New GM/Player questions; Bionics and others

[Poocho]

Hello all,

I am relatively new to Heroes Unlimited and Palladium games in general (I'm used to the D20 system). Our group recently decided to give HU a try, and I'll be co-GMing the game with one of the other players (we'll switch off for different adventures, but collaborate for world-influencing details). While going through the rules and creating my own character, I've come up with quite a lot of questions. Lots of page flipping and head scratching has helped me decipher what some of it is talking about, but I still feel left in the dark about a lot of it. We can come up with some GM rulings if necessary, but I'd rather check with all you experts to see if there are valid understandings that already exist.

We all decided to roll up random characters, and I got an Alien with Bionic "powers." He has a Humanoid Ape appearance, comes from a Low-gravity world, and received Military Specialist education. Bionics itself confused me in a few areas, but I'm especially perplexed when I try to combine it with my alien background. My budget (and my desire to expedite this as quickly as possible) allowed me to pick a Brain Transplant Cyborg.

* Now, since I'm replacing the entire body but the brain with bionic counterparts, does that mean that I completely ignore the SDC bonuses given to my alien, or are they added on since that would be the effect on his homeworld?
* Does the SDC of a completely bionic character "heal" naturally like other characters, or is someone with mechanical skills required to repair him (I imagine the latter).
* He is supposed to get "Advanced Optics;" I had to assume that I got to pick one of the Special Optics. Is that what it means?
* Does my character get anything from Bionics when leveling up beyond the standard HP roll and an increase in his skills? I didn't see anything, so I imagine he'd have to purchase further upgrades out of his pocket.
* I get "one hand to hand combat skill of choice." This seems to mean I can pick any level of H2H, but I don't want to cheat.
* Do the physical skills still provide all their benefits to a mostly mechanical character? I'd like to think they were designed to work for Bionics as well, but I don't know if they expect us to assume that machines can't get stronger/faster simply through practice. If they do apply, does that apply both to bonuses like an extra melee attack, strike, dodge as well as SDC?

Those are the questions I can think of at the moment. If they were explained somewhere in the book or these forums I couldn't find them through my searches. For reference, we have the HU main book plus Powers Unlimited. That reminds me...

* Is there a table somewhere to randomly select powers including those found in PU?

I'll likely come up with more questions later, but thank to everyone in advance for your help.

Just my thoughts,
Poocho

[Galroth]

Hello all,

I am relatively new to Heroes Unlimited and Palladium games in general (I'm used to the D20 system). Our group recently decided to give HU a try, and I'll be co-GMing the game with one of the other players (we'll switch off for different adventures, but collaborate for world-influencing details). While going through the rules and creating my own character, I've come up with quite a lot of questions. Lots of page flipping and head scratching has helped me decipher what some of it is talking about, but I still feel left in the dark about a lot of it. We can come up with some GM rulings if necessary, but I'd rather check with all you experts to see if there are valid understandings that already exist.

We all decided to roll up random characters, and I got an Alien with Bionic "powers." He has a Humanoid Ape appearance, comes from a Low-gravity world, and received Military Specialist education. Bionics itself confused me in a few areas, but I'm especially perplexed when I try to combine it with my alien background. My budget (and my desire to expedite this as quickly as possible) allowed me to pick a Brain Transplant Cyborg.

* Now, since I'm replacing the entire body but the brain with bionic counterparts, does that mean that I completely ignore the SDC bonuses given to my alien, or are they added on since that would be the effect on his homeworld?
Ignore any physical abilities/SDC from your race, that will all be replaced by bionics.
* Does the SDC of a completely bionic character "heal" naturally like other characters, or is someone with mechanical skills required to repair him (I imagine the latter).
Repair will be required to regain SDC. HP's will heal at the standard rate I believe.
* He is supposed to get "Advanced Optics;" I had to assume that I got to pick one of the Special Optics. Is that what it means?
I believe so.
* Does my character get anything from Bionics when leveling up beyond the standard HP roll and an increase in his skills? I didn't see anything, so I imagine he'd have to purchase further upgrades out of his pocket.
Out of pocket.
* I get "one hand to hand combat skill of choice." This seems to mean I can pick any level of H2H, but I don't want to cheat.
Nope, you pick the skill then get the bonus listed for level 1 at level 1. At level 2 you add the bonuses for level 2. And so on.
* Do the physical skills still provide all their benefits to a mostly mechanical character? I'd like to think they were designed to work for Bionics as well, but I don't know if they expect us to assume that machines can't get stronger/faster simply through practice. If they do apply, does that apply both to bonuses like an extra melee attack, strike, dodge as well as SDC?
% based skills and the Extra Attack from boxing should be all you would get from any Physical Skills.

