Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:Perception wouldn't need to be perfect if what you're trying to perceive is glaringly obvious. You must not have a mental image of what we're talking about here. All your 'Oh you could sneak under it by moving slow" and what not. The beads would still move and cause a void the size of a human body. you'd have to be literally retarded not to notice that and that's pushing it.
That depends on where your attention is focused, how much sleep you got, what's on your mind, etc. I've sometimes been so disoriented I don't even notice a door is open/closed when I'm right next to it and assumed the latter. It's an eventual risk with any human guard.
Which is why there's not just one guard, guarding a point of entry to a highly fortified fortress city. There's multiples. So if someone starts slacking off you can pimpslap the back of their helmet and get them back on tasks. That's what NCO's are for. And... did you some how miss... the what.. 5 or so times I pointed out multiple redundancy? So your one mentally defective guard that some how got placed on guard duty.. and can't see a frigging curtain move... isn't the last line of defense for the CS fortress city? The others would pick up the glaringly obvious thing?
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:You'd have to have a severe mental retardation to some how miss it and at that point we're talking "Can't dress yourself' sort of mental deficency. Not the person you have standing on guard duty.
Mental deficiency/retardation can be a temporary state
So it's your contention now... that the guard, who's life literally depends on the actions he's conducting... just so happens to have a momentary attack of retardation, the instant someone tries to breech security.
Wow. Lucky infiltrator....
Axelmania wrote: that even very competent humans can sink to when under extreme stress,
This is their chosen profession, and while stressful, wouldn't be any more stressful than any other day on the wall.
Axelmania wrote: and I imagine it's stressful being a CS soldier.
Any soldier really. But one stationed inside of Chi town is going to be a lot more chill than one out on the frontier. One working a security check point isn't going to be more stressed than someone working the US border or the TSA, or more likely the DMZ in South Korea. They do their jobs and go home at the end of the day and watch tv
Axelmania wrote: I think much of the reliance on competence with this approach would be on the fatigue-immune Skelebot, making them the point of failure enemies would target.
Because you're acting like all the human troops and all the dog boy troops are just alseep at the switch. this is the CS military. We don't have it typed out in a book, what happens to people that slack off at guard duty, but I'm guessing it's going to be something akin to the Mobile Infantry of Starship troopers.
Perhaps a stern talking to by your NCO for first offense (Maybe skipping that) and strung up and lashed for a second, and drummed out with a dishonorable discharge for a second or third, if not jail. This is the safety of the CS at stake here. your personification of Bevis and Butthead jerkingaround, picking their noses and staring at the sun, so oblivious that they can't even see a curtain part to admit a human sized individual because... that individual was sooooo crafty as to part the curtain at the bottom, is absurd. Are there jerkoffs and lay abouts in the CS military? Oh yes.
But you don't station them at one of your few points of entry for your fortress city. you send them out to hold the line at some back of beyond wilderness out post.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:If you're an ant you could pull it off, but you're not playing an ant, so we can just table such stupidity.
If a 6 foot guy is say, 2 feet broad, then a shrunk to 6 inches guy would be 2 inches broad. A slow-motion 1 inch radius cylinder rolling under this will ALWAYS be detected?
You're moving the goal posts and adding in even more additional spells that this mage is pulling off all at the same time. If you're giving him superpowers too this becomes a different equasion. And my point wasn't that the curtain can stop any and all things. it was that the curtain would stop the combo proposed up thread.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:It doesn't matter how slowly you move. Your body displaces the beads. They move to allow the body through them. unless your body is a cm or less thick, you're displacing the beads. Moving slower will just make them part .... slowly. Where in the guard on duty smirks elbows his friend, Targets the middle of the gap and vaporizes your head.
I think the human eye is attracted to faster movement and uber-slow movement might not register.
The human isn't a Trex from Jurassic park. Infact the Trex from Jurassic park wasn't even the Trex from Jurassic park. that misconception was cleaned up in later books as a misunderstanding of the movement bast visual acuity.
