Mysteries of Magic -- available now

[AlexM]

Just ignore that pesky "pre-order" on the product page, it's sitting in our warehouse and will ship tomorrow. It answers the question: What if magic was the high technology of your world? Wizards need to be able to afford the necessities of day to day life, and a few may not be able to do it by offering their abilities for sale or trade. The more entrepreneurial might become merchant mages, while others might opt to become combat mages. This is a different take on the Wizard that I think Palladium fans will enjoy.


http://www.palladiumbooks.com/Merchant2 ... t_Code=472



Oh yeah,
Alex Marciniszyn

[Stone Gargoyle]

This is an issue I have been trying to address, actually: How to make magic and technology work together in campaigns. My order should be shipping tomorrow, then?

[Shawn Merrow]

Congrats Mark.

[Carl Gleba]

I was talking to Kevin last night and he was raving about this book. He told me a whole bunch of stuff that Mark brought up and it seemed to answer a lot of questions. I can't wait to get my hands on it. Plus thanks to Mark we'll have a whole series of these books.

Carl

[UR Leader Hobbes]

Still not believing in this book until it's in my hands and I have read it, gone to bed, awoken and found it still there..

Sorry but shiping tomorrow is just too far out still. Ya never know. Something messed up might still happen like the warehouse catching fire or something..

Not getting my hopes up until I actually have the book.

[azazel1024]

I heard some rumor about CERN creating a blackhole with their latest and greatest particle accelerator.

Who knows, they could create a microblack hole that devours every copy before it ships

At any rate, I am looking forward to it. I am on the fence on ordering it now, or ordering several books at once in a month (IE Dead reign expansion book 2 when it comes out, this and if Dimensional outbreak is out by then that too).
-Matt

[gaby]

I hope some some will give a review of it.

Tell what number of New Spells are in it.

What is good about the New Magic,s O.C.C in it.

What do you think other Mysteries of Magic,s books need to Focus on?

[J. Lionheart]

I heard some rumor about CERN creating a blackhole with their latest and greatest particle accelerator.

Sounds like another person in need of...

Has The Large Hadron Collidor Destroyed The World Yet? (.com)

[azazel1024]

I should have put in *sarcasm* somewhere in there.

Yeah, the guys and gals who keep thinking its going to end the world are a little beyond my ability to comprehend. Of course so are a lot of other 'whack jobs' (well, I think they are anyway).
-Matt

[drewkitty ~..~]

I heard some rumor about CERN creating a blackhole with their latest and greatest particle accelerator.

Sounds like another person in need of...

Has The Large Hadron Collidor Destroyed The World Yet? (.com)

*groans and shakes head while trying not to laugh*

[UR Leader Hobbes]

I hope some some will give a review of it.

Tell what number of New Spells are in it.

What is good about the New Magic,s O.C.C in it.

What do you think other Mysteries of Magic,s books need to Focus on?

I plan on writing a full review and posting some first thoughts on the book.. Gotta give the writers some feed back.

[drewkitty ~..~]

I plan on getting it. about the time the next rifter comes out. That way I'll save on shipping.

[Stone Gargoyle]

Well, did it ship? Huh? Huh? Did it? Did it?

Yes, it is already on its way to me. Oh, the chaos I will create! More spells, more spells,tralalla lala!

[DarkwingDuk]

I agree, but it's the first fantasy book in how many years? I won't complain as long as another follows faster!

[Stone Gargoyle]

I am still waiting for the credit card to clear. As far as I can tell, mine has not shipped yet.

[Nekira Sudacne]

I have it and I have read a good chunk and skimmed the rest.

My first impressions:

This book is mostly concerned with the history of the palladium fantasy world as it relates to magic, and how mages shape history and find their place. I know that seems relatively obvious, but there's not really all that many hard and fast rules to be found outside teh surprisingly short New Spell list. The material is great, but it leaves one with more questions about how magic works than answers. Which, I suppose, is why it's entitled "Mysteries of Magic"

True Names are a potent thing, but I'm afraid they went overboard. Completely negating all bonus's to save vs. magic of any mage who knows your true name is powerful, but it dosn't translate well to other games. In a setting like Heros Unlimited where everyone gives their real name as a matter of course, it would make even a relatively inexperianced mage rediculouslys powerful.

I really liked the discription of the various ages. Good stuff.

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.



Overall, I love the fluff, and the spells are good and balanced, but there's a few sticking points where it really feels like palladium failed to consider the full implications of the material from a game-balance prespective.

