Fool's Gambit: Worst matchup in history

[Novastar]

Ummm, water is 62.4 lbs per cubic foot, which translates roughly into...

1000 kg/m^3

Seriously, do a reality check. Can you move as quickly underwater, as in air?

I didn't think so.

Also, the area affected is important, and the drag coefficient incredibly so (millions of dollars have been made searching for low drag substances...such as Teflon).

Those giant mechanical dragon necks are NOT going to be your friends underwater...

*****

In game terms?

IIRC, Robotech's Mach 4 Veritechs could still go 300mph underwater.

That kind of speed will create a huge cavitation wave (which sonar WILL pick up), but allows the ship to outrun torpedoes, so it's a trade-off.

[The Artist Formerly]

Uh, the Dragon Dred is outmatched by a squad of German Jagers with missile packs fighting on the ground. There is no way it could take on the Ticondroga and have a hope of winning.

[KLM]

Once the DD gets on the hull, it can claw and chew the Tico
to death.

Getting there, before the small craft can be launched
however is tricky (best bet is to get the Tico deep underwater,
and also, enlist a High Lord TW to spend some quality time
with the DD), but after then the 32 Serpent PA from the
DD can effectively stop anyone trying to go out and get
rid of that mechanical nightmare ripping of the conning tower.

Adios
KLM

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

i would post an intelligent comment and give you some wonderous advice, but your so thoroughly screwed it would be a waste of my time.....luckily for you i have alot of that....anyways you said a dreadnought and not a tw dreadnought right? as long as you werent specific you can still win. get some invulnerability going and you should be ok for the duratuion, but aside from that and temporal magic, i cant see how you're going to survive.

[Lucas]

yeah this is one of those stuck between a rock and a particle beam moments

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

Your odds are nil. I'm sorry. You have lost by even assuming the ticonderoga was ever meant to be defeatable. It's another case of D20 Cthulu, "just because its statted, doesn't mean you can kill it."

[Lucas]

all you have to do is use the greater dragon dreadnought that taalismn came up with and you will be fine....actully you will outgun him....

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

I forgot about that one it was seriously very badazzedly awsome. if some who liked to post links *cough*NMI*cough* found that you'd be set.

[Josh Sinsapaugh]

Guys, Virgil noted in the thread title that this is a bad matchup. Stop given 'em flak for that.

Welcome to the boards, Dude.

~ Josh

[taalismn]

I forgot about that one it was seriously very badazzedly awsome. if some who liked to post links *cough*NMI*cough* found that you'd be set.

Just check the Splugorth Starships thread further downt eh line of past threads...It's near the beginning....

[KLM]

Your odds are nil. I'm sorry. You have lost by even assuming the ticonderoga was ever meant to be defeatable. It's another case of D20 Cthulu, "just because its statted, doesn't mean you can kill it."

Wrong.

The Tico is probably the best the Golden Age could offer. Problem is,
that the kittani were fighting the Mechanoids even millenia before that,
and according to the Atlantis book, the DD is the best they can offer.

Not that the scenario is realistic, to begin with, but what the hell...

Adios
KLM

[Library Ogre]

Your odds are nil. I'm sorry. You have lost by even assuming the ticonderoga was ever meant to be defeatable. It's another case of D20 Cthulu, "just because its statted, doesn't mean you can kill it."

Wrong.

The Tico is probably the best the Golden Age could offer. Problem is,
that the kittani were fighting the Mechanoids even millenia before that,
and according to the Atlantis book, the DD is the best they can offer.

But are they the same class of ship? IIRC, the DD is not a combination supercarrier/battleship/submersible, designed to be a semipermanent home to thousands.

[KLM]

But are they the same class of ship? IIRC, the DD is not a combination supercarrier/battleship/submersible, designed to be a semipermanent home to thousands.

Nope, the DD is a combination carrier/warship/spaceship/submersible
(besides, I think if the scenario beings at 3 miles deep, it frankly
means a crushed wreck of the Tico... Somewhere it mentions that
her depth tolerance is like 2 miles, while the DD can go even
deeper)...

Also, an F-18 isn't the same class as a WWII carrier, right?

Adios
KLM

[KLM]

2. If we're talking underwater, the Dreadnought could be seen at all times with the noise it'd be making through the water. Even 90 Techno-wizards making the ship have Invisible: Superior wouldn't be able to hide the huge disturbances it would be making underwater.

