Northern Gun 1 & 2

[earthhawk]

I'm really wanting these two books to come out before the end of the year. Why? Quite simply they will be the last Rifts books that I buy. After two decades of buying Rifts materials I feel that (for me) there's really not much to look forward to in the game world. Most of the major continents have their own world books, and North America has all but been fleshed out as well. Yes you could create a book or two here and there, but really are they necessary? I personally don't think so. At this point it seems that any books that come out after NG 1 & 2 will seem redundant. Perhaps the only thing that would keep me interested in buying more Rifts books is an update to the game mechanics, but unfortunately I don't see that happening anytime soon. I will say that Chuck Walton is a fantastic artist, Palladium is lucky to have such a talented artist on their payroll. I can't wait to see his interpretation of Northern Gun come to life in the new books, hurry up already Palladium!

[EmeraldToucanet]

They could get pretty redundant if Palladium isn't careful, but looking at the upcoming releases, it could go either way. For example Megaverse in Flames will likely involve familiar areas, but if done right it will still be solid fresh new material, and not just covering things that other books have covered (hopefully it will include things like solid new OCCs, cool new demons and dyvals, and hopefully it moves the game world forward in a good way). But they could fall into the trap of just retreading well worn ground.
Then we have more Chaos Earth stuff, that ....well, some day that will come out, and I doubt it will be redundant. But as long as they are creating material that genuinely enriches a part of the world, then the books aren't really redundant. Plus there's still parts of the Three Galaxies that I really would like to see fleshed out more, and always the possibility of interesting new dimensions being detailed (no they aren't Earth, but they are still part of Rifts).

[Lt Gargoyle]

well i would like these ones myself. just so i can see if my imaged version of Northern Gun is how they see it. I have truthfully stoped using the world books for anything but tidbits of info. If something sounds good ok, i ll use it. but i prefer to simply make the world my own. So the core books are all i need. though i do like the robots and PAs.

What i honestly think they should do is focus on some of the other deimensions like EmeraldToucanet suggested already. MAybe some alien technology that is not for the PCs to ever use. Some monstrous creature and supernatual stuff that haunts every PCs dreams. Something that eats the power core of robots and PA.

flesh out the rest of the megaverse. take some time from rifts earth and stop over crowding a place which was suppose to be pretty barren and bleak.

[EmeraldToucanet]

There are some places I would still like to see fleshed out more in Rifts, like the US West Coast and the Forbidden Barrier (where supposedly a lot of Elemental Fusionists come from so we know there are some people living there, and there could be lots of interesting creatures there and further west). That the elemental fusionists from the Forbidden Barrier are secretive about what's there, makes me just want to know about it more (even the name makes it sound like there should be some sort of really interesting mysterious, and probably very dangerous thing there). Some tidbits on Hawaii would be nice too (though that has been touched on in Rifter issues I hear, so I guess I should pick those up). But still I would much rather see a couple more Dimension books, and see the planned Chaos Earth books finished.

[azazel1024]

Well don't hold your breath on "before the end of the year".

My rainy day (where I am) depressive post is, "it won't happen before next year. If we are lucky".

Latest Robotech book has been said to be going to Harmony Gold "in a day or three" for something like 2 or 3 weeks now. It is now October and the next book is going to be Vampire Kingdoms Sourcebook 1. Originally that book was all but done last year. Now Kevin has been talking about lots of added material to what had been written and choosen to be in it, plus lots of writing and editing he needs to do.

Instead of maybe 1-2 weeks till printer on it, something tells me if Kevin rips through it, it is a month till printer on that one. That is once Genesis pits is done. Earliest NG1 might be "next in line" is probably early November. MAYBE.

Supposing Megaverse in flames doesn't step up th the plate first. Or Genesis pits doesn't take extra time or VK:SB1 doesn't take longer.

Then NG1 is likely to take at least 3-4 weeks to finish and get to the printer...and well PB has never done a book release between Thanksgiving and the New Year. At least not in my memory/last decade. The instant Thanksgiving week hits, they are all busy with their family/friends and/or getting Christmas Grab bags out the door. I am sure a little book work happens in there, but they haven't published a book in the last many years in that period.

So if it isn't the printer before Thanksgiving, I'd bet very large sums of money it won't be done till the New Year. Once it hits the New Year, I am sure there will be at least a couple of weeks of getting over New Year "funk" and or flu or what have you. Maybe February before it is back from the printer?

Yes, I am being horrible pessimistic, and maybe a might unfair. However, that would follow in with the typical track record of PB over the last decade. Rare is the book, no matter how "done" it is, that gets finished in less than 4 weeks once Kevin finally gets his hands on it as the next book in line for printing (its happened maybe every year or two for the last 10 years). Typically it takes 5-10 weeks per book (part of the reason PB is averaging only 4-6 books a year, not including Rifters).

In general, promises are in the 2-4 week range once a book is next to go and always plan on it taking at least twice as long as Kevin says it will initially.

[azazel1024]

That negative post out of the way. I am really looking forward to NG1&2. Northern Gun is one of the places I have been dying for PB to flesh out a little bit.

MI is also up there (included in the NG books?).

Lazlo and New Lazlo would also be nice to have them covered a little more. Honestly once that is done I'll feel pretty covered on the NA front. A follow up book on Russia and Japan would be nice as well as maybe another book or two detailing a bit more of Europe would be nice as well. The Russia books and Triax get in to the rest of Europe a little, but are still fairly vague.