[UR Leader Hobbes]

GURRRAAAHHHAHHA!!!!!!!!

I called my game store whom I preordered from and they are getting the shipment on Thursday..

*sigh* looks like I'll have to wait it out..

This is almost worse then not getting any new books.. Having a new one out and not being able to read it.

[Library Ogre]

I'm still waiting for mine, as well, Hobbes.

[J. Lionheart]

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.

I don't have the book in hand yet, so I may be missing the issue, but it sounds like placing a magic spell on a person that allows you to control them will show up in their aura?

While it's true that only a handful of people have the ability to alter an aura, it's also true that only a handful can see aura in the first place. Being as it is not a free power, they have to expend energy to use it, those who can see aura aren't likely to wander around parties checking every person's aura. As the mage doing the enchantment, it is your responsibility not to make the victim do something overboard or stupid enough to draw that kind of attention.

/shrug

[Nekira Sudacne]

I'm still waiting for mine, as well, Hobbes.

Me getting a final copy of the book before the author strikes me as hilarious, somehow

[Nekira Sudacne]

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.

I don't have the book in hand yet, so I may be missing the issue, but it sounds like placing a magic spell on a person that allows you to control them will show up in their aura?

According to this book, casting any spell whatsoever on anything imprints your aura on it for a few hours afterward.

While it's true that only a handful of people have the ability to alter an aura, it's also true that only a handful can see aura in the first place. Being as it is not a free power, they have to expend energy to use it, those who can see aura aren't likely to wander around parties checking every person's aura. As the mage doing the enchantment, it is your responsibility not to make the victim do something overboard or stupid enough to draw that kind of attention.

/shrug

It's not common, but most powerful people arn't afraid to specifically hire people who do have it to check people out. Also I have never played a game in history where at least two party members didn't have it, which is my real complaint.

Also, See Aura isn't free, but it is pretty cheep, and you can check out the entire party before the duration expires. you don't have to pay for everyone, it's a duration--pay once, you can see everyone's aura.

[azazel1024]

Well think of it like a magical metal detector.

"Hey, you there, you look like someone is controlling you. Ain't no way your getting in to see the King today. Come back when you aren't under magical compulsion!"

Makes sense to me.

The true name thing just sounds like something to be applied to PF and not other parts of the megaverse.
-Matt

[Library Ogre]

The true name thing just sounds like something to be applied to PF and not other parts of the megaverse.
-Matt

Actually, true names work just fine in other parts of the Megaverse... it's just that they're very different worlds, with different cultures. In Heroes Unilimited, you have a world where magic of that sort is far less common, especially so in the lives of ordinary people. Most people don't think twice about giving out their names... but Superheroes do. They tend to disguise their true identity behind code-names and the like. Other societies mask names in other ways... the person may have a secret name, that is their true name, and a public name, which is what everyone calls them. They may have a middle name that is just commonly omitted.

And, heck, we KNOW the power of true names today. Didn't you always come when you Mom called and used your whole name, not just the first one? I know that if Mom used my middle name, I was in deep poo-doo.

[Jesterzzn]

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.

I don't have the book in hand yet, so I may be missing the issue, but it sounds like placing a magic spell on a person that allows you to control them will show up in their aura?

According to this book, casting any spell whatsoever on anything imprints your aura on it for a few hours afterward.

Then this book is consistent with most the rest of palladiums books. There is a reason object read is a pretty useful ability. What did you think you were reading if not an echo of their aura, and why would it not follow that the same is true of magic users that cast their spells on people and things?

[Library Ogre]

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.

I don't have the book in hand yet, so I may be missing the issue, but it sounds like placing a magic spell on a person that allows you to control them will show up in their aura?

According to this book, casting any spell whatsoever on anything imprints your aura on it for a few hours afterward.

Then this book is consistent with most the rest of palladiums books. There is a reason object read is a pretty useful ability. What did you think you were reading if not an echo of their aura, and why would it not follow that the same is true of magic users that cast their spells on people and things?

And, Jester is reading it correctly. I really want to also be able to read it.

[azazel1024]

The true name thing just sounds like something to be applied to PF and not other parts of the megaverse.
-Matt

Actually, true names work just fine in other parts of the Megaverse... it's just that they're very different worlds, with different cultures. In Heroes Unilimited, you have a world where magic of that sort is far less common, especially so in the lives of ordinary people. Most people don't think twice about giving out their names... but Superheroes do. They tend to disguise their true identity behind code-names and the like. Other societies mask names in other ways... the person may have a secret name, that is their true name, and a public name, which is what everyone calls them. They may have a middle name that is just commonly omitted.

