Thought Experiment - Rifts 2

[Godogma]

I'm a little annoyed by the whole "More Apocalypse! More Scavengers!" That's what Chaos Earth is for. Rifts is pulling itself out of that. About nations fighting the wilderness and each other to carve out a place in the world.

True! Rifts is a post-post-apocalypse world. If you want a post-apocalypse world, go play Chaos Earth (or whatever, there are dozens of those settings).

--flatline

A post-post-apocalyptic world where the majority of the population has a medieval tech level.

Actually a good number of civilizations are more like the early 1900s/late 1800s technology wise and a good many are much higher.

If you stick to the former continental U.S yes. Rifts is more than that though, huge chunks of Africa aren't, same with Russia, most of Canada, mainland Asia(an entire civilization in Japan isn't), western Asia, eastern Europe, most of Australia and so on. Apparently my home of Alaska is nothing but the occasional Native American tribe and a Tundra Ranger or two, and we're bigger than Texas.

*shrug* I'll pick my battles, I can't argue about any of that; there just isn't enough information there to argue any point. For all we know much of everywhere is a real big empty and there just isn't enough interest in P-B staff for those areas for them to bother developing them.

[Eclipse]

I'd probably have a supplementary/source book that focused on taking ideas from the real world to flesh out the world of Rifts. Something that combined what we know about human nature from social studies, science, architecture, the dramatic arts with the themes of science fiction/fantasy. Use concepts from books like Machiavelli's 'The Prince' as a basis for constructing stories about political machinations/realities, which could inform the GM. Maybe use the rifter to look for people to write articles about their field of endeavor or personal interest - like the article in the Knights of the Dinner Table comics where a writer describes how to construct a role playing session that fits with a particular fantasy/sci fi movie - except that the contributors are writing about how to use their area of interest as a source of game information or thematics.

I'd probably have a rules-light core book that simplified/streamlined the mechanics, and perhaps construct a program for tablets that tracked these simplified game mechanics (you could enter your own dice roll results by touching that number on a touchscreen grid, or just roll a virtual dice) and maintained character sheet(s). Perhaps include a very basic drawing application or recommend one, so those so inclined could do up drawings of their characters. Basically it'd be to make the process of running the game much simpler so you could spend less time prepping or prep better.

[Kagashi]

Assume for a moment that you have been tapped to write the setting chapters for a new edition of the game. You are to focus on middle-America, but you are free to add/drop/keep whatever you like. What does your vision of Rifts look like? Do you stick with the Coalition, or do you choose another faction to build up? Where in the time-line do you focus? Pre 104PA? Post 109PA? Why?

Good question. I think I would keep the current setting to be honest. I might retcon some stuff, like the Holmes maneuver, but the result of the SoT would remain the same (despite the fact the CS should have lost by book 2). Why? Because I like dynamic, changing environments. I would even go a step further and make more definitive changes to Europe, with the NGR achieving total victory against the Gargoyles. In my world, humanity is coming back. Chaos Earth is over, as is the uncertainty of the future of humanity, and the quest for humans to reclaim their homeworld has begun.

New books would cover areas we have heard about since the beginning, but dont have a lick of info on, like Lazlo and New Lazlo. I would work on those settings before I would even start to consider new material. I would also give a definite answer on the Xiciticx War.

I would also re-categorize the use of World, Source, and Adventure books. For example, DBees of North America is by far a Source Book and not a World Book. And Juicer Uprising and Xiticix Invasion are more Adventure Books than anything. (point to a map and show me where the area "Juicer Uprising" or "DBees of North America" is...you cant because the Juicer Uprising was an event, and DBees are beings...not places.).

All future World Books would be set in 109. Adventure Books would be based on the already written World Books and would advance the timeline as needed. Source Books would provide source material only, would not advance the story line (aside, "this bot was designed in 111 PA...")

I would also limit OCCs in all books to about 30 total.

[earthhawk]

My incarnation of Rifts 2 would start with North America, specifically the remnants of the United States. Due to the abundant source of magical energy, techno-wizardry would become the main source of power. No longer would nuclear power, energy cells, and the like be necessary or even wanted, as their high-cost to maintain would tax limited resources too much. Everything from city lights to power-armor would run on some sort of techno-wizard device. Of course alternate means of energy production would be available too (i.e. windmills, watermills, solar power, human/ animal waste, etc…) as technology in form would be difficult to acquire and maintain. I would think your typical town in Rifts would have technology closer to the early 1800s.