Please read again the spell description. No motion detectors
and not even footprints - ie. no cavitation, noise... Probably
fools radar, sonar and MAD too.

Also, if BOTH ships are placed at three miles deep, as it is in
the description above...

But I agree: this scenario is very unlikely to say so.

Deliberately castrating the Tico while not similarly affecting the DD at all puts the fight in the DD's favor, but the underwater ineptitude of the DD's crew and the massive training and experience the Tico's crew can draw on makes it only slightly in the DD's favor.

Excuse me?

Adios
KLM

[KLM]

Gotta agree with KLM on this one. I hardly think the crew of a DD would be inept in any fashion. In Pantheons' a DD engaged Poseidon.
(...)
They're not as experienced at it as Nemo with his centuries of naval warfare experience, but how many people can boast of that? Not being on the Tico's level is equivalent to saying "everybody else".

Err... Poseidon engaged the Mechanoids (and almost bought the farm
doing so).

On the other hand, check the description of the Kittani : average
IQ over 20, speed reading, total recall, telemechanics, and probably
not the average ones are selected to crew the DD's.

And if we put in a High Lord (with TW as chosen "area") as a supervisor,
with its centuries of experience, even cpt. Nemo-2 is just a passionate
amateur...

However, this is the point, where the debate becomes pointless,
at least untill the parties clear out all questions TW raises, and
from this point on, it is not DD vs. Tico, but TW high lord vs Tico.

Adios
KLM

[The Artist Formerly]

No.

Once combat has begun, the Tico has the DD beat hands down. Not even a dice challange here.

The Tico can simply bring more attacks to bear then the DD can deal with. It can't be hit by it's own crusie missiles, the weapons boss would simply self destruct them before that could be real threat. Failing that, maybe the weapons boss was out getting tacos at the time, the ship's own point defenses could easily overwhelm the crusie missile.

Additionally, why are we firing crusie missiles, weapons for striking other ships and or fortified targets, like cities, at a super sonic mega fighter?

It doesn't really matter, the DD would have gotten cut to ribbons by the Orbital Defense systems and kill sats as soon as it broke the alt. limit cap.

Also, missiles always strike the main body, not the bridge section. This play test reads like players who didn't fully understand the rules at play.

Tale of the tape, Taffy style.

The DD's long range weapons systems consist of 16 LRMs. Which it can pointlessly expend either one at a time or in one big useless volley. The Tico can counter fire, in fact it's got four seperate batteries of MRMs for just that purpose and six batteries of lasers to support those missiles. Once the DD has used up all of it's LRMs, it should turn and run away, but if it presses the attack it could find itself facing four seperate batteries of missiles. One to counter fire whatever the DD throws out and three batteries tossing four smart mediums per melee round. The pilot/Copilots litterally wouldn't have sufficent quantities of dodges after to eight seconds.

Once the DD has used up all of it's MRMs, it would have to close to 6000 feet to attack with it's tail laser(1d4x10 MDC, less then the fire power of a Wilks 457 laser rifle), all the while dodging more MRM attacks. To use it's big guns, it would need to get even closer, putting it within range of the Tico's support weapons systems and all those missiles.

A direct fire fire-fight under water means the Tico turns the DD into paste with it's main guns (uneffected by submersion) while the DD sees it's weapons ranges cut down.

I don't mean to jump on Virgil, but his story is just bad game mechanics and it sounds like the GM and Tico player didn't know the rules systems governing what's going on.

[KLM]

TAF, disagreed:

1, The DD never left the atmosphere... It only broke INTO the
atmospere, form underwater, to get rid of the missiles
on its tail.

2, I bet you guessed that all 6 CIWS turret can fire on a single
incoming target. Yeah, right...
Same for the ion pulse turrets, do you think they have a 360/180
degree arc of fire?

3, Yeah, the DD has to get close... But when it is literally knocking
on the bridge window, you can screw your MRM's, CIW turrets,
and other weapons, Nemo's only hope is in the hundreds of smaller
units (conveniently left out from the example, not a realistic scenario).

4, The cruise missiles coming back and hitting the launching craft...
Well, in that regard I agree. Most IRL guided weapons self destruct
after a 180 degree turn - as a safety measure.

5, That aside, the DD launching a massive volley of missiles,
using it to occupy the point defense missiles and guns and
lands on the flight deck and begins to rip the ship apart - risky,
but if it succeds, go to point 3.