And, heck, we KNOW the power of true names today. Didn't you always come when you Mom called and used your whole name, not just the first one? I know that if Mom used my middle name, I was in deep poo-doo.

In modern times its something that take a long time to impart your power over a person using their true name.

I know darned well my 20 month old son responds just as much to saying Jack as he does when I yell JACK THOMAS! I figure 2 or 3 years of constant ritual magic (IE my wife and I saying it) should impart our true name power over him.
-Matt

[Library Ogre]

In modern times its something that take a long time to impart your power over a person using their true name.

I know darned well my 20 month old son responds just as much to saying Jack as he does when I yell JACK THOMAS! I figure 2 or 3 years of constant ritual magic (IE my wife and I saying it) should impart our true name power over him.
-Matt

Yes, but your son is not a supernatural creature. Supernatural creatures respond far more strongly to their true names, because the magic of true names is more tightly woven to them.

[Nekira Sudacne]

I liked what they said about Aura's, although, again, i'm afraid they went overboard. How is any mage supposed to enchant or enslave someone at a party or anyplace public without anyone with see aura knowing immediately who's responsible? Only a handful of mages also have alter aura.

I don't have the book in hand yet, so I may be missing the issue, but it sounds like placing a magic spell on a person that allows you to control them will show up in their aura?

According to this book, casting any spell whatsoever on anything imprints your aura on it for a few hours afterward.

Then this book is consistent with most the rest of palladiums books. There is a reason object read is a pretty useful ability. What did you think you were reading if not an echo of their aura?

Quite frankly, I thought it was a kind of limited postcognition, having nothing to do with auras

[Stone Gargoyle]

My copy just arrived. Very cool. As you said, too little material, but what is there is awesome. It nicely clarifies minor points of contention and expands the available source material. Of course,that is my first impression from preusing it. I am sure I will appreciate it even more one ihave taken time to read it.

[Reagren Wright]

All in all I'm pleased with the book. I love all the history in the book and Nekira Sudacne
was right about it being the dominat theme of the book. What I real liked was a realistic
explaination for the reasoning behind the Elf/Dwarf War, an almost classic reason why real
nations go to war. Wizards finally have a means of casting those 200+ P.P.E. spells,
but Kevin appears to have changed the rules on energy available on ley lines and nexus. The
sub-classes of priests, I'm not to happy about, namely because I'm a skills nut and they play
important roles in my games, so having characters have to sacrifice them O.C.C. releated is
not a thing that goes over well with me. Love the history of how one becomes a wizard
before reaching first level. Aura and familiar stuff is good, would have like a bit more flavor on
what belonging to a guild does for you. The learning new spells stuff was great, but trying to
create a new spell I really don't like. Way to impossible to accomplish even if you are 9th
level. True Name stuff is awesome. The Forsaken Mage will be cooler once the new magic
come out. Which reminds me, SEX MAGIC... I've got to know, Mark is this one yours,
Kevin's, or someone else. Its mentioned several times and the first thing that pops into my
mind is the Japanese anime cartoon LA BLUEGIRl and that is as far as I'm saying about it.
I'm also confused as to how another wizard recognizes that your a Forsaken Mage or a Half
Mage. The Half Mages are...not my thing I guess. Especially when it says in the book they
quit before their training was completed so why is there options for them to even have spells
higher then fourth level.

[Reagren Wright]

Continuing on. Kevin did fix the annoying quirk about Cobblers. Main book says twice per
24 hours and doesn't suggest they have any P.P.E. MoM fixes that. I love Mark's skill
specialization idea and some of the skills from Yin Sloth Jungle 1st edition have been made
into 2nd edition. The astrology one is very nice. Now for my biggest complaint the wizard and
warlock spells. Some are cool, its nice to give the wizard damaging spells, especially lightning
ones, which have been lacking in Palladium Fantasy for far to long. HOWEVER, why do they
ALL have to be mutal ones used by warlocks and wizards. I don't see the reasoning behind
the mystic mark spells or see how to use them in game play. If anyone has idea or scenario I
love to see it posted. Cloud of Slumber is offically listed as a wizard spell, only its listed
TWICE??? Once as a 1st level spell and again as a 7th level spell??? . It cost 6 and 17
P.P.E. On page 86 its says, "Same as 2nd level air warlock spell". Cloud of slumber is a 1st
level warlock spell? I believe an editing misshap occured here. There is no 2nd level cloud spell
that cost 17 P.P.E. anywhere. Create Magic Mankikin (Pinnochio) is kind of silly for me. But I'm
sure others will get a kick out of it. Disappointed water warlocks didn't get any offense spells
and I hate Semi-Impervious to Cold. Why not Resist Cold, its the same thing. Semi-anything
language is corny for a fantasy setting. And apparently there is no Immune to Cold spell. You
can be immune to fire (even magic) but not cold . And no there is no immune to
cold in Northern Hinterlands or Library of Blethred. So in all I have to give the book 2 1/2
stars. My biggest complaint NO UNDEAD HUNTER .