A follow on to Mutants in Orbit (a book or three) would also be really nice.

Oh, also that Rifts Underseas 2 book.

I could see how they could continue pumping out books for a really long time to come, ones that I'd be interested in too. I also hope another Phase World book or three isn't too far out in the offing. That pirates and smugglers book sounded/sounds interesting. I hope it sees the light of day.

That said, NG1 and 2 would be my main wants and I'd feel fairly happy with the state of things once I see those two.

[Lt Gargoyle]

i would really like it if they leave the west coast of alone. I also would not count on it before christmas. but it would be nice.

[Icefalcon]

I seriously doubt either book will see print in this year.

[earthhawk]

So I just read the last update and for what I could understand it looks like the books will delayed. I'm thinking we won't see the Northern Gun books until February or March at the earliest. Or who knows, maybe we won't see them at all. On a good note, Christmas Packages are here! Sorry, but I can't get excited for grab-bag items when I'm still waiting for actual books to be released. I'm doing my best not to get to negative or pessimistic, but I had sinking feeling this would happen. Enjoy your grab bags.

[ExoKnight]

So I just read the last update and for what I could understand it looks like the books will delayed. I'm thinking we won't see the Northern Gun books until February or March at the earliest. Or who knows, maybe we won't see them at all. On a good note, Christmas Packages are here! Sorry, but I can't get excited for grab-bag items when I'm still waiting for actual books to be released. I'm doing my best not to get to negative or pessimistic, but I had sinking feeling this would happen. Enjoy your grab bags.

It doesn't look like Northern Gun is going to happen this year. Lets hope we get it before the next crowdfunder.

[Sureshot]

I seriously doubt either book will see print in this year.

Or at most the first NG 1 probably at the last minute. For the next kickstarter I would demand Kevin gave a time frame. Why should fans offer money for a kickstarter that maybe months or even half a year or longer late. It's not being fair to the fans imo.

[Nether]

Here i was thinking that NG1 was already released but then reading this i am just shaking my head thinking myself a fool for falling for the crying wolf. It really looked like they were starting to very slowly make the changes needed to succeed, and avoid their major pitfalls of the past...

You know what the worst part about this is?
It means that even after the devastating event that almost destroyed PB, that PB hasn't changed one iota.

So they still have threads about saving PB, which is a scam, otherwise they would have got rid of them years ago.
Now they have thought up new ways to 'trick' us out of money for products that we may never see or at the very least in PB style, be very very very very very very late.

Sinse PB can't seem to pull their... get things right for shipping, maybe they should just adapt the policy of no book get ANY mention that it is in the works, in process, in development until it is at the printers and even then, it will still probably ship very late, but prolly within a few months versus a few years or never.

You know this is a pretty negative post about their abilities, and I have given alot of faith to them, but this just shows me their colours. It is sad and depressing to see something so many of us love be run thru the mud like this.

[Icefalcon]

After reading the weekly update, I am a little angry. Are they seriously working harder on getting miniatures games out than they are working on books? I understand they are going through another company for development for the miniatures game but Kevin is still spending too much time worrying about that and someone else's comic kickstarter than on getting us the books he PROMISED by the end of the year. This weeks update is very skimpy on the details of the NG books but by the indications, all of the work is not yet in on these titles. How do they hope to have even NG 1 out before 2013 if they don't even have all of the work?

After I get these two books, I am done with any further Insiders from Palladium. Their are way too many other companies out there that offer their books in a more timely manner. It looks like I am going to have to leave off Palladium for another 10 years or until they can get their act together.

[Sureshot]

The sad part is even with some posters being angry in this thread it's not going to change anything imo. At most they are going to be seen as posters like myself. Being overly negative. Not posters with any leigimate complaints. At the end of the day since the majority of the fanbase don't say anything they can take anything they do towards them for granted. I seriously thought that once they started kickstarting that they would at least have enough business sense to focus on kickstarters. Apparently not. It seems Kevin jumps from project to project. Not focusing on one or the other. With no one at PB taking him aside and saying "maybe you should focus on project first". Before anyone says that they do. Sorry but I refuse to beleive you on that. His past murmurs seem to show someone trying to do everything and anything. No prioritizing. No focusing on one project. What bothers even more is that they went so far as to use a sob story type of murmur. I can understand still being aqffected by the death of loved ones the COT is old news at this point. The murmur felt less like a apology to the fans and more as a way to make us feel sorry for them. Yes we get it bad things have happened to PB and in general. Well PB and the people who work a the company don't have a monopoly on bad things happening to them.

On my end 2012 was a lousy year. A mom in the hospital for cariac arrest. A grandmother that passed away. A father that was admitted to the hoapital this week because of heart problems. Nothing major for my dad and he is coming out tommorow but it's stress on stress. I could have fallen apart. Asked my freinds and others to feel sorry for me. Got up dusted myself off and and moving forward. I still stick to my theory that PB misunderstood what a kickstarter was for. It was not another one for them to beg for cash and not deliver. It was to get certain books out the door in a reasonable amount of time. I wonder if the company realizes how much bad pr they are generating and the resentment from the fans by taking the fans money that going "oops well we did it again. The company does not care really. The last murmur while a little apologetic does really come across as someone who is really sorry for the delays. Even some of their defenders are starting to question their decisions which is imo not a good thing. I'm not going to fault them for going after the minis game because it may have been a opportunity they could not pass up. Promoting someone else kickstarter you just don't do that when your own kikcstarters are late by weeks and from the looks of it by months. Get your own house in order before trying to help someone else out first.

