Equipment players always forget...

[pblackcrow]

Cooking supplies.
Medical supplies.
Dishes...Bowls. (Good thing I put turtles in the game)
Arrows/bolts.
Rope.
Tools like axes and shovels.
They are always forgetting THEIR MOUNTS!!!
Socks...(major penalties when in a swamp, marsh, bog, jungle, etc.)
That saddle bags exist!
Water skins.
Fishing hooks.
Candle holders...(Honestly...they've burnt down more forests that away.)
ink, charcoal, chalk...
and food!

[drewkitty ~..~]

underthings &
extra Underthings

[Zamion138]

Socks.....
Torches.
Fire starters.
Wet stone/sharpeners.
Armor maintenance (oil polish, ect.)
Horse shoe blanks.
Dental care.
Soap. Never seen this on a char sheet.

[drewkitty ~..~]

shoes
Scabard
belt/harness

(My pet peeve but not equipment per-say: a full physical description that tells everyone else what the char looks like. And not just something like "human fighter pb xx" )

[pblackcrow]

In my games, bath houses are everywhere. Sewers are common enough. And believe it or not, inn's actually have bathing vessels. Yay. We usually come across at least 1 stream per game. Yet they usually don't think to stop and bathe while they water the horses, if I am not playing. And they wonder why that wound got infected or the like, also wonder why they are being attacked by wolves, bores, bears, etc; and why all the other animals up wind of them run away and flies love them. I haven't given them lice yet. I really should start though, and maybe crabs as well...

Oh yes, and add laundry soap to the forgotten supply lists. Yes, I am talking about the soap with male urine in it.

[Cinos]

that Money weighs a bunch

This has always been the one thing that gets to me. My players are good about remembering the small things most the time (in part from my history of punishing any character without things when I could, though I do follow Rappanui's vision of fantasy in which soap isn't an 'essential', most my players shell out for it anyway).

But money. I mean even today, just a pocket of 2 grand (lets face it, most adventuring PC's are also their own bank) is a thick wad of cash even in hundreds. And you can't just pay your bar tab with a hundred. So it's likely 20's or so.

Now make it gold coins that weigh a few ounces each and you now need a literal gold mule just to get around. God help you if it's saddle bags spring a leak going through a brier patch. I had a fun one off where the party's pack mule which carried their gold got carried off by some animal (forget what it was, like a Chimera or something) and they instantly had to track it down. But every new player I've really gotta go through that effort of education on this and it's always the last thing to be grasped.

[kiralon]

My players have to get their characters to bathe if they want to do things in towns, villagers aren't so bad, so the SOP for entering a town is Inn, bath, pay for clothes washing, eat then do stuff. One character took cooking a little far and gave me elaborate descriptions of what he was making and how he was doing it and would go out of his way to find herbs and spices. Usually money isnt an issue as i have some trading companies that have bases in most places and you can get letters of credit (for a price of course) that can be redeemed elsewhere. Forging isnt an issue as the companies use magic to check (truth sense and contact place where letter of credit comes from) and there havent been any forgers of their letters of credit brought before the courts in a while. (face stabbings galore)
My players do try to ignore encumbrance though, but they know i will wait until the worst possible moment to tell them that they cant carry 3 swords an axe a crossbow 4 daggers 50 quarrels, plate and chain, spare full plate and their travelling gear over the stepping stones at the top of a waterfall and have to leave stuff behind, i tell them to use common sense (they say i shoudnt have been able to carry it up there in the first place, ill agree and say but its still here and you didnt figure out your encumbrance so bad luck, your the player you figure out your encumbrance, ill just check from time to time).

[pblackcrow]

Yeah, true. To start out, very few players really think about things like that. And I have been kind to them thus far about encumbrance. 10-25 lbs over it is okay, as long as they don't abuse it.

And yes, travelers script has definitely come in handy. They may charge a hefty sum for things like over seeing a hoard transference, but they have to count it, keep track of it while it is being transferred or they risk their own standings, rep, and also probably their hide.