[Library Ogre]

What I real liked was a realistic explaination for the reasoning behind the Elf/Dwarf War, an almost classic reason why real nations go to war.

IIRC, there was some editing there. I recall making it one of several reasons, but haven't re-read that portion.

Wizards finally have a means of casting those 200+ P.P.E. spells,
but Kevin appears to have changed the rules on energy available on ley lines and nexus.

Some of that was me, some was Kevin; I prefer for nexuses to add in proportion to the number of ley lines at the nexus, instead of a flat bonus.

The sub-classes of priests, I'm not to happy about, namely because I'm a skills nut and they play
important roles in my games, so having characters have to sacrifice them O.C.C. releated is
not a thing that goes over well with me.

It's a fairly severe change from how I originally wrote them.

Aura and familiar stuff is good, would have like a bit more flavor on what belonging to a guild does for you. The learning new spells stuff was great, but trying to create a new spell I really don't like. Way to impossible to accomplish even if you are 9th level.

The numbers are a lot lower than I set them at, and a number of modifiers got left out.

True Name stuff is awesome.

It leaves out a lot of the original.

Which reminds me, SEX MAGIC... I've got to know, Mark is this one yours,
Kevin's, or someone else.

It is one of mine, actually. I put it in, originally, as a means of gaining additional PPE for ritual spells; Kevin is interested in expanding it in a later book.

I'm also confused as to how another wizard recognizes that your a Forsaken Mage or a Half Mage. The Half Mages are...not my thing I guess. Especially when it says in the book they quit before their training was completed so why is there options for them to even have spells higher then fourth level.

My original rules for Hedge Wizards (which became Forsaken Mage and Half Wizard OCCs) were closer to my non-CC psionic rules... expend a certain number of skills to become a minor, partially trained, wizard.

Continuing on. Kevin did fix the annoying quirk about Cobblers. Main book says twice per 24 hours and doesn't suggest they have any P.P.E. MoM fixes that.

It's a bit of a change off the True Cobbler OCC I did for Rifter #16, and this book; the True Cobbler cast faerie magic just like a faerie, where regular cobblers were more limited (two per day).

I love Mark's skill specialization idea and some of the skills from Yin Sloth Jungle 1st edition have been made into 2nd edition.

I've actually refined it over the years to simply a +5% every time you take the skill again. The other way simply becomes a PITA to keep track of.

Now for my biggest complaint the wizard and warlock spells. Some are cool, its nice to give the wizard damaging spells, especially lightning ones, which have been lacking in Palladium Fantasy for far to long. HOWEVER, why do they ALL have to be mutal ones used by warlocks and wizards.

My general idea in designing the grimoire was to provide an alphabetical list of spells, and the levels to which they would be appropriate for every class that can use them... your air warlock might not KNOW Lightning #3, but it's something that would be reasonably available at that level.

I don't see the reasoning behind the mystic mark spells or see how to use them in game play.

Ask Kevin; they're not mine.

If anyone has idea or scenario I love to see it posted. Cloud of Slumber is offically listed as a wizard spell, only its listed TWICE??? Once as a 1st level spell and again as a 7th level spell??? . It cost 6 and 17 P.P.E. On page 86 its says, "Same as 2nd level air warlock spell". Cloud of slumber is a 1st level warlock spell? I believe an editing misshap occured here. There is no 2nd level cloud spell that cost 17 P.P.E. anywhere.

IIRC, I originally wrote it as a 2nd level wizard spell. I have no idea why it was put in as 7th.

Create Magic Mankikin (Pinnochio) is kind of silly for me. But I'm sure others will get a kick out of it.

