Ideas for The Ultimate Supreme Villain

[jaymz]

i was allowed to create a greater norse giant reaver assassin with the gift of yggdrasil. Cutter, 80supernatural ps, autododge, all temporal magic(scrupolous alignment so wouldnt use necromancy),and all normal spells levels 1-5, bio-regenerate d4x100 mdc per melee, impervious fire&heat all types,change size 6-40 feet and 18000mdc. yea my offense consisted of timeslips and hiding alot. even totally immune to their weapons a wasp slamming you at mach2 does like 2d6x100md. he wound up luckily enough using a time space teleport escaping after the humans were able to board the mothership(we played the first book sdc=mdc for mechanoids) So basically a lesser god was pretty much curb stomped by the mechanoids, pretty easy since they just kept coming and coming thousands at a time.

NICE!

[say652]

i still look at his character sheet and weep. lol

[jaymz]

as you should

[say652]

psi stalker/gunslingers

[say652]

since most mechanoids are psychic using them as a global police force(see aura to determine alignment.) seems plausible and it could be the inherent flaws in mankind is what drove them into insane world destroying villians(they only way to save humanity is to end it type thing) i mean that would make a great campaign, things went well at first but suddenly our robot protectors started vaporizing people for littering. soa resistance(the pc's) must somehow stop this global police force.

[Tor]

Dougs four powerarmor crew consists of an Anti-Monster, a six armed light japanese borg police officer,a Naruni Repobot and a White Tiger shock trooper. all level 3. the team calls itself the "Metal Heads" and have even met Thor on one occasion(He walked past them on the training grounds of Asgard!!!! Truly inspiring to the team.) Doug wields two giant size warhammers surrounded by an energy field. The Metal Heads are currently looking for a norse giant named Cutter any help in tracking down this man would be appreciated. He is not wanted for a crime but is still considered extremely dangerous.

I think Thor could defeat the Metalheads. Do you concur?

Well Gods generally come from godlings, yes?

No, no they do not. This is not ever said, anywhere that I have seen, actually. I've heard of demigods being elevated to gods (Herakles, and while not said in Pantheons, this was also the case with Dionysus according to myth).

Mortals have also been elevated to gods, there's "she who walks circle" in Spirit West and maybe some other one. Gods have special abilities that go beyond that of mortals or godlings, the rules for their design have not been clarified to us.

Even with alien intelligences, we are only given generic rules that apply to most of them, but there are still unique cases. The possession powers of Nxla far eclipse anything you could roll up on the AI table, same with vampire intelligences.

Much like dragons come from hatchlings. At least that is how i've always seen them.

You could use a Godling to represent a young God I suppose, but it's not entirely how they work. If they did begin that way, they would gain abilities beyond Godlings.

As such then Gods would be essentially subject to the same rules. Apparently the gods in Pantheons break the rules as just in the first ten or so I see a couple of Stone Masters and Temporal Wizard. Considering neither of those is an option for Godling powers, beings who become gods, I guess the rules were broken in the same book they were written

No, that didn't break any rules at all. There's nothing in the rules preventing a Godling from stopping advancing their natural godling powers and choosing an additional OCC. The gods who became Stone Masters clearly went and trained in that OCC like anyone else. Although I think Zurvan probably taught himself to be a Temporal Wizard, being a natural 4th dimensional entity and all that.

....it also says the powers of the character would reflect powers of their Pantheon so it stands to reason that if there are gods in the pantheon with powers that are not listed in the "rules" that one could argue they should be allowed.

Sure, heck a demigod even gets an undefined additional power like their parent (this is in addition to the godling power) so that's certainly fine. Subject to GM approval of how extensive that should be and what's allowed.

With that my original idea can stand as is since there is a god in the first parts of the book that is a Techno Wizard. Considering there are no rules for multiclassing I find it interesting that a God would have multiple classes to begin with.

There ARE rules for multiclassing, they're up on the FAQ. Conversion Book 1 even mentions you can change from a diabolist or wizard into a techno-wizard. They should've been printed in a Rifts book, yeah, but they do exist. If you want to argue that being in a Palladium Fantasy book is reasons to keep it out, then I'd imagine you'd also want to strip the various Diabolists/Summoners of their powers too, since those are also from PF.