[Alrik Vas]

Gear placement is a huge issue, yes. Though the way i look at it, if you have a bit of gear for your traveling pack, there are standards you can apply to them. If your PC's take a little bit of time and figure out the cost of a "standard travel pack" they can use it for all characters, then add things as needed.

As far as upkeep goes, I see nothing wrong with a player spending X amount of gold every month and we just assume they're clean, their gear is working properly and they are well fed, unless the bathing, good repair or meal is important to the game itself.

[Hotrod]

Dogs. They're simply the best early warning/protection against supernatural evil. They'll instinctively fight with you against it. Why everyone doesn't have one, I don't know.

[pblackcrow]

No, but you can have a trained rottweiler in 97% of the urban settings.

[Chronicle]

i noticed a lot of people forget to buy more food. yes it is true.

[Hotrod]

How do you strike a reasonable balance between requiring characters to micro-manage everything they own/have on their bodies at every given moment and keeping things realistic?

I'll grant you, the logistics side of some adventures can be fun. Stocking up your Byzantium Lighter with consumables and trade goods for an around-the-continent voyage can be a fun exercise (and can get players out of your hair as a GM for an hour or so so you can prep the next port of call), but at a certain point, tracking how many rolls of toilet paper you used in a given day gets in the way of good storytelling, doesn't it?

[pblackcrow]

Yeah, and what is up with them wanting to buy heavy jars, live chickens, and things? When they have dried food stocks such as lentils, beans, dried fruits and veggies, salted ham, summer sausages, etc. They never think to ask.

Not really, and we have magic for such things as TP.

[kiralon]

I will generally let the players set the pace, if they want to split it up like that no probs, but i also allow x days worth of food instead and then generally insist they eat at taverns when they can, and short term preserved food lasts for about 2 weeks (tin rations) and is about 10-20 gold per day, and Iron rations last for up to 6 months and taste terrible and are 25-50 gp per day. I also allow elven travelling bread which is mixed nuts, fruits, honey and magic that last up to 10 years, but cost a minimum of 100gp per day, but tastes OK. Dwarves also have a version, which is a rock, you pull the rock out, say i can't eat this and eat anything else available.

[MADMANMIKE]

My Legal and letter character sheets (linked below) have a couple of columns of common pricing for things such as armor repair, healing, basic provisions, etc.. I'm thinking the Tombs of Gersidi ought to have a section of provisions and supplies.. and maybe a few group worksheets for tracking them..

[drewkitty ~..~]

For those male chars that had a clean shaven description: shaving razor.

[The Dark Elf]

Pencil, eraser, their character sheet, their dice, their mini, drinks, snacks, apple for the GM.

[Chronicle]

Pencil, eraser, their character sheet, their dice, their mini, drinks, snacks, apple for the GM.

You raise a good point have that happen a lot

[drewkitty ~..~]

Pencil, eraser, their character sheet, their dice, their mini, drinks, snacks, apple for the GM.

You raise a good point have that happen a lot

[pblackcrow]

It's like my friends last weekend didn't take cooking supplies, a can opener, pots, or pans.

[Cinos]

Pencil, eraser, their character sheet, their dice, their mini, drinks, snacks, apple for the GM.

Oh a group forgot the honorary GM soda once. There where many deaths that night. Memory improved after that.

[pblackcrow]

Yeah, well, we have a standard rule of thumb...If you don't have a 100% completed character sheet, you start off with a -100 to the exp. We have a standard rule...Didn't think to make a character, or have one under 75% completed, you forgot your sheets and you forgot to e-mail it to one of the 4 gm's for approval...You are not playing.

Pencil, rubbers/eraser, and dice aren't a big deal. Whoever hosts it is likely to have a set of dice or 10 to spare.

We leave our characters at the game master/mistresses. They'll award the players who brings snacks and drinks.

[Cinos]

I've had players show up and forget their willingness to play, instead , they watched sports on tv.

This would see you dropped from one of my games. If you lose your willingness to play, have the grace to call in sick.

[Zamion138]

I've had players show up and forget their willingness to play, instead , they watched sports on tv.

This would see you dropped from one of my games. If you lose your willingness to play, have the grace to call in sick.