Sorry TAF, but please read the specifics before rumbling.

The only problem with this scenario, that a DD should
never encounter the Tico without her smaller craft.

End of story.

Adios
KLM

[The Artist Formerly]

1, The DD never left the atmosphere... It only broke INTO the
atmospere, form underwater, to get rid of the missiles
on its tail.

Missiles aren't used under water to engage water born targets. That makes no sense.

2, I bet you guessed that all 6 CIWS turret can fire on a single
incoming target. Yeah, right...
Same for the ion pulse turrets, do you think they have a 360/180
degree arc of fire?

No clue. Doesn't really matter, the CIWS put forth a consistant amount of fire forcing the DD to either eat damage or dodge. If it dodges, it burns it's attacks. Which is the point to continue to limit the way the DD can respond.

No clue where the firing ports for the Ion guns are either, but they aren't spesifically limited so I think it would be safe to assume that at least one can be brought to bear on either side and both weapons trained for forward arc and rear arc firing.

3, Yeah, the DD has to get close... But when it is literally knocking
on the bridge window, you can screw your MRM's, CIW turrets,
and other weapons, Nemo's only hope is in the hundreds of smaller
units (conveniently left out from the example, not a realistic scenario).

But it's got to get there first. And once the MRMs are launched, they'll keep attacking until they are killed or run out of fuel. Used in fours, no dodging allowed, only shoot downs work, and that becomes a game of simple brute force math to kill the DD.

4, The cruise missiles coming back and hitting the launching craft...
Well, in that regard I agree. Most IRL guided weapons self destruct
after a 180 degree turn - as a safety measure.

And you don't use crusie missiles against high mobility targets.

5, That aside, the DD launching a massive volley of missiles,
using it to occupy the point defense missiles and guns and
lands on the flight deck and begins to rip the ship apart - risky,
but if it succeds, go to point 3.

The DD can't put up enough missiles to overwhelm the defensive fire abilities of the Tico. Again it's just brute force math.

Sorry TAF, but please read the specifics before rumbling.

The only problem with this scenario, that a DD should
never encounter the Tico without her smaller craft.

End of story.

Adios
KLM

I don't think you are in full understanding of the rules at play here. The LRMs are the only weapons system to be worried about, and even they are only moderately annoying to the Tico. At max damage on a critical strike the Nuke Multis of the DD can only inflict 7680 MDC, less then half of the Tico's main body of 20,000. Toss in 8 MRMs and we add 1920 MDC bringing us to a max of 9600. And of course as massive single volley, it's easy to shoot down with a counter fire volley from the Tico. The Tico could spend three attacks from it's response weapons (one missile attack and two from the lasers) and still have three more missile attacks to make as well as however many lasers one would be willing to rule to allow.

Another point, even without the smaller craft, the Tico does have it's crew of Super Human Sea Titans, a swarm of whom should be able to jack hammer the DD into abject submission. Normal human Marines with body armor and small arms.

If you wish to talk about reading before rumbling, perhaps some time with the basic high tech rules might be in order.

The only way the DD has any effect in this fight is if it's first action is to call the Slaver fleet for help and then stays the hell out of range.

[taalismn]

Either way...I'm getting out of the immediate neighborhood of the fight, since it promises to chew up a lot of landscape...

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

The test play went on this evening. The result: The DD utterly destroyed the Tico. In agreement with Alejandro's comemnt, the lack of combat craft did severely weaken the Tico's ability to defend itself. To say it was amputated may be a stretch...you should've seen how many missiles that damn thing shot at me. The scenario was changed to 2 mile depth and 20 mile distance in a nod to KLM's post. The other player figured since it could reach the bottom of a trench, 3 miles would be no sweat, and I think it sinks at 2.5 miles if the hull is breached, but I could be reading the description wrong.

The turning point was when I dodged a cruise missile volley and proceeded to let it follow me into the atmosphere (I was going Mach 3.05 to the Cruise Missiles 3) Then I flew a wide arc to double back and set a collision course for the main bridge. All of my gunners spent their actions shooting down incoming missiles. With a heinous piloting roll and a hefty dodge, I was able to veer off from the main bridge...the cruise missiles did not. The bridge took something on the order of 4,000 MDC (goodbye Capt. Nemo...see you in hell). After blowing up the main comm tower (480 mdc) they lost control of their fire systems until controls could be jurry rigged to engineering...in 1D6 hours.