Those are the questions I can think of at the moment. If they were explained somewhere in the book or these forums I couldn't find them through my searches. For reference, we have the HU main book plus Powers Unlimited. That reminds me...

* Is there a table somewhere to randomly select powers including those found in PU?

I'll likely come up with more questions later, but thank to everyone in advance for your help.

Just my thoughts,
Poocho

Hope that helps.

[Poocho]

Would the physical abilities I'd ignore include the 1/2 speed penalty for coming from a low-grav world? I kinda thought that since the bionics were built on the alien world, they would inherit the same effects that my character would. What I mean is, the bionics of course worked normally--had the same stats as in the book--on my home planet, just as my character wouldn't have the listed effects if he were still on his homeworld. However, now that he's on a higher gravity planet, he receives the SDC bonus, speed penalty, weight increase, etc. Wouldn't this change in environment also affect the alien technology he's made up of that wasn't built for Earth? I guess that makes sense to me, but I suppose I'll go with whatever the book means to say.

I'm a bit disappointed that bionic "powers" doesn't provide any benefit after level 1. Leveling up isn't much of an incentive this way.

Ah, that's kinda what I meant with the H2H question; I just said level instead of type. I just wanted to confirm that I could pick, say H2H: MA without spending more skills on it.

Any one know of a random PU power selection table?

Thanks, Galroth, for your explanations. Despite my above doubts, what you said should be very helpful.

--Poocho

[Galroth]

Would the physical abilities I'd ignore include the 1/2 speed penalty for coming from a low-grav world? I kinda thought that since the bionics were built on the alien world, they would inherit the same effects that my character would. What I mean is, the bionics of course worked normally--had the same stats as in the book--on my home planet, just as my character wouldn't have the listed effects if he were still on his homeworld. However, now that he's on a higher gravity planet, he receives the SDC bonus, speed penalty, weight increase, etc. Wouldn't this change in environment also affect the alien technology he's made up of that wasn't built for Earth? I guess that makes sense to me, but I suppose I'll go with whatever the book means to say.

I'm a bit disappointed that bionic "powers" doesn't provide any benefit after level 1. Leveling up isn't much of an incentive this way.

Ah, that's kinda what I meant with the H2H question; I just said level instead of type. I just wanted to confirm that I could pick, say H2H: MA without spending more skills on it.

Any one know of a random PU power selection table?

Thanks, Galroth, for your explanations. Despite my above doubts, what you said should be very helpful.

--Poocho

Isn't there a random table in PU? If there is a table just for that book, I'd just do a 50/50 before rolling for each specific power to see if you get one from the main book or from PU.

Yeah, if you want to get more powerful for leveling up Psionic or Mage type characters do better at that. As to your low gravity questions, I've never seen any specific rules about that so it would probably be up to your GM.

[AlanGunhouse]

The random table is in PU 3 I think, but it does not cover the new powers from Armageddon Unlimited.

[Poocho]

Thanks for the input guys. I'm sure I'll have more rules questions, but what I'm wondering about now is what are considered the best/most important HU books for a GM and his group to have? Currently I have the main HU book (2004 printing--is this considered HU2 that people refer to?) and Powers Unlimited (the first book, since it has no number). Should I invest in VU? I've read mixed reactions about the Powers books; should I get either or both? Is TMNT fully compatible? When I hear AU referred to do they usually mean Aliens Unlimited or Armageddon Unlimited? Are either of those worth it?

Mostly I'm looking for opinions of those who have experience with the books. A list showing their favorites from most to least would be helpful. I'm not about to buy them all, so I appreciate your thoughts.

[AlanGunhouse]

It should say on the cover if it is Heroes Unlimited Second Edition (2004 edition should be).

[Poocho]

Ah, yes, there it is on the back cover. Thanks Alan.

Any opinions from all you experts out there on which books are most important for a HU GM and his group?

[Senator Cybus]

I'd advise definitely getting Century Station, probably getting Powers Unlimited 2 and maybe getting Armaggedon Unlimited.

Century Station, apart from just being a great read, gives you loads of ready made heroes and villains (normally, it's a point of pride for me to make NPCs from scratch, but the characters in Century Station are so good that I've used most of them just as they are), a pre-built, highly detailed and just plain cool city with a unique history, 101 adventure ideas and all sorts of inspiring plot hooks. It's a near perfect sandbox for a new Heroes Unlimited G.M.

Powers Unlimited 2 gives you new Power Categories: Immortals, Symbiotes, Super Inventions and more. All cool ideas and it gives you more options for P.C.s and villains.

