The Cross-Alignment PC Party Conundrum

[Akashic Soldier]

Picture this... you have a socially retarded (MA 7), drug dealing/making/using Ley Line Walker with limited hacking ability, the ability to decipher military radio so he can tell if the CS are after him (but more importantly so he can sell secret information to other people) and a ghetto, haiku writing (IQ 6) musclebound Burster extortionist who only speaks in mnemonics and...

A principled 2D straight by the code Cyber Knight.



As you can imagine the original two characters are are scum of the earth (though they're more stupid than maliciously evil, often not understanding the consequences of their actions and their behavior resulting from the lifestyles they've lead over any dastardly intent to harm others.) It was easy giving them a reason to team up... I literally didn't need to do anything... the conversation went something like this:

"My character has Chemistry Pharmaceutical so I can make drugs"
"My character has bribe and the ability to make criminal connections and intimidate people."
"Yay together we can improve our lot in life!"

Then came the Cyber Knight, shining example of all that is... not anything to do with anything these guys would do. I was able to tie the character to the Burster (who for some reason had martial arts) by saying that he had been taken in by the Cyber Knights when he was a child because they had seen his psionic potential... and then the player promptly added "But this muthah wouldn't do K with me so I left those guys behind!" ... "and promptly destroyed your future" I added, "Yeah!" he agreed.

So I had a link there... but not a particularly strong one... the other player toyed with the idea of being his brother to a different mother (can't pick your family) but the Leyline Walker is from south America and Hispanic and we couldn't convince the cyber knight player to go with his father having a second family in South America.

So here is the issue: The Cyber Knight has no reason to hang around these guys and in doing so he would likely flay them (and as he is more powerful than both of them combined). The problem is one of code of ethics and alignment... I need a good reason a good aligned person (a Cyber Knight Virtual Reality Paladin!) would associate himself with the dregs of society.

Normally I'd tell the two players to remake more heroic characters but in this instance their personalities are so well fleshed out (and hilarious) that to not see more of their moronic antics in game would be a real shame. However nor do I not feel it is fair to say to the Cyber Knight "remake your character" either because he is trying to play a heroic (more importantly by the book) character...

So, um, suggestions please!

[Pepsi Jedi]

*Reads that very pained*

Well.... it sucks but these sorts of things pop up now and then. The way I avoid it is to sit down with my group and ask what sorts of chars/games they're looking for.

If two guys go "We wanna play retarded chriminals" and the other guy goes "I wanna play a true hero".... one side needs to give to the other. Otherwise you risk .. four or more outcomes.

Outcome 1) Cyberknight gives them a chance to stop their crap. They refuse. he turns them over to the cops(( Authorities whatever)) and goes on his way. if they fight back with deadly force, the Cyberknight kills them.

Outcome 2) The criminals.. being criminals, drug dealers and extortionists.. realize the cyberknight is a threat. They agree to go straight.. and kill him in his sleep.

Outcome 3) All three try and play their char's, as their chars would.. but someone's bending their character to justify his or her involvement in this group he clearly shouldn't be involved in, and isn't having fun because he's sort of lieing to himself about the true nature of the char. That person gets mad.

Outcome 4) The other guy/guys get mad that they have to change their char to fit in with the other one/ones.


None of those is really optimal. The "Humor factor" of the ebonics speaking retarded character will get old really quick. As will the drug dealing mage, if he's teamed up with a retarded muscle guy that plays with fire....

Criminal or 'bad guy' games can be done. But unless you're purposefully aiming for the "Stupid humor" type of games, the ones described aren't going to go over well. Nor is trying to force them in with perhaps one of the most stand up shining examples of good and purity out of the rifts world.

The onlyway I can see it working... is that if the Cyberknight has a reason to 'redeem' the guys. Maybe he's saving the life of one of their mothers and she still dies but asks him with her dieing breath to get her son out of trouble and get him on a good and honest path, and the cyberknight (( perhaps being young and ideolistic (dumb) )) makes the promise.

So he seeks out the criminals. Tells them the deal and is all "You gotta fly straight. So you're coming with me while I do my adventuring, and I'm going to keep you on the straight and narrow"

Now... to keep the cyberknight from killing them or them killing him.... they'll have to want to go straight and put effort into overcoming their 'criminal natures'.

Sadly I see it like the story of the Fox and the Scorpion.

[Cinos]

Pretty easy to me. The eves dropping ley line walker ends up over hearing something the Cyber Knights would rather he didn't that could be useful in CS hands. Buying his silence is an option, but someone like that would crack under pressure, and Cyberknights can't just off him to be safe, so the only real option is to protect him (weather he likes it or not), as well as ensure he doesn't take that info right to the wrong buyer. Thus they assign some smuck to the job, trying to keep him out of the wrong hands. Also a fine start to an adventure idea, and it provides inner conflict as they try to keep selling their wares and being up to no good as the Cyber knight tries to keep them on the up and up (and out of trouble).

