U...F...O...

Let's talk of things that go bump in the night. Stuff that makes your skin crawl. Creatures that are Beyond the Supernatural™. Also checkout the in-character site - Lazlo Society™

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Gallahan
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U...F...O...

Unread post by Gallahan »

I've been an avid researcher of ghosts, lake monsters, Bigfoot and UFOs since I can remember. I mean, in 2nd grade or so, we would talk about these things! I've been in the US Air Force ever since 6 months graduating high school, and have come to hear many stories about UFOs since being in military service.

These firsthand stories have been passed on to me by very credible military people, from naval watch officers to security policemen at missile silos to special forces operatives. ---I've even seen two UFOs, once in Blytheville, Arkansas at a Strategic Air Command base; once in Tucson, Arizona, at Davis Monthan AFB.

Just like ghost stories, there are many of us out there that have seen UFOs, or know family or friends that have seen them. Even the former President Jimmy Carter filed a UFO report.

And, by "UFO," I mean UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECT. This does not mean aliens, per say. Yeah, it *could* be aliens, but who's to say? They could be our own vehicles, clandestinely created in secret ranges hidden away in obscure desert research facilities.

So... here is the task: Let's discuss, compare, list, categorize our collective UFO experiences. We all know someone, either friend or family, who's seen one... or several.

Were any of you there to witness the Phoenix Lights? --or any other prominent or famous sightings? What's the latest "buzz" on the topic?

Share it with us all. I'd like to hear, and I dare say... "WE" would like to hear.

8-)
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Unread post by Sentinel »

I've not seen UFOs, but I plan to prove the existance of the Cheaspeake bay monster, Chessie.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.

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Unread post by Beelzebozo »

The most logical look at real-world UFOs I've seen:

http://www.skepdic.com/ufos_ets.html

Visiting skeptic/debunker/rationally-thinking sites can actually be more inspiring than the fringe whacko sites. :D
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Unread post by Beelzebozo »

Sightblinder wrote:No kidding, because they try to eliminate the unanswered using facts and rational theories


Yeah, because we all know where facts and rational theories have gotten the world. Science, technology, the banishment of superstition...who needs those? :D

albeit sometimes they are trying to hold water with a watertight container...


Quote altered for accuracy (at least in the real world; I sincerely hope you don't fall for those beliefs in real life, Sightblinder). BtS and UFO whackos are a different matter. :D
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The Bigfoot and UFO Connection

Unread post by Gallahan »

Thrall: Did you know that there is a supposed connection to Bigfoot sightings and UFO reports? I'm not sure of all the details, but if you did a Google search or something, you might get some more information. I remember reading about a theory concerning Bigfoot and UFO sightings.

Sentinel: I spent most of my life in Virginia, being raised there! --However, in the central, Richmond regions. However, I was stationed at Langley AFB in Hampton, VA, from 2000 - 2002. I've never heard of Chessie! Would you please provide us some more details? I know this is a UFO thread, but it's so very interesting!

A neat website to visit is www.coasttocoastam.com. It's the old Art Bell show, now hosted by George Noory. They post odd and unreported (by mainstream media) news stories at the site. I think those stories are at the bottom right side.
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Unread post by Xanador »

"UFOlogists would rather follow their faulty logic than accept the conclusions of Project Blue Book, the U.S. Air Force report which states that "after twenty-two years of investigation...none of the unidentified objects reported and evaluated posed a threat to our national security"

That's just funny. Blue Book was nothing more than a PR project designed to calm the UFO hysteria of the 50's-60's. It was never an objective scientific investigation. The fact is there never has been an objective scientific study. Objective being the key word here.

That skeptics site has as much opinion and belief in it as any fringe UFO one.

And no I'm not trying to say UFO's are aliens. I just get sick of the superior attitude skeptics take because they claim science is on their side.
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Unread post by Gallahan »

Really great observation, Xanador. In fact, many people don't realize that the "main guy," who was a PhD or something (and I currently forget his name) in charge of conducting the majority of the investigations for Blue Book... eventually could not stop denying the fact that many of the cases had merit. He couldn't keep lying to the public, and in a moment of clarity, turned the coin and took up the cause on the side of UFOlogists.