Armaggedon Unlimited is good; a few new powers and Power Categories, pre-made enchanted weapons and objects, characters and organisations, and a big adventure in which you fight demonic villains to prevent (as you might guess from the title) armageddon. It's part of a cross-over with other Palladium games, but you don't need any of that to use this book. Basically, if you want a high stakes adventure with a supernatural slant, and with lots of magic-tinged options for new characters, get this book.

As for the rest...

If you have the main book and Powers Unlimited, you probably have more than enough options for super powers right now, so you won't need Powers Unlimited Three, which is just more of that; personally, I love PU 3, but I wouldn't say it was essential if you're looking to save money.

Gramercy Island is a follow-up to Century Station, and by the same author, so it's a good read. It details a high-tech, super human prison complex near to the city. Again, lots of good characters and ideas, but not essential if you have Century Station.

Villains Unlimited I have, but, truthfully, don't really use much. It's basically a long list of characters and organisations; some are interesting, like Fabricators Inc. (weapon makers for the superhuman community) and the Dark Tribunal (human-hating aliens, trapped on Earth) but for the most part, the characters in Century Station are better (plus, after reading that, you'll probably be inspired to create a ton of brand new characters).

Heroes of the Megaverse (which is technically a Rifts/Phase World book, but compatible with Heroes Unlimited) is all about the Book of Heroes, a unique artifact that every major power in the universe seems to be after, as the book can grant great power and control to those who wield it. Nice idea, some new powers and characters (examples of those empowered by the book), but not essential. Certainly shouldn't be one of the first books you buy.

As for the rest of the H.U. line...I don't have them, either because they just don't appeal to me or I've heard poor reviews.

Also, you night want to have a look at the Black Vault Wiki, a fan-created website with hundreds of new powers and various other options which you may find useful. And yes, I contribute to it, so I'm biased. None of it is official, but ideas tend to get posted to this forum for appraisal and criticism first before being added to the wiki, so any potentially game-breaking problems usually get weeded out; as with any home-brewed material, see what you think before incorporating it into your game.

[csyphrett]

You might need the gm guide for help with adventures. The thing about bionics and some robotic types is you are trading your natural abilities for things you are implanting.

A hero like Cyclops would start losing his blasting power for every piece of machinery he switched in
CES

[Malakai]

First, a clarification of Poocho's question Galroth's response concerning "one H2H combat skill of choice"; I think Poocho was asking whether could choose the "level" (Basic, Expert, Martial Arts, Assassin) freely, whereas each normally has a different cost in skills (Basic is 1 skill, Expert "costs" 2 skills, MA 3, etc), in which case I say yes, you can choose which H2H you want. And as far as selecting physical skills go, as a Brain-Transplant, Your physical attributes and SDC are now bionic, not flesh-and blood, so the attribute and SDC bonuses won't apply, though all others would.

That also answers your other questions about what part of your alien physiology you keep - in this case, very little (your IQ and MA Bonuses only, losing the PS, PP, and SDC bonuses). In going over the two sections (Alien and Bionic), your low-gravity bonuses and penalties are taken away when you go full-bionic, because you are replacing that physiology with technology. Want to keep them? Go partial-borg. The other benefit of being an Alien Borg is the high Attribute limits (40>28 PS, 26>24 PP, 200>88 SPD [without reinforcement]). The technology is relatively stand in that a short sword is going to do 2D4, whether it was designed and made on a low-gravity world or not. In that same vein, the tech is going to perform the same as well, though you may design it differently (i.e. if you want to merely keep up with your slower-moving race, you need only put in so much into your Speed attribute, and can use the saved money to buy some more armor, effectively granting the same effect).

As far as leveling goes, what Galroth said is true: if you really like power to come with level, Magic or Psychics are the way to go. But, before you count your extraterrestrial bionic ape out, consider that you can always add more later, thus give possible advancements down the line. No, it may not neatly coincide with your character level, but they are there, nonetheless. I once had a character plan out something like $4 million in various cybernetic pieces (and he wasn't even a borg! - all the pieces were small / did not replace a significant portion of his tissue). When I scrounged up enough cash, I would go to the doc, and there ya go, a new "power" was gained. It was fun, game me purpose and drive, and helped define the character.