After that, I did as KLM suggested and chewed that thing like a pack of Big Red. I didn't really have the firepower to beat the Tico, but I was able to use its own firepower against it. Not saying that it'll work every time, or most of the time, but it worked this time (I have witnesses).

The damage sustained by the DD was minimal. The DD is too damn fast for that thing to hit. WAY too fast.

Next test will be the full on Tico with all of its compliment. I've been offered the use of TWO DD's to compensate. I think two DD's have a chance of taking the Tico out.

Feel free to comment, ask questions, suggest tactics, and (please) give odds of survival. Thanks for all of the posts.

Ok, i may have read this wrong but.....huh??? is this bullsh*t? since when did you underwater battle, or any underwater battle, involve the atmosphere. back that train up and try again. the whole argument is whether or not you would win below the ocean. the tico cant fly so duh you would win above it.

[The Artist Formerly]

"Reread the DD in Atlantis. The longest range non-missile system it has is a laser cannon in one of the 4 heads (2d4x10 , 2 mile range) The 4 wing laser turrets can converge on a single target for 4d6x10 at 6000 ft, and the tail laser has 1d6x10 damage at 6000 ft also.

Oops, my bad.

Those CIWS? They got slagged...fast. By the end of the first round , I'd destroyed 4 of six. Because they have a range of 4000 ft and 150 MDC, and I just stayed 6000 ft away from deck and blew them to hell. So much for them. I never had to burn attacks dodging them at all; they were never a threat.

Bad playing on the part of the Tico player. Failed to keep you choking on missiles.

"The Ion cannons are forward mounted in the nose of the Tico (Underseas p.130 see MDC by location)

They're nose mounted, not forward limited under the weapon's stat block.

Once we surfaced, unless I skimmed the water surface in a frontal charge or the ship's nose was pointed out of the water, those were useless.

That's a GM's call.

Once we surface, the only weapon systems of the Tico that are a damager are the Counter-Missile Batteries and Cruise Missile Launchers. And going in to this, I'd have agreed with you completely...but it turns out we are both VERY WRONG.

Reserve one CMB to counter the DD's LRMs and the use 3 to launch strikes. Each launcher can fire 32 missiles per round. Doesn't matter. Between the Attacks of my pilot and co-pilot in just outrunning them,

This is where things break down. Out running them? You'll spend days of game time trying that tactic, the Tico will have strolled, perhaps mossied, maybe, just maybe sashaied back to Salvation bases. Not to mention either your pilot dodges or your co-pilot dodges, not both of you.

and my 4 gunners, we can destroy 3 volleys each time. I assign one gunner to a volley(3) and the wing laser gunner to destroy the launchers. Especially since MRM's have 15 MDC. Of all the damage sustained,none of it was from the CMB system. It was woefully impotent in the fight. The DD is fast...I didn't realize how fast until last night. In short, the DD DOES have the attacks to dodge/intercept/outrun the CMB system strikes.

Counter weapon fire with just the energy weapons is slim odds. First of all each counter fire shot with the weapons you're deploying has to hit the target (12 or better, some GMs go 15 or better because of size/speed). Then it has to inflict sufficent damage, 15 MDC giving most of your weapons used a 1 in 4 or 1 in six chance of failure to kill the missile, only one of them is an absolute kill. Then you have to make kill percentage checks on each volley, 45% or less.

That's less then 50% chance, then 75% to 80% then less then 50%. Three dice tests and you must succeed in each in each test or take damage. And each time the DD engages and is forced to run, it's exposed to two rounds of fire at ranges it can't respond to without expending it's own missiles.

Because the Cruise Missiles are doing what you mistakenly expect the CIWS to do; make me burn attacks dodging/destroying them, so the MRM strikes from the CMB have a chance to hit me. Besides, the DD is 120 ft long. It's not a honda civic.

No. It's a super sonic fighter craft. It's big but you don't use Cruise Missiles on it.

KLM already answered this one.

Cruise missiles can be wet launched but they aren't for use under water. Nor are the CWIS or MRM counter fires. Those are surface running systems. If engaged under water the Tico turns on the stealth system, and uses it's torpedo tubes while the DD is swimming around wondering what's attacking it, who are these manics and why are they beating on the DD's tank.