Peter Jennings had one of the BEST UFO documentaries that aired a couple of months ago on ABC, prime-time television. Very well done, and it included this bit on that Blue Book researcher. You're right that Blue Book was PR (public relations) and/or a disinformation campaign orchestrated by the government to calm the public (where do ya think Chris Carter go a lot of his inspiration for X-Files).

Sure... we can't prove that those mysterious lights in the sky are *aliens* but we can say with certainty that they weren't necessarily caused by swamp gas or the misidentification of Venus.

On a gaming slant, you could run a BTS campaign based on the a modern day version of Project Blue Book, where the government tries to introduce a civilian psychological operations campaign to debunk a rash of modern sightings. Blue Book all over again.

This could be really fun, incorporating the return of Men In Black, in the fashion of the movies, perhaps, but with a realistic edge to them. Not the comic un-reality of MIB 2. I mean, Will Smith's character never took *any* of the situations seriously, and we knew he wasn't going to die, and it was more of a ridiculous comedy than a cool sci fi film with a new slant.

Back to UFOs: Minot Air Force Base, North Dakota (featured in the Jennings documentary) has had a rash of UFO sightings, especially during the Cold War years. Did you realize that if North Dakota were to break from the United States and become its own sovereign nation, that it would have the 2nd largest nuclear arsenal in the world? Did you realize that Roswell, New Mexico --at the time of the famous incident-- was home to the only nuclear bomber group, at the time? Nukes somehow come into play with UFOs. Now, take this one step further...

FACT: The Roswell incident, in which the US Government *OFFICIALLY* claimed that it had recovered a crashed alien saucer/UFO and then retracted that comment saying it was a weather balloon, happened in July of 1947.

FACT: The Central Intelligence Agency was created within months of this incident.

FACT: The United States Air Force broke from Army ranks (as the Army Air Corps) and became its own military service: our modern Air Force in September of that same year, about 2 months later.

FACT: Admiral Byrd's expedition to the pole recorded some unusual facts which are glossed over in history, but are out there if you do an internet search: he recorded uncharted lands at the pole that year... lands filled with green, verdant vegetation and he even sighted what looked like a wooly mammoth during his famous airplane flight. Some contend that he was descending into a *depression* located at the area where the pole is supposed to exist. But that is another story; just do some research on Google, using "Admiral Byrd" and "pole" as your search parameters. You might be quite surprised at what you find. Just visit some of the seemingly "outlandish" sites you will surely get and give them 10 to 20 mintues of your time. You might find a UFO connection... along with "hollow" pursuits.

The point of those previously listed FACTs is that 1947 was, for some reason, quite a *momentous* year for modern history. These facts, along with other unknown and forever classified and/or forgotten facts are threaded, weaved together.

They form a fabric that underlies UFOs and the shaping of modern reality. And somehow, secret societies might even be involved. But, as the saying goes, "It's hard to see the picture when you are part of the frame."

So, here we are, parts of the frame. Pieces of the illusory puzzle of UFOs, lake monsters, Bigfoot, Men-in-Black, the CIA, secret societies, Hollow Earth Theory, etc.

So, any sightings out there to report? UFOs, Bigfoot, lake monsters? We'd like to hear; I certainly would...

:P
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Re: The Bigfoot and UFO Connection

Unread post by Xanador »

Gallahan wrote:Sentinel: I spent most of my life in Virginia, being raised there! --However, in the central, Richmond regions. However, I was stationed at Langley AFB in Hampton, VA, from 2000 - 2002. I've never heard of Chessie! Would you please provide us some more details? I know this is a UFO thread, but it's so very interesting!


This page is a decent summation of Chessie.

http://www.hometowntales.com/chessie.html
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Unread post by Gallahan »

Fortean Times is a good magazine; so is Fate. You should be able to find both in the racks at a good Barnes & Noble or Borders Books. Archaeology is also good, for background material on the ancient world. Ancient America is pretty good too.