The closest to this has happened at our table was when we noticed the gms copy of blue ray hobbit........after fondeling it for 15 minutes..."sigh....do you guys want to watch the hobbit or play...." (us).."ahhhhhhhh you know ahh welll....hobbits pretty cool"

So it was a group decision

[kiralon]

i turn off wireless in the house
and also have very loud speakers for when the wow players want to talk wow, ill play abba, loud. or roxette. That usually stops them.
Phones stay in kitchen.

[The Immortal ME]

*snip*rubbers*snip*

What kind of game are you running over there?

[kiralon]

Yeah, well, we have a standard rule of thumb...If you don't have a 100% completed character sheet, you start off with a -100 to the exp. We have a standard rule...Didn't think to make a character, or have one under 75% completed, you forgot your sheets and you forgot to e-mail it to one of the 4 gm's for approval...You are not playing.

Pencil, rubbers/eraser, and dice aren't a big deal. Whoever hosts it is likely to have a set of dice or 10 to spare.

We leave our characters at the game master/mistresses. They'll award the players who brings snacks and drinks.

I also enforce the if its not on your character sheet you don't have it, and the follow up rule to that
If its on your character sheet and you dont have it or noted that you dont have it you get to erase the item and all your money.
No levelling up during game time, if you havent picked your skills and the games started, well obviously you werent interested enough and dont want the skills, and can't have them.

How ever its usually at my house, and i get the snacks, and generally cook tea as well.

[kiralon]

The rules have evolved from player actions, like a player who hasnt picked all his skills and someone needs disguise, the player would then pick the skill, and the other from players trying to sell the same item a couple of times to players who have found the sword of demonslaying and pass it around each other for fights and arguments breaking out over who actually has it

[pblackcrow]

We make exceptions for those who have never done a character before, and didn't have time to attend the character roll up on Friday, because we are way too busy our selves.

[GlitterKnight]

It's a classic problem; how much is the game a spelunking/camping simulation or a cinematic adventure?

I Like what I personally consider a fair balance, but of course, I'm biased. The players are responsible for tracking their inventory and supplies, accurately, including encumbrance, and making sure its all on their sheets, so I can check it when I want.

Making sure they've brought the vital gear and they have what they need when they reach for it is a grey area. Encourage them to develop a standard kit; a load that fits into a rucksack that even the weakest party member can hump. How specific and exacting you are with the list is up to you; i play in a game where when we started as an urban campaign, but when we first started into the wilds, we were handed a bag of holding, complete with merlins spoon, folding bost, decanter of endless water, campfire bead, even a folding boat. We were chastised by the DM for "forgetting" bowls, cups and spoons, so we had nothing to eat or drink with. We felt that was a little unfair, as we're just handed a magic camping bag, so it seemed that it would be handwaved. Players forget things the characters likely wouldn't, since most players are not experienced campers or spelunkers. Like I said, it's a matter of how you want to play your game. In real life, I tnink I know a bit about how medieval life worked, and what you need while camping, but I don't actually know what care and feeding horses require, and I've never ridden. If they've got horses, note the kit load out for the saddlebags and pack horses. If they think that they'll just buy a damned wagon and a couple draft horses and not have to worry about anything less than trying to haul a ten ton stone idol home, put fallen bridges in their way, make the wagon break an axle, have the horses killed. It should never become a non-issue, in my opinion. You can focus on traveling light, or go for broke and trust you can carry everything and protect the logistics.

If they want horses to move faster and help carry the load home, then they need to supply and protect the horses. Who watches the horses when they're in the dungeon, and keeps the horses rubbed down and shoed? Well, they might hire a groom (or master of horses, or whatever the title for that job should be). They can see to the horses needs, collect a small wage and it's not a concern for the players. Except one guy in the woods with a train of horses, and maybe wagons, is a tempting target for monsters and bandits, so they need to hire guards to protect their growing caravan. They also need to trust these followers; for some of them, if they're treated poorly, it might make sense to steal the treasure wagon while the party is busy with something. That's a fun adventure hook; players hate being robbed. The players can be as involved with managing their followers and henchmen as much or as little as they want, but show the consequences. If they just hand off their reins to a nameless henchman, and expect their hired guards to protect the treasure wagon with their lives, while showing no concern for henchmen slaughtered by a wyvern; well those PCs shouldn't be surprise when the mutiny happens. The opposite doesn't have to be them dutifully learning every porter's name and backstory, and sidequestng to save their groom's cousins farm from orcs every week. But they should have a core group, preferably the armed guards, who are their sworn men, and whom might be more invested in the enterprise, maybe they get half or quarter shares of the loot. They should probably have a seneschal of some kind who can reliably run things in their absence. A personal wagon train can introduce things like "buying soap" on their own. The men smell, and start grumbling, and demand a soap stipend be enacted! Then the characters realize, they haven't bathed since the game began...