[Pepsi Jedi]

Why would the Cyberknight have a secret of such severity that it makes him totally forsake his code and keep blackmailing criminals alive? Wouldn't most cyberknights call the blackmailing bluff and take their lumps?

[Cinos]

Say locations of vital training locations, military lines of Tolkeen, locations of surviving refugees, keycodes to vital mainframes used by Cyberknights, information on how to manufacture their arms and armor, things that would take time to change and put countless more lives on the line than a single cyberknight.

And to be clear, I'm not saying -this- Cyberknight has something blackmailable, I mean the hacker gets information on -the- cyberknights to where the order deems it needed to place a knight as a guard (rather than order his death, a rather un-cyberknighty thing to do), meaning some smuck gets the unlucky job of dealing with this pair until they can get their ducks order that the information is no longer harmful. If it's something very large (like refugee camp locations or long term plans in motion) it could take months to get in the clear. Long enough at least for a GM to think up a long term solution to the problem.

[Akashic Soldier]

Say locations of vital training locations, military lines of Tolkeen, locations of surviving refugees, keycodes to vital mainframes used by Cyberknights, information on how to manufacture their arms and armor, things that would take time to change and put countless more lives on the line than a single cyberknight.

And to be clear, I'm not saying -this- Cyberknight has something blackmailable, I mean the hacker gets information on -the- cyberknights to where the order deems it needed to place a knight as a guard (rather than order his death, a rather un-cyberknighty thing to do), meaning some smuck gets the unlucky job of dealing with this pair until they can get their ducks order that the information is no longer harmful. If it's something very large (like refugee camp locations or long term plans in motion) it could take months to get in the clear. Long enough at least for a GM to think up a long term solution to the problem.

Thanks both of your guys. I really appreciate it. The game is in a few hours and if nothing else you've bought me a game session or two. Like I said, normally I'd just ask the two to remake... but trust me these are some of the best most thought out and well rounded characters I've seen the players make (its just an unfortunate side effect that they're both very grey ethically). The Ley Line Walker's drug addiction stemmed from using psychedelics to expand his understanding of the universe (apparently his MA 6 was just a product of him being a dick) and the African American Burster never really had much of a shot at the future due to his low intelligence so got by using the power behind his raw emotions and brute strength.

Far as I can tell the Cyber Knight is perfect in every way without any back story or depth other than his alliances are to the planet before any people or even his own knightly order and due to a bad roll he isn't psionic. So it was difficult fitting him in. Having him stuck as "the poor shmuck" will work easily.

The premise of the game was to drop the characters into the criminal underworld and see if they'd float, sink, or drown... (I didn't tell them that) but the fact that they made criminals made the opening scene I am going to run make so much more sense.

Anyway, thank you again! Wish me luck!

[Cinos]

Honestly if there was a character I'd ask someone to be re-rolled, I'd be looking at the Cyberknight if anyone. He is easily the least interesting and least thought out character. Him being the most powerful is just another strand on that hay stack to me. Grey Morality beats having nothing but good guys any day of the week.

[Akashic Soldier]

As a funny enough thing, its not the fact that his lowest stat is 20.



Its that Cyber Knights have an armor rating of 16, which means (as I understand it) someone has to over a 16 or they cannot even inflict damage to him. I am by no means complaining... its AWESOME... it would just be more awesome if he didn't also have +5 to parry and dodge. lol. I suspect the first "learn how to play" combat is going to be the CK mopping up while the Leyline Player goes... "So how many actions is this spell?" and the Burster is still trying to figure out what his many martial-arts based combat options are.

Guess, we'll soon see. I just don't want to buff up the encounter encase the other two are ashed so that its even a mild challenge for the CK.

[Cinos]

Been a while since I've done rifts, but the AR for Cyberknights is dealt with like normal armor, as in, Strike 17+ hits him, under hits armor, so if it's SD, it's more or less 17+ or get nothing, but MD pistols will right smoke him if it hits past AR if it's his only line of defense.

[Akashic Soldier]

Been a while since I've done rifts, but the AR for Cyberknights is dealt with like normal armor, as in, Strike 17+ hits him, under hits armor, so if it's SD, it's more or less 17+ or get nothing, but MD pistols will right smoke him if it hits past AR if it's his only line of defense.

He's also wearing standard MD armor as it suggests they do. Everyone is late. lol.

Not a good sign.