The Coalition States, being mostly dependent on nuclear power has begun to crumble causing them to loosen their grip within the US. Chi-Town, once the crown jewel of the CS, is on the brink of collapse as decades of wars and the inability to refuel its nuclear cores has taken its toll. The great-great-grandson of Emperor Prosek, Dorian Prosek I, has decreed that the remaining CS states are to look for alternative means of power. The great race for fuel is on again.

The Native Americans have risen to power once again, with the traditionalist faction within the Indian Nations taking hold, banning technology in any form and relying on ancestral methods passed down from generation to generation. They’ve fully embraced biomancy and live as one with nature as they did in pre-Rifts times.

In my version of Rifts 2 I would like to see an emphasis on pre-Rifts cities rather than entire continents. One of the best things about the Rifts setting is its use of real-world locations. Far too often in world books I see these locations get a minor skimming, and most of the time it’s to highlight an area that has access to power armor or new O.C.C.s. Instead, give me books on the city of Los Angeles, Denver, Dallas, Chicago, D.C., etc… tell me how they survived the rifts and what are they like now. Not every new book needs pages and pages of power armor and equipment. Call this book Rifts: Cities.
Mutant humans and animals would comprise more of the general population than d-bees. It’s simple math in my book, but for some reason there are thousands of d-bees on Rifts earth. Also, I would get rid of the Tolkien-esque fantasy genre; it’s rather stale and overdone. Earth doesn’t need elves, dwarves, or anything else that you can find in your typical fantasy book. Humans, mutant animals, and few significant d-bees should do the trick.

I know there’s more I would change but for now this is what I’ve come up with.

[MikelAmroni]

As for a setting change, as the OP asked for, my thoughts are pretty simple:

Advance the year a hundred or two hundred years. Describe how it all went in very general terms. Describe the slow changes that turned the CS from a pro-human literacy-fearing, anti-magic, anti-psionic nation to one that emphasizes the use of pyramid technology to control the Ley Lines, Psychics to control the few mages they have, and basic soldiers with fantastic gear like magic net grenades and anti-magic beams. In short give them a Star Gate Ancients-like means of using PPE to power technology and give them super-science gadgets. Ironically this change would have been predicated by their attempts to destroy the xiticix and taming Old Chicago, which they've mostly done. Properly describe how the CS interacts with its member states, and then describe how Lazlo, Kingsdale, Whykin, Free Quebec, and the other regional powers have changed. By contrast I would have Free Quebec be more like the old CS in terms of their completely anti-magic stance (instead of using magic as a means of controlling magic). The Federation of Magic would also need a lot better description - either they remain bogey-men who plot in the shadows (I don't like this idea) or they become a bastion of pro-magic, pro-supernatural political movement. but unlike Lazlo (which would have expanded, and continues to try and be the egalitarian pro-magic, pro-cooperation city).

I would also have Arzno and the Colorado Baronies actually form into another coalition of nation states, and call it the Four Corners Coalition - a magically active TW friendly state that has a large swath of uninhabited area between them and the CS. However all of this consolidation wouldn't be seemless. Rifts would remain island of calm amidst seas of rough wilderness, but the islands would be slightly bigger. the CS would still be imperial, just not as naive as it used to be. Free Quebec, with their insular nature, would remain largely the same, though with one of the strongest armies because of their well supported Glitter Boy Legions. Some of the Amerind nations would crawl out of the shadows and into world politics. Splynn wouldn't care about the CS largely because even with their newfound control over the ley lines near them, they are still fairly gun-shy when it comes to most magic. And what ability they do have just makes them create good slave fodder. Atlantis would remain the super-power it is. The Phoenix Empire would remain, and the Gargoyles would remain a thorn in the NGR's side, but nothing like the Brodkil who have managed to maintain something of an empire with the angel of death the power behind the throne.

I could post a lot about this, but that should be enough to get the point across.

[SAMASzero]

Some are my ideas, some are responses to the rest of y'all:

I don't mind bringing SDC combat back up more. In fact I have a few ideas on that -- The most common MDC weapon will be similar to the BigBore guns from New West and the Black Market sourcebook. They would be capable of firing both SDC and MDC rounds. Railguns are much rarer. Replace about 80-90% of the ones we have now with machineguns like the one in Merc Ops.

