Opinions on the New Zombies

[Reagren Wright]

Hey guys

Once again I'm out of my usual element (PF and HU) and asking the fans of Dead Reign what do
you think of the new zombies? I'm curious because the ones in Dead Reign to me apptimize the
zombie genre. The ones in Civilization Gone and Dark Places are okay. Although the Pretty
Zombie feels like a stretch me. Then we come to Endless Dead and the Terror Zombie from Fear the
Reaper . These guys seem to belong in the PF or Rifts realm more than a true zombie genre
game, and most of those in Hell Followed are basically the same ones from the main book
only specialized. Although the Seeker and Screecher are pretty cool. Dead Weight and Swimmer
seem repetitive of earlier zombies. The Kidnapper and Shopper feel silly to me. The Dead Mound
Giant (same as those from Endless Dead). Cannibal, Vandal, and Armor feel like a stretch. Toxic
is definitely a favorite. So I'm just curious as what you hardcore fans think about these non-
zombie genre zombies. Do you use them, do you like them, are they silly, etc. Just a freelancer
who is curious about the opinions of the fan base.

[filo_clarke]

I view the different Zombies in the books as options for creating various types of campaigns, and not all found in the same world. Other RPGs about Zombie Apocalypse scenarios (not to name any) do the same thing, by giving a sort of "toolbox" to pick and choose from.

For what it's worth, I tend to stick with a pretty limited set of Zombies based on whatever the theme of my current game happens to be. Usually it is limited to the Sloucher, and variations of those (Crawler, Trash and Sewer Crawlers, Juggernauts, etc.) for games where the Zombie outbreak is the background to the story, and the zombies are more of an "environmental effect" rather than the focus of conflict. These creatures are simply traps and tools to keep the PCs moving through the story, and not really the crux of the action.

I use ones like the Thinker, Pattern Zombie, Mock Zombie (and maybe eventually the Shopper, and Kidnapper) if the game is about humanizing the dead, and the horror of killing those that have been turned. The PCs find it more difficult to callously execute a creature that is still clinging to the shredded memories of a former life. To this end, I tend to portray the zombies more like humans that have been "turned" against their own will, into something monstrous; and the PCs need to decide if killing them is right or wrong, because the dead still carry remnants of their past lives inside themselves.

I have only used Fast Attack zombies a couple of times, to create truly horrific survival scenarios that are difficult (if not impossible) to outlast. These games have always been one-shots, and were very self-contained both in terms of plot, and physical area (Zombies outbreak in a physically contained zone that the PCs have to enter and escape). It pushes the survival horror to a really terrifying level, when the PCs are completely outmatched by the undead.

So, while I haven't used all of the Zombies in the books yet, I do see the possibilities for most, if not all of them. Given the right kind of game, of course.

[Hound]

I'm relaunching our DR campaign shortly and I see possibilities for most of the Zeds. It really depends on what type or DR you are running. I'm using the original setting from Rifters 40 & 45, so having a few "weirder" types fits the supernatural slant.
The normal 'everyday' zombies my players will face will be Slouchers, Crawlers & Juggernauts (and eventually Trash Crawlers and Blow Fish). Runners I'll use as more... attack dogs for the Brulyx cultists. Same for the new Seeker Zombies... those I see lots of possibilities for. Later on they'll start seeing the wierder types, like the Fused Zombies, the new Armored Brutes and a Impersonator or two. Definitely a Walking Grave to scare the hell out of them.
The new "Big Mound" zombie, the Kidnapper, and things like the Spare Parts Thinker are out for me.. they are a bit much- same with Mock and Pretty Zombies.
Thinkers in my game will be FULL thinkers, not basic intelligence but full capacity brains. That should scare my players enough to want to kill me.
One other that is an 'auto-include' for me is the Zombie Shopper. I just love the idea and since we have a Scrounger in the group it's natural to add one.

[bradshaw]

I don't see any of the Classes as "Silly or a Stretch."

[Jimbo]

I think it would depend on the type of game one wants to run. If you are looking more toward the drama of The Walking Dead, then most of the walkers are superfluous beyond slouchers, crawlers and the like. If you are looking at something more along the lines of Z Nation, then the possibilities are much broader. I am more of a classic zombie kind of guy myself. I think that quite a lot of the zombies in the later books are modified rehashes of previous ones.
All that being said, I do like the setting as presented in the books. I don't have all of them but enough to make what I feel is a solid judgement. If I were to run a DR campaign I think I would focus it more on the breakdown of civilization and the way it affects the survivors, using more of the crazy folk as primary antagonists with the zombies as a constant sub threat.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I'm still trying to figure out what "apptimize" means....

That said I agree with Jimbo. (And let me tell ya. I never thought I'd type that sentence.... lol)

Depends on the type of game you're trying to run. If you're going for a 'serious' Zombie game you don't need much beyond slouchers and crawlers.