The treasure is another sore point for me. Magical gear tends to be divided up quick and immediately out to use, as much of it is very useful. But treasure that is just loot; currency or high value goods, that has to actually be carried back to civilization before it can be made to work for you. Operative word, "carried". I had to chastise one player who was carrying 150+ lbs of coinage. The others had all exchanged their gold for platinum. PFRPG makes it even easier with bigger denominations, up to Old Kingdom coins, which nicely have a numismatic air to them. I hate when they forget that money has weight, volume, mass; it's heavy metal items, ya lazy gits. We play Pathfinder right now, but I've kept them away from bags of holding and the like. My players are rather spoiled and don't want to deal with it at all; they've played in games where hewards handy haversacks were literally handed out to everyone, and they act like those are infinite. I do not like it when supplies and encumbrance are totally hand waved away with magic and magical items. What you thought to bring and what loot you can haul out before the demons tomb self destructs SHOULD matter. Suddenly carrying capacity matters! And did they bring sacks? No? Well it's hard to carry coins in your arms, ain't it?

Things like bags of holding ARE available, but magic items should be wondrous, not a mundane, boring cop out so the players don't have to track encumbrance, and loot can go back to being a static number noted on their sheet. "12,368 gp" is a terrible way to think of the rewards you've won with sword and spell! I try to describe the chests, overflowing with gold coins, jeweled swords thrust into the hoard, crowns and necklaces dangling from the hilt! It has weight, it takes up space! The wood of the chest is rotten and old, it might break and spill the coins everywhere if you drop it! Climbing under furniture in the dungeon to retrieve every loose gold piece shouldn't just be a chore if someone clumsily dropped it; it should be a dangerous distraction in enemy territory. Do you leave the rest and run, or stay and fight to try to recover it all? A magic bag that lets you carry all that out safely and easily should be a godsend. Something you thank your lucky stars for. Something that fills you with "wonder".

[pblackcrow]

It's a classic problem; how much is the game a spelunking/camping simulation or a cinematic adventure?

I Like what I personally consider a fair balance, but of course, I'm biased. The players are responsible for tracking their inventory and supplies, accurately, including encumbrance, and making sure its all on their sheets, so I can check it when I want.

Making sure they've brought the vital gear and they have what they need when they reach for it is a grey area. Encourage them to develop a standard kit; a load that fits into a rucksack that even the weakest party member can hump. How specific and exacting you are with the list is up to you; i play in a game where when we started as an urban campaign, but when we first started into the wilds, we were handed a bag of holding, complete with merlins spoon, folding bost, decanter of endless water, campfire bead, even a folding boat. We were chastised by the DM for "forgetting" bowls, cups and spoons, so we had nothing to eat or drink with. We felt that was a little unfair, as we're just handed a magic camping bag, so it seemed that it would be handwaved. Players forget things the characters likely wouldn't, since most players are not experienced campers or spelunkers. Like I said, it's a matter of how you want to play your game. In real life, I tnink I know a bit about how medieval life worked, and what you need while camping, but I don't actually know what care and feeding horses require, and I've never ridden. If they've got horses, note the kit load out for the saddlebags and pack horses. If they think that they'll just buy a damned wagon and a couple draft horses and not have to worry about anything less than trying to haul a ten ton stone idol home, put fallen bridges in their way, make the wagon break an axle, have the horses killed. It should never become a non-issue, in my opinion. You can focus on traveling light, or go for broke and trust you can carry everything and protect the logistics.

