Golden age Weaponsmiths Abrams Tank

[Vrykolas2k]

In the alternate world that became Rifts earth, it's possible that the various world governments might have mothballed old equipment, particularly for use by some sort of reserve units or whatever. That's just my take on why the old stuff's still found by GAW and others.

[ShadowLogan]

My whole issue is the belief that a modern Battle tank is not naturally possessed with hundreds of MDC and a powerful Mega Damage cannon.

Well if we look at RCB1r rules for conversion of between SDC and MDC. They have holes in them, and aren't consistently applied (its not always 1:1) and do not seem to consider aspects such as AR in the conversion (and the rarely used PV).

Part of the problem also stems from the lack of scale on Palladium's part where lighter items have more mdc per unit of mass, or where BFGs don't seem to be all that impressive on giant robots that dwarf a Glitterboy's boomgun that is just killer. It just reveals how arbitrary the values actually are in the system (though surprising consistent) as it favors some things over others to be better. Something that might better balance in the SDC system because of AR (both levels) and maybe PV (if used).

My biggest issue with them "finding" and refitting these items is the fact they would likely not even be in civil defense armories by 2098......just like CS Navy having subs that would be over 120 years old when "stored" let alone adding almost 300 years to them when "foun

Being 120years old... That is some what possible, at least with proper care and conditions (which they could have received during the GA). There are people who still fly WWII-era planes, and the B-52 service life is projected to approach 90+ years. The USN does maintain a "ghost fleet" of inactive ships, and the USS Constitution entered service in 1797 (221years IINM, granted this is an exception and not the rule). I don't know about the army, but USAF maintains a boneyard of old aircraft for parts and such.

Now getting through the 300 years without care/conditions IS an issue, but one that Rifts provides some options that no one has caught on to just yet and just belives they've been sitting there for 300years:
1. Time travel like the RCMP (WB20) or GA Japanese Cities (WB8) or dinosaurs, etc
2. They aren't "native" to the dimension, but Rifted in
3. They are reproductions (who built/put them there and why I don't know) and not "originals" (WB14 has "reproductions" for Old West guns, why not 20th Century military hardware)
4. They aren't actually what they appear to be, but rather some "mutation" of hardware induced by the Rifts (we know organics can be changed by exposure, I can't think of a tech example off hand, but we are talking about magical energies so...)

[glitterboy2098]

One possibility is that the NAA was actually running its own refit program on the M1, to export the results to allied countries that cant afford new build gear. Then you could justify an extensive refit on the armor. It was done prerifts, with gaw just find in a storage warehouse with most of the work done, so it just has to clean them up and install electronics and ammo.

You would still only get the mercops stats though. No mdc internals means any new external armor would have reduced protection, and for such an old tank they wouldn't want to spend more on it than they have to. So they probably wood be using older less efficient composites.

No way you would get the original post' s stats, which are almost on par with what would be the cutting edge (the IHA designs). Not with a century old platform. Would be like expecting a M4 Sherman could be refit to match an M1A2.

[Nightmartree]

4. They aren't actually what they appear to be, but rather some "mutation" of hardware induced by the Rifts (we know organics can be changed by exposure, I can't think of a tech example off hand, but we are talking about magical energies so...)

Psychic Guns and Weapons, no not weapons and armor and vehicles with psychic powers. Rather the REAL items decayed long ago, what remains is merely a psychic impression, so empowered by the energies of rifts earth that they remain usable as real items! Normally they are only sdc items, however on leylines and nexus points they are super charged becoming MDC structures with MD capabilities.

If you want a lot of them...well...there is this ONE little rift/dimension that when opened so that the energies can come through will totally blast everything in the area into nothingness...luckily the dimension has a ton of loose psychic energies that empower the impressions of the destroyed items remaking them as "real" enities! even people! sometimes!....the rest kind of get blasted into oblivion as their minds are destroyed by the outpouring of psychic energies, that destabilizes their impressions and they poof

[taalismn]

Psychic Guns and Weapons, no not weapons and armor and vehicles with psychic powers. Rather the REAL items decayed long ago, what remains is merely a psychic impression, so empowered by the energies of rifts earth that they remain usable as real items! Normally they are only sdc items, however on leylines and nexus points they are super charged becoming MDC structures with MD capabilities.