As for Alistair....using a spell published god knows how many years after the fact still makes it broken because there is no mention of Alistair even knowing demon magic so that can't be how he did it.

Where does it say that the list of spells he knows is ALL the spells he knows? Alistair has 2 major demons as his buddies, he could've learned some. Perhaps he learned it, gained a huge amount of power, and then the Raksasha used a Mind Wipe to strip him of it under orders of Modeus to prevent Mortals from knowing the exclusive demon magic.

Could that be an option? Yes. Is it? No not according to his write up. So makes him an illegal character by your standards.

No, all NPCs must be legal, because they are canon. If they don't seem to be legal, I take the approach there must be unpublished rules to explain how they came to be, and I have rationalized Dunscon, and there is nothing in his writeup preventing this rational explanation for his high PPE.

i think they supreme ultimate villians were already made, they are called Mechanoids and it doesn't matter how badass your character or even if you let your players play five characters each they are gonna die if you cross paths with the Mechanoids.

Those guys are damn powerful considering their publication date... but I think a Mind Bleeder might find them delicious.

i was allowed to create a greater norse giant reaver assassin with the gift of yggdrasil. Cutter, 80supernatural ps, autododge, all temporal magic(scrupolous alignment so wouldnt use necromancy),and all normal spells levels 1-5, bio-regenerate d4x100 mdc per melee, impervious fire&heat all types,change size 6-40 feet and 18000mdc. yea my offense consisted of timeslips and hiding alot.

Did you roll through the coma chance to survive and everything, or just start out with Yggdrasil's gifts?

I always thought the alignment restrictions on necromancers were dumb. It's not like the OCC requires you to murder people or anything. I don't really see why a principled person could not chop up dead bodies and attach them to himself, or animate them to fight for him. People look down on that stuff due to squick factor and respect for the dead and all that other cultural stuff, not any of the actual moral things behind the Principled alignment.

even totally immune to their weapons a wasp slamming you at mach2 does like 2d6x100md.

How do you calculate that? Also how were you immune to their weapons?

So basically a lesser god was pretty much curb stomped by the mechanoids, pretty easy since they just kept coming and coming thousands at a time.

I wouldn't feel bad, ignoring the Kittani I'm pretty sure it mentions somewhere in Pantheons that the Mechanoids gave a whole pantheon some trouble. Or maybe I'm thinking of Pachimama from SA2.

I saw Phase Mystics mentioned in this thread and that got me wondering, why are they considered Practitioners of Magic (i know the GMG as them listed as such)? They don't cast spells nor do they even use PPE and their phase powers use ISP which makes them more akin to psionic powers than magic.

They are psychics in pretty much every way (except that they are taught I guess), so it was probably just a labeling error.

I'm kinda wondering if non-psychic races could become phase mystics. I don't think they'd get the psychic abilities, but since phase powers are distinct from psychic powers, maybe they could learn those? Kind of like how it's not completely clear if the martial arts powers in Rifts China, though using ISP, if they're psychic or not?

since most mechanoids are psychic using them as a global police force(see aura to determine alignment.) seems plausible and it could be the inherent flaws in mankind is what drove them into insane world destroying villians(they only way to save humanity is to end it type thing)

The only problem with this is that they embrace non-humanoid races, presumably including those who also have such flaws.

Heck considering how the standard alignment of so many non-humanoid monster races is evil, I really don't think See Aura is that reason.

Have to agree that even one enlightened immortal turned megalomaniac could easily decide to dominate humans, demons and undead. They can walk amongst all as each their own.

I can stop an enlightened immortal with a vibro-blade to the face. Not permanently, no, he'll come back into action in a decade or so, but that's enough down time to refill my e-clip.

They can flat out control massive armies of undead

Lots of people out there controlling undead armies. I guess if they consolidated them, prevented infighting and organized them, it would enhance their threat... but they're still undead.

if I remember right even demons (At the very least banish them nearly at will ... technically they could banish millions in an instant).

