Forums of the Megaverse®

Or the TGE giving one a jet-black paint job and welding cool-looking (kitchen) gadgets to the hull...then spreading the rumor it's a super-secret stealth spy ship prototype, and seeing who's dumb enough to steal the thing...

I can safely bet, that Semetras making any tinkering TW drool...

Adios
KLM

It would make one wicked TW Starship! Got to admit that the Kreeghor might do that to get rid of their junk.

Wraith class corvette

This design was the last major class of the Silhouette Expansion,
before it succumbed to the TGE. Also, it was the first successfull
hybrid technological-magic design for the shadowy humanoids.

At this point we have to remind the readers, who are not familiar
with the magical aspects of space warfare, that purely magical
construct, while did (and do) an admirable job of getting there and
back to remote space, they clearly lacked when it came to slug it out
with technological ships. As theory goes, magical ships were created
with the same point of wiev as spells - a highly personal thing, may
it be an ages old invocation, used by generations of spellcasters,
or even a mass produced vessel. So they were designed, and
perhaps used for combat likewise: personally (be it an open helmet
cavalier or a claok-and-dagger assasin style).
Technological ships however collate data, regulate enery flow,
solve equations which hopefully result is a small, albeit very
lived star lighting up against the carpet of the night.
This happened when the Star Elven ships clashed with the Kittanii,
and later, when the SE's fleet was pitted against the TGE.
As misery loves company, in both cases the agressor also had
detailed magic knowledge, so even the suprise factor of magic
was countered rather effectively.

The Wraiths however were technological ships, even if only
commercial grade ones, souped up with Silhouette magic.
They seemed to halt the Kreeghor onslaught for a glorious
three months, untill the TGE managed to field some technology
and tactics to counter them.

Being a rather dull patrol corvette from the technological side,
Wraiths were equipped with the Silhouette's version of Rift drive,
which travels through the Shadow dimension, intead of the UWW
"flux dimension" variant.
Giving an overly simplified explanation, the ship merges with
the shadow of a stellar body, enters the Dimension of Darkness,
and then homes on another sufficiently large shadow within
her range. Also, while in such shadow, the crafts are very hard to
detect. This made (and still makes) the Wraith an effective
stealth bomber and recon ship.

As an interesting paradox, the smallest ship the UWW was able
to cram in its Rift-drive is the Arcane class with her 12.000 tons.
On the other hand, the Wraith with her 1200 tons is the largest
vessel (even to this day) which can use the Shadow Rift Drive.

This also played an important part in the fall of the SE - they
were not able to move large amounts of troops, materials
or even firepower without mobilising a whole fleet. Just
imagine Earth's WWII, when D-day had to be made with
Flower class corvettes being the biggest ships around.

Another weakness was that the ships were rather slow
both sublight and FTL-wise, when were not in shadow,
so the TGE used a crude, but effective tactic: several
jury-rigged AM warheads were used to create bright light
over the sieged planets, making blockade running, hit-and-fade
attacks impossible, even creating similar panic in the populace
as we humans would react, if an enemy force blocked
out Sol's light during an invasion.

This was long ago, the TGE digested it prey, yet Wraiths
are still manufactured, as there are always a good number of
Royal Kreeghor, who find the vessels stylish, creating a
constant, if limited demand for it (and even defying imperial
buerocrats, who wish to cease all - even remotely independent -
warship manufacture in the Empire). The formation of the
Invincible Guard (and its influence on the imperial matters),
the growing participation of the Silhouettes in the dreaded
secret police also ensured the survival of the Wraith class.

On the other hand, while the technological parts of the ship
are constantly upgraded, the magical systems remained the
same - as the Emperor was adamant about stopping all
non-kreeghor magic research. Frankly, the original formulae
is also rather inflexible regarding the technological chassis,
so the ships are still pretty much resemble the original
SE ones.

The UWW did a research project, dissecting vessels which
sought refuge, even consulting some of the research chantry
members, but appearantly did not adopted the idea. Partly
because they didn't want to upset the TGE (to be honest, with
the kreeghor's vulnerability to magic, the TGE also very
cautious when dealing with the UWW), and partly because
they found the Shadow Rift Drive very risky, particularly
to non-Silhouette crews.

So, the Wraiths are still resembling a bat-winged futuristic
biplane (not unlike the picture of the "runner ship" in DMB2)
and even the weaponry is basically the same.

The ship has two forward fixed mass drivers as their main
dogfight guns, two defense and two assault missile launchers,
and a heavy magic mortar.
While the mass drivers and the launchers are stricly EM or CG
based weapons (as chemical guns and missiles would cause
disturbance in the magic systems) they could be upgraded.
The mortar is still the same for generations.

The ship also has a magic forcefield system (as well as PPE
storage and generators) acting as primary FTL, stealth system
and protection to the hull, in case the ship is detected and fired
on.

Model: Wraith MkIII to XIX
Class: multipurpose corvette
Crew: 20, including the Navigator and at least three gunners,
who must be magic users (for the mortar and the magical
missiles). A power armor platoon up to 20 can be crammed in,
if cargo area is converted.

MDC by location:
*Main body: 2400
*Bridge: 1200
Massdrivers(2): 400 to 600, depending on variants
Defense missile launchers: 150 to 400
Mortar: 480
Force field: can engulf up to 1000 MD see description
**Wings(4): 700

*Depleting the main body shuts the systems down,
however it takes a further 1200 MD (the "bridge")
to cause decompression in the whole hull (or reactor
meltdown)

**The wings are actually the CG propulsion system,
destroying one decreases sublight speed by 25% and
FTL speed by 50%

Speed:
Atmosphere: 1M, 4 M at night or in darkness (severy
storm for example)
Sublight: 7M, and an astonishing 25M in planetary shadows
or in gas clouds unless "illuminated" . Speeding in shades
however drains the PPE reserve at a rate of 20 PPE per melee.
FTL: 1-4lys/h for conventionaly CG drive, Shadow Rift drive
can traverse vast ranges, costing 500 PPE to enter, and then
100 PPE per light year (and a successful Navigation - Space
roll for each ly), travel rate is 12 lys/h (ie. 5 minutes per light year).
Getting lost means the ship HAVE to find a large shadow
to emerge back to reality before PPE runs out, or risking
similar effect as a Rift Cannon hit (see table in DMB2).
For silhouette crews it is not as severe as it sounds, since
the 20 man crew could easily triple the onboard PPE reserve
from their personal powers.
Also, if enough time is taken (ie. 10 minutes per ly) before
initiating the SRD, to plot the course, the Navigator can roll
twice for each ly to be covered, and if half of the rolls are
successfull, the ship arrives safely, althought each botched
roll adds another minute to travel time (substract 100 PPE per 5 mins).
Precalculated data adds +20% to rolls and halves calculation
time - such navigational aids (beside being expensive)
always take a form of a model of star system in question,
engraved with runes.
Travel between galaxies is TEN times faster (and takes
one-tenth of PPE, and navigation rolls, as the vessel can
emerge back to realspace anywhere). However, as there
has to be a Navigator actively guiding the ship, crew
endurance is paramount.