If you want a lot of them...well...there is this ONE little rift/dimension that when opened so that the energies can come through will totally blast everything in the area into nothingness...luckily the dimension has a ton of loose psychic energies that empower the impressions of the destroyed items remaking them as "real" enities! even people! sometimes!....the rest kind of get blasted into oblivion as their minds are destroyed by the outpouring of psychic energies, that destabilizes their impressions and they poof

Interesting idea.
I went with 'haunted vehicles' myself, but not everybody wants to drive a former gate guardian armored vehicle that may have an agenda of its own.

[Nightmartree]

Interesting idea.
I went with 'haunted vehicles' myself, but not everybody wants to drive a former gate guardian armored vehicle that may have an agenda of its own.

I like it, you end up with "normal" arms and weapons, used by "normal" people and then as a full moon rises in the sky, demons pour forth from a rift and an old army unit from before the time of the rifts rolls over a hill, bullets fly as haunting ghosts, ghost vehicles (cause lets face it psychic impression is just saying ghost) and more defend this earth upon which they were born and now are sustained by the (un)life sustaining energies. None of them do "weird spooky stuff" like walk through walls or fly or any of that "ghostly stuff" these are real men and women with real armament from back then...as far as they are concerned they were just given the power to fight the supernatural, they no longer have to eat or really rest (though they get tired),it does come with the side effect of dissolving upon death, but they're just normal people...just normal people.

If a few of your fellows ended up with their minds in vehicles that occasionally manifest an ectoplasmic body as long as it doesn't go too far from their "body", well at least they can still eat their favorite foods in the motor pool. Just bring an entire military base forward in time, if someone dies they get reduced to a entity like the possessors or tectonic ones until they get enough PPE or ISP to reform, if they are destroyed in those forms they die finally. That adds some survivability to the base and items to explain how they made it all these years with only "normal" weapons and gear, none of the super tech really made it through intact, maybe it was too new? They may die, but they can reform unless wiped out totally.

[taalismn]

Interesting idea.
I went with 'haunted vehicles' myself, but not everybody wants to drive a former gate guardian armored vehicle that may have an agenda of its own.

I like it, you end up with "normal" arms and weapons, used by "normal" people and then as a full moon rises in the sky, demons pour forth from a rift and an old army unit from before the time of the rifts rolls over a hill, bullets fly as haunting ghosts, ghost vehicles (cause lets face it psychic impression is just saying ghost) and more defend this earth upon which they were born and now are sustained by the (un)life sustaining energies. None of them do "weird spooky stuff" like walk through walls or fly or any of that "ghostly stuff" these are real men and women with real armament from back then...as far as they are concerned they were just given the power to fight the supernatural, they no longer have to eat or really rest (though they get tired),it does come with the side effect of dissolving upon death, but they're just normal people...just normal people..

That sounds like some kinda Heroes Unlimited superpower combo---Weretanks/aircraft. Or maybe a Nightspawn morphus combo(Military Vehicle-theme)

[Shark_Force]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

[Jefffar]

There are still militaries that include derivatives of WW2 Sherman Tanks and T-34s on their official inventories.

[slade2501]

Interesting idea.
I went with 'haunted vehicles' myself, but not everybody wants to drive a former gate guardian armored vehicle that may have an agenda of its own.

I like it, you end up with "normal" arms and weapons, used by "normal" people and then as a full moon rises in the sky, demons pour forth from a rift and an old army unit from before the time of the rifts rolls over a hill, bullets fly as haunting ghosts, ghost vehicles (cause lets face it psychic impression is just saying ghost) and more defend this earth upon which they were born and now are sustained by the (un)life sustaining energies. None of them do "weird spooky stuff" like walk through walls or fly or any of that "ghostly stuff" these are real men and women with real armament from back then...as far as they are concerned they were just given the power to fight the supernatural, they no longer have to eat or really rest (though they get tired),it does come with the side effect of dissolving upon death, but they're just normal people...just normal people.