That's the rule and I will grant you that 100%...and I don't care even a little bit. Here's why:
The DD is hovering in front of the main bridge. If I fire my missiles at it, they will veer over the side and hit the ship, since striking the launch area is a hit to the Flight Deck, not the main body. Oh, here comes Jarhead Joe in his APA-15. I lock a LRM onto him, and blow him to hell. My targeting system can lock onto an 8 ft RPA trooper, but can't hit a structure that's as big as the DD is?

There are times, in the interest of sanity, a GM makes a call and allows things to happen contrary to the rules...because it makes sense. I took a -4 to hit a particular area and was allowed to strike the large structures (bridge, towers, flight deck...technically I can't hit THAT with a missile, can I?) because I could hit robot vehicles smaller that they were. By the book, you're right...but really, come on.

What you mean to say is house rule. If the GM makes the call at the time, fair enough, but this entire thing makes no sense. Bad mechanics, bad tactics, nonsensical efforts by the Tico player.

I appreciate your calling out what you saw as bad game mechanics, but that's not what happened here.

A) Destroying the CIWS removes 36 attacks/round.

How could it get that close?

Above the surface the Tico would see the DD hours before the DD was within range. Under water the Tico is invisible and snickering as they launch attacks the very slow DD unaware of until it's almost too late. Remember, underwater lasers (nonblue-greens) ranges are cut in half, non-specialty Ions are cut to 30 percent, and plasmas weapons systems are down to 30 percent as well.

B) The Tico player was told, twice, that he could detonate any cruise missile, he only had to say that he did. Unfortunately, he's a power gamer and their tactics consist of "Hulk,smash" Another reason why I was dodging cruise missiles. He was allowed to do it, but did not detonate the missiles before the bridge impact. Player error, but not bad game mechanics. As far as fail safes, there's only so much the game can do for somebody. More to say about that, but later.

Huh. Concidering the number of potential weapons bosses the Tico could have with a crew of thousands. There are plenty of guys to throw the switch. As smart bombs, the crusie missiles simply wouldn't hit the Tico, they'd dodge all by themselves, and continue to attack the DD.

This whole thing just doesn't make sense. If you're having fun, I suppose whatever does it for you though.

[taalismn]

Hey, don't dis the Honda Civic...My '91 will drive into the Tico's bridge or the DD's cockpit and do victory-donuts on your ace crews...

[Kelorin]

About targeting missiles at locations other than the main body...

I think the 'Missiles always hit the main body' rule was implemented primarily to prevent players from nonsense like: "I fire a volley of reflex multi-warheads at his head". For certain factions, to simulate their super high-tech or space age nature (the Kittani for instance), I'd let their missiles be smart enought to target locations other than the main body, (especially on something the size of the Ticonderoga).

Even using just Robotech, I've allowed Veritech fighters use their missiles to target gun turrets, engines, entrance hatches, etc. on Zentraedi capital ships plenty of times. Otherwise, strike craft become nearly useless in capital ship battles, since they would never have the necessary firepower to bring down a large capital ship. Conversely, I don't think I'd let a Veritech Pilot character use missiles to target a CS soldier's helmet, or SAMAS wing, because the targets would be too small to acheive a proper lock, but the bridge on an enemy capital ship? Why not?

[Library Ogre]

I would allow missiles to target something other than the main body IF you have someone dedicated to targeting (a gunner); spending an attack specifically on targeting, and making a Weapons Systems (and, if the range is great enough, Read Sensory Equipment) roll to pick out a point. If there are penalties to targeting a point because of it's size, apply them to all rolls involve (multiplied by five for skill rolls).

So, let's say two UAR-1s are facing each other on the practice range. Abel is piloting the first, Baker and Charlie are in the second. They're about half a mile from each other.

Initiative is rolled. Baker and Charlie win initiative, so Baker, the pilot jockeys for a better position while Charlie targets and fires three mini-missiles at Abel's sensor turret. To do that, Charlie spends an action targeting, and makes a Read Sensory Equipment roll and a Weapons System roll, both a -10% (because you are minus -2 to hit the sensor turret, which translates into 10%).

Abel is now aware of a weapon's lock on him (simple RSE roll). Lacking time to aim, or a gunner to do it for him, he launches three short-range missiles at them. Baker fires the lasers, trying to shoot some out of the air; the missiles fail to disable Baker and Charlie.

Next attack, Charlie fires his volley of mini-missiles at Abel's sensor turret. The mini-missiles take out the sensor turret; Abel is now sensor-blind... no radar, no targeting system.