Despite Kevins and anyone else saying it's not true the company is just damn determined to not change anything. Nothing. Here i'm thinking okay unless a company really screws up how can they go wrong with kickstarting a product. Since every other kickstarter either from big companies or small companies with less staff and resources that I have sent cash for have delivered. As usual everyone else seems to thrive and get their books out on time with kickstarters. PB is late even with a influx of cash from the fans. If as a company you can't deleiver on time because of a lack of resources well don't promise to get boos out. And don't takes the fans money. Just seems wrong to take th money than go "opps we did it again". When it's out of your pocket take all the time you need. I doubt fans of any kickstarter expect their moeny to be locked in to a kickstarter with a indefinite amount of time. On a personal level you can't help but go "why would it be different this time around". Intution told me not to invest any PB kickstarters. I'm glad I listened, I also wanted to wait and see if they could actually get at least one of them out on time. No such luck and I'm not investing in any kickstarters from PB in the forseeable future. Same old staus quo being held up no matter the cost to the company.

[azazel1024]

After reading the weekly update, I am a little angry. Are they seriously working harder on getting miniatures games out than they are working on books? I understand they are going through another company for development for the miniatures game but Kevin is still spending too much time worrying about that and someone else's comic kickstarter than on getting us the books he PROMISED by the end of the year. This weeks update is very skimpy on the details of the NG books but by the indications, all of the work is not yet in on these titles. How do they hope to have even NG 1 out before 2013 if they don't even have all of the work?

After I get these two books, I am done with any further Insiders from Palladium. Their are way too many other companies out there that offer their books in a more timely manner. It looks like I am going to have to leave off Palladium for another 10 years or until they can get their act together.

But, it could be a great business venture for them! Like the minitures they had already done.

And yeah, I am getting pretty annoyed that Kevin can't focus enough on getting books out the door and has to spend the time, energy, etc that his is on other pet projects, which may or may not see the light of day and may (or most likely?) won't contribute to PBs bottom line much. Oh, I hope the project is a smash hit. However, especially as many have mentioned, I paid for NG1 and 2 already. I understoond Genesis pits and VK:SB1 were coming before them and they are contractually obligated on times frames for Robotech books. That said, the fact that focus seems so diffuse on getting those books out and then hammering out NG1 and 2 really pisses me off this time around.

Lemuria was endlessly delayed first off (after starting the whole MI thing) and now NG1 and 2 are (well, I guess VK:SB1 is as well, by a good year or more now on that one). Hanging on is all nice and good, but deadlines have been so bad (worse than I think I have ever seen them, even during the height of the CoT, which is now years in the past) combined with the MI, which is a great idea, but only if you can DELIVER the products you are having people pre-pay for in a resonable time frame.

I am firmly (now anyway) in the camp of we paid up front, you need to get the darned books out, yesterday! Yes a little slippage, stuff happens. Half a year (which is what it looks like it'll be, if not more) is not a little slippage. That is just SNAFU.

I do also agree on getting the best possible books out. But they also need to be the best possible books within a RESONABLE time frame (and considering some of the errors I and others have found in some of the books the last few years, they are NOT the best they could possibly be. At least not from an editing stand point, even if the plot/narrative/content on the whole is very good). At some point continuing improvement has to yeild way for slipping release date and just get the book out. There also needs to be more focus on the core business, releasing the books.

I "started back" maybe 3-4 years ago after having taken 2-3 years off of PB/RPGs. However, my patients with slipping dates and unfullfilled promises (and a general refusal to get with even the first years of the 21st century, come on PB, it took some serious shaming to get you to do a FB page, lets just do PDFs for everything and call it a day!) is pretty much at its limit. If next year isn't actually better like Kevin has been claiming for years, I just don't know that I can stick around anymore. I should probably just chill out and let it go, but it is just too frustrating for me.

[earthhawk]

I'm glad Palladium was able to get the much needed cash influx from the kickstarters, in the same breath, I'm glad I didn't participate. My assumption is that the kickstarter money from NG 1 & 2 went to the miniatures game for Robotech. Unfortunately very few people play Robotech... Guess I'll check in again next year for these books.

[Mack]

So they still have threads about saving PB, which is a scam, otherwise they would have got rid of them years ago.

No, that's just the Mods not pruning the boards (which the vast majority of posters don't want us to do).

[Nether]

So they still have threads about saving PB, which is a scam, otherwise they would have got rid of them years ago.

No, that's just the Mods not pruning the boards (which the vast majority of posters don't want us to do).

I myself would be all for pruning in this case as it leaves a very bad taste when looked upon about a year from the date of occurrence. If anything i would think it should have the title updated to show that it is OVER and Finished, therefore new or old readers aren't shaking their heads wondering whats up.

But at current it still looks like PB is still in a crisis and asking for helping handouts. This really needs a "Resolved or Finished" tag on it.

Then this issue with deadlines has not been resolved at all, nor has 'experience' from the past seemed to have bring them wisdom on how to better improve this Major Major issue that is allowed to keep plaguing them.

I think i am normally a very optimistic person, but how many times do you have run and check on the little boy you love to death, who cried wolf before you throw in the towel and say no more? Obviously I am still here but I like many on these boards are the extreme few that are left that have been destroyed by these faults that just wont get addressed. And now we just get sob story after sob story of poor me or excuse, excuse, excuse to why these things are as they are. This is out of the norm for me, but at the same time I think I have 'earned' the right to be a little bitter about such things when i have given so much devotion to this company.