Dimensions:
Lenght: around 50 meters
Height: around 10 meters
Width: around 40 meters
Weight: around 1200 tons fully loaded. The ship is not
a compact design by any rate.

Cargo: three cargo areas, each is about 4 by 4 by 3 meters,
and can hold 100 tons.

Power system: Technological power systems vary, from
nuclear with 5 years of reactor life (can be refuelled),
or anti-matter with up to 50 years. Never fusion, as
it is "perceived" to be a small star - and this would mess
up the magic systems
There is a PPE generator, producing 400 PPE per hour "at night"
or 100 PPE per hour "in daylight". PPE storage is usually 1000,
but can be extended by 500 if one cargo bay is filled with
PPE capacitors (giant clay pots, filled with suspicious stuff and
carved with magical symbols).

Market cost: a rare MkIII relic, in good condition costs a
whopping 600 million, the newest Mk XIX, with the top of
the line TGE hardware can easily cost two times as much.
However, the technological parts of the ships are rather easily
upgradeable if supervised by a skilled TW.

Systems of note:
Tech systems:
Mass driver cannons, 2, fixed forward:

Original (Mk I to III):
EM quad railguns, range 3 / 6 miles, damage is d4*100MD per
100 round burst, payload was usually 200 bursts per battery.

Mk XIX:
GR-3000 railguns, firing 80 round bursts, damage is d4*100MD
against small targets, d6*100+100MD againts large targets
(frigates and up), otherwise see DMB2 for GR-100

"Small" missile launchers (2), turreted, one is in belly, one is in
top turret, retractable:
Original:
MM launchers, payload 64 mini-missiles, can fire salvoes of up to
8, can be reloaded in 2-3 melees

Mk XIX:
SRM launchers, payload of 40 short range missiles, can fire
salvoes of 6, can be reloaded in 3-5 melees.

If operated by a magic-using gunner, can fire magic missiles,
even in theory, the dreaded bottled demons missiles too. As
a side note, plasma warheads launched from the craft fail to
detonate within 1 mile of the ship...

"Large" missile launchers(2):
Originally the system was designed with the stealth ability in
mind, so the launcher could only fire LRM "bombs". Later Kreeghor
variants were equipped with cruise missiles, but it lacked the ability
of launching massive swarms to overload defenses, so basically
the long range firepower was negated.
Also the two launchers are not identical. The front bay can fire
massive volleys, but incapable of firing magic missiles. The top
launcher can fire magic warheads, even teleport them near the
target, but can only fire 4 at a time and has a much limited
payload.

Front launcher:
Mk I to III:
LRM bomb launcher, payload of 80 LRM bombs, can fire salvoes
of 12 missiles, up to 40 missile per melee (for example two 12 missile
heavy swarm, an 8 missile swarm, and two 4 missile bursts, provided
the gunner has 5 attacks per melee). Can be reloaded in 2 minutes.

Mk XIII (cruise missile):
Payload of 20 CRMs, can fire salvoes of 4, twice per melee.
Reload is a painful 10 minutes.

Mk XIX
LRM launcher, payload of 50 LRMs or 100 LRM bombs, RoF of
40 per melee, as above. The TGE special ships employ full sized
LRMs, with downgraded propulsion, but with cruise missile warheads,
the NE is also begun to manufacture a full sized missile, with
decreased range and a massive K-Hex warhead.

Top (turret) launcher:
Payload of 4 LRMS or 8 LRM bombs. Can fire salvoes of 4 OR
(for 30 PPE) can teleport a single missile up to 40 miles away,
(100 miles in space) once per melee. The point of arrival must
be seen (via sensors) and not very accurate (deviation of
d6 meters multiplied by every mile - ie. 4d6*10 meter for 40 miles),
but since the missile can then home on the designated target.
Missiles appearing within 100 meters gain a +4 to strike,
and countermeasures (including even automated point defense)
are useless, if the missile pops within 1 mile of the target.
At least shields will work, however many Berserkers were gutted
as they charged with shield concentrated on the front.

Magic systems
1, Magic Mortar:
Basically a "specialised" rift canon, similar to the Death Cloud
canons of the Arcane Mark II ships. However, these are "linked"
to the dimension of shadows, and can fire in two modes.
The first mode is a scaled-up Annihilate spell, doing double
damage in a radius 10 times of the original invocation. Costs
100 PPE, Rof is one per three melees.
The second mode is puts the target (or in case of large vessels,
the portion of the target) into the dimension of shadows for a
random period (3d6*10 seconds), in a 100 meter radius sphere.
Crew in the area are in magic darkness, suffer the effects of a
life drain, disoriented, and to make matters worse, 2d6 Shadow
Beasts are running amok on the vessel.
Ships fully covered by the effect disappear from this reality,
to reappear 3d6 miles from the point of impact after the duration
elapsed. Costs 200 PPE.

2, Magic Force field
Equal to a Shadow Meld, but even almost invisible to sensors
(-40% to detect), except by LADAR (laser-based radar),
which still has trouble to spot the ship (-20% to detect). This
allows the Wraith to sneak up ship as close as 100 miles
where the above penalty begins to decrease one percent per
mile.
Firing missiles or otherwise creating bright explosions can
negate this effect, revealing a patch of amorphous darkness
where the Wraith corvette is.
This costs 10 PPE per minute, and only useably in planetary
shadows.
Also, the darkness around the ship can be manipulated
to engulf incoming attacks, so the operator (usually the
Navigator, but can be used by up to 3 individuals) can
try do deflect incoming attacks. It takes an action, a
strike roll with +2 (+4 in case of missiles), and 20 PPE.
However, powerfull attacks, like cruise missiles, cruiser
sized and bigger canons might even penetrate this
defense (ie. subtract 1000 from damage in case of a successfull
"counterhit").