Can you clarify what ability/page this is? Would like to read over what you're referring to.

To rule humans they would need to employ more conventional means but of course total knowledge of all magic helps a great deal.

Since when do enlightened immortals have 'total knowledge of magic'? EIs don't even necessarily know ANY magic. They have all zenjoriki, and most also know all chi, but that's different.

It wouldn't even have to be a totally insane immortal as they could simply be doing it to tip the balance to center or some unknown taoist reasoning few could fathom. I wouldn't toss out good old megalomaniac ambition though

Good ol' "restoring balance to the force" eh?

[say652]

Dougs four powerarmor crew consists of an Anti-Monster, a six armed light japanese borg police officer,a Naruni Repobot and a White Tiger shock trooper. all level 3. the team calls itself the "Metal Heads" and have even met Thor on one occasion(He walked past them on the training grounds of Asgard!!!! Truly inspiring to the team.) Doug wields two giant size warhammers surrounded by an energy field. The Metal Heads are currently looking for a norse giant named Cutter any help in tracking down this man would be appreciated. He is not wanted for a crime but is still considered extremely dangerous.

I think Thor could defeat the Metalheads. Do you concur?

Well Gods generally come from godlings, yes?

No, no they do not. This is not ever said, anywhere that I have seen, actually. I've heard of demigods being elevated to gods (Herakles, and while not said in Pantheons, this was also the case with Dionysus according to myth).

Mortals have also been elevated to gods, there's "she who walks circle" in Spirit West and maybe some other one. Gods have special abilities that go beyond that of mortals or godlings, the rules for their design have not been clarified to us.

Even with alien intelligences, we are only given generic rules that apply to most of them, but there are still unique cases. The possession powers of Nxla far eclipse anything you could roll up on the AI table, same with vampire intelligences.

Much like dragons come from hatchlings. At least that is how i've always seen them.

You could use a Godling to represent a young God I suppose, but it's not entirely how they work. If they did begin that way, they would gain abilities beyond Godlings.

As such then Gods would be essentially subject to the same rules. Apparently the gods in Pantheons break the rules as just in the first ten or so I see a couple of Stone Masters and Temporal Wizard. Considering neither of those is an option for Godling powers, beings who become gods, I guess the rules were broken in the same book they were written

No, that didn't break any rules at all. There's nothing in the rules preventing a Godling from stopping advancing their natural godling powers and choosing an additional OCC. The gods who became Stone Masters clearly went and trained in that OCC like anyone else. Although I think Zurvan probably taught himself to be a Temporal Wizard, being a natural 4th dimensional entity and all that.

....it also says the powers of the character would reflect powers of their Pantheon so it stands to reason that if there are gods in the pantheon with powers that are not listed in the "rules" that one could argue they should be allowed.

Sure, heck a demigod even gets an undefined additional power like their parent (this is in addition to the godling power) so that's certainly fine. Subject to GM approval of how extensive that should be and what's allowed.

With that my original idea can stand as is since there is a god in the first parts of the book that is a Techno Wizard. Considering there are no rules for multiclassing I find it interesting that a God would have multiple classes to begin with.

There ARE rules for multiclassing, they're up on the FAQ. Conversion Book 1 even mentions you can change from a diabolist or wizard into a techno-wizard. They should've been printed in a Rifts book, yeah, but they do exist. If you want to argue that being in a Palladium Fantasy book is reasons to keep it out, then I'd imagine you'd also want to strip the various Diabolists/Summoners of their powers too, since those are also from PF.

As for Alistair....using a spell published god knows how many years after the fact still makes it broken because there is no mention of Alistair even knowing demon magic so that can't be how he did it.

Where does it say that the list of spells he knows is ALL the spells he knows? Alistair has 2 major demons as his buddies, he could've learned some. Perhaps he learned it, gained a huge amount of power, and then the Raksasha used a Mind Wipe to strip him of it under orders of Modeus to prevent Mortals from knowing the exclusive demon magic.

Could that be an option? Yes. Is it? No not according to his write up. So makes him an illegal character by your standards.