MDC weapons are not quite widespread, but nowhere near rare. The problem is that they are hard to replenish. Expensive and time-consuming to charge and replace. The price from SB1R stays the same, but note that it takes hours just to charge a single E-clip. MDC weaponry is not so much rare as it is reserved: You don't pull out the big guns unless absolutely necessary.

Once change I would make to armor is to make it semi-modular: most modern suits of armor consist of a jumpsuit or body glove that can act as ready SDC armor. This can be augmented with extra SDC or MDC pads/plates to make the suits we all know and love.

Monsters and D-Bees are, as a rule, done to a 70-30% SDC to MDC. This may change from location to location. Generally speaking, areas with heavy Magic concentration tend to have higher ratios of MDC monsters.

I'm a little annoyed by the whole "More Apocalypse! More Scavengers!" That's what Chaos Earth is for. Rifts is pulling itself out of that. About nations fighting the wilderness and each other to carve out a place in the world.

All good tweaks to the availability of MDC, but what would you do to the story?

Well, I'm still figuring out the details, but the basic idea would be "Things are better, but they might get much worse." The timeline is somewhere between 140-210 P.A.

The CS is a little Greyer. They got shook up badly in both the Minion Wars and an attack by the Federation of Magic (thinking of maybe even having a partially-successful Decapitation strike on Karl Prosek, leaving Joseph in charge. With fighting in the streets of many of the Fortress Cities, the Dog Boys (and maybe even some other Lone Star mutants) were instrumental to saving the CS in a big way. Consequently, the people of the CS now love their Dog Boys more than ever. As a side effect, they are actually slightly more tolerant of nohumans (Razing of villages for having D-Bees is down 20% from 109 PA..). Still as anti-magic as ever, though.

In the west, a lot of small kingdoms based on Tolkeen refugees have grown into a loose confederation, still fearful of the slowly approaching Coalition States and what they see as the inevitable Siege War II. Friction between them and the "native" people of the New West (to say nothing of the actual Native Americans) is another factor that sometimes ends up in skirmishes.

In Europe, the NGR capitalized on their initial advantages and swept the Gargoyles out of northern France. However, recent movements by the Gargoyle Empire launched a number of retaliatory raids that have left some of the west of France once again hotly contested. Meanwhile, the Brodkil have started trying to absorb the Western splinter Gargoyle Tribes, with varying levels of success. Worse, they have also made contact with the Naut'Yll, who have attacked the NGR, CS, and New Navies with increased ferocity (and some Mindwerks implants).

In Australia, contact and relations have broken down between Melbourne and Perth, and both are gearing up for war. The Outbackers, as usual, are caught in the middle, and they're starting to get sick of it.

In Japan, the Otomo and the Oni made their move, and it worked, wrecking Takamatsu and overrunning large parts of both the Empire and the Republic... Naturally, that's when the Oni turned on the Shogunate. The New Empire, Republic, and what's left of Takamatsu have been forced closer together to defend themselves from rampaging Oni, but are rebuilding, and will soon be ready to take Japan back.

[Bill]

This was a good thread. We should have more like it.

[Zer0 Kay]

Hmm. What was the purpose of necroing this? Oh well. I'd like to see the original concept for Chaos Earth from the early Rifters still still be done. I'd like to see some of the dimension books be alternate dimensions Not just someplace that may likely just be a far off galaxy. Maybe some major alternate historical ones too, after all Rifts aren't just gates to space and dimension we often don't see the time element, unless we have our players pop back to other games.

[Bill]

I'd like to see some of the dimension books be alternate dimensions Not just someplace that may likely just be a far off galaxy. Maybe some major alternate historical ones too, after all Rifts aren't just gates to space and dimension we often don't see the time element, unless we have our players pop back to other games.

Good ideas. I've played around with adjacent timelines a bit. It can be confusing and fun!

[Fyrpower]

Rifts England..nuff said, none of this b-movie/medieval/cliche setting with King Arthur for starters, I'd make it more like 28 Days Later except without zombies and more or less with supernatural beings and monsters from specific dimensions that keep appearing from small (or large) short lived rifts, due to the fact that members of a faeire/celtic pantheon (from mythology or not, doesn't matter) are trying to megically terraform the country (Ireland, England, Wales and Scotland) to suit their dimension (the fours seasons for each country etc.) Add loads of new flora and fauna as side effects (or intentional). The rest of it like the druids and d-bees etc I'd keep.

[Killer Cyborg]

Hmm. What was the purpose of necroing this?

Sometimes, Necromancy is its own reward.

(Also, if you do it enough, you get to turn into a lich.)

