Physical Skill bonuses and Martial Art Forms

[thorr-kan]

In general, the bonuses from Physical Skills stack with the bonuses from Martial Art Forms. But MAFs are pretty specific about what combat skills they grant. Take Pao Chih (Mystic China): it only grants Dodge and Roll with punch/fall/impact.

But if a Physical Skill grants a Combat Ability, doesn't a MAF get that? For example, some versions of Gymnastics and Acrobatics give a kick. I just can't find the citation for it.

But more interestingly, if a Physical Skill grants a bonus to a Combat Ability an MAF does not have, does that MAF now have the Combat Ability? For example, some versions of Athletics (General) give a bonus to strike with a body block/tackle or a bonus to kicking damage. In the example above, does this user of Pao Chih now have body block/tackle and kick as Combat Abilities?

[green.nova343]

Remember to check the MAF descriptions. A lot of them will list actions that don't necessarily get a bonus, or don't get bonuses until a higher level...but they can still perform them.

Aikido might be one of the few that actually would have a limitation like that. Note that while its sole hand attack (Knife Hand KO) does no damage & can only be used on a target that you already have in a Joint Lock, it uses a Strike roll...even though the form itself has no bonuses to strike. But your natural PP bonuses would apply...so someone who took Boxing would still get the strike bonus.

[Soldier of Od]

My take on this is that, just like if you have more than one martial art forms, all attack moves are separate.
If you get a kick attack from having gymnastics, you can kick, but your bonuses to strike from your martial art form(s) will not count towards this kick attack (P.P. bonuses would).
If you get a body-block attack from having athletics, and that provides a bonus of +1 to strike with said body block attack, if your martial art form does not include a body-block, then you just get the strike bonus from athletics. But, if you already get a body-block move as part of your martial art form, then I would add the +1 bonus from athletics to that.

[thorr-kan]

My take on this is that, just like if you have more than one martial art forms, all attack moves are separate.

Except Physical skills specifically stack with MAFs.

[Soldier of Od]

My take on this is that, just like if you have more than one martial art forms, all attack moves are separate.

Except Physical skills specifically stack with MAFs.

Sorry, I am confused - if you are already sure of that, then what is your original question?

[green.nova343]

I think that he's not talking about a situation involving the bonuses for the specific attack move, but rather whether the specific move is even available.

Granted, he specifically mentioned Acrobatics and Gymnastics. Personally, I can't find a version of either skill that automatically provides a Kick attack with that skill (& even the mention of using the leap distance in Gymnastics heavily implies that they can only use it to attack if they already have a Leap Attack option available).

However...Wrestling does provide some additional attack moves that do damage or have a specific effect (Pin/Incapacitate, Crush/Squeeze, & Body Block/Tackle). Since bonuses from physical skills stack with MA form bonuses (just like PP bonuses), there's nothing wrong with using those moves in conjunction with any MA form your character knows. And I would say that, barring specific bonuses, generic bonuses would also apply (i.e. a strike bonus would apply to Body Block/Tackle).

[thorr-kan]

I think that he's not talking about a situation involving the bonuses for the specific attack move, but rather whether the specific move is even available.

HU2E,R:
Acrobatics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 2D4 damage.
Gymnastics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 2D4 damage.
BTS2:
Acrobatics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 1D8 damage.
Gymnastics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 2D4 damage.
DR:
Acrobatics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 1D8 damage.
Gymnastics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 2D4 damage.
NB:
Acrobatics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 1D8 damage.
Gymnastics: Automatic kick attack at first level; 2D4 damage.

And then there's all the kicks granted by the Kickboxing skill.