No, all NPCs must be legal, because they are canon. If they don't seem to be legal, I take the approach there must be unpublished rules to explain how they came to be, and I have rationalized Dunscon, and there is nothing in his writeup preventing this rational explanation for his high PPE.

i think they supreme ultimate villians were already made, they are called Mechanoids and it doesn't matter how badass your character or even if you let your players play five characters each they are gonna die if you cross paths with the Mechanoids.

Those guys are damn powerful considering their publication date... but I think a Mind Bleeder might find them delicious.

i was allowed to create a greater norse giant reaver assassin with the gift of yggdrasil. Cutter, 80supernatural ps, autododge, all temporal magic(scrupolous alignment so wouldnt use necromancy),and all normal spells levels 1-5, bio-regenerate d4x100 mdc per melee, impervious fire&heat all types,change size 6-40 feet and 18000mdc. yea my offense consisted of timeslips and hiding alot.

Did you roll through the coma chance to survive and everything, or just start out with Yggdrasil's gifts?

I always thought the alignment restrictions on necromancers were dumb. It's not like the OCC requires you to murder people or anything. I don't really see why a principled person could not chop up dead bodies and attach them to himself, or animate them to fight for him. People look down on that stuff due to squick factor and respect for the dead and all that other cultural stuff, not any of the actual moral things behind the Principled alignment.

even totally immune to their weapons a wasp slamming you at mach2 does like 2d6x100md.

How do you calculate that? Also how were you immune to their weapons?

So basically a lesser god was pretty much curb stomped by the mechanoids, pretty easy since they just kept coming and coming thousands at a time.

I wouldn't feel bad, ignoring the Kittani I'm pretty sure it mentions somewhere in Pantheons that the Mechanoids gave a whole pantheon some trouble. Or maybe I'm thinking of Pachimama from SA2.

since mechanoid weapons are plasma and laser and the character was immune to fire and heat damage of all types you can tell me.

[say652]

I saw Phase Mystics mentioned in this thread and that got me wondering, why are they considered Practitioners of Magic (i know the GMG as them listed as such)? They don't cast spells nor do they even use PPE and their phase powers use ISP which makes them more akin to psionic powers than magic.

i mentioned the psionic phase mystic cause they rock.

[say652]

Dougs four powerarmor crew consists of an Anti-Monster, a six armed light japanese borg police officer,a Naruni Repobot and a White Tiger shock trooper. all level 3. the team calls itself the "Metal Heads" and have even met Thor on one occasion(He walked past them on the training grounds of Asgard!!!! Truly inspiring to the team.) Doug wields two giant size warhammers surrounded by an energy field. The Metal Heads are currently looking for a norse giant named Cutter any help in tracking down this man would be appreciated. He is not wanted for a crime but is still considered extremely dangerous.

I think Thor could defeat the Metalheads. Do you concur?
i concur Thor would waste the Metalheads even with five rpa-elite doug trained juicers as co pilots.

Well Gods generally come from godlings, yes?

No, no they do not. This is not ever said, anywhere that I have seen, actually. I've heard of demigods being elevated to gods (Herakles, and while not said in Pantheons, this was also the case with Dionysus according to myth).

Mortals have also been elevated to gods, there's "she who walks circle" in Spirit West and maybe some other one. Gods have special abilities that go beyond that of mortals or godlings, the rules for their design have not been clarified to us.

Even with alien intelligences, we are only given generic rules that apply to most of them, but there are still unique cases. The possession powers of Nxla far eclipse anything you could roll up on the AI table, same with vampire intelligences.

Much like dragons come from hatchlings. At least that is how i've always seen them.

You could use a Godling to represent a young God I suppose, but it's not entirely how they work. If they did begin that way, they would gain abilities beyond Godlings.

As such then Gods would be essentially subject to the same rules. Apparently the gods in Pantheons break the rules as just in the first ten or so I see a couple of Stone Masters and Temporal Wizard. Considering neither of those is an option for Godling powers, beings who become gods, I guess the rules were broken in the same book they were written

No, that didn't break any rules at all. There's nothing in the rules preventing a Godling from stopping advancing their natural godling powers and choosing an additional OCC. The gods who became Stone Masters clearly went and trained in that OCC like anyone else. Although I think Zurvan probably taught himself to be a Temporal Wizard, being a natural 4th dimensional entity and all that.