If a few of your fellows ended up with their minds in vehicles that occasionally manifest an ectoplasmic body as long as it doesn't go too far from their "body", well at least they can still eat their favorite foods in the motor pool. Just bring an entire military base forward in time, if someone dies they get reduced to a entity like the possessors or tectonic ones until they get enough PPE or ISP to reform, if they are destroyed in those forms they die finally. That adds some survivability to the base and items to explain how they made it all these years with only "normal" weapons and gear, none of the super tech really made it through intact, maybe it was too new? They may die, but they can reform unless wiped out totally.

oh god I LOVE THIS IDEA

[Nightmartree]

oh god I LOVE THIS IDEA

Someone gets it

[Zer0 Kay]

Ill agree that the up-armoring on the GAW-stuff seemed really light. If you simply replaced the armor on the Abrams with an equal weight of MDC armor (which is usually *lighter* than old-school armor) it should have had a decent amount of MDC - same for any of their upgrades.

Only reason i can see it being so light is to really keep costs down, i guess.

The cannon itself doesn't need upgrading but i can see thoroughly modern rounds being made for it that inflict more damage than what you listed, simply because a mini-missile warhead is smaller than those shells. Hell, you could just use mini-missile warheads.

you could use mini-missile warheads. but I would argue that the cannon-firing action could detonate the missiles due to acceleration forces. would probably have to redesign the warhead trigger mechanism, and GAW probably finds it easier to reproduce the old style cannon ammo than spend time and credits designing a new round from scratch. Which would be FAR easier still than replacing the main gun. even changing out the barrel on an Abrams is quite the ***** of a job, never mind remounting the main gun or replacing a turret.

That said, they could probably try to build some specialty rounds with different explosive mixes, or gas/smoke rounds, IR-opaque smoke, radar blocking, ECM, etc. make the gun more versatile.

I have a beautiful mental vision of one of these main gun rounds slow-mo shattering some CS grunt's torso like a dinner plate filled with ketchup, his squad's scorn and laughter suddenly silenced as they are splashed with their fellow's gibs. A Samas pilot grips his railgun tighter in dawning realization of the threat as the turret gunners open fire with their laser weapons and more main gun rounds pound in, chewing 20ft bites out of the landscape and throwing troopers bodies like ragdolls. The sound of 40 tons of turbine driven battle-metal tearing up soil, rock and trees as it grinds shredded armor and flesh into the earth. The sweet poisonous smell of cordite, paired with the servo-motor whine of the turret's rotation. the returning fire gouging and scratching at armor, cutting but not deep enough. A trooper's scream radioed and sharply cut short as biting tank treads roll him under like a set of hungry giant's teeth........

Why? Most missiles travel faster than an APFSDS round.

[taalismn]

[
Why? Most missiles travel faster than an APFSDS round.

Because missiles are more expensive?
Well, depending on the size.

[Zer0 Kay]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

[Zer0 Kay]

[
Why? Most missiles travel faster than an APFSDS round.

Because missiles are more expensive?
Well, depending on the size.

Sorry I was asking why a missiles detonator would have to be altered due to acceleration forces.

[glitterboy2098]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

except he wasn't talking about sales to civilians. rather to 2nd and 3rd world nations. like how we've supplied Vietnam, Pakistan, Iran, Turkey, etc at various times. until fairly recently, said sales were usually of older equipment that we were retiring or which needed cleared from the boneyards to make room for more recent retirees.

[Jefffar]

[
Why? Most missiles travel faster than an APFSDS round.

Because missiles are more expensive?
Well, depending on the size.

Sorry I was asking why a missiles detonator would have to be altered due to acceleration forces.

Because missiles don't reach top speed for several seconds, shells reach it by the time they leave the barrel. The acceleration forces are considerably different.

[eliakon]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

Exactly
They are allies who are getting our old gear.
The US was part of a rather large alliance of nations during the "New Cold War" with a rather wide range of allies. Many of those allies would want ANY MDC gear at all... and the US gets to get rid of its antique surplus, and make some money, and clear up space, and make its allies happy, and project force strategically with out using US lives.... Pentuple Word Score!

And considering the vast number of warlords and rebels that the US backs nowdays with top flight gear I dont see any reason to suppose that would suddenly change.