That's actually a bit my fault. I had meant for Mannikins to be very small... smaller than gnomes... and basically more intelligent golems... sort of Chucky, but not necessarily homicidal. Since I wasn't clear about the size, they got assumed to be human sized.

Disappointed water warlocks didn't get any offense spells and I hate Semi-Impervious to Cold. Why not Resist Cold, its the same thing. Semi-anything language is corny for a fantasy setting. And apparently there is no Immune to Cold spell. You can be immune to fire (even magic) but not cold

Semi-impervious to cold wasn't mine; I can't recall if I had an Impervious to Cold spell.

My biggest complaint NO UNDEAD HUNTER .

It was in the manuscript; I assume Kevin was saving it for later.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Disappointed water warlocks didn't get any offense spells and I hate Semi-Impervious to Cold. Why not Resist Cold, its the same thing. Semi-anything language is corny for a fantasy setting. And apparently there is no Immune to Cold spell. You can be immune to fire (even magic) but not cold

Semi-impervious to cold wasn't mine; I can't recall if I had an Impervious to Cold spell.

Just to make a note to both, the full Impervious to Cold spell got stuck in Ocean Magic in Rifts Underseas. Apparently kevin felt for some reason the full version didn't belong in regular invocations. Why, i'm not sure.

[Stone Gargoyle]

Disappointed water warlocks didn't get any offense spells and I hate Semi-Impervious to Cold. Why not Resist Cold, its the same thing. Semi-anything language is corny for a fantasy setting. And apparently there is no Immune to Cold spell. You can be immune to fire (even magic) but not cold

Semi-impervious to cold wasn't mine; I can't recall if I had an Impervious to Cold spell.

Just to make a note to both, the full Impervious to Cold spell got stuck in Ocean Magic in Rifts Underseas. Apparently kevin felt for some reason the full version didn't belong in regular invocations. Why, i'm not sure.

All of the Ocean Magic spells are in Rifts Book of Magic. Get that and you're set.

[Northern Ranger]

Just ordered it, finally. Looking forward to sinking my brain into this one Mark. Again, congratulations. I'll PM you with my thoughts on it. Don't need to be sharing that crud with all these folks. (Besides, I'll probably embarrass myself, gushing about it!)

[Vidynn]

pre-ordered it but still havent got it (Europe...)...

cant wait!!

[Soldier of Od]

I received mine yesterday (and I'm in Europe too!).

One question for Mark regarding the Half Wizard: it says in the write up that the half wizard can pick clergy as their second O.C.C. (Quote: 'especially preist'), but unless I've missed it, I don't see any skill package choices for clergy. Where are they?!

I haven't read much of it yet, but one thing I have noticed has already annoyed me that started in the Library of Bletherad book: when PFRPG updated to 2nd edition, wizards could no longer access the majority of warlock spells, which was fine by me, as it made the two classes a bit more distinct. But the additional warlock spells that are turning up in LoB, Northern Hinterlands and now MoM are often available to wizards as well. How come? It means that wizards get access to the newer, often more specialised and supposedly rare, warlock spells, but none of the general common warlock magic from the main book. Seems screwy to me. Can't Palladium make up their minds which it should be? Leave warlockry to warlocks.

The rest of it looks good so far. Looking forward to reading the history section of the book.

[azazel1024]

It could be that some of those spells were actually developed by wizards, but warlocks figure them out easily enough once they knew about them, because face it, they are link to the elements and get that stuff better then a wizard does. The same doesn't really apply the other way around. A warlock spell is pretty much a mystery to a wizard unless a warlock teaches it to them (which they are NEVER going to do even under pain of torture). You bring the elements in to it and for a warlock, its frankly elemental
-Matt

[Vidynn]

received my copy today!! yiha!

congratulations, Mr. Hall.

[Prysus]

I received mine yesterday (and I'm in Europe too!).

One question for Mark regarding the Half Wizard: it says in the write up that the half wizard can pick clergy as their second O.C.C. (Quote: 'especially preist'), but unless I've missed it, I don't see any skill package choices for clergy. Where are they?!

Greetings and Salutations. I really need to buy this book! I keep meaning to and forgetting. Anyways, I would say (without being Mark Hall or having read the book) that Clergy should refer to the category of O.C.C. (like Men of Arms, or Practitioners of Magic, or Psychics). Included are Druid, Monk, Priest of Light, and Priest of Dark (listed in the PF main book, it's the category before Men at Arms).