As far as books go, here's my list:
1: GM's Guide - indispensable, for all the little stuff they put in there that they couldn't fit in the main book. You can find quite a few treasures in there, hidden amongst the adventures and such
2: PU2 - Several different Classes, some that build on or expand others.
3a: Century Station / Gramercy Island - I put these here because it offers a wide range of material to work with, both ready made setting and NPCs as well as offering a "fishbowl" of sorts to see what you like and don't like to use individually in your own campaign. Great if your keeping it on Earth
OR
3b: AU (Aliens Unlimited) / AUGG - Get these if you plan on dealing with aliens as a significant part of the campaign

In the bottom I put VU, PU3, and MU:
VU, while giving some good items (Organization builder, for one), is mostly a book of NPCs (in contrast, Gramercy Island also includes the island and associated equipment, as well as ready-made adventures involving such)
PU3 was hit or miss with various powers - they may have gone a bit overboard with the APS stuff, and it seems the focus is very much on cookie-cutter Major powers (APS:_______, I'm looking at you ) where as I would like to see more minors and/or more variety in the Majors (such as a Major that incorporates multiple heightened senses [Mega-Eyes?])
MU, while giving a nice background and some good points, I felt they could have done more with it, though considering the price difference you may want to look at it anyway.

I would caution about ArmaU, as though it does offer a decent amount of material (and I have been especially pleased with the update of the Mystically Bestowed option), it does necessitate getting other books to truly appreciate that material, so if you are budget conscious, that may be a downside.

[Poocho]

Thanks all for the suggestions. I took them all under consideration and got the GM's Guide and TMNT. Just briefly looking through the GM's Guide has already helped me find things I've wanted to learn. TMNT I got partially for nostalgia (one of the first short-lived but very memorable campaigns I played in was TMNT) and partly in case I can use any of it in the game.

Now for the current little issue facing our group. We had our first session a week or so ago, and it went reasonably well. Unfortunately, we ran into a little snag with one of the players. I knew he'd been browsing an outdated version of HU at home that he got from someone and using it to give him an idea of how to build his character with the new book. I soon found out, though, that he actually created his character using that book first and then changed him as necessary following the HU2 rules. That was fine by me, as long as he fully converted him.

The issue is this: Since he wanted to incapacitate rather than kill, he gave his original character version a Gusari from the old book and intended to use the Entangle rules as stated in that old book when we played. Now I don't have the HU2 book any where near memorized, and the Palladium combat system is still new to me/us. So, when he announced he was attacking the baddie with his gusari and entangling him, I asked him to explain how Entangling worked. He didn't have it written down, so he had to search for it in the book. That's when we found out, to his great annoyance, that neither the Gusari or Entangle rules existed in the HU2 book we are all using.

There's no way I'm going to allow simple porting of old rules and weapons from an old version (and as far as I'm concerned, nonexistent) that only he has access to. I explained this to him, being as tactful as I could considering he's the co-GM I was talking about earlier. As the rest of us muddled through our first combat rounds, he frantically searched through the book looking for anything to clear up the situation. The only thing he found was a simple definition of Entangle(d?) without any rules for how it would work. Since he still wants to pursue this, and I understand his desire to do so.

In a nutshell, or TL,DNR, How can we incorporate Entangle rules or something similar using HU2, and if possible what would be the best stats for a gusari in HU2. I'm mostly interested in that first part, since I imagine we can come to a reasonable decision for the weapon.

I'll cut my endless rambling off here. Let me know if I need to clarify anything further, and thanks much for any advice given.

Just my thoughts,
Poocho

[drewkitty ~..~]

The most important HU2 books. (besides the main book)
* HU2: GM Guide
* PU2
*The Compendium of Contemporary Weapons
*HU2: Galaxy Guide
*VU
*AU
*PU1&2
*century Station
*mutant underground
*The Ancient weapons compendiums.
*monsters & animals (more for the animals then the monsters)
*ATB2 (for the mutant animals)
*MiO (for the space skills and classes)
*rifts bionics compendium
*rifts book of magic

[Malakai]

Which printing of HU2 do you have? Mine (4th printing), shows Entangle on page 68 - basically, you use it in place of a Parry (takes an action), and it pins the opponent's weapon/arm, preventing it from being used in an attack. The stats for a Gusari can be found in the GM's Guide, page 200

[Poocho]

drewkitty, are there any HU related books you DON'T think are important?

Malakai, thank you again for your help. Sorry I took so long to reply. I wanted to look things over a bit before asking another question I should've found for myself.