If you're a guard, set to guard a hallway and watch a curtain for movement, and movement indicates magical or high tech invaders, which have to be assumed to be hostile and at LEAST possessing magic and or tech to be rendered invisible... then yeah you're going to pay attention to any movement fast or slow.
Again your concept that the guards are too mind numbingly stupid, to register movement in the one thing they're watching for movement in, is frankly stupid.
Axelmania wrote:
If you're rolling the "middle" of the gap would by your abdomen not your head.
It doesn't matter, a human sized object has to displace a human sized hole.
Axelmania wrote:Pepsi Jedi wrote:Because the beads aren't just going to part to allow an object through them on their own. So if/when they do part you know SOMETHING is coming through.
Only if your brain can register they are parting. If shower curtain was being slowly opened at a speed of 1 millimetre per minute and you were set to stare at that door for an hour, when exactly would you notice it is opening?
When it starts to move. I.E. with in the first minute, and before you can fit an entire person through the gap. lol Just because it's moving slowly doesn't mean you don't notice the gap and you're going to notice it before its more than an inch wide, because... that's what you're watching for, and you're not slipping through in that small amount of space, with out MORE spells and super powers poured on top, changing the equation.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:you can watch the entire curtain at once. What kind of metal rejects do you perceive on guard duty only watching the top few inches of the thing???
The greater the area you focus on, the less you would be able to perceive subtle movements.
A human sized gap is not subtle unless you're far far away or your npc's are very very VERY stupid.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:Yes, you have meat eyes watching the security just in case magic or psionics can block cyber ones, and you have Cyber eyes (skelebots, cameras, motion detectors etc) just in case the meat eyes are fooled.
This brings up an interesting idea:
What if, rather than invisibility, the solution is simply to create a magical illusion over the area of an unparted curtain?
The skelebot just shoots the mage and a different one brings a mop? The motion detectors pick up the movement instead of the illusion, etc etc etc. the only way the above combo even has a chance is with the invisible to sensors thing included. With out it you're stopped before you start.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:"oh I think a camera could do it better" When we're literally discussing a spell that would make a camera fail. lol You think over the 100 years the CS has been a thing, they never heard about that spell? One of the vanguard din't give them a heads up? Or a mage caught INSIDE the city didn't give up how he got past the cameras under.... 'enhanced questioning'???
Again this only works if your CS are LITERALLY retarded.
The spell in question would make a camera fail to detect a person, not fail to detect a curtain. Some other spell cold probably manage that, but then some other spell could make humans fail to detect a curtain too. I think 'illusion' in either case.
Illusion isn't going to trick the motion sensors and Skelebots, and the dog boys are going to pick you up. Even if they can't see you they'll sense and smell you and hit the button dropping the blast doors, then you're toast.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:It doesn't matter if you roll at the rate of a cm every hour. The curtain is still going to bow out and move 'around' you. people notice it when it's moved out of standard placement. Even if it moves slowly. You're targeted and eliminated for being stupid.
Oh? So WHEN do they notice? I think it's potentially a slow-boiled frog situation.
Only because you're attributing the guards with the brain of a frog. The easiest answer is that the magnetic strip on the floor that pulls the beads back into line, is painted a different color. So you can tell when the beads are off the mark.
And as simple as a sensor that triggers when ever a mild electrical contact is lost with the strand. if the beads break contact with the floor the light flashes. Light flashing draws the eye (As if they wern't already watching) and you look to see what sets it off. The beads are out of place? Why? Oh my there's a void in the curtain the size of a human or dbee. what could that possibly be? Maybe we should hit the button closing the blast door and investigate!
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:It's actually a well spread myth. Chocolate is 'poisonous' to dogs, if they eat their own body weight in high coca dark chocolate. The myth was mainly spread by parents that didn't want their kids sharing their (Realitivly) expensive treats with their pets, and some vets wink wink nudge nudge going along with it. Your dog is fine.