[G]

As mentioned the cyberknights armor is not what you thought. It is VERY POOR armor, not very good armor. its not a natural armor rating, where anything below a number doesn't deal damage. Its a modern armor rating, where anything below hits the armor, and anything above hits the user. Given that most people are sdc, and most weapons are mdc a roll above the AR number is instant death to the CK. Its a last ditch survival method...for when you are out of armor.

In terms of damage, the burster is more powerful than a CK. A LLW is a grey area, they could be powerful, but tend not too, from the games I've been in.

As for the CK, I'm hoping the other PCs can corrupt him...he can be a fallen knight (or possibly a mystic knight from Federation of Magic).

As for why he is with them...perhaps he needs cannon fodder? Perhaps he thinks that as long as he can keep them fighting for good, its much better than killing them. If he is on a mission and needs help, he may have to take what he can get. Keeping them with him is more likely to keep them out of trouble and alive. He can be trying to change their ways (they are wayward sheep that need to be brought back into the light).

[Severus Snape]

This is really easy. The Cyber-Knight is on a personal mission to, for some reason, help these 2 dregs see the error of their ways and help them reform and become contributing members of society. Mercy and compassion should be part of the Cyber-Knights moral code (as well as in their alignment), and for some reason the knight thinks there is enough good in these two that they would be better served as being saved and reformed instead of thrown in jail or killed.

Easy.

[Killer Cyborg]

Normally I'd tell the two players to remake more heroic characters but in this instance their personalities are so well fleshed out (and hilarious) that to not see more of their moronic antics in game would be a real shame. However nor do I not feel it is fair to say to the Cyber Knight "remake your character" either because he is trying to play a heroic (more importantly by the book) character...

So, um, suggestions please!

Get over it.
"One of these things is not like the others, one of these things just doesn't belong."

The CK is the odd-man out, so he's the one that has to go.
The character can be used in another game some other time, or it can be modified to fit in with the rest of the part by loosening him up a little, or otherwise getting his personality to mesh better with the others.

Edit:
OR just play it as it lies, and watch the ensuing inter-party conflicts.

[The Beast]

Maybe the CK is on the run...

[Akashic Soldier]

Okay, it actually played out pretty well... there were the inevitable hickups but the CK player realized that he had to make a new character. I don't know if it was when the Leyline Walker thought it would be a good idea to ask the CS Grunt for directions (while in his full Wizard get up) or when the CK burst into the Ley Line Walker's room later that night to find him fully naked -- then had to maintain a casual conversation with him while Alfonzo (who is apparently very comfortable in his nakedness) told the CK "not to be ashamed," or if it was one of the many other interactions he had but he realized it wasn't going to work.

He messaged me today saying he was making a new character explaining that he wasn't used to playing that type of character and couldn't think of any ideas for a new character and I told him to stop trying to think up chosen one angles and basing your character around ability sets and to imagine a world like Return of the Jedi and Dune and to make a character who fitted into that. Then I explained that he doesn't have to define "good" characters by as someone who have a set code of morally correct ethics that they force on others and that in this particular instance just making a PC with a very human "good is a way you treat others" down to earth attitude he would be able to be around these guys and it wouldn't be such a rough time on him. There is supposed to be another game tonight continuing on from it so I am hoping his new character has a little more character and history for me to weave into the story and isn't such a tightly wound preachy character.

EDIT: Also, as it turned out the Armor Rating 16 wasn't as bad as I'd thought it be. And I am not sure if anyone else has ever encountered anything like this but I had them spotted by a CS guy in casual uniform (no MD armor) on his way home or to visit friends. I thought it would be an easy first encounter to teach them about SDC combat and show them the power of a normal MD hand pistol but it would be a battle that would end rather quickly. What I could not have planned on was this CS guy could not roll anything except natural 20's. I had never seen so many 20's one after another. If I had not been there I wouldn't have believed it. To be "fair" I let one of the players roll a couple of his dodges and both times Natural 20. In the end he was done in by one of the players rolling a natural 20 and he only got a 19 on his defense so he was instantly killed by the Megadamage. But even so... it was amazing.

[GA]

The group shouldn't be together. The cross alignment thing doesn't work. Sure you can force it to work but its always going to seem forced. Disallow the cyber knight. Either that or make him a fallen one so he is more in line with these guys. Putting him with these guys for whatever bs reason is not being true to the alignment and its just feels false. A real cyber knight wouldn't be with these guys he'd probably kill them or imprison them. So why are you forcing this?

[MaxxSterling]

You just need a common cause or common enemy. The coalition sounds fine to me. If you can manage to keep them from each others throats long enough, eventually, they'll pull the cyber knight down to there level, or he'll pull them up to his, or they'll meet in the middle. If not, have one of them get the role-reversal insanity or whatever it's called.