Sensory system:
In addition to standard technological sensors, the following
magical effect are useable:
See the invisible (range 20 miles, 10 PPE per minute)
See Aura (as a magical scanner, range 50 miles, 20 PPE per
target, takes 3d6 seconds to scan, even more for bigger targets)
Eyes of Thoth (as a decryption method, 8 PPE)

Other:
The Wraith is very manouverable, can use Fighter Combat Elite,
and has a +2 to initiative, dodge and dogfight as long as the
shadow field is working even if the ship is detected

Afterthougths:
The ship's interior must be shadowy, which does not
bother Silhouettes, but freaks out most humans and
other beings on the long term. As a matter of fact,
any attempt to upgrade the lamps will fail - or will
ruin the magic systems.

Magical missiles need to be worked out, but not by me
in this hour.

Adios
KLM

KLM wrote:I can safely bet, that Semetras making any tinkering TW drool...

Adios
KLM

Well, they've been around long enough to have seen the beginning sof techno-wizardry, if they really are of ancient Atlantean design...so I imagine quite a few have been 'hot-rodded' over the millenia, lending to the legend....

Oh, and the Wraith?


Beeeeaaauttttifffuuuulllllllllllll........

Excellent ship KLM! Please keep them coming!

After having a brief sleep, then a tiresome day behind me (its half past midnight here, waiting for my better half to come out of the bathroom)...

I got another idea of magic FTL drives - based on Ley line phasing.
That is how the Star Elves (and probably any starfaring race,
who can produce Ley Line Walkers) probably got to the stars.

First, of course with the old "manual" way, then - after getting
inspiration from the Warlocks - with crude starships. It looks like
a fairly easy and safe way of transport, but it is tied to Ley Lines.

Kinda handycapped when compared to technological - or even
"proper" Rift Drive - ships... Reminds me a comparison of a
sampan on the river vs. an AC-130.

Anyway, as sampans are still in use, I would write up a Ley-line
Drive boat or two... The question is whether this is the right place
or should we move to the UWW R+D section (even if these ships
predate the UWW as well as not restricted to it)?

Adios
KLM

ps.: Thanks for the compliments

PLus charting the galactic leyline net is a major undertaking, as well as all the factors affecting the strength and orientation of leylines in space(back when I was doing conversions in the day, I used this to explain a rather vague anime plot)...I can imagine Star Elf 'line seers' charting and piloting craft on new lines and 'wild lines'...not knowing, initially, if the line was going to hold steady and be a reliable conduit of travel(like unstable Rifts and Wormholes)...

taalismn wrote:PLus charting the galactic leyline net is a major undertaking, as well as all the factors affecting the strength and orientation of leylines in space(back when I was doing conversions in the day, I used this to explain a rather vague anime plot)...I can imagine Star Elf 'line seers' charting and piloting craft on new lines and 'wild lines'...not knowing, initially, if the line was going to hold steady and be a reliable conduit of travel(like unstable Rifts and Wormholes)...

Errr... Disagree.

Althought beginner Ley Line Walkers are a bit disoriented folk
(for example, finding a nexus is 40%+5% per level - however
sensing it is instant an automatic. Therefore if your flip a coin
you have 50% to find the nexus - go lef or right, right? Well,
it looks like beginner LLWs usually WRONG )
but their "power #2" gives rather good information about ley
lines. Something that fades it out, a ley line storm, or
a passing asteroid field - IMO - qualifies as "major natural disaster".

That said, the Forge knows how many "transits" a wizard has
to do before arriving to a planet, where he can put his enviromental
suit down (and just because he wears a talisman protecting from
the microbes of that world).
For you see, if line A starts from planet A, getting to planet B
might require the wizard to phase to a nexus on line A,
get to line B, C, D, E... And if lucky he is on planet B, but odds
are, he have to stay there untill he has enough "Ley line Phase
attempts"to get back.

Adios
KLM

What about a ley line phase jump drive for starships of Phase World and the 3Gs? If it could do what a ley line walker could do might speed up travel time in and around the UWW. So what do you all think of it. Just a thought.

One of several possible magic mass transit systems available to the UWW...such as doing away with spacecraft altogether and 'stepping' from world to world.

I think Ley Line Phasing, while the easiest looking magical
FTL transportation, have its limitations.

For example it is tied to ley lines (obviously), and subject to their
disturbances.

Also there is the issue, whether the line in space move or not?

If they move (ie. one point is "tied" to a nexus on a given planet)
it is the easier part, but what hazard a ley line, moving in space,
an having a ley line storm... So what hazard it poses ?

If they do not move... Well, it is like Sliders:
Great... We are stuck on this planet for a week, and have to
get to the opposite continent in that time. Hope, there IS a continent
there... If we miss... Well, we will have a vacation of a few months.

All in all, mass transit - which is by definition RELIABLE -
should be done by pyramids or (semi-permanent) Rifts.

Adios
KLM

taalismn wrote:One of several possible magic mass transit systems available to the UWW...such as doing away with spacecraft altogether and 'stepping' from world to world.

Don't they already talk about doing that?


Daniel Stoker

Yes....Of course, such problems as previously noted are treated by the megacosmopolitan citizens of the UWW much like we treat the risks of commerical air travel..."Sure, it's dangerous, but ain't anything in this life?"

Of course, if something goes wrong on a gate, it ain't just luggage they lose, and where do you begin searching? Unless the travel group had a Shfter or mage that could somehow open a communications gate or set up some sort of dimensional beacon, a search and rescue party is going to have its work cut out for it...

Of course, it's a GREAT HLS...

Feeding my inner munchkin...

Galoot Great Ghazoon-class Battleship
(aka ‘Nuclear Blimp’, ‘Gun-Moon’, ‘Mega-Galley’)

“Never ignore the so-called ‘second-rate’ members of the Three Galaxies...Those who recognize they AREN’T the biggest powers around and do not break under the strain, can become quite profficient at guarding those parts of space that are their own....Either they will pick fights they know they can win, under conditions of their choosing, or else they will fight like madmen if you choose to take the fight to them....In any case, regard every battle you are going into as if you were facing the CCW’s elite, with a CosmoKnight back-up, and proceed with reasonable caution against any opponent you do not know absolutely EVERYTHING about..
However, by the same token, do not let your enemy know that you do not know everything about them...Imperial glory is not won by the timid or the fearful.”
----Admiral K’hzar Rang (ret.), TransGalactic Imperial Armed Forces

“I’ve got eighteen alien capital ships out there acting like they own this part of space...I don’t know what they’re capable of...whether they’re millenia-old products of advanced galactic technology from some ancient civilization that was old when my ancestors were still crawling on their bellies in the primordial muck, or the latest cutting-edge advance from a year ago...I don’t have the time or leeway to find out...Load our most powerful warheads and plot out a three-salvo wave pattern that will get to them while we hit them with the main batteries, then back us off and reload the tubes while we assess damage. Winning isn’t accomplished by half-measures!”
----Captain Reluff’Fuu-Wollon, UAFGSBSS-04 Woon-Fan. United Armed Forces of Gallute Prime.