If you're going for a more campy or splatter punk game, wherer the point is to see just how gross out and silly/stupid things can get, the other ones come into play.

I'm more of the serious type myself, but I understand that Palladium wants to make money on the very popular Genre right now and after you do basic zombies in the book you gotta find something else to put in there.

So we get the silly campy ones.

I've got a book around here some where (non palladium) Where they even had Zombie cows... so... Palladium hasn't reached epic level sillyness yet. (But I'm curious how long before it's presented as an "option' or something.. Zombie animals. could do half a source book on that alone.)

[Jimbo]

Pepsi Jedi, you make it sound as if you know me. Lol

[Unfortunate Son]

I see it not so much as campy or silly, but a logical progression of Palladium doing a zombie game. It doesn't at all surprise me that the minds behind Nightbane gave us multi armed zombies.

The way I see it, these zombies all fit in during an Apocalypse that was designed and Implemented by an intelligence. It only fits that there would be a variety of zombies, including ones that may seem silly.

Hell, I view the zombies as their pantheon of hell, like Hades or Dyval. Only makes sense Brulyx has his legion.

[Pepsi Jedi]

That factors on you playing where the apocalypse "is" Designed and implimented by an Intelligence.

I can't speak for all, and wouldn't want to, but the games I've played have ignored the 'mystical crap'. Much of it was pulled out of the main book to give a more generic Zombie trope. As a writer, I'm a little miffed that the original creator's work was gutted in that fashion. But as a PLAYER I much prefer the "No one really knows what happened" Zombie trope.

If playing in a "Zombies are magical creations of a demon critter" then yeah the more exotic and silly ones 'fit' better, but I just don't play in that setting. Nor.. has anyone I've played with actually preferred that setting.

Heck you throw one sprinter at people and it scares the pants off them. Start adding in Resident evil type stuff and it gets campy instantly and then it's just one sillyness to the next.

[eliakon]

I guess my opinion is that I don't think "Campy" and "silly" can be used as epithets to a zombie game.
The entire genre is campy. Complaining that something that is not useful for your personal house ruled version of the game is 'too silly' strikes me as trying to tell people that they are 'playing it wrong'.
And to be frank... the only use I have for the entire DR line is for the zombies. The more variants and odd balls the better, since I am only buying the books so that I have more stuff to populate the hordes of undead that my necromancers conjure up in other games.
Because to me the idea of a ZA game just breaks my suspension of disbelief and I can't do it. I just can't. The entire thing is, to me, overly campy and ends up being a marathon session of melodrama.
If other people like it, then more power to them. But just as I don't like the game at all, I am going to speculate that some people like it one way, some people like it another way, and others like it still a third way.
Especially since the variant zombies let you play your game in a "Walking Dead" mode or a "Resident Evil" mode or any other ZA mode that you have ever encountered, just season to taste.

[Pepsi Jedi]

Well just opening "Hell Followed"

You're blessed with a 20+ Page section on idiots in masks and what not. Starting with "Brimstone" and "Fire" in a devil mask and red tuxedos respectivly.
"The Dead Rats Gang" where these guys put on giant rat masks
"Snoose" a guy in a gask mask who's loony.
"Zombie cop" who's a half living ... zombie cop
"Mr Banana's" Who's a shirtless tubby freak in a monkey mask.
"Skull Rider" AKA "Wicked pisser"

And then it goes into a 7 page comic where a mock zombie comes across zombies about to eat a naked girl (Why she's naked, it doesn't say) And 'saves' her only to drag her off by ther ankle and put her in the back of his convertable, feet in the air, the insinuation QUITE clear....

Before it goes into the 'new' zombies.
Armored brute, sure, I can see that one being used. They had one on TWD a few episodes ago.

Cannibal munchers (Their words not mine) Whom... attack other zombies to have something to chew on.
"Dead mound giant" where... for reasons not really explained, a bunch of zombies have formed together like.. voltron or something to form a giant head, the size of a Simi, that crawls around to eat people. The bodies are absorbed and then 'changed' to form the giant head thing. (Which it should also be noted is trying to eat a girl with big breasts and nipples who's panties are showing. )
Dead Weight Zombies. Which aren't really a new type, but just a zombie that walks off a roof and falls down on you trying to get you.
Kidnapper Zombies, which abscond with pretty women to....... yeah. And the picture for THAt is some sort of horrible pedophile zombie with literally a woman over it's shoulder grinning hugely as he scampers off with his victim.
Shopper Zombies.. that are walking around like homless guy with a shopping cart
Vandal Zombies... which are.... Zombie street gangs that go around destroying things.

So yeah... I think I'm safe to say that alot of the stuff they're publishing now is just silly.

But maybe guys running around in Monkey masks and no shirts on and "Rat mask game guys" and stuff are not silly to all. Or zombies that are pushing shopping carts around are normal, or ones that with out reason mold themselves into giant heads to eat pretty girls, and I don't even want to touch the zombie rapist...

