some rather useful modular facilities created by stacking and connecting pods together, but on Earth such facilities just didn't work....Mobility, and not static defensive points, were your best strategy on Earth...Admittedly, some landed teams managed to make serviceable hideouts by burying their bunkers and turning them into quite serviceable boltholes and supply caches, but those were the exceptions, groups that had the opportunity, means, and time to create such elaborate camouflage far from our usual patrols and meet-and-greets.
And not to bad-mouth the redoubtable Karbarreans, but as much effort as they put towards rebuilding the REF fleet, they were already shifting their production towards their own force needs...big ships compatible with their own physiologies, and their own equipment...Correcting human design flaws in mid-contract was not one of their big priorities...And I thinbk they rather believed your main strategists that the big gun ships and fighters would render the need for armed transports unnecessary. "
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
batlchip wrote:*Zara leans back and crosses her legs*Speaking of getting rid of fools I read the stage five Invy Corg was a nut job too.So was Dolza I can't seem to understand why you males tend to go mental.I mean loo-*RDF guy blows smoke in her face*Anyway what's the deal with the horizont and why doesn't have any defensive weapons?*Zara just looks him coldly*
"Corg was also incredibly stupid...or maybe all too human, and more so than the rest of us Stage Fives at the time...I mean, one against a Beta? Even in an RCB that was long odds if the Beta had a full missile load...But Corg couldn't resist rubbing his enemy's nose in his supposed 'inferiority' and decided NOT to call for support, as was his privilege as a Stage Five, and pick his opponent apart with numbers...'Pride cometh before the fall', and it provides no protection against plasma missiles either...So much for superior evolution. "
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Corg was also incredibly stupid...or maybe all too human, and more so than the rest of us Stage Fives at the time
Not to offend any Invid, especially stage 5's, but it seems to me that the male stage 5's had a higher rate of being, for the lack of a better word, mentally unstable. During the occupation, we had fought against a number of Invid and it seems like the male stage 5's were more aggressive and held grudges. Has the Invid noted this?
Corg was also incredibly stupid...or maybe all too human, and more so than the rest of us Stage Fives at the time
Not to offend any Invid, especially stage 5's, but it seems to me that the male stage 5's had a higher rate of being, for the lack of a better word, mentally unstable. During the occupation, we had fought against a number of Invid and it seems like the male stage 5's were more aggressive and held grudges. Has the Invid noted this?
"...mmmm...(consults a small notebook, then writes something in it...)...the guy who set fire to my lawn...the jerk who cut me off in the parking lot....ah! Mustn't forget the nit who lost my favorite 'LotR' shirt....'lost in the laundry' indeed.....(looks back up)...Oh, you were saying?"
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
mostly a case of following too closely to the blueprints, i believe. i've known my share of arrogant, conceited and unstable people. after all, i am a fighter pilot. such things are par for the course.
Humanity is not well known for emotional control, just look at our history. combine this with a unfamiliar biology that the invid had not evolved mentally to cope with, and you get some really stupid actions.
a multitude of Hormones, influencing mental chemistry in ways the Regis may not have truely understood, effecting personalities not used to such things.
in short, Puberty
Author of Rifts: Deep Frontier (Rifter 70) Author of Rifts:Scandinavia (current project) * All fantasy should have a solid base in reality. * Good sense about trivialities is better than nonsense about things that matter. -Max Beerbohm Visit my Website
*Zara shakes her head and sighs*And I thought we where bad I always thought the REF would do something about the DTTS-12 after seeing lots of them get blown to bits.Not that we meltrans were any better.Case in point the stupid reentry pod.It was like your LSTs from your WWII.Talk about being a sitting duck.The Garfish was a little better,at least it had some defensive weapons.*Zara pulls out a make-up marker and fixes one of her eyebrows*
Who is evil? Who is joy Who is pain Who is death Who is good Who is blind Who is foolish Who is smart Me and you that's who For we are mankind.
Hope he's doing well!
I always thought the REF would do something about the DTTS-12 after seeing lots of them get blown to bits.Not that we meltrans were any better.Case in point the stupid reentry pod.It was like your LSTs from your WWII.Talk about being a sitting duck.The Garfish was a little better,at least it had some defensive weapons.*Zara pulls out a make-up marker and fixes one of her eyebrows*