Though new to the galactic scene, the Galoot people have quickly recognized that it’s a hostile Three Galaxies...Thus, it came as no great surprise that the Galoot have martialed their resources to build up their space defenses in the event that somebody should take less-than-friendly notice of them. What DOES surprise everybody is the scale of the investment and its products...particularly the four vessels of the Great Ghazoon class.
Constructing these giant ships ate up a substantal portion of the annual defense budget of several Galoot nation-states, and development and construction required a previously unknown degree of cooperation between the various militaries involved. Under the auspices of a global defense initiative, the requirements for a class of capital ships able to match known Galactic battlewagons was drawn up and keels laid on the most promising designs. To accommodate the massive physiques of the Galoot, the ships are big to begin with, huge by the standards of smaller sentients. The Galoot have clearly had assistance in acquiring some of the more advanced systems aboard these imposing vessels, but the ship is at heart a Galoot design(though it shares many similaries with Botwhin Ch’Chunga warcraft designs).
The Great Ghazoon-class battleships have been described as looking like ‘armored watermelons’; massive ellipsoid craft with few protrudances. The Galoot have forsaken the usual array of turrets common to other Three Galaxies capital ships in favor of several large broadside array gun-decks running almost the entire length of the vessel. Although the placement of the weapons limits their effective arc of fire and leaves several blindspots in their coverage, the Galoot have proven quite adroit at rolling the ships to bring the mighty main batteries to bear. The ships mount massive armor, both to survive battle damage and to handle the Galoot homeworlds’ thick atmosphere. A variable strength forceshield system is obviously of galactic make, and a separate dedicated forcefield generator protects the rear quarters of the ship fropm its own nuclear pulse drive.
The drive system, though an older-model contra-gravity model, is quite reliable at moving the ships’ massive bulk. However, for combat maneuvering, the Galoot have backed it up with a more archiac and arguably spectacular drive system from their own space travel experience. The Galoot are one of the few races who use nuclear-pulse propulsion systems; the ship ejects a small kiloton-grade nuclear explosive from rear ejector ports, where it explodes aft of the ship. The nuclear blast, acting on the heavily armored hull and special forcefields protecting the rear of the ship, push the vessel forward with the resultant nuclear shockwave. Triggering this system rapidly in succession, the Galoot warships, propelled by their series of nuclear ‘burps’, can hit some impressive accelerations. It also makes these vessels rather hazardous to dogtail in combat; the multiple nuclear flashes can blind sensors and fry unwary vessels that chase too close when the Galoots decide to accelerate to battle speed.
Not surprisingly, Galoot battleships frequently pick up an escort of Vrusk rad-salvage craft, eager to haul away the irradiated debris of any Galoot opponents.
All other systems, including sensor gear, are Galactic-standard systems, or else are reasonable copies of standard Galactic systems.
Among the failings of the Great Ghazoon-class are a lack of speed, and a lack of fighter support; the Galoot have still not mastered the concept of fighter combat, nor have they produced anything in way of suitable designs. Coupled with a rather weak secondary armament, this makes Great Ghazoons painfully vulnerable to being overwhelmed by fighters. Wise fleet commanders try to keep the battleships on the edge of action, where they can snipe at targets of opportunity and still have enough warning of approaching trouble to retreat if necessary.
The Great Ghazoons were conceived of as pure gunfighters; they lack fighter complements and troop capacity, which limits their utility in service. The Galoots have added the capacity to deploy space mines; the Galoots typically carry and deploy heavy nuclear weapons of overkill capacity(knowing little of Galactic capabilities). If the time and opportunity present themselves, Great Ghazoon captains will attempt to deploy minefields around their commands, to create a defensive buffer zone about their ships in leiu of a proper fighter screen. This has worked to good effect on several occasions; pursuing enemy forces targeting the battleships have blundered into the minefields and taken serious damage; in the chaos the battleship managed to nuke-pulse back out of range and jump to FTL.
The battleships’ slow speed is also an impediment; by the time the ships lumber into the battle zone, an enemy has plenty of time to pull back and avoid them. Nevertheless, if the Great Ghazoons should close the range, their massed broadsides can obliterate an enemy within seconds.
The Galoot have invested massively in their battleship program, having built four Great Ghazoons in the past five years, which shows their concern about galactic affairs. The battleships rarely venture out of Galoot-declared space, except on military exercises with neighbors and the occasional joint stiffening of resistance against common enemies like the Splugorth. On two occasions the battleships have been severely damaged, though not enough to prevent their repair, giving the Galoot invaluable lesson-experience in Galactic warfare and the limitations of their own technology.

Type: UAFG-BS-02C Great Ghazoon
Class: Battleship
Crew: 800
MDC/Armor by Location:
Main Body 190,000
Bridge 80,000
Main Gun Decks( 8 ) 18,000 each ( Laser Cannons-10- 800 each, Rail Guns-6- 600 each)
Secondary Laser Batteries(4) 3,000 each ( Laser Cannons-10- 800 each)
Long Range Missile Launchers(3) 900 each
Point Defense Lasers(25) 200 each
Hangar Bay 10,000
Variable Forcefields 10,000 per side, 60,000 total
Rear ‘Bumper’ Forcefield 30,000
Height:2,500 ft
Width: 2,500 ft
Length: 4,800 ft
Weight: 19 million tons
Cargo: 800,000 tons
Powerplant: Advanced Nuclear Fusion w/ 50 year energy life
Speed:
(Atmosphere) Hover to Mach 3; transatmospheric.
(Sublight) Mach 8
(Kitsune Values: 50% of light speed; Accelerates/decelerates at 0.8% of light speed per melee)
Under nuclear pulse, the Great Ghazoon can hit acceleration/deceleration speeds of 5%
(FTL) 1 light year per hour
(Underwater) Not Possible
Market Cost: 40 billion credits
Systems of Note:
Standard Starship Systems
Weapons Systems:
1) Heavy Laser/Rail Gun Battery Decks(8, 4 each side)---The main armament of the Ghazoon is its lateral broadsides of heavy lasers, with massdriver railguns interspersed among them. Each array-deck consists of a line of ten heavy lasers and four rail guns(for a whopping total of eighty lasers and forty-eight rail guns!). However, the arc of fire of indivdivual lasers is limited to about 40 degrees and their rate of recharge is slow.
a) Heavy Lasers(80; 10x8)
Range: 15 miles in atmosphere, 80 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 80 miles in atmosphere, 80,000 miles in space)
Damage: 5d6x100 MD per shot; 5d6x1,000 MD per full deck salvo
2d6x10,000 for all four batteries firing on the same target!!!
(Typically, no more than two decks can be brought to bear accurately on the same target at the same time).
Rate of Fire: Twice per melee
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