I would love to see the NG books before the end of the year, but I will put money down right now that says it won't happen.

[ExoKnight]

So they still have threads about saving PB, which is a scam, otherwise they would have got rid of them years ago.

No, that's just the Mods not pruning the boards (which the vast majority of posters don't want us to do).

Same fans as the ones Kevin used for his market research?

[earthhawk]

I'm not trying to disparage Palladium or anyone works there, I'm just voicing my disappointment that the modus operandi seems to be the same. Every year we hear how things are turning around, sales are up, and new ideas are flowing. Yet, for some unknown reason, when it comes to releasing books, they just don't seem to have found a reliable system that allows them to get stuff done in a timely manner.

[Icefalcon]

I'm not trying to disparage Palladium or anyone works there, I'm just voicing my disappointment that the modus operandi seems to be the same. Every year we hear how things are turning around, sales are up, and new ideas are flowing. Yet, for some unknown reason, when it comes to releasing books, they just don't seem to have found a reliable system that allows them to get stuff done in a timely manner.

If they don't streamline this process soon, they are going to lose even more business and will never attract the newer gamers that they are going to need to keep their games alive.

[ffranceschi]

Ok, Let's assume that they are unable to release books in a timely manner. How did they survive so far? The Crowd funding "thing" is rather new to count it as the silver bullet. The Christmas Surprise Packages? There is only one explanation, IMHO: the fan base (the one in the forums and the others) must be TRULY LOYAL and they have bought everything they can during the past ten years o more. So, no matter the delays, they will be there for PB. I think there are 300 die hard PB fans or something like this (my guess).

However, if I were Kevin, I would concentrate all my firepower in new books and I would hire someone TO COMPLY with a strict schedule.

[Nether]

Wizards bought Dnd and turned it into a stronger game and improved their professional attitude and deadlines. Now 4e is a joke but at least they came right out and said they F'ed up, they know it and they apologize and they are trying to fix it with the new in works system.

So what this tells me is PB needs to either hire some professional business savvy employs that have enough power to enforce productivity and responsibility, or hire another company to fix them.

It just seems most other game companies are adapting to the times, whereas PB in stuck in the past. Just my perception of it.

[Mack]

I believe some folks don't realize just how small a company Palladium is. Last I knew it was less than 10 people, total. They don't have the depth of resources of other game companies.

[Sureshot]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources" when fans were asked to help kickstart two books that are delayed. To who knows when. Kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth to be honest. What is being forgotten and ignored is that once you ask the fans to help bail out your company you have to improve how some things are done. A "whoops we did it again with the release dates" is imo not helping either. I don't blame some fans for being uhappy at the delays with the kickstarters. One assumed that the money was not only to get it printed yet also to be released in a reasonable amount of time. No mention of the books possibly being delayed were included in the kickstarter description. Or a release date. Nor were the fans told be patient because of the size of the company. All this was brought up after the kickstarters were funded and money taken.

Robotech can't be ignored because of contractual reasons. The mini game maybe be a hit yet I doubt it. Books are still late. Not only that books that were payed out of pocket by the fans. PB is very very lucky a large chunck of their fanbase is willing to be taken for granted or at least very forgiving. Any other company would have the fans ripping them a new one. Then again if the majority of the fans are willing to forgive them anything and everything why would PB change anything. So at this point we can only hope to see the NG gun books this year. But spare us the small company with less resources because imo it's a slap in the face of the fans who invested in their kickstarters. Why even take the money if the company is so lacking in resources to not get the books out on time.

[DhAkael]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources" when fans were asked to help kickstart two books that are delayed. T who knows when. Kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth to be honest. What is being forgotten and ignored is that once you ask the fans to help bail out your company you have to improve how some things are done. A "whoops we did it again with the release dates" is imo not helping either. I don't blame some fans for being uhappy at the delays with the kickstarters. One assumed that the money was not only to get it printed yet also to be released in a reasonable amount of time. No mention of the books possibly being delayed were included in the kickstarter description. Or a release date. Nor were the fans told be patient because of the size of the company. All this was brought up after the kickstarters were funded and money taken.

Robotech can't be ignored because of contractual reasons. The mini game maybe be a hit yet I doubt it. Books are still late. Not only that books that were payed out of pocket by the fans. PB is very very lucky a large chunck of their fanbase is willing to be taken for granted or at least very forgiving. Any other company would have the fans ripping them a new one. Then again if the majority of the fans are willing to forgive them anything and everything why would PB change anything. So at this point we can only hope to see the NG gun books this year. But spare us the small company with less resources because imo it's a slap in the face of the fans who invested in their kickstarters. Why even take the money if the company is so lacking in resources to not get the books out on time.

Seconded. With aces.

[Galroth]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources" when fans were asked to help kickstart two books that are delayed. T who knows when. Kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth to be honest. What is being forgotten and ignored is that once you ask the fans to help bail out your company you have to improve how some things are done. A "whoops we did it again with the release dates" is imo not helping either. I don't blame some fans for being uhappy at the delays with the kickstarters. One assumed that the money was not only to get it printed yet also to be released in a reasonable amount of time. No mention of the books possibly being delayed were included in the kickstarter description. Or a release date. Nor were the fans told be patient because of the size of the company. All this was brought up after the kickstarters were funded and money taken.

