Pepsi Jedi wrote:camk4evr wrote:Pepsi Jedi wrote:
I can't speak for others, but the Evacuation, and relocation plans I've put forth don't need teleportation of masses of people to work. Boiled totally down to just bare bones.
1) Scout an area well out of CS reach.
2) Secure and fortify (Militarily) the area.
3) Start pilgramages from Tolkeen. Starting with those able to build the infrastructure. The enginers, construction people. Those with magic to make this easier (( Elemental magic, stone magic, nature magic, ect) All the millions and millions spent on mercs can be spent to secure the pilgramages. Mercs to defend them, along with their own magical capibilities. ((Dragons are great for this, with supernatural strength they can carry huge loads. Most can fly. They're magical and provide teleportation of FORCE multipliers. Ect))
4) When the first pilgramages get there, they start using their abilities and knowledge to build up the 'New city" with in the new area as per pre planed design. Naturally this would be to get power sources on line. Water. Then other infrastructure. It would be designed from the ground up to be defendable by the military already present and in case, in the future if threats come, to put the most important things in places where they can be defended but wouldn't hurt civilians if hit.
5) Keep up the pilgramages. As the city is being built, more can move into place, which gives more ability to build and advance the city.
6) Keep the defenses of "Old"Tolkeen manned.
7) when you've gotten 3/5s to 3/4ths of the people moved, you move the 'stuff' be it the books in the library, or the artifacts. The "Stuff" that you can't just build in the new area. If you're keeping the location 100% secret. (( hard to do.)) you do this via magic or at least aided with by magic. If not, the Black Market excells in this. (( So the new book tells you REPEATEDLY. lol ))
in the end, you're left with the city being maned by a defense force and skeleton crew. At this point you would probably want to rig it to destruct. To keep your 'secrets' out of the CS hands. All that power pumped through the pyramids and stuff can be set to overload or whatever.
9) Then.. poof. the last defense forces pull out. The city goes 'boom' and hopefully you've done so in a way that makes it look like they had some sort of magical accident and nuked themselves with thier own naughty naughty magic. (( The destruction of 'old Tolkeen' prevents it's usage by hostile forces. Be it demons or the CS it self or folks from the Fed or some huge merc army. ect.))
It's a good plan PJ and it would have worked. There's just a few issues with it:
1) They had four years to implement it (according to thr RMB, the CS had only started sending troops on recon and S&D missions into Minnesota in 101 PA and the war started in 105 PA according to SOT1). Less than that really as the council (or whatever it was that governed Tolkeen) would need time to debate the evacuation and then they'd have to convince the populous.
Tolkeen has known the CS was coming for years. There was a full decade of Military build up -after- the decision to fight instead of run was made. If you used those years to run, you'd have plenty of time before the CS came down on ya.
I don't like to ask this because I think it's kind of a ****ish thing to do but where does it say that they had a full decade of military build up? I don't remember seeing in the books (admittedly, it might be in one I don't have).
At any rate, it's only human nature to fight for what's yours from an invader so it's not surprising that they chose to fight (esp. since they supposedly had a great defensive position with the ley lines and nexii which I don't remember them ever using (I swear they fought the war like a bunch of rocks)) instead of an evacuation that could take longer if they aren't lucky enough to find a suitable location in less than a year.
camk4evr wrote:
2) They had allies (or, at least, reasonbly friendly nations who they expected would ally with them, or both) until just before the war, so they had reason to believe that they wouldn't be facing the CS alone and therefore it's likely they wouldn't have seen the need to come up with an evacuation plan.
They had allies till it got out how evil they'd become. Even during the war allies like HALF the Cyberknights were on their side (( even with TOLKEEN forces killing and eating them)) The prroblem was from the ---start---- all of Tolkeens allies agreed on one thing. "You can NOT WIN. You should RUN". Not one but TWO of the magical "powers" agreed that ALL of the magical powers united would ----ALL DIE--- if they teamed up. It wasn't like they sat around waffeling. They looked at it and went "Hey Tolkeen even if you, and us, and everyone teamed up. We'd all die. It'd take longer but we'd all die..so we're not teamin' up. You need to get out of dodge!" Where in the now evil tolkeen's reply was 'Frak you guys. We'll do it on our own! You'll see!!!!"
True. Problem was it wasn't until 104 or 105 PA that they told Tolkeen they were on their own (except for Dunscon's FOM who waited until after the shooting started).
camk4evr wrote:
3) the CS was at war with Free Quebec and while Quebec would (likely) eventually be defeated, the war would have seriously weakened the Coalition enough that it would be years before they could threaten Tolkeen. Besides, only a fool would start a war with someone when thet're already fighting another war.
...... Isn't that what happened? The CS had a (( pretty minor to be honest)) War with FQ. They were "at war" but the CS wasn't full out balls to the wall with it. It wasn't full scaled overwhelming invasion. The navy really traded blows, but the war wasn't that.... I don't want to sound like I'm minimizing it.. but the CS wasn't "All in" in the FQ war. They WERE having a war in two places till the now evil Tolkeen sent armies of demons to kill CS troops with a wink and a nod to FQ, kinda "Hey you're at war, we're gonna help you out and kill some CS with this army of Demons. You can watch" and FQ went "Army of demons?? Against humans? No.. That's my Big brother! NOONE PICKS ON HIM BUT ME!! You wanna use Demons against humans, you gotta go through US FIRST Mother fraker!" and it was that act which caused a pretty gigantic thing from the CS. When they saw FQ laying down their lives to protect fellow humans from monsters and demons, Karl, the Diabolic leader of the CS, totally took responsibility for the war with FQ. Said he was WRONG. Apologized, and pledged support and friend ship and recognized FQ's sovereignty. That was/is a -----huge----- thing for the CS to have done. Admit it was wrong??? The Emp taking personal responsibility??? Even his advisers were blown away. Apologize publicly!?!?!? Whoo. That was a bigger thing for the CS than beating Tolkeen. -----------------Everyone------------------ except tolkeen it self knew the CS would win in the war against tolkeen. Everyone. ---NOONE--- Thought the CS/Emp Karl would ----EEEEVER----- Admit wrong doing and apoligise for ------ANYTHING-----.
And? Seriously, I'm not trying to be facetious or insulting but it has nothing to do with what Tolkeen and others perceived at the beginning of the war in 105 PA as opposed to what we know, now, after reading the SOT series. Besides, even if the CS wasn't 'All In' in the war it was still drawing off resources from the front at Tolkeen and, apparently, stretching their forces thin (according to either Free Quebec or CWC, or maybe SOT 1, I forget which of 'em).