b) Rail Guns(48, 6x8)---These weapons blast out a burst of hypervelocity projectiles, but the eight gatling barrels can also be slighty offset to generate a ‘shotgun’ blast of effect.
Range: 6 miles in atmosphere, 18 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 18 miles in atmosphere, 18,000 miles in space)
Damage: 2d4x100 MD per burst, or 1d4x100 MD to a 150 ft wide area at half range, 4d6x10 MD to a 400 ft wide area at maximum range
8d6x100 MD for all six deck-guns firing on the same target in salvo.
Rate of Fire: EGCHH(usually 4-6 bursts per melee)
Payload: 1,000 bursts per gun

2) Secondary Laser Decks(4, 2 forward, 2 aft)----In an attempt to over some coverage to the battleship’s fore and aft blind spots, Galoot engineers mounted four smaller arrays of four lower powered lasers. One such quad-array is located above and below the forward and aft ‘poles’ of the hull
Range: 18 miles in atmosphere, 90 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 90 miles in atmosphere, miles in space)
Damage: 3d6x100 MD per single shot; 3d6x400 MD for all four lasers firing simultaneously
Rate of Fire: Three times per melee
Payload:Effectively Unlimited

3) Heavy Torpedo Bays(3)---These are heavy long range missile launch bays mounted equidistant around the mid-section of the ship.
Range: Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 3,400 miles in atmosphere, 1,800,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-50
Payload: 300 missiles per launcher, 900 total; additional missiles may be carried and loaded from cargo, but will take at least 30 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 12 missiles)

4) Point Defense Lasers(25)---Nearly invisible against the hull are these twenty-five small laser blisters of conventional design.
Range: 3 miles in atmosphere, 10 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 10 miles in atmosphere, 1,000 miles in space)
Damage: 3d6x10 MD per burst
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload:Effectively Unlimited

5) Space Mine Deployment Racks(4)---These are modified missile ejectors used to throw out space mines. The Galoots use several different types of space mines; conventional fragmentation, nuclear, and nuke-pumped x-ray laser. All space mines have a low-visibility stealth sheathing to prevent early detection(-50% to detect).
Damage: Varies;
Fragmentation: 1d6x100 MD to 2,000 ft blast radius
Nuclear(typical) 4d6x100 -2d4x1,000 MD; 300 ft to 1,000 ft blast radius
X-Ray Laser: 1d4x1,000 MD laser blast; range 50 miles(Kitsune Value: 50,000 miles)---One-shot weapon that destroys itself in the process of firing.
Advanced models can target as many as 10 separate targets within range simultaneously.
Rate of Fire: 1-10 mines per melee
Payload: 100 mines per launcher; additional mines can be carried as cargo(typically 2-5 tons per mine)

6) Nuclear Pulse Drive---Though meant primarily as a propulsion system, the nuclear pulse drive has some limited utility as a weapon, especially at close range. The drive-nukes are not really optimized as weapons, but in order to drive the twenty million tons of battleship bulk, they are powerful, and the drive ejector systems can spew the bombs out as fast as four per melee.
Range: 2 miles aft of ship
Damage: 1d4x 1,000 MD to anything caught in within a half-mile blast radius; 4d6x10 MD to anything else in a 4 mile blast radius from the shock wave. 50% chance of temporarily blinding enemy sensors for 1d4 melees, and 40% chance of permanently knocking out unshielded electronics in an 80 mile radius(including missile guidance systems).
Rate of Fire: 4 times per melee
Payload: The Great Ghazoons carry 4,000 drive-nuke ‘pony bombs’

Auxiliary Craft:
5 Shuttle-Landers
8 Scout Shuttles

Not bad at all. Something to be taken seriously, yet a Protector
would mop the floor even with two or three of them (unless
caught by suprise).

----
On the down side, I would decrease sublight speed (but with option
of nuclear speed boost) and increase FTL. Also, the main laser batteries
are a bit too powerfull...

All of this is of course compared to standard, "canonic" designs
(which in turn need their point defenses seriously upgraded).

Adios
KLM

The main cannons individually fall into the category of high-end medium weapons, but I wanted to show how massed lesser weapons can do MASSIVE damage if you get enough of them...

yeah, it's munchy, but I warned yah, no?

If you remember the anime 'Gunbuster' or the game Renegade Legion, the capital ships in those games had GIANT massed broadside energy weapon arrays that looked like glass-topped missile silos...I was kinda trying for the same feel here...

Almost didn't include the point defenses, but even the eighty-foot tall Galoots would recognize that a mosquito can kill if there are enough of them...but a Galoot 'fighter' would be the size of a shuttle and steer like one at their current level of advancement...

Tossing in so many nukes was a bit of overkill, I admit, but I have several radiation-proof races, so why not use that to best advantage?

Oh, I have MUCH worse coming...

I think it's pretty awesome! It would be the coolest football shaped Battleship. So do they have one named the "Stewie"? Since they are football shaped.

Nope, but I'll gladly atomize that little hellspawn...

ROFLMAO!!! I've had thoughts along that line too!

Good lord...111 pages of starship designs....whew!

taalismn wrote:Good lord...111 pages of starship designs....whew!

Without - mostly - illustration, and most of the "magic" designs
are in different forums.

Adios
KLM

Still there are a lot of ships here on the boards! Congrats everyone who helped us reach that far!

KLM's going to HATE me for this...

Plus I've reposted the Botwhin PAMship for good measure...