Robotech can't be ignored because of contractual reasons. The mini game maybe be a hit yet I doubt it. Books are still late. Not only that books that were payed out of pocket by the fans. PB is very very lucky a large chunck of their fanbase is willing to be taken for granted or at least very forgiving. Any other company would have the fans ripping them a new one. Then again if the majority of the fans are willing to forgive them anything and everything why would PB change anything. So at this point we can only hope to see the NG gun books this year. But spare us the small company with less resources because imo it's a slap in the face of the fans who invested in their kickstarters. Why even take the money if the company is so lacking in resources to not get the books out on time.

To be fair this is a widespread problem with kickstarter type projects, it isn't just Palladium. Although PB has a well documented history of missing deadlines.

[Zamion138]

im pretty disapointed , i figured it was going to be like lumaria i paid into the kick starter and i think it was a bit over a month afterward my stuff showed up.
I figured since the thing for book one and two were alwready done that you know at least 1 would be in a box at my house with a month of say getting the money fro my preorder on 2...... id be suprised if i get either before new years

[ffranceschi]

Wizards bought Dnd and turned it into a stronger game and improved their professional attitude and deadlines. Now 4e is a joke but at least they came right out and said they F'ed up, they know it and they apologize and they are trying to fix it with the new in works system.

So what this tells me is PB needs to either hire some professional business savvy employs that have enough power to enforce productivity and responsibility, or hire another company to fix them.

It just seems most other game companies are adapting to the times, whereas PB in stuck in the past. Just my perception of it.

Wizards of the Coast did ok but at the end, it hurted TSR, and HASBRO gave it the final death blow. DnD 4th Edition was the end of D&D as we knew it (a disaster!). Please, I prefer Palladium, and its delays than to fall in the trap of hiring lots of "professional people" that don't understand the "feeling of the RPG properties". They only need ONE guy who works hard everyday to make the others keep on the schedule. But at the end of the day, I trust Kevin's judgement...so far he wrote LOTS of the best books that I have ever read!!!

[Sureshot]

Unlike PB Wotc is actually trying to learn from some of it's mistakes and trying not to repeat them. PB not only keeps repeating the same mistakes they do nothing to improve let alone prevent the mistakes. WotC is playtesting the latest version of D&D coming out out (5E). When is the last time PB did a playtest of their of their latest material. I rather have a bunch of professionals. Maybe some of them may not understand the feeling of rpg properties (whatever the hell that means). Most usually do atleast I can get my books on time. Than having one person who keeps making the same mistakes over and over again and delaying books for years sometimes decades. Even when the fans give him money to make sure the product is published. Who imo never seems to learn from previous mistakes. And imo at this point is taking the fanbase for granted. Wotc is at least trying to get some of their market share and their fanbase back. PB is determined to do neither.

[Mack]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources"...

I think my point about PB's size was missed. Several folks have advocated hiring project managers, or a cabal of consultants, which simply isn't within PB's financial reach.

Is PB's track record of book releases satisfying? Nope, not by a long shot. But doubling the corporate staff isn't feasible. (Unless someone here knows a team of pro bono production managers.)

----EDIT----
Or perhaps they're recovering better than I thought. Noticed this is the Weekly Update:

I need to hire some additional staff next year,

[Icefalcon]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources"...

I think my point about PB's size was missed. Several folks have advocated hiring project managers, or a cabal of consultants, which simply isn't within PB's financial reach.

Is PB's track record of book releases satisfying? Nope, not by a long shot. But doubling the corporate staff isn't feasible. (Unless someone here knows a team of pro bono production managers.)

----EDIT----
Or perhaps they're recovering better than I thought. Noticed this is the Weekly Update:

I need to hire some additional staff next year,

But Mack, people here have offered to do work for free. A good large number of them if I remember correctly. They have offered mostly to edit, which we all know Kevin will not turn over to anyone else. That is the one area that the company needs more, experienced people. I am not saying that Kevin is not talented, just that a professional editor would go a long way to getting the books out the door on time.

[Mack]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources"...

I think my point about PB's size was missed. Several folks have advocated hiring project managers, or a cabal of consultants, which simply isn't within PB's financial reach.

Is PB's track record of book releases satisfying? Nope, not by a long shot. But doubling the corporate staff isn't feasible. (Unless someone here knows a team of pro bono production managers.)

----EDIT----
Or perhaps they're recovering better than I thought. Noticed this is the Weekly Update:

I need to hire some additional staff next year,

But Mack, people here have offered to do work for free. A good large number of them if I remember correctly. They have offered mostly to edit, which we all know Kevin will not turn over to anyone else. That is the one area that the company needs more, experienced people. I am not saying that Kevin is not talented, just that a professional editor would go a long way to getting the books out the door on time.

I don't believe grammatical editting is a schedule driver for PB. Generating the content and ensuring it dovetails with KS's vision is the challange. Even if a freelancer turns in a good manuscript, it still must be reviewed by KS himself to assure a proper fit. My suspicion is that running the company takes up enough of KS's time that he can't devote as much energy to writing/editting as he (and we!) would like.

However, I'll admit it's all speculation on our part. None of us know what the true bottlenecks are.

[PhellaOne]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources"...

I think my point about PB's size was missed. Several folks have advocated hiring project managers, or a cabal of consultants, which simply isn't within PB's financial reach.