I once saw a shooting star pass through the clouds at low level. It was neat because we never saw the meteor itself, just the layers of coulds light up in succession as it passed over head through them. Technically it was a UFO, but I'm sure it was a shooting star / meteor. It was really neat looking.
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Unread post by Gallahan »

I once knew a security policeman on watch, guarding B-52 bombers pre-loaded with nukes (on alert) in case the (then) Soviets conducted a preemptive strike.

"Something" bright and flashy landed at the end of the runway and the security policemen called it in to the command post. They were told that nothing should be there, and asked to look again and confirm that something was actually there. Duh. Yeah, they blinked and reconfirmed. They were told not to mention it again and that nothing, indeed, had been seen by anyone.

Do you think the government is covering anything up? And if so, what? Why would they hide the truth? I mean, by now everyone in the US has been saturated with images of aliens, monsters, spooks, whatever... to the point that if the gov came out and plainly said: Yeah, okay, there're aliens in saucers... that it wouldn't shock us (the public) any more. So, if they're covering something up, it must really be a duzie of a secret.
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Unread post by AlexM »

I have been studying this subject for a long time. There are excellent ground, air and radar simultaneous sightings reports. I have the Condon Report. It does nothing to address reports like those.


The objects are solid and quite real. The only consistent theme going through the entire history of the "modern" UFO reports, starting from 1947 in the U.S., is the ridicule of eyewitnesses. Within the last 10 years, Freedom of Information Act requests have uncovered FBI, CIA, and U. S. Air Force reports and information.

Unlike movies, these physical objects have not:
Invaded the earth.
Destroyed major landmarks.
Openly contacted the authorities.


If you're interested in really studying this subject, I can recommend a few books. Just send me a PM.





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Unread post by Gallahan »

AlexM: Have you seen a UFO? I know that people who study strange things sometimes have never seen them, like UFOs or Bigfoot or lake monsters. I've been lucky to have seen UFOs on two occasions. --Very distant, very quick sightings, nothing up close and personal.

Also, can you describe one of your more credible reports?
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Unread post by AlexM »

Yes, I did see one. A glowing orange sphere with indistinct edges, moving slowly from west to east. Observation time of about two minutes. Unable to determine how big it was since the sighting was at night.

A high quality report: "The unknown machine was making 635 m.p.h., flying a course of 350 degrees.
"Seconds after the blips appeared, GCI called Captain Ned Baker, one of the F-94 pilots. Giving him the UFO's position, they ordered an interception.
"Baker put his jet into a steep climb and his radar operator, Lieutenant Guy Sorenson, carefully watched the rear-pit scope. As the F-94 reached 20,00 feet, GCI vectored Baker into a left turn. A moment later Sorenson picked up the saucer's blips and locked on. The UFO was four miles away, flying at their altitude.
"Calling Baker on the intercom, Sorenson gave him the bearing. Peering into the night, Baker saw the strange machine, its position marked by a flashing light. As he watched, the light changed from red to green to white, alternating at regular intervals. Opening up to full power, he tried to close in.
"Back at Ground Control, fascinated radar men watched the chase on their scope...
"... the ATIC [Air Technical Intelligence Center] conclusion... 'The temperature inversion theory will not explain the simultaneous visual and radar sightings when observers on the ground and in planes see a UFO at the same spot, when a plane's radar has locked on the object, and ground radar stations have both the plane and the UFO on their scopes at the same spot. Conclusion: Unknown.'"


This report was made over fifty years ago, but the UFO "controversy" continues. What is more "unknown" to me is the continuing ridicule, since credible reports have been made by credible observers.




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Unread post by Gallahan »

Great report...! You guys are right. There are credible reports, tons of 'em, and people continue to get ridiculed if they report them. The government denies them. Makes you think there's some kind of *big secret* out there that only a few members of elite secret societies are truly aware of. Or something like that.

In that Peter Jennings doc that I referenced, there was a report on a mass sighting in St. Louis. Some guy sights the UFO and flinching from ridicule, reports it to the police. Everyone laughs (it's on the 911 tape) and reports it to field units. Several units follow this thing, sometimes getting within hundreds of yards from the low flying craft, across several counties. It was more than confirmed. And yet... none of this gets major news circulation for long.