Botwhin ‘PeaceBinder’ (Chessna*Toc) Battle-Carrier
(aka ‘Stamper’, ‘BigBoomah’, ‘Hailstorm’)

“Ah, sib-kin of mine! How goes the harvest?”
#Better than expected! Resistance is marginal at best; their weapons pose little threat to us, and their panic has paralyzed them! The other faction-tribes are cowed by our pronouncements, or else are letting their mutual hatred for our first-to-be-culled dictate their non-intervention! The others keep sending us platitudes of greeting and offers of peace! For all their inter-tribal rivalry, they have no idea of how to deal with us! We shall have a few thousand of the first-to-be-culled all ready to send up to those who must orbit to slack your hunger while we consolidate this first continent!#
“Excellent! Save me a few dozen of the tastier-thinking ones; I’m having dinner with my harem tonight and I want something that screams well.”
(Alarms shriek)
@Multiple Contacts!!! Multi---@
“What the Five Hells is THA---”
**KRACK**SSWWWAAAUUUSSSSShhhhhhhhhh-------

The PeaceBinder-class Carriers of the Botwhin fleet are the second-largest warships in the service of the Botwhin Char’Chuga, and are rightfully feared by those who would rouse the Botwhin ire against them. Even Botwhin allies get nervous when they don’t know where all the ships of this class currently are.
Ominously, the PeaceBinders look and behave almost exactly like giant freefall bomblet dispensers, but instead of exploding into rains of bomblets, the giant cylindrical ships serve to carry and deploy a veritable armada of Botwhin Singleships.
Four massive bays run nearly the length of the long hull, each covered by a set of sliding plate ‘roll-back’ doors. In each of these bays, over fifty Botwhin singleships, armored spheroids with nearly as much armor as a cruiser and the firepower of a destroyer, can be parked, in five rows of eleven vessels each(three rows carried above a lower tier). Retractable service gantries can be run up from below, between the ships, allowing for servicing and reloading of the ships. Cabins and chambers within the PeaceBinders’ main hulls provide housing and briefing areas for singleship crews on long transits and before engagements. Plenty of cargo space is provided for spare parts and weapons reloads fro extended combat operations.
Because of their deviation from the solid spheroid construction favored by the Botwhin for their warships, the PeaceBinder isn’t nearly as fast or maneuverable as the other craft of the Botwhin military(though they still travel at bone-crushing accelerations that would require any other species carried as passengers to seek haven in grav-shielded quarters or gel-suspension tanks). This hasn’t reduced their lethality any, however, as the Botwhin have seen fit to give these ships powerful shields and a monstrous array of armaments that allow them to give long range fire support to their singleship complement. The bulk of the armament is concentrated at the ends of the cylindrical hull, leaving the central length of the vessels uncovered, except by the superheavy armor cladding typical of Botwhin warships, a scattering of point defense turrets, and by whatever small craft are remaining in the large bays. Unlike other Botwhin ships, the PeaceBinder is NOT designed for ramming as a standard tactic. Physical armor is just as impressive; a thick shell of reinforced kaladite cermametal with more protective value than a CCW battleship’s primary hull(fabricating the massive external armor shell takes up half the production time and budget alone for one of these ships).
PeaceBinders go into battle like a bomb sprayer; a sudden high-speed exit from hyperspace, with bonecrushing braking almost at the last minute as the gunnery sensors lock onto targets, suppression fire unleashed, and the sudden deployment of several hundred singleships accelerating with homicidal abandon at the enemy formations. This has proven particularly effective in Botwhin interventions against planetary invasion violations of the SAAPA(Senexi Arm Aboriginal Protection Act; a sort of ‘Monroe Doctrine’ with regard to less advanced species that the Botwhin zealously enforce); suddenly emergent Botwhin Marshal forces appearing ‘above’ alien armadas engaged in invasion support, and unleashing a ‘rain of hell’ of PAMships slamming through the enemy formation. As the Marshal taskforce drops towards the planet below to deploy ground troops for surface intervention and disaster relief, the singleships take the opportunity to snipe and ram targets of opportunity on the way down. Caught between trying to stop the relief forces heading towards their own ground troops, and the Botwhin capital ships blasting away at them from high orbit, most alien invaders fall apart in the chaos.
The PeaceBinder takes its name from the Botwhin term(‘Chessna*Toc’) for an instrument used to officially close and seal binders and safety trigger-locks on weapons carried into no-weapons zones and treaty areas, as well as to sign envelopes for documents of surrender/capitulation/ceasefire in Botwhin culture. An appropriate name, considering that once this ship and its complement have made their mark on a battlezone, peace and disarmament follow soon thereafter.
Fortunately, for the peace of mind of galactic powers, the Botwhin apparently only have eight of these monsters, keeping them mostly at homeport, but the Botwhin have shown a decreased reluctance in recent years to use their firepower to resolve SAAPA violations. The Botwhin blame this on the turmoil surrounding the Forge Wars, and the breakdown of the normal galactic laws and treaties protecting the less-developed worlds from exploitation by more technologically advanced, and culturally less scrupulous, species.
Type:PAM-BSCV-03
Class: Battleship-Carrier
Crew: 500+600 additional troops/passengers
MDC/Armor by Location:
Main Body 300,000
Bridge 80,000
Forward Heavy Sensor Array 90,000
Rear Heavy Sensor Array 90,000
Rear Engine Nodes(4) 80,000 each
Small Craft Bays(4) 80,000 each
Long Range Heavy Laser Cannons(8 ) 4,000 each
Long Range Particle Beam Cannons(8 ) 4,000 each
Medium X-Ray Laser Batteries(8 ) 500 each
Cruise Missile Launchers(4) 1,400 each
Long Range Missile Launchers(12) 300 each
Medium Range Missile Launchers(20) 280 each
Mini-Missile Turrets(24) 200 each
Gattler Turrets(18 ) 500 each
Point Defense Lasers(36) 200 each
Tractor Beam Projectors(24) 180 each
Variable Forcefields 15,000 per side, 90,000 total
Height: 950 ft
Width: 950 ft
Length: 5,000 ft
Weight: 20 million tons
Cargo: 1 million tons
Powerplant:Nuclear Fusion w/ 50 year energy life
Speed:
(Atmosphere) Hover to Mach 3; transatmospheric.
(Sublight) Mach 18
(Kitsune Values: 50% of light speed; Accelerates/decelerates at 1.8% of light speed per melee)
(FTL) 5 light years per hour
(Underwater) Not Possible
Market Cost: 53 billion credits
Systems of Note:
Standard Starship Systems, plus:

*Hardened Systems---Botwhin sensors and electronics are heavily shielded against EMP, radiation, and other disruptions...Ion weapons and electrodisruption damage does NOT apply to the ship’s systems.