Is PB's track record of book releases satisfying? Nope, not by a long shot. But doubling the corporate staff isn't feasible. (Unless someone here knows a team of pro bono production managers.)

----EDIT----
Or perhaps they're recovering better than I thought. Noticed this is the Weekly Update:

I need to hire some additional staff next year,

I offered Kevin my services personally. I offered to work as a janitor at the office and BUY MY HOUSE in Michigan just to have him listen to the ideas I have. I have TONS of material to turn in, but I haven't turned in any of it because of the manuscript "limbo" that is Palladium Books. So I kept it and tweaked it for my own personal use. I knew that just turning in a manuscript would take "forever and a day" (let alone MANY manuscripts!) and was willing to take the drastic measures necessary to have Kevin hear me out in full, and in person (I can talk for WEEKS about what's going through my head and I absolutely HATE phonecalls; I need to look someone in the eyes to actually guage their reactions). I proofread all my own work (not SpellCheck as somebody here on the Forums claims to do!), cross-reference every detail to eliminate "canon conflicts", and even got banned from these very Forums for writing a post about the grammer, spelling, and overall jibberish that seems prevalent here (I'm not attacking or insulting anyone right now, so calm down ). I have spotted EVERY SINGLE typo and inconsistency in EVERY book I have, and have been VERY VOCAL in questioning their claims at the amount of time they've spent "editing". Needless to say, I got NO RESPONSE.
Then I called the office under respectable advice from some popular guys here on the Forums. I got in contact with Alex M. and pitched my project to him (he brought a few things to the table and for that I thank you, Alex; the project has "evolved" yet again due to some of the things you mentioned; I learn even when you're not aware that you're teaching ). Even though he shot down MOST of what I mentioned, he was curious about my "100% complete, 20 minute PC sheets". He said he was going to bring it up to the Boss Man and call me back on that specific application. True to his word Alex called back and shot THAT down as well, saying that KS was ALREADY WORKING ON THE SAME THING. OK, fine, whatever. My opinion is that it will be the same caliber as the rest of Palladium's "non-publishing" material (if it EVER comes out ) and wasn't threatened by it. So, SPOILER COMING, Alex M. told me over the summer that they (Palladium Books) have a quick, 21st century "PC Generator" in the works and it was "Top Secret". I guess that Alex only has a "Secret" clearance at Palladium Books because he wasn't aware of it until he brought up our conversation to the Boss Man (I understand, I still have "just" a Secret military clearance myself).

Now, before the Moderators get upset, I need everyone to know that I have been a customer/fan for over twenty years and have tried to do what I could from my location without actually getting caught up in the chaos. References:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=126498
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=93938
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=100675
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=126534
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=126739
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=126675
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=126537
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=126754
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=127307
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=93947
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=131248
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=132396
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=127042

This post is simply me stating my personal frustration and the actions I've taken to try and correct these issues. I've been in contact with people who've worked at/for Palladium Books and EVERYONE says the same thing about the internal workings (don't ask who I've spoken to, but there aren't too many names on the list so I'm sure most people can figure it out; I spoke to them on the condition that I NOT mention them by name, and I keep my word on ALL things ).

I've been accused by the Moderators of being overly critical and of crying that "Palladium didn't do things my way, so it's wrong" (and implying that I was butt-hurt ; well we already KNOW Palladium's way ISN'T the "right way", so you can't dismiss my suggestions as the "wrong way" until you either prove me wrong or Palladium figures out their own "right way" ).

So to any who are interested, I'm looking for some imaginative people to help with the current incarnation of my project. It's been a slower going than I originally planned, but I make no excuses to it and now accept the fact that it'll happen when it happens. And it WILL happen. My slogan is "That’s How We Imagined It!™", and I now invite you to become a part of the "we". If you can write (or even if you just have some cool ideas/concepts), draw (full-page, quarter-page, black and white, and/or full color), have legal experience (IP's and patents mainly), or business experience (We're starting from the ground up!), you are invited to join my project. There will be a serious screening involved and those who are invited onboard will have some paperwork to sign (nothing too restrictive, but it will include some non-disclosure stuff). Once onboard, that's when I tell you what it is, NOT BEFORE. I'll also grant those who make it to the temporary site that's holding the info. Although the project originates from "pen & paper" RPG's, that's not where it ends. Not by a LONGSHOT!

Some of you have offered to help, and I've reached out to others (you know who you are, pros and amatuers alike ), but now the call goes out to any and all who want to see their imaginations come to life in one form of media or another.

Don't send me a PM through this site, email me directly at phellaone@yahoo.com

Two things: I'm not in this for the money, although if all goes according to plan, that'll happen on it's own. And, this is just the beginning.

[Icefalcon]

It's a little late to use "PB is a small company with not as much resources"...

I think my point about PB's size was missed. Several folks have advocated hiring project managers, or a cabal of consultants, which simply isn't within PB's financial reach.

Is PB's track record of book releases satisfying? Nope, not by a long shot. But doubling the corporate staff isn't feasible. (Unless someone here knows a team of pro bono production managers.)

----EDIT----
Or perhaps they're recovering better than I thought. Noticed this is the Weekly Update:

I need to hire some additional staff next year,

But Mack, people here have offered to do work for free. A good large number of them if I remember correctly. They have offered mostly to edit, which we all know Kevin will not turn over to anyone else. That is the one area that the company needs more, experienced people. I am not saying that Kevin is not talented, just that a professional editor would go a long way to getting the books out the door on time.