[dreicunan]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

Exactly
They are allies who are getting our old gear.
The US was part of a rather large alliance of nations during the "New Cold War" with a rather wide range of allies. Many of those allies would want ANY MDC gear at all... and the US gets to get rid of its antique surplus, and make some money, and clear up space, and make its allies happy, and project force strategically with out using US lives.... Pentuple Word Score!

And considering the vast number of warlords and rebels that the US backs nowdays with top flight gear I dont see any reason to suppose that would suddenly change.

Your point is strengthened because we know for a fact that the American Empire was sometimes handing out cutting edge gear like the USA G-10 to their allies.

[Blue_Lion]

[
Why? Most missiles travel faster than an APFSDS round.

Because missiles are more expensive?
Well, depending on the size.

Sorry I was asking why a missiles detonator would have to be altered due to acceleration forces.

Because missiles don't reach top speed for several seconds, shells reach it by the time they leave the barrel. The acceleration forces are considerably different.

they do make missiles that are fired from the main guns of tanks.
A cannons projectile typically get its speed by being launched from a controlled explosion. The explosion sets the speed of the round. Missiles typically get propelled by rocket propulsion. It is entirely possible and even done for rocket propelled missiles to be fired from a canon.
(If i recall right as soon as the round is launched from the shell by the explosion before it leaves the barrel it is at top speed. This can be seen in EFP that may not have a barrel.)

[taalismn]

[
they do make missiles that are fired from the main guns of tanks.
A cannons projectile typically get its speed by being launched from a controlled explosion. The explosion sets the speed of the round. Missiles typically get propelled by rocket propulsion. It is entirely possible and even done for rocket propelled missiles to be fired from a canon.
(If i recall right as soon as the round is launched from the shell by the explosion before it leaves the barrel it is at top speed. This can be seen in EFP that may not have a barrel.)

Not sure how successful they've been, though. The US military in the 60s sank a lot of money into the Shillelagh cannon-launched missile. The system proved so bug-fraught that it killed both an M60 variant and the M551 that the Army had pinned hopes on.
The Russians went on to try something similar, but I've heard nothing on their success with the same idea. They may have just gone with lasere-guided 'smart' shells.

[jaymz]

Yeah at this point you're better off in just mounting an external itow launcher....

[taalismn]

Admittedly the US Air Force was also experimenting in the 1950s with lower caliber rocket-firing aviation cannon(an improved version of the Scorpion interceptor was going to carry it) that never got anywhere(larger guided missiles proved more viable against the expected Soviet threats), which I shamelessly knocked off and munchkinized for my own Paladin Steel, but that's hardly canon.

So, either generous amounts of handwavium-spiked Golden Age tech to produce a viable and game-breaker cannon-fired missile, super-velocity giant gyrojet KEW round, or go with external missile racks.

[ShadowLogan]

Admittedly the US Air Force was also experimenting in the 1950s with lower caliber rocket-firing aviation cannon(an improved version of the Scorpion interceptor was going to carry it) that never got anywhere(larger guided missiles proved more viable against the expected Soviet threats), which I shamelessly knocked off and munchkinized for my own Paladin Steel, but that's hardly canon.

So, either generous amounts of handwavium-spiked Golden Age tech to produce a viable and game-breaker cannon-fired missile, super-velocity giant gyrojet KEW round, or go with external missile racks.

Well we know Columbia uses such technology (WB6 and WB9 adds a few more with another block), though I'm not sure if they use them in <100mm range. In terms of man-portable systems and 20mm systems they are fairly potent. Columbia's tech also dates to GA IINM.

[glitterboy2098]

Admittedly the US Air Force was also experimenting in the 1950s with lower caliber rocket-firing aviation cannon(an improved version of the Scorpion interceptor was going to carry it) that never got anywhere(larger guided missiles proved more viable against the expected Soviet threats), which I shamelessly knocked off and munchkinized for my own Paladin Steel, but that's hardly canon.