If they want horses to move faster and help carry the load home, then they need to supply and protect the horses. Who watches the horses when they're in the dungeon, and keeps the horses rubbed down and shoed? Well, they might hire a groom (or master of horses, or whatever the title for that job should be). They can see to the horses needs, collect a small wage and it's not a concern for the players. Except one guy in the woods with a train of horses, and maybe wagons, is a tempting target for monsters and bandits, so they need to hire guards to protect their growing caravan. They also need to trust these followers; for some of them, if they're treated poorly, it might make sense to steal the treasure wagon while the party is busy with something. That's a fun adventure hook; players hate being robbed. The players can be as involved with managing their followers and henchmen as much or as little as they want, but show the consequences. If they just hand off their reins to a nameless henchman, and expect their hired guards to protect the treasure wagon with their lives, while showing no concern for henchmen slaughtered by a wyvern; well those PCs shouldn't be surprise when the mutiny happens. The opposite doesn't have to be them dutifully learning every porter's name and backstory, and sidequestng to save their groom's cousins farm from orcs every week. But they should have a core group, preferably the armed guards, who are their sworn men, and whom might be more invested in the enterprise, maybe they get half or quarter shares of the loot. They should probably have a seneschal of some kind who can reliably run things in their absence. A personal wagon train can introduce things like "buying soap" on their own. The men smell, and start grumbling, and demand a soap stipend be enacted! Then the characters realize, they haven't bathed since the game began...

The treasure is another sore point for me. Magical gear tends to be divided up quick and immediately out to use, as much of it is very useful. But treasure that is just loot; currency or high value goods, that has to actually be carried back to civilization before it can be made to work for you. Operative word, "carried". I had to chastise one player who was carrying 150+ lbs of coinage. The others had all exchanged their gold for platinum. PFRPG makes it even easier with bigger denominations, up to Old Kingdom coins, which nicely have a numismatic air to them. I hate when they forget that money has weight, volume, mass; it's heavy metal items, ya lazy gits. We play Pathfinder right now, but I've kept them away from bags of holding and the like. My players are rather spoiled and don't want to deal with it at all; they've played in games where hewards handy haversacks were literally handed out to everyone, and they act like those are infinite. I do not like it when supplies and encumbrance are totally hand waved away with magic and magical items. What you thought to bring and what loot you can haul out before the demons tomb self destructs SHOULD matter. Suddenly carrying capacity matters! And did they bring sacks? No? Well it's hard to carry coins in your arms, ain't it?

Things like bags of holding ARE available, but magic items should be wondrous, not a mundane, boring cop out so the players don't have to track encumbrance, and loot can go back to being a static number noted on their sheet. "12,368 gp" is a terrible way to think of the rewards you've won with sword and spell! I try to describe the chests, overflowing with gold coins, jeweled swords thrust into the hoard, crowns and necklaces dangling from the hilt! It has weight, it takes up space! The wood of the chest is rotten and old, it might break and spill the coins everywhere if you drop it! Climbing under furniture in the dungeon to retrieve every loose gold piece shouldn't just be a chore if someone clumsily dropped it; it should be a dangerous distraction in enemy territory. Do you leave the rest and run, or stay and fight to try to recover it all? A magic bag that lets you carry all that out safely and easily should be a godsend. Something you thank your lucky stars for. Something that fills you with "wonder".

Yeah...I agree. I mostly play a mage, and let me tell you I have had players give me the money in the game to get the spell dimensional pocket scroll and learn the spell. That and create milk and bread and a few other spells.

I have only played in 4 groups where the other pcs didn't at least assist me in getting some of the spells. In 1 of them, I didn't need help. In another they were all playing Anarchists. The other 2 there was absolutely ZERO group conformity. And that's putting it mildly. Group cohesion was -60. Then, there were also the land grab games where each of us were able to manage small holding on a borderlands with and expand. But those were meant to not have a group cohesion. However, we actually did...Some of us had alliances and trade agreements. While others just sought to take over the whole map. Eh, they were the first to die and lands and holdings were divided amongst us.