Actually, I had just read the stats for the Gusari the night before you posted your reply (I had only recently acquired the GM's Guide). Page 68 of my 5th printing book does indeed describe the rules for Entangle. Still, I am a bit curious about something. It says you must roll above the attacker's strike roll to entangle, but it doesn't mention if you use any bonuses or if it's simply a straight die roll. Does it actually use any bonuses, such as your bonus for Disarm, or do you just have to hope you roll higher than their modified Strike roll? Also, does Entangling replace the damage normally dealt by the weapon, or do you both entangle and deal normal damage. I would think getting my arm caught in a chain would hurt, as would having it whipped around and kept entangled in subsequent attacks, but probably not as much as it would hurt to have the chain simply lashed at me. I could make a GM call on the matter (say, negate damage or half damage), but I'd rather know how it's designed before I start making things up.

Our group was also a bit curious as to the use of movement and regular attacks and actions in a round. If a character uses his action to move, does he forfeit his attack or vice versa? I haven't seen where it mentions that. To me, that should partially depend on the character's speed. So if their speed lets them just barely reach the target during their action, then I wouldn't say they could still do anything. But if they had a high speed and could cover the distance in a fraction of the time their attack action would take, then they should be able to do more than just stand there waiting for their next action. Some games allow a character to, in addition to his normal attacks/actions, always have room for a "2m step." Of course, the length of the rounds in those games are much shorter and often don't allow more than one attack/action. Is there a similar provision in HU? One scenario that comes to mind is when one character is chasing a slower character. Since his speed allows him to catch up to his prey, wouldn't he be able to then do something? It wouldn't make sense for a character with a spd of 20 to keep catching up to a NPC with a spd of 15, only to be powerless to stop him since he already used up most of his action. Even so, I don't see where the book addresses this simple scenario (I'm not saying it's definitely not in there, just that if it is, I haven't been able to find it).

Another related issue I just came across when trying to figure out the answer to my above question was concerning acceleration for super speeds. It mentions that every 10 MPH takes 10 ft. to accelerate. Is this really the acceleration rate for characters of all speed levels all across the board? I can understand this being the case for characters whose super speed is given by technology, such as robots and cyborgs, but it doesn't seem to fit what we've seen beings with super powers do, such as the Flash or Superman. They seem to hit incredible speeds in, well, a flash. Sure their absolute top speeds may take a while to reach, but if the Flash saw a tray of snacks being served across the room at a dinner party, he wouldn't start running around the room in order to build up enough speed. He'd simply be there and back again in milliseconds, so fast no one would even see him move. It seems to me there should be some type of acceleration scale for beings of such incredible super speeds. In fact . . . *sigh* never mind I guess. I just *tried* to crunch a bunch of these numbers in my head on how this would affect the acceleration of characters of all speed factors, considering they're supposed to be able to cover as many yards/meters in one action as their speed factor . . . but I eventually gave up. It just seems there's something a bit off with some of this.

Thank you again, everyone, for your patience with my rambling. I and my group appreciate any help you've been willing to offer, and we will continue to be so. Even when you answer my current questions, I intend to come back to this thread as I come up with new ones.

--Poocho

[Malakai]

No problem - here to help.

First, in regards to Entangle, as since it seems to be primarily a defensive maneuver, I would say no damage for your typical use. Special considerations might be made for some weapons (I'm looking at you, Particle Whip ), but the benefit of no damage, and the mechanics of why this occurs, the weapon wrapping around the target as oppose to striking with the "point".

As far as movement in combat, this is how I run it: Take a look at your speed. That number is how many feet per second your character can move at a full sprint. Since nearly all of the time you will have fewer than 15 attacks, I use the simple rule that you can move at your speed and still act. This is also where "Shooting Wild" comes into play - you can take your shots on the run, but don't expect them to be too accurate. Another good rule to remember is that 15 MPH equals a speed of 22 - this lets you easily convert your speedsters' movement (the end result is them usually able to go wherever they want on the battlefield in a flash )

As far as your acceleration goes, PB gives information that causes you to get 2 different numbers for acceleration (assuming Acceleration is constant). The first is the X number of feet to reach X mph, and the second is taking 7.5 seconds (half of a melee) to reach Maximum speed. Using the 7.5 number, you find that your minimum distance is way off (by a factor of more than 5), and using feet=mph, you get what appears to be relatively slow speeds over very short distances - not the "blinking" you are looking for. The Sonic Speed is a better choice, letting you reach max speed in a single action, which could probably stand in for the blinking you are looking for (you could still cross nearly a football field in the first second from a stand-still, and 10 feet in 1/25th of a second, which means you could likely make it across a small room literally faster than someone could blink) This makes for a general rule that if they have a speed 25x the distance they are covering, they can get there in a "blink", but again, that usually means they have to be moving ahead of time (Your Extraordinary speedster can't even cover 2 feet at first level in a "blink" from standstill, and is barely passing 4 feet by 15th) Sonic speed, with it's "1 action to full-speed", seems your best bet here.