*Tractor Beams(24)---- Each small craft bay has six tractor beam turrets around the perimeter of their hatches for assisting in docking, undocking, and recovering the complement of singleships. Effectively each rated for 3,000 tons dead weight, but can be used for imparting small changes in momentum/direction to ships/structures several times that mass.
Range: 5 miles in space(NOT usable in atmosphere)(Kitsune Values: 5,000 miles in space).

Weapons Systems:
1) Long Range Heavy Laser Cannons(8 ; 4 forward and 4 aft)
Range: 30 miles in atmosphere, 90 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 90 miles in atmosphere, 90,000 miles in space)
Damage: 1d4x1,000 MD per blast
4d4x1,000 MD for four cannon firing on the same target simultaneously
Rate of Fire: Once per melee
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

2) Long Range Particle Beam Cannons(8 ; 4 forward and 4 aft)---These weapons have a better rate of fire than their CCW equiavlents due to a more robust power delivery system.
Range: 18 miles in atmosphere, 70 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 70 miles in atmosphere, 70,000 miles in space)
Damage: 1d6x1,000 MD per blast.
4d6x1,000 MD for four cannon firing on the same target simultaneously
Rate of Fire:Once per melee
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

3) Medium X-Ray Laser Batteries(24, eight batteries of three lasers each, fire and aft)---Pumped by their own independent fusion powerplants in a series of ‘micro-blasts’, these intense laser beams are designed to defeat conventional anti-laser defenses and tear into enemy destroyers and other light craft. Aside from a slower rate of fire, they are identical to those carried on the PAM singleships
Range: 8 miles in atmosphere, 16 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 16 miles in atmosphere, 16,000 miles in space)
Damage: 2d6x100 MD per blast, plus the high X-ray component punches through laser-resistant armors without diminishment of damage. 6d6x100 MD for all three lasers in a battery firing at the same target simultaneously
Rate of Fire: Four times per melee round
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

4) Cruise Missile Launchers(4)----These launchers are used to unleash barrages of anti-spacecraft missiles into enemy formations
Range:Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 3,400 miles in atmosphere, 1,800,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-32 each launcher
Payload: 128 each launcher, 512 total. Additional missiles may be stored in the cargo holds and reloaded within 20 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 6 missiles)

5) Long Range Missile Launchers(12) ---Typically used to take out enemy spacecraft, spacestations, and surface facilities at long range.
Range: Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 3,400 miles in atmosphere, 1,800,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-30
Payload: 300 missiles per launcher, 3600 total; additional missiles may be carried and loaded from cargo, but will take at least 30 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 12 missiles)

6) Medium Range Missile Launchers(20)---Mid-range defense against fighters, robots, and cruise missiles, these VLS-style launch cell batteries can throw out massive barrages of MRMs at once.
Range:Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 160 miles in atmosphere, 80,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-40
Payload: 400 missiles each launcher; total. Additional missiles may be stored in the cargo holds and reloaded within 10 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 24 missiles)

7)Mini-Missile Turrets(24) ---Close-in defense against fighters and missiles that have somehow survived the MRMLs...The Botwhin appreciate what a well-placed knife or poisoned needle can do...and intend to meet it with a well-swung morningstar.
Range:Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 2 miles in atmosphere, 100 miles in space)
Damage: Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-20
Payload: 480 mini-missiles per turret. Additional missiles may be stored in the cargo holds and reloaded within 15 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 96 missiles)

Nuclear Gattlers(18 )---(Also known as a Nuclear Pellet Gun) This is a GIANT eight-barreled heavy-caliber(200mm) gatling gun that spews hundreds of tactical-nuclear shells per minute. PAMs typically use these weapons to spew instant nuclear minefeilds in the path of enemy ships, fighters, and missiles. The use of special isotopes in the warheads reduces radiation to a minimum, making these weapons ‘environmentally safe’(if you excuse the massive holes chewed in the environment).
The PeaceBinder mounts no less than EIGHTEEN of these weapons as ‘point defense’...four forward, four aft, and five each on the lateral flanks between the launch bays.
Range 5 miles in atmosphere, 15 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 15 miles in atmosphere, 15,000 miles in space)
Damage: Does 1d6x100 MD to a 50 ft blast radius, 6d6 MD concussion damage to a 100 ft blast radius. A 24-round burst does 2d6x1,000 MD to a 300 ft blast radius
Rate of Fire: Bursts of 1-24
Payload: 3,200 rds

9)Point Defense Lasers(36)---The Botwhin consider these lightweight weapons, but they’re low-cost, easy to maintain, easily automated, and heck, you can’t have too much protection, can you?
Range: 2 miles in atmosphere, 4 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 4 miles in atmosphere, 400 miles in space)
Damage: 4d6x10 MD per blast
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

Auxiliary Craft:
220 Singleships(carried 55 to a bay, in five rows of 11 each)
8 Heavy Shuttles

Botwhin PAM Singleship

“So you’re going riding with the Marshal, are you? Here’s a few tips...write out ypur will first and have it placed in a safe place with people you trust, then take off all your clothes when seating yourself aboard the torchship and set aside everything in heavy bubble wrap...Why go starkers? Because besides saving you some heavy cleaning and underwear changing, you don’t want to have your buttons and zippers embedded in your flesh upon takeoff....”