I'd like to see the original concept for Chaos Earth from the early Rifters still still be done.

Seconded!

I'd like to see some of the dimension books be alternate dimensions Not just someplace that may likely just be a far off galaxy. Maybe some major alternate historical ones too, after all Rifts aren't just gates to space and dimension we often don't see the time element, unless we have our players pop back to other games.

Good idea.

[Zer0 Kay]

Rifts England..nuff said, none of this b-movie/medieval/cliche setting with King Arthur for starters, I'd make it more like 28 Days Later except without zombies and more or less with supernatural beings and monsters from specific dimensions that keep appearing from small (or large) short lived rifts, due to the fact that members of a faeire/celtic pantheon (from mythology or not, doesn't matter) are trying to megically terraform the country (Ireland, England, Wales and Scotland) to suit their dimension (the fours seasons for each country etc.) Add loads of new flora and fauna as side effects (or intentional). The rest of it like the druids and d-bees etc I'd keep.

Meh, I like king Arthur... The real one returning as promised. And a young Merlin because he ages backwards. High technology because neither are idiots and wouldn't just use tech nut use it to its greatest effect. Maybe even higher tech than the group brought out of cry to hunt him down, descendants of the first guard who watched to make sure he would come back and rise to power again. Since those who rule now in 2014 are invaders and not originally or at least not the first from the island.

So Arthur = Celt and Anti Arthur group = Germanic (Anglo, Saxon or Jute)

[Bill]

Hmm. What was the purpose of necroing this?

Sometimes, Necromancy is its own reward.

(Also, if you do it enough, you get to turn into a lich.)

Shh! Don't give away my plan!

[Slight001]

Rifts England..nuff said, none of this b-movie/medieval/cliche setting with King Arthur for starters, I'd make it more like 28 Days Later except without zombies and more or less with supernatural beings and monsters from specific dimensions that keep appearing from small (or large) short lived rifts, due to the fact that members of a faeire/celtic pantheon (from mythology or not, doesn't matter) are trying to megically terraform the country (Ireland, England, Wales and Scotland) to suit their dimension (the fours seasons for each country etc.) Add loads of new flora and fauna as side effects (or intentional). The rest of it like the druids and d-bees etc I'd keep.

Meh, I like king Arthur... The real one returning as promised. And a young Merlin because he ages backwards. High technology because neither are idiots and wouldn't just use tech nut use it to its greatest effect. Maybe even higher tech than the group brought out of cry to hunt him down, descendants of the first guard who watched to make sure he would come back and rise to power again. Since those who rule now in 2014 are invaders and not originally or at least not the first from the island.

So Arthur = Celt and Anti Arthur group = Germanic (Anglo, Saxon or Jute)

My plans for England was to have the mythical Arthur come back and raise an army to retake the land for the people. However, I also planned to have the ancient king be a lot more brutal then the 'modern' Arthur impostor.

[Alrik Vas]

Wow, Rifts two, huh?

I'd pick the Tolkeen War as a moment of change. Skullheads siege the city, lose men left and right, their generals assassinated, their materiel stuffed full of gremlins. The CS answers back with a covert force disguised as mercs, one of them is a robot pilot who's reactor is actually a bomb.

As the mages scramble to find it using their psychics and magic, it goes off, Tolkeen is wiped off the map.

Then the tolkeenites who are left (mostly bros hanging out in another dimension because they're super buff), plague the CS. The FoM finally steps in and takes advantage of the CS' weakness, splinters the domain of man.

Then the demon portals open as of Megaverse in Flames and the FoM makes deals with them instead of fighting them, those who do fight (like the 3 dudes that are a split god) get devoured, the souls fed to the demon lords.

Now Rifts is hell on earth, worse than Wormwood, as there is no unified force that can stand against the hordes in north america. So the game from there would be about the other factions, arms dealers, native americans, the cloud magic hawk people, the juicer army, FQ and various churches of various gods who oppose demons everywhere as they band togther. It's literally the most desperate situation you can think of.

But of course, there are rumors of humans joining together, lead by some skull-faced ghost, making demons the hunted.

Because it's palladium, and humans have to win. 'murica.

[Zer0 Kay]

Hmm. What was the purpose of necroing this?

Sometimes, Necromancy is its own reward.

(Also, if you do it enough, you get to turn into a lich.)

Shh! Don't give away my plan!

All for self gratification eh Bill? You know ya can go blind from too much masternecroing?