Keep in mind that the American media is literally *owned* by a small group of people. What the public is allowed to get is only a small fraction of what's going on in the world. Sometimes I hear about what I consider to be a ***MAJOR*** news story, like the freezing of light beams or the teleportation of a section of a laser beam, and these things get 14 seconds in a news blurp that you never hear about again. It's crazy.

I guess we're just meant to be fat, happy and dumb. Talk about the greatest incarnation of the "wine and circus" approach ever created in recorded history. I mean, who wants to hear about mysterious things that are at the edge of our known reality when WWF is on TV? Or the Michael Jackson trial?
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Unread post by Beelzebozo »

Gallahan, try looking at this site, then see how far your irrational belief really goes.

http://www.skepdic.com/

"Credible UFO report" is an oxymoron. There are very few UFO reports filed by astronomers and other professionals who observe the skies.
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Unread post by AlexM »

Beelzebozo wrote:Gallahan, try looking at this site, then see how far your irrational belief really goes.

http://www.skepdic.com/

"Credible UFO report" is an oxymoron. There are very few UFO reports filed by astronomers and other professionals who observe the skies.



That is not true. I can post a link to a CIA site that lists the reports they took. Lots of astronomers and military pilots have seen UFOs. This thing started "officially" in 1947. One of the first chroniclers of UFO reports in the U.S. was Major Donald Keyhoe, a former Marine.

The book "UFO-FBI Connection" chronicles the FBI's interest in the phenomenon. And I can post links to official Air Force documents outlining the reporting procedure for UFOs. In the 1950's, the Canadian Department of National Defence (as part of NORAD), published a document titled CIRVIS-MERINT REPORTING PROCEDURE. In it is an illustration of a UFO that shows a solid disc with a dome on top.



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Unread post by AlexM »

Sightblinder wrote:I heard once that the USA is the only country whose government denies the existence of UFOs, which in itself makes for some interesting theories...




Not so. Every country denies the existence of solid, usually disc shaped, unidentified flying objects. The British Ministry Of Defence denied any official involvement, but, recently, a document from the 1950's surfaced showing that a study group was formed in England to investigate UFOs. It is now available for viewing on the MOD web site.

Job one was, and continues to be, ridicule the witnesses. "You saw nuthink, nuthink!" You were drunk, high, mentally ill, saw a high flying aircraft, star, moon, space shuttle, temperature inversion, ice crystals, meteor, comet, need glasses, hallucinate, and just make up stories to get attention, and you are not a trained military pilot, astronomer, radar operator, or other aviation professional. Trust me, it wasn't a solid, metallic, disc shaped aircraft. Repeat millions of times in print, TV and radio for over 50 years. Gets results.





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Unread post by Jefffar »

I hear that the RFAS doesn't deny UFO's exist, they jsut say that theya re Unidentified.

Iran does similar - except when they say that it's a US spy plane.
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Irrational

Unread post by Gallahan »

Beelz... Look, that's not what this is about. We're not here to call each other's "beliefs" as irrational. That being said, you are absolutely entitled to your opinion. However, you offered no such thing. You gave a web address as your advocate, not your own words (unless you are the author of the site, but judging from you lack of follow-through, I doubt it).

If you're going to reply to this thread, I would, on behalf of those who read this thread, ask that you offer a position and back it up (in your own words). Yes, it's a controversial subject, but at least stand up to the plate yourself and don't just chutter off a website.

As far as "irrational" goes... All I can ask is that you present a *rational* platform. You offered nothing of the kind, and your words are forever retained in the electrons and photons of this forum.

And to everyone else, I INVITE you to share your experiences, sightings, stories into this thread, realizing that people will try to ridicule your real life experiences in such ways. However, the truth will ring true, and all *rational* people will know who is rational and who is not... and who is blowing smoke for the sake of controversy.