If your 4 pound yorkiepoo ate 2 POUNDS of dark chocolate it might get sick, but if it ate two pounds of anything it's likely going to get sick.
https://www.merckvetmanual.com/toxicolo ... /chocolate claims "One ounce of milk chocolate per pound of body weight is a potentially lethal dose in dogs.", so rather than 2 pounds (32 ounces) it sounds like 4 ounces would be enough for fatal effects. MILD (non-fatal) symptoms also appear to start at 0.02 oz/lb according to Merck.
As I said it's a well spread myth. I've worked in vets offices. I can't tell you how often panic'd people bring their dogs in for getting ahold of a chocolate bar. Dr Kourtney would just laugh softly and check them out. If the people insisted, (And they often did) he'd run a few tests. In literal -years- of working at the vet. I never once saw chocolate kill a dog. Nothing more than making the dog throw up. Which can happen with any 'people food' you give it. Depending on the dog. Kids give chocolate to dogs -aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll- the time. Very few of them even get sick. There's not 1000s of dogs killing over every day becaus they got a few ounces of chocolate. Heck I even saw it make it into an RPG about werewolves once. It's silly.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:So now you're playing 6 inch player characters. Well if we're going to add even MORE to the what is it? Three or four spells we've stacked up, why not super powers too, intangibility would get you past the curtain fine. added to allllllll the other absurd stuff you might just make it.
Who needs Intangibility? Already mentioned the temporal spell d-phase.
Riiight.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:Axelmania wrote:
The magnets would still take a small amount of time doing this, so human walkers would leave a wake for short people to follow through.
Which is why you enforce a pause.
Like a "the beads are sitting atop my head and back" pause to see if you grew a tiny gnomish hunchback or bead-booty?
I don't even know what you're talking about.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:You need to reread the 50 or so source material books. If anything, the CS is not skimping on security.
No matter how many billions you spend on security, you can always make it more secure, so inevitably you relativistically "skimp" somewhere desired if some other desired placed seems more important.
But choosing to skimp on points of entry, JUST So the other side has a better chance of getting in, would be pretty dumb.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:When you're a guard you use as many senses as you can at the same time to take in more information and process it. Your eyes to watch for things, ears to listen, nose to smell (More than one sneak has been betrayed by odor, and not just by dogs.) you even 'feel'. Displaced aircurrents or vibrations in floors have given sneaks away. Now it's doubt ful you'll taste someone, but the others you use.
I 100% agree that guards will be instructed to use many senses: which will make them slightly sub-optimal than they would be if focusing one sense on one task. Even if it's as minor as being 99% as good.
Which doesn't matter. You're just arguing to argue.
Axelmania wrote: Pepsi Jedi wrote:guards aren't wearing ear plugs to cut out the sound so they can 'Watch harder' and some aren't sitting around with black out goggles on so they listen harder.
I agree, because the net benefit of using all senses is better: but it does mean they wouldn't be as good as if they did that. They might not need to be, but if you were trying to utterly maximize one sense and avoid distraction, I think you would do that.
It's stupid. Full stop. No guard station in the WORLD has guards sitting with ear plugs in so they can 'watch 1% harder' or masks over their eyes so they "Can listen 1% harder"
It's stupid. Stop it.
Axelmania wrote:
I can blow my bedroom door shut if I stand close enough, and dog-boys probably have lungs thrice as powerful as mine.
So now we have the big bad wolf guarding the door..... and huffing and puffing and blowing at the security curtains... but they're too stupid to notice if the curtains move.....
Axelmania wrote:
A better explanation than coffee however might be if dog-boys pant to stay cool, which they might need to, since they don't often get full environmental body armor (only occasional surplus) with built-in AC, yet they are still dressed in heavy black plate, have loads of muscle, fur, etc.
Which doesn't move curtains more than an inch or two from their face...
Axelmania wrote: Makes me wonder what the seasonal temperatures of chi-town are. Are we going to assume the CS with its unlimited resources can keep all checkpoints perfectly air-conditioned?
The check points would lead through the hallway and secure location. They may 'start' out doors but you'll be funneled through quite a bit of indoor area before you're free to move about the city.
Chi town has the resources to build millions of nuclear reactors the size of hockey pucks. They can pull off AC if they wish.