I don't believe grammatical editting is a schedule driver for PB. Generating the content and ensuring it dovetails with KS's vision is the challange. Even if a freelancer turns in a good manuscript, it still must be reviewed by KS himself to assure a proper fit. My suspicion is that running the company takes up enough of KS's time that he can't devote as much energy to writing/editting as he (and we!) would like.

However, I'll admit it's all speculation on our part. None of us know what the true bottlenecks are.

I will admit that for the most part, it is all speculation. However, things like book release schedule delays are based off of evidence of Palladium's records over the last 10 years or so.

[Sureshot]

I think Kevin should take a page from H.P. lovecraft. Have his own vision of the Cthulhu Mythos yet also allow others to write in the same universe. Even if they did not fit HPL vision. Even if Kevin hire 50 new people it makes no differece imo. If they all get stalled at the editing bottleneck. It seems a mix of fitting in to kevins vision and a fear of someone writing something better than kevin or a mix of both.

[Sureshot]

I will admit that for the most part, it is all speculation. However, things like book release schedule delays are based off of evidence of Palladium's records over the last 10 years or so.

Its not like 2012 like other years was a slow year. The slow releases and missed release dates have been happening for the last 10 years. If not even longer.

[earthhawk]

On a positive note I think these books will be awesome, even if they are the last Palladium books that I'll buy (at least until there's an update to the rules). I just wish that they [PB] could get things out on time, or at least close to the schedules posted on the website.

[Icefalcon]

On a positive note I think these books will be awesome, even if they are the last Palladium books that I'll buy (at least until there's an update to the rules). I just wish that they [PB] could get things out on time, or at least close to the schedules posted on the website.

I have already decided that I won't buy anything new from the company for a long time because of their reluctance to update the system. I will keep checking back, year to year, until they do so but I will not buy anything until then.

[azazel1024]

I think one of the things PB needs the most is a staff member who can take care of a lot of the business end of things for PB (handling contract stuff with Harmony Gold, paying the bills, working with the bank, etc, etc). I am sure it doesn't take up massive amounts of Kevin's time, but he talks about it a lot.

However, I think for reasons in the past (CoT) Kevin would be unwilling to not handling 99-100% of the business side of things himself ever again (for better or for worse).

Much has been written about the writing/editing process at PB in the past and I doubt that will change and likely remains a pretty weak spot for PB.

I think when it comes down to it, unless Kevin changes how the books actually go through their process or unloads some of the work her does on someone else, things will not get out the door faster. Which is part of the reason I wish Kevin would be more realistic on dates. How is a new year going to be any different when you haven't really changed how you do anything???

[Sureshot]

I think Kevin wants to give the fanbase hope. Except that is meaningless when you cant deliver your books on time. Telling me to expect "six rifts books in 2013". When the books from 2012 you advertised as a company are still not out and possibly delayed to 2013. Well why would I get my hopes up. Why would I believie 2013 is going to be any different from 2012. Its not going to change. As long as its jus the usual fans like myself bringing up the issue they dont really care. I mean after all if the majority quietly stays silent and does not complian o say anything well if I was PB I would not change a thing. From the looks of it though the lateness of the NG books is having the effect of fans leaving once again. Maybe a trickle this year but imo its not going to get any better. Fans PB cant afford to lose. Yet when your not going to change anything why should some fans put up with it.

[Icefalcon]

According to today's Murmur, "estimated" release dates are pushed back another month. Kevin puts release of NG1 at December and NG2 at January. What happened to the "promise" they would be out THIS year?

[earthhawk]

According to today's Murmur, "estimated" release dates are pushed back another month. Kevin puts release of NG1 at December and NG2 at January. What happened to the "promise" they would be out THIS year?

"Meanwhile, we are moving forward on all fronts. It is my personal mission to get Robotech® Genesis Pits and Rifts® Vampires Sourcebook, if possible, in your hands in November. Rifts® Northern Gun™ One in December, and Rifts® Northern Gun™ Two in January."

Sad, really really sad. I was under the impression that participating in the Megaversal Insider would help them [Palladium Books] pay bills, create new product, and most importantly release their product according to their schedule. I hate to say this but I'm starting to feel like a sucker. I bought into the smoke and mirrors of how if I, as a true fan of Palladium Books, would gladly pre-order a black and white, hardcover book for $50 or more. If I paid more than that I could get my name on the inside of the book as a true champion of Palladium Books (unfortunately misspelled). So now, after all of the hype has worn off, we are still at square one: books promised and not delivered on time again and again. Nothing has changed and nothing will ever change. It's business as usual. The next time a Megaversal Insider goes up I'll be sure to pass and let someone else get their hopes up.

[ExoKnight]

There is no way Northern Gun is going to come out this year. Disappointed myself but the reality is quite clear now.

[kaid]

Hopefully the vampire book will be out in november but I would be terribly surprised to see NG1/2 or megaverse in flames make it before early next year. I am not mocking writing speeds or anything of that nature its just that publishing and shipping in december has some very limited windows due to the holiday season so pretty much if its not almost totally finished by the end of november it won't ship till jan or later. I am not to worried about it as long as they are done well I will enjoy them when they appear.

[Icefalcon]

The longer they put these two books off, the more help they will loose during the next Megaversal Insider. Some people are just now realizing how much Kevin lied in all of those weekly updates and Murmurs. I have already decided I will not participate in another one until they can have three straight years of stability without blaming any more of their problems on the Crisis of Treachery.