Hey, this is why America is the greatest country in the world! --along with our allies and other free nations.
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The Bible and UFOs

Unread post by Gallahan »

When I was a kid, there was a show on NBC called Project Blue Book, of all things. It was about a couple of Air Force guys (a Captain or Major and a Staff Sergeant) who traveled the country to investigate UFO sightings.

The show started off with a neat montage of ancient images of "UFOs" drawn by classic artists, to include Leonardo DaVinci. And then, the voice-over/narrator said something like:

"...When Ezekiel saw the Wheel. This is the wheel he said he saw..." (montage of classic UFO images, then opening credits and music)

I then flipped eagerly through the pages of my bible and discovered to my astonishment that there was indeed a book of Ezekiel, and a particularly INTERESTING passage about his encounter with angels....

While I don't have a bible handy at the moment, and thus can't write direct quotes, and may have even mis-spelled Ezekie's name, his passage is VERY interesting. He describes, using analogies in ancient parameters, a UFO. A four-faced angel descending from a loud craft sounding like a rushing river on expanding legs, etc. It's literally a biblical account of a CLOSE ENCOUNTER.

Get your nearest bible and look up his name and read his section. You will be astonished!
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Unread post by AlexM »

Xanador wrote:"UFOlogists would rather follow their faulty logic than accept the conclusions of Project Blue Book, the U.S. Air Force report which states that "after twenty-two years of investigation...none of the unidentified objects reported and evaluated posed a threat to our national security"

That's just funny. Blue Book was nothing more than a PR project designed to calm the UFO hysteria of the 50's-60's. It was never an objective scientific investigation. The fact is there never has been an objective scientific study. Objective being the key word here.

That skeptics site has as much opinion and belief in it as any fringe UFO one.

And no I'm not trying to say UFO's are aliens. I just get sick of the superior attitude skeptics take because they claim science is on their side.




Having studied the whole UFO issue for some time, the only conclusion that can be drawn is that actual, physical, often disc shaped objects have been seen by highly qualified witnesses and radar. The Air Force's official explainer of reports, astronomer J. Allen Hynek, got so tired of the contrived explanations that he started his own UFO study center.

The one consitent thread running through all of the critic's assumptions is that the viewer did not see what he or she said they saw. The fact is military jets have chased tangible objects that were picked up by radar and locked onto. What is being told to the public is: Trust us, there's nothing to it. When, in fact, there are many FBI, CIA and other documents that show that the US and other countries were very interested in this subject. The US Air Force and Canada (via NORAD) issued detailed directives for reporting unidentified aerial objects. In the case of the Canadian version, an explanation of a UFO shows a drawing of a disc with a dome on top.

Alien, man-made, inter-dimensional? Take your pick, but "nothing" is not a viable answer.




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Unread post by Jesterzzn »

I live near an US Air Force base. One night driving home I saw burning metal wreckage in a field about a mile from the road. It was burning so hot, I could feel the heat from inside my car more than a mile from the fire. Before I even had a chance to stop my car two jeeps pulled up with soldiers carrying rifles and told me to turn around and get home by another route. When i got home (after about a 30 minute detour) I turned on the news and nothing. The paper the next day, nothing. The only thing I ever saw on the matter was an interview with firefighters that responded to a 911 call. They said they could not get within 100 yards of the fire due to the intense heat, and that moments after their arrival they were relieved by military personnel. Perhaps not a UFO, but still kinda creepy.
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Unread post by Jesterzzn »

Atramentus wrote:Fnord!
:-P
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Unread post by Gallahan »

During the height of the Cold War, Minot AFB, North Dakota was put on *high alert* because UFOs were hovering near the WSAs (weapon storage areas) which contained nuclear weapons stockpiles. UFOs also harassed MLFs (missile launch facilities) during this time.

I was stationed there during the late 90s but had not heard any of this until years later. These events happened in the 50s and/or 60s. But there were many other strange things that went on up there in those frozen fields.

A friend of mine actually saw a UFO in Minot and she was actually thrilled by it, driving home one night after a late night shift as a radio DJ for a country music station. I believe her; it was a glowing, bullet shaped thing that darted across the distant highway after midnight. No such luck for me.
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