[The Artist Formerly]

Virgil, your position is based on house rules. That's fine. You want the DD to win, that's fine. Rules as printed don't support you, but it's your game.

[Rallan]

About targeting missiles at locations other than the main body...

I think the 'Missiles always hit the main body' rule was implemented primarily to prevent players from nonsense like: "I fire a volley of reflex multi-warheads at his head". For certain factions, to simulate their super high-tech or space age nature (the Kittani for instance), I'd let their missiles be smart enought to target locations other than the main body, (especially on something the size of the Ticonderoga).

I'm with Kelorin on this one. If you took the "always hit main body" rules literally, you'd be able to fire a cruise missile at a twenty-foot robot on the deck of the Ticonderoga, or at an infantryman in body armor, or even at an ant crawling across the deck deck. But you wouldn't be able to fire a mini-missile at the bridge tower from ten feet away. Common sense has to prevail somewhere.

Although then again, if common sense had prevailed the Ticonderoga wouldn't have had its bridge slagged by a ridiculous saturday morning cartoon "I circle back and make it get hit by its own missile!" stunt in the first place

[Rallan]

Virgil, your position is based on house rules. That's fine. You want the DD to win, that's fine. Rules as printed don't support you, but it's your game.

More importantly, the DD can only do that if the Ticonderoga is polite enough to come up for air. Why on Earth would it want to surface when it holds all the aces (ie torpedoes and depth charges that actually function underwater, as opposed to missiles that don't) in a submarine fight?

[KLM]

More importantly, the DD can only do that if the Ticonderoga is polite enough to come up for air. Why on Earth would it want to surface when it holds all the aces (ie torpedoes and depth charges that actually function underwater, as opposed to missiles that don't) in a submarine fight?

Err... torpedoes - it looks like - cannot catch a DD, and for depth
charges... well, good for fishing.

So, above water, the DD can outfly the missiles, underwater
in can outswim the torpedoes, and as it looks like, it can avoid
beams long enough to pick out turrets.

Adios
KLM

[Kelorin]

More importantly, the DD can only do that if the Ticonderoga is polite enough to come up for air. Why on Earth would it want to surface when it holds all the aces (ie torpedoes and depth charges that actually function underwater, as opposed to missiles that don't) in a submarine fight?

Err... torpedoes - it looks like - cannot catch a DD, and for depth
charges... well, good for fishing.

So, above water, the DD can outfly the missiles, underwater
in can outswim the torpedoes, and as it looks like, it can avoid
beams long enough to pick out turrets.

Adios
KLM

Which is why, aside from this handicapped cage match, the Ticonderoga would simply hide, & scramble its own S-14's & Manta Rays. Now how many attacks does the Tico's side have?

[KLM]

The only problem with this scenario, that a DD should
never encounter the Tico without her smaller craft.

End of story.

Adios
KLM

I wrote this on Monday Kelorin, thank you for reading
carefully

Adios
KLM

[taalismn]

Be creative.....Use depth charges to muddy the waters, foul the accoustic environment, deploy 'em like mines...even if it distracts the Kittanis' attention for a few seconds, that can be vital...

Fight dirty, swabbies. fight dirty...

[KLM]

Fight dirty, swabbies. fight dirty...

I think someone said:
"Only one thing is worse, than losing dirty. Winning dirty"



That aside, depth charges were outdated even in the
1940's (from the Hedgehog).

Adios
KLM

[Shadyslug]

How do you dodge missle volleys?

[Mouser13]

How do you dodge missle volleys?

can't over 4 but the RUE has update bad rules that allows people to shoot them down. Though not much different then the one's in RIFTs main book.

[Nightshade37]

In your simulation:

1. Wait until DD attacks.

2. Simultaneous attack with volley of cruise missiles.

3. Profit.

But seriously,

The biggest problem with this matchup as written, is that most of the Ticonderoga's advantages (planes/minisubs) are absent, while the DD keeps all of its. In an actual confrontation, a single DD would get rolled and smoked by the Ticonderoga because of its attack craft.

[Shadyslug]

IM not so HO, the match was broken to begin with.

First of all...you can't dodge a volley of missiles. Period. That's game mechanics. If you wanted to put house rules on it and say that you can...well...that's on you.

You might want to say that you could outrun them...which is valid. Unfortunately, you do have to turn around to keep fighting, and the missiles REACT to your movement.

Regardless...it sounds like you had fun with it...and that's all that really matters...right?