So, either generous amounts of handwavium-spiked Golden Age tech to produce a viable and game-breaker cannon-fired missile, super-velocity giant gyrojet KEW round, or go with external missile racks.

and it isn't like there hasn't been examples of external missiles racks on tanks before. in WW2 pretty much everyone stuck multiple rocket launcher systems onto a tank at some point (T23 Calliope, T40 Wizbang, Matilda Hedgehog, Sherman Tulip, Panzerwerfer and Nebelwerfer rocket mounts, etc), and there has been various experiments with mounting ATGM's or light SAM's onto tanks using external mounts during the cold war. (the French tried fitting HOT-3's and SS.11 ATGM's to the AMX-13/75, the Swedes tried mounting 3 Rb 53 BANTAM missiles to the Stridsvagn 81-102, the Russians tried mounting their various external ATGM's (AT-1's, 3's, and 5's usually) on MBT's at various times, in the end using them just on the BMP and BTR-D's, and pursuing the gun launched missiles for the tanks. (which they have several versions for the T-55, T-64,T-72, and T-90) usually it just proved too finicky using the missile tech at the time to warrant adoption. though such systems did find a niche on IFV's and APC's.
rifts missile tech is a lot more mature, and we see missiles on armored vehicles across the setting, from the IHA stuff to the CS to the NGR, etc..

[guardiandashi]

there is also technically RAP (Rocket Assisted Projectiles) rounds, although I believe they are kind of going the other way, IE they are more cannon rounds that have a rocket booster stage that is loaded, and ignited when the cannon fires, IE you load the shell then you load the rap section kind of like loading a second round, then you load the powder and fire the cannon / artillery and the round is fired, with the rocket igniting and continuing to accelerate the round after it leaves the barrel until the rocket booster portion burns out, then the projectile continues it flight path.

[Zer0 Kay]

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

Exactly
They are allies who are getting our old gear.
The US was part of a rather large alliance of nations during the "New Cold War" with a rather wide range of allies. Many of those allies would want ANY MDC gear at all... and the US gets to get rid of its antique surplus, and make some money, and clear up space, and make its allies happy, and project force strategically with out using US lives.... Pentuple Word Score!

And considering the vast number of warlords and rebels that the US backs nowdays with top flight gear I dont see any reason to suppose that would suddenly change.

We're talking allies... then yup. Not just mothballed but brand new ones. In that case it'd be more likely to sell new equipment to allies they want to see survive... Well at least less old. With that scenario in mind giving an ally a M1 Abrams in the GA would be like giving one of our current allies a Sherman... no an M1917. Gotta figure even the U.S. was still using Sherman's before the Abrams but by the time of CE at least a couple newer... Never mind. For some reason I keep thinking CE happened in 2398 not 2098. Eighty years from now the Abrams is exactly what we'd be giving/selling to our allies as we would have just produced or have recently fielded the fleet of next generation MBTs.

Okay everyone you can save this post where I admit my argument is wrong for so long I've thought CE was 2398... the realization/realignment now makes SOME of the GA:WS equipment make sense... they found mothball yards full of the previous couple generations of equipment. Still it isn't really GA tech it is prior to GA tech.

[Prole]

Has this been compared to Kitsune’s version yet?

i would point out that just because a given vehicle would no longer be in the US army doesn't mean it couldn't be in anyone else's army. we've already established that tanks are MDC vehicles capable of dealing MD, so yeah, in a world with glitter boys they certainly aren't going to be ideal, but if the US is for some reason not willing to sell their golden age tech with you, well, maybe the government doesn't care about you selling 20th century tanks (especially if they have minimal electronics, for example) just like the modern US government probably would be relatively unconcerned about a company selling WW I rifles to someone.

so if we presume that was the case, and the companies and factories were intended to ship a no-frills version of the tank out to african warlords or something like that, it makes a bit more sense for them to still be around even in the height of the golden age.

Yup government has no problems with people buying Thompson M1919s... oh oh and M1918 BARs are definitely legal for the average gun buyer.

Why are you comparing Apple's to oranges?

The U.S. is as likely to sell a Sherman to someone in the 20th century as the American Empire would an Abrams one does not sell off ones mothballed equipment without demilling it first or vetting the purchaser.

People for decades could buy Thompson M1919s and M1918 BARs, actually, sometimes they were sold at hardware stores.