[flatline]

I have already decided that I won't buy anything new from the company for a long time because of their reluctance to update the system. I will keep checking back, year to year, until they do so but I will not buy anything until then.

Even if they did revamp the system and managed to create something really good, it would offer them essentially no competitive advantage since every other game also has a decent system. But most other games have lackluster settings or, even if they started with good settings, drove them into the ground by rehashing them with every update to the system.

Systems are a dime a dozen.

Good settings are hard to find and creating good settings happens to be something that Kevin has a knack for.

Why should Kevin waste time revamping the system when it's his settings that set his books apart from the rest of the industry?

I would actually be extremely happy if Kevin abandoned Rifts Earth entirely and focused on creating new settings with no more than 3 or 4 books per setting. He can continue to use his mediocre system and I will continue to ignore his system while I adapt his wonderful settings for my own purposes.

--flatline

[earthhawk]

I have already decided that I won't buy anything new from the company for a long time because of their reluctance to update the system. I will keep checking back, year to year, until they do so but I will not buy anything until then.

Even if they did revamp the system and managed to create something really good, it would offer them essentially no competitive advantage since every other game also has a decent system. But most other games have lackluster settings or, even if they started with good settings, drove them into the ground by rehashing them with every update to the system.

Systems are a dime a dozen.

Good settings are hard to find and creating good settings happens to be something that Kevin has a knack for.

Why should Kevin waste time revamping the system when it's his settings that set his books apart from the rest of the industry?

I would actually be extremely happy if Kevin abandoned Rifts Earth entirely and focused on creating new settings with no more than 3 or 4 books per setting. He can continue to use his mediocre system and I will continue to ignore his system while I adapt his wonderful settings for my own purposes.

--flatline

The setting will only go so far. If your reputation as a company is the consistent inability to meet deadlines, then what do you really have? A game with a great setting, antiquated rules, and a track record of releasing books far beyond set release dates. Plus add in the fact that the company uses gimmicks and promises to generate cash flow instead of producing product on time. Sorry but I'm not buying into anymore sob stories about declining sales and how with my help they'll be able to turn the corner in this all to frequency rough patch. You'll need to find a new angle to get my money in the future.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I also noticed the repeated promises of 5 or 6 books out this year seem to evaporated. Careful use of "Try to get it out by___ " has replaced it.

On the one hand, I'm happy that it seems he's listened when we've complained about him making promises that everyone knows he can't keep.

On the other hand, he clearly is breaking his promises and not even addressing the fact. Which, while it's not a surprise to anyone, (( And you folks who were all "I'll think he'll do it!!" don't think we don't notice your silence!!)) it's still a disappointment to be so very clearly correct.

We may see Robotech before the end of the year. Depends on him getting the entire book off to HG (( How does one simply forget a chapter of the book so large it takes two weeks to edit?)) and getting it back.

Vamp sourcebook was rumored to have been written with Vamp Kingdoms revised. Which would mean most of the work on it should be cleaning and editing but we've received multiple posts that he's writing a ton of new stuff. Should it be MOSTLY written, polishing it up could POSSIBLY see it out in late November to mid Dec.

Some how... I'm not feeling it though. As others have pointed out there's holidays rolling up. Halloween is big for Kevin and Kathy. That's roughly a week you can mark off. Then in the end of November, Thanksgiving. Call it a week there too. That leaves december... remember Palladium printing turn arounds take 2 to 3 weeks... and there's christmas towards the end of December.

That only leaves 3 to 6 weeks to get the book done and printed.

Can it be done? Possibly.

Will it?........ I'm not going to be difinative. I'll say "Maybe" but "Probably not."

We might get one book before Christmas. I DOUBT we'll get two....


_________________ I HOPE I'M WRONG_____________

[Icefalcon]

I also noticed the repeated promises of 5 or 6 books out this year seem to evaporated. Careful use of "Try to get it out by___ " has replaced it.

On the one hand, I'm happy that it seems he's listened when we've complained about him making promises that everyone knows he can't keep.

On the other hand, he clearly is breaking his promises and not even addressing the fact. Which, while it's not a surprise to anyone, (( And you folks who were all "I'll think he'll do it!!" don't think we don't notice your silence!!)) it's still a disappointment to be so very clearly correct.

We may see Robotech before the end of the year. Depends on him getting the entire book off to HG (( How does one simply forget a chapter of the book so large it takes two weeks to edit?)) and getting it back.

Vamp sourcebook was rumored to have been written with Vamp Kingdoms revised. Which would mean most of the work on it should be cleaning and editing but we've received multiple posts that he's writing a ton of new stuff. Should it be MOSTLY written, polishing it up could POSSIBLY see it out in late November to mid Dec.

Some how... I'm not feeling it though. As others have pointed out there's holidays rolling up. Halloween is big for Kevin and Kathy. That's roughly a week you can mark off. Then in the end of November, Thanksgiving. Call it a week there too. That leaves december... remember Palladium printing turn arounds take 2 to 3 weeks... and there's christmas towards the end of December.

That only leaves 3 to 6 weeks to get the book done and printed.

Can it be done? Possibly.

Will it?........ I'm not going to be difinative. I'll say "Maybe" but "Probably not."

We might get one book before Christmas. I DOUBT we'll get two....


_________________ I HOPE I'M WRONG_____________

This!