I haven't read much of it yet, but one thing I have noticed has already annoyed me that started in the Library of Bletherad book: when PFRPG updated to 2nd edition, wizards could no longer access the majority of warlock spells, which was fine by me, as it made the two classes a bit more distinct. But the additional warlock spells that are turning up in LoB, Northern Hinterlands and now MoM are often available to wizards as well. How come? It means that wizards get access to the newer, often more specialised and supposedly rare, warlock spells, but none of the general common warlock magic from the main book. Seems screwy to me. Can't Palladium make up their minds which it should be? Leave warlockry to warlocks.

The rest of it looks good so far. Looking forward to reading the history section of the book.

Well, though wizards don't typically have access to them (and I don't believe a Warlock could teach them even if they wanted), Wizards do have the ability to create spells (I believe this started with Through the Glass Darkly and has kind of become the standard rule since). So by seeing a warlock cast it the Wizard stands a chance to try and work out an invocation equivalent. I know this started off as only a few, not sure if the other books have made it for every Warlock spell. Usually though it should have at least been higher level and higher P.P.E. cost. This one I don't know as well, but figured to give a shot to answering it since I was taking the time to answer the first one (clergy, which I'm nigh positive is right). Maybe someone else who knows more on the matter can answer this one better. Thank you for your time and patience, please have a nice day. Farewell and safe journeys.

[Library Ogre]

One question for Mark regarding the Half Wizard: it says in the write up that the half wizard can pick clergy as their second O.C.C. (Quote: 'especially preist'), but unless I've missed it, I don't see any skill package choices for clergy. Where are they?!

No idea. The half-wizard and forsaken mage were variations on the rules I submitted, which allowed people to have one OCC and to get the minor psionics equivalent of wizardry.

I haven't read much of it yet, but one thing I have noticed has already annoyed me that started in the Library of Bletherad book: when PFRPG updated to 2nd edition, wizards could no longer access the majority of warlock spells, which was fine by me, as it made the two classes a bit more distinct. But the additional warlock spells that are turning up in LoB, Northern Hinterlands and now MoM are often available to wizards as well. How come? It means that wizards get access to the newer, often more specialised and supposedly rare, warlock spells, but none of the general common warlock magic from the main book. Seems screwy to me. Can't Palladium make up their minds which it should be? Leave warlockry to warlocks.

In my case, it's because if a warlock can do it, a wizard can figure out a way to duplicate it. It will be more complex (higher level), and usually less effective (most warlock spells have one or two perks over the wizard version), but coming up with spells to do what they want is what wizards do.

The main difference here, aside from spell level, is that a warlock can simply choose a spell... if the player comes up with a 4th level warlock spell that the GM approves, he can choose it as one of his spells when he hits 4th level. The wizard has to go through a long research process to make the spell he wants, or find it in some forgotten scroll or spellbook.

[Soldier of Od]

Actually, taking a second look, there are less warlock spells available than I first thought. Maybe I overreacted!

Your reasoning is sound, Mark, and I don't really have any problem with wizards learning the equivalents of warlock spells. The only beef I had with it was that in the 2nd edition main book they didn't allow wizards to learn warlock spells (with a couple of exceptions like fireball and call lightning), but in later suplements, this seemed to change. It just seemed wrong to me that they can learn some of these newly introduced spells, but not the standard ones. Like Palladium changed their minds.

Regarding just choosing a spell rather than learining: 2nd edition wizards can 'figure out' one spell per level (something else I didn't like from the revised edition) in addition to those learned in game from books, alchemists etc. So they can just 'pick' a new spell at each level like a warlock does. Or do you handle this differently?

[Library Ogre]

Actually, taking a second look, there are less warlock spells available than I first thought. Maybe I overreacted!

Your reasoning is sound, Mark, and I don't really have any problem with wizards learning the equivalents of warlock spells. The only beef I had with it was that in the 2nd edition main book they didn't allow wizards to learn warlock spells (with a couple of exceptions like fireball and call lightning), but in later suplements, this seemed to change. It just seemed wrong to me that they can learn some of these newly introduced spells, but not the standard ones. Like Palladium changed their minds.

Regarding just choosing a spell rather than learining: 2nd edition wizards can 'figure out' one spell per level (something else I didn't like from the revised edition) in addition to those learned in game from books, alchemists etc. So they can just 'pick' a new spell at each level like a warlock does. Or do you handle this differently?

I allow wizards to figure out spells that already exist at the normal rate per level. New spells, however (something the player came up with), I require them to research the spell, first.