[eliakon]

Well just opening "Hell Followed"

You're blessed with a 20+ Page section on idiots in masks and what not. Starting with "Brimstone" and "Fire" in a devil mask and red tuxedos respectivly.
"The Dead Rats Gang" where these guys put on giant rat masks
"Snoose" a guy in a gask mask who's loony.
"Zombie cop" who's a half living ... zombie cop
"Mr Banana's" Who's a shirtless tubby freak in a monkey mask.
"Skull Rider" AKA "Wicked pisser"

And then it goes into a 7 page comic where a mock zombie comes across zombies about to eat a naked girl (Why she's naked, it doesn't say) And 'saves' her only to drag her off by ther ankle and put her in the back of his convertable, feet in the air, the insinuation QUITE clear....

Before it goes into the 'new' zombies.
Armored brute, sure, I can see that one being used. They had one on TWD a few episodes ago.

Cannibal munchers (Their words not mine) Whom... attack other zombies to have something to chew on.
"Dead mound giant" where... for reasons not really explained, a bunch of zombies have formed together like.. voltron or something to form a giant head, the size of a Simi, that crawls around to eat people. The bodies are absorbed and then 'changed' to form the giant head thing. (Which it should also be noted is trying to eat a girl with big breasts and nipples who's panties are showing. )
Dead Weight Zombies. Which aren't really a new type, but just a zombie that walks off a roof and falls down on you trying to get you.
Kidnapper Zombies, which abscond with pretty women to....... yeah. And the picture for THAt is some sort of horrible pedophile zombie with literally a woman over it's shoulder grinning hugely as he scampers off with his victim.
Shopper Zombies.. that are walking around like homless guy with a shopping cart
Vandal Zombies... which are.... Zombie street gangs that go around destroying things.

So yeah... I think I'm safe to say that alot of the stuff they're publishing now is just silly.

But maybe guys running around in Monkey masks and no shirts on and "Rat mask game guys" and stuff are not silly to all. Or zombies that are pushing shopping carts around are normal, or ones that with out reason mold themselves into giant heads to eat pretty girls, and I don't even want to touch the zombie rapist...

I don't have my copy yet, so I haven't read the stats.
But of those.
The Cannibal Munchers and Dead Mound Giant are already sounding useful as necromantic creations.
The Kidnapper Zombie and Vandal Zombie sound like they have use as well, again looking at it through the lens of "necromancy and supernatural"
If your starting with the premise that 'zombies should just shamble around and attack the protagonists in waves like in that one show/book/comic/whatever' then yeah, its probably not useful to you.
In that case, sure just stick with shamblers and be done with it.

[Pepsi Jedi]

My point being that when you -literally- have tubby guys in gorilla masks, guys in rat masks looking like Spy vs Spy and "Wicked pisser" along with mutoid giant heads, it's in the realm of silly and campy.

Which is fine, if that's what you want to play. But call it what it is at that point. lol.

[bradshaw]

As a writer.

I'm an avid reader and am curious what have you written?

[Eagle]

Haven't read the new book, but the variant zombies could have uses. Again, it depends on what kind of game you want to run. Not all of them should really fit in the same campaign. But one or two of them might be appropriate to your game. Most of these were probably based on some zombie that appeared in some movie somewhere.

As far as the pretty zombie, watch the film "Dead Girl" about that very topic. Not a silly movie at all, very very creepy.

[Suicycho]

I have a few of the DR books. My big problem with the variety of zombies is that a lot of them are the exact same zombie, stat-wise, you just find them in different locations. When many of the zombies are 99% identical in stats/natural abilities, do you really need to waste so much page count doing a complete write up of each zombies stats and natural abilities? It would be better to just list Standard Abilities or In addition to standard abilities. Too many palladium books pad the page count with copy & paste reprint info.

[eliakon]

I have a few of the DR books. My big problem with the variety of zombies is that a lot of them are the exact same zombie, stat-wise, you just find them in different locations. When many of the zombies are 99% identical in stats/natural abilities, do you really need to waste so much page count doing a complete write up of each zombies stats and natural abilities? It would be better to just list Standard Abilities or In addition to standard abilities. Too many palladium books pad the page count with copy & paste reprint info.

^this^
I actually like the zombie variants...
...that are variants.
But unless it has a different moan, then just say "Zombie moan" and move on.
And if it is a MK III Shambler with a quirk... just a paragraph telling us about this kind of quirk is all that you need.
This would allow for the page count to be used for stuff like some maps of generic locations (A truck stop, a school, a restaurant, a store, a mall, whatever) some sample NPCs, or other bits of color that can help flesh out the world so to speak.

[Suicycho]

As a writer.

I'm an avid reader and am curious what have you written?

Same. Anything on amazon?