....it also says the powers of the character would reflect powers of their Pantheon so it stands to reason that if there are gods in the pantheon with powers that are not listed in the "rules" that one could argue they should be allowed.

Sure, heck a demigod even gets an undefined additional power like their parent (this is in addition to the godling power) so that's certainly fine. Subject to GM approval of how extensive that should be and what's allowed.

With that my original idea can stand as is since there is a god in the first parts of the book that is a Techno Wizard. Considering there are no rules for multiclassing I find it interesting that a God would have multiple classes to begin with.

There ARE rules for multiclassing, they're up on the FAQ. Conversion Book 1 even mentions you can change from a diabolist or wizard into a techno-wizard. They should've been printed in a Rifts book, yeah, but they do exist. If you want to argue that being in a Palladium Fantasy book is reasons to keep it out, then I'd imagine you'd also want to strip the various Diabolists/Summoners of their powers too, since those are also from PF.

As for Alistair....using a spell published god knows how many years after the fact still makes it broken because there is no mention of Alistair even knowing demon magic so that can't be how he did it.

Where does it say that the list of spells he knows is ALL the spells he knows? Alistair has 2 major demons as his buddies, he could've learned some. Perhaps he learned it, gained a huge amount of power, and then the Raksasha used a Mind Wipe to strip him of it under orders of Modeus to prevent Mortals from knowing the exclusive demon magic.

Could that be an option? Yes. Is it? No not according to his write up. So makes him an illegal character by your standards.

No, all NPCs must be legal, because they are canon. If they don't seem to be legal, I take the approach there must be unpublished rules to explain how they came to be, and I have rationalized Dunscon, and there is nothing in his writeup preventing this rational explanation for his high PPE.

i think they supreme ultimate villians were already made, they are called Mechanoids and it doesn't matter how badass your character or even if you let your players play five characters each they are gonna die if you cross paths with the Mechanoids.

Those guys are damn powerful considering their publication date... but I think a Mind Bleeder might find them delicious.

i was allowed to create a greater norse giant reaver assassin with the gift of yggdrasil. Cutter, 80supernatural ps, autododge, all temporal magic(scrupolous alignment so wouldnt use necromancy),and all normal spells levels 1-5, bio-regenerate d4x100 mdc per melee, impervious fire&heat all types,change size 6-40 feet and 18000mdc. yea my offense consisted of timeslips and hiding alot.

Did you roll through the coma chance to survive and everything, or just start out with Yggdrasil's gifts?

I always thought the alignment restrictions on necromancers were dumb. It's not like the OCC requires you to murder people or anything. I don't really see why a principled person could not chop up dead bodies and attach them to himself, or animate them to fight for him. People look down on that stuff due to squick factor and respect for the dead and all that other cultural stuff, not any of the actual moral things behind the Principled alignment.

even totally immune to their weapons a wasp slamming you at mach2 does like 2d6x100md.

How do you calculate that? Also how were you immune to their weapons?

So basically a lesser god was pretty much curb stomped by the mechanoids, pretty easy since they just kept coming and coming thousands at a time.

I wouldn't feel bad, ignoring the Kittani I'm pretty sure it mentions somewhere in Pantheons that the Mechanoids gave a whole pantheon some trouble. Or maybe I'm thinking of Pachimama from SA2.

I saw Phase Mystics mentioned in this thread and that got me wondering, why are they considered Practitioners of Magic (i know the GMG as them listed as such)? They don't cast spells nor do they even use PPE and their phase powers use ISP which makes them more akin to psionic powers than magic.

They are psychics in pretty much every way (except that they are taught I guess), so it was probably just a labeling error.

I'm kinda wondering if non-psychic races could become phase mystics. I don't think they'd get the psychic abilities, but since phase powers are distinct from psychic powers, maybe they could learn those? Kind of like how it's not completely clear if the martial arts powers in Rifts China, though using ISP, if they're psychic or not?

since most mechanoids are psychic using them as a global police force(see aura to determine alignment.) seems plausible and it could be the inherent flaws in mankind is what drove them into insane world destroying villians(they only way to save humanity is to end it type thing)

The only problem with this is that they embrace non-humanoid races, presumably including those who also have such flaws.

Heck considering how the standard alignment of so many non-humanoid monster races is evil, I really don't think See Aura is that reason.

Have to agree that even one enlightened immortal turned megalomaniac could easily decide to dominate humans, demons and undead. They can walk amongst all as each their own.

I can stop an enlightened immortal with a vibro-blade to the face. Not permanently, no, he'll come back into action in a decade or so, but that's enough down time to refill my e-clip.

They can flat out control massive armies of undead

Lots of people out there controlling undead armies. I guess if they consolidated them, prevented infighting and organized them, it would enhance their threat... but they're still undead.

if I remember right even demons (At the very least banish them nearly at will ... technically they could banish millions in an instant).

Can you clarify what ability/page this is? Would like to read over what you're referring to.

To rule humans they would need to employ more conventional means but of course total knowledge of all magic helps a great deal.

Since when do enlightened immortals have 'total knowledge of magic'? EIs don't even necessarily know ANY magic. They have all zenjoriki, and most also know all chi, but that's different.

It wouldn't even have to be a totally insane immortal as they could simply be doing it to tip the balance to center or some unknown taoist reasoning few could fathom. I wouldn't toss out good old megalomaniac ambition though

Good ol' "restoring balance to the force" eh?

i didnt roll for the yggdrasil gift my gm did. my goal was a awesome evil norse giant hell bent on destorying asgard but the whole alignment flip thing screwed me.

[Tor]

since mechanoid weapons are plasma and laser and the character was immune to fire and heat damage of all types you can tell me.

I'm not sure I can. I'd class plasma under fire/heat but I'm not clear on lasers... I usually don't think of them that way... usually as 'light'...

But I guess the effect of that light impacting someone does end up being extreme heat so... you could be right...

[Akashic Soldier]

The key to understand why Phase Psychics are practitioners of magic is tied to how they think, what phase power is, and the social circles they move in. It is the same way the Crazy O.C.C. is a Man at Arms and not a Psychic despite all their powers coming from psionic augmentation. It's a role-playing thing and a part of their method and spiritual beliefs.

[Tor]

If we had to make a comparison, perhaps it would be to Mystics, who are also magic OCCs in spite of having psionics?

Phase powers themselves, I don't think they'd be magic, but I'm not sure if they're psychic either, something doesn't have to be psychic just because it's ISP-powered, just like something PPE-powered doesn't have to be magic.

[say652]

a splugorth that doesn't require the constant ppe source, hence allowing it to travel anywhere without starving would be terrifying. of the chart attributes four occ's worth of abilities not many skills but with tens of thousands of mdc does that really matter. even scarier if you gave said splugorth the ability to create witches and shifters or even mystically bestowed super powers. then this rouge alien intelligence could turn any slave race into a formidable fighting force. spluggy X finds a prison powers up the inmates and stands a really good chance of conquering the world with enough (i am sure willing) bad guy soldiers the universe would definately be in danger.

[Alrik Vas]

Yeah, i had an idea like this once (what the OP is saying anyway).

Essentially God and all his angels get drunk one night. They remember the good old days when it was just them and no mortals or other beings were around to cramp their style. They miss those times and drink, talking about how cool it would be to go back to that. God stays up late while the angles pass out one after another. He looks down at the universe and sees what he has wrought; the conflict, the greed, the hate and selfishness. So he decides to get rid of it all. Right before he waves his hand and gets it over with, one of the archangels begs him to stop. They didn't mean it, it was just late night party talk, ***** about their jobs etc etc. They really love it all. Though God's not convinced.

So he charges one of his angels to find him a mortal who can stand for all existence and pits him in what is essentially a chess match vs the archangel Michael, each player controlling reality, fighting good vs evil.

So basically, God just gets sick of it all, but his servants are worried about job security.