The PAMship is the most often encountered unit of the Botwhin military forces outside their own home solar system. This pockmarked metallic bowling ball of a starship, covered with blast ports, weapons blisters, and equipment hatches, has no discernable front or back, except when it opens up its main plasma drives(at full throttle). The ship is propelled by a combination of fusion ramjet and gravitic impellor drives.
As its name suggests, the Singleship is just large enough to accommodate one Botwhin Protection Act Marshall and its gear. A second Botwhin-sized passenger can be squeezed in, but conditions will be cramped. Additional smaller beings can be carried as cargo, but must be carried in special containment casings, like gravity-insulated pods or liquid suspension gel packs, to prevent them from being crushed to goo under the intense and constant acceleration PAMs favor.
PAMships are heavily(some say obscenely) armored for their size, and very fearsomely armed, mostly with long range X-Ray laser cannons and nuclear projectile devices. A favorite weapon of Botwhin space forces is the Nuclear Gattler, a heavy caliber rapid-fire multi-barrel autocannon that spews hundreds of mini-tactical nuclear projectiles with each burst. A blast from these weapons in defensive mode can set up a blast barrier able to stop even volleys of smart missiles, or tear enemy fighters to free atoms. Used against larger targets, the thousands of micro-nuke blasts of a concentrated attack can overwhelm forcefields and bury surface fortifications in radioactive ash.
If the PAMship has a weakness, it’s the lack of anything that couldn’t be considered an ‘overkill’ weapon....simply crippling or swatting aside enemy fighters just isn’t possible with weapons that would more likely vaporize them. However, the Botwhin don’t regard this as a problem, as they typically just ignore, outrun, or ram through anything less than a capital ship battleline opposing them.
Most opponents, after facing a Botwhin SINGLESHIP, don’t stick around to encounter the heavier ships in the Botwhin arsenal....


Type: PAM-PEC-2
Class: Patrol Enforcement Craft
Date of Introduction:
Crew: 1-2 Botwhin
Up to 10 human-sized passengers can be carried in cargo anti-g pods
MDC/Armor by Location:
Main Body 10,000
Reinforced Crew Compartment 2,000
Nuclear Gattler Turret (1) 500
X-Ray Laser Turrets(3) 360 each
Missile Launchers(2) 300 each
Variable Forcefields 6,000 each side(36,000 total)
Height: 180 ft
Width: 180 ft
Length: 180 ft
Weight: 2,800 tons
Cargo: 50 tons; typically the PAM’s arsenal, body armor, and evidence kits
Powerplant: Nuclear Fusion w/ 50 year energy life
Speed:(Atmosphere) Hover to Mach 6(boost mode)
(Space) Mach 30
(Kitsune Values: 50% of light speed; Accelerates/decelerates at 3% of light speed per melee)
(FTL) 4 light years per hour
(Underwater) Perfectly functional underwater; can withstand depths up to 5 miles deep.
Cost: Not available for sale off Botwhina
Systems of Note:
Standard Spacecraft Systems, plus:

*Hardened Systems---Botwhin sensors and electronics are heavily shielded against EMP, radiation, and other disruptions...Ion weapons and electrodisruption damage does NOT apply to the ship’s systems.

*Retracting Sensor Mounts---All the ship’s sensors are mounted in retractable pods that are pulled into the hull when encountering combat or hazardous conditions...This means that the ship often flies blind, operating on basic sensors(effective range of 600,000 miles) in hot situations, until it can safely deploy its sensors/cmmunications pods.

Weapons Systems:
1) Nuclear Gattler(1)---(Also known as a Nuclear Pellet Gun) This is a GIANT eight-barreled heavy-caliber(200mm) gatling gun that spews hundreds of tactical-nuclear shells per minute. PAMs typically use these weapons to spew instant nuclear minefeilds in the path of enemy ships, fighters, and missiles. The use of special isotopes in the warheads reduces radiation to a minimum, making these weapons ‘environmentally safe’(if you excuse the massive holes chewed in the environment).
Range 5 miles in atmosphere, 15 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 15 miles in atmosphere, 15,000 miles in space)
Damage: Does 1d6x100 MD to a 50 ft blast radius, 6d6 MD concussion damage to a 100 ft blast radius. A 24-round burst does 2d6x1,000 MD to a 300 ft blast radius
Rate of Fire: Bursts of 1-24
Payload: 3,200 rds

2)Heavy X-Ray Lasers(3)---Pumped by the fusion powerplant in a series of ‘micro-blasts’, these intense laser beams are designed to defeat conventional anti-laser defenses.
Range: 8 miles in atmosphere, 16 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 16 miles in atmosphere, 16,000 miles in space)
Damage: 2d6x100 MD per blast, plus the high X-ray component punches through laser-resistant armors without diminishment of damage.
Rate of Fire: Five times per melee round
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

3)Long Range Missile Launchers(2)---These can be used to fire ordnance or probes
Range: Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 3,400 miles in atmosphere, 1,800,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-5
Payload: 100 missiles

4) Sandcasters(4)----Sandcasters throw out clouds of special silica shards and metal chaff that stay with the ship for up to five melees as long as the ship doesn’t make any changes in course or speed, and provide limited protection from enemy fire and missiles.
Range: Fills a cloud around the ship, expanding until it disperses to ineffectiveness within 5 melees
Damage: Lasers do HALF damage through the cloud before it disperses, and anything flying into the cloud takes 4d6 MD of damage. Enemy missiles have a 50% chance of being decoyed and diverted off course by the chaff; ‘smart’ missiles have only a 25% chance.
Payload: 100 canisters

5) Plasma Exhaust---By quickly closing with a target, then slewing about while openning the throttle in what has been called a ‘comet ram’, Botwhin daredevil pilots can use their own plasma drives as weapons, hitting the target with a spray of intense plasma and drive radiation...They aren’t called ‘torchships for nothing. This tactic is especially effective against ground targets...the ship can melt enemy fortifications into slag or turn an enemy base into a pool of molten volcanic glass simply by hovering overhead.
Range:0.5 miles in atmosphere, 2 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 2 miles in atmosphere, 50 miles in space)
Damage: 5d6x10 MD per 5 seconds of exposure, in a 500 ft wide cone. A full melee hovering melt-blast would do 1d6x100+50 MD. Radiation-based sensors (Radar, optics) will be effectively blinded by the sudden spike in energy, with a 50% chance of being permanently damaged and taken offline.
Rate of Fire: Can only be attempted with a -20% to piloting skill, -10% against stationary targets, per each attempted strike.

6) Ramming----Botwhin ships are built TOUGH, and thus it comes as no great surprise that the Botwhin often use their ships’ toughness and high acceleration to deliver sideswipes and rams, though this ‘billiarding’ maneuver is often hard to accomplish with any great accuracy. Their practice of making meteoric re-entries and slamming into the ground on landing is infamous; sometimes the only warning that an oppoent has that the PAMs have arrived is the earthquaking, building-shattering impact of the PAM singleship into their headquarters.
Spaceborne Ram/Sideswipe----5d6x10 MD(-2 to strike)
Landing Slam---2d4x100 MD, and sinks the ship up to 90 ft into hard surfaces.

Cool ships. Very nice!

Thanks...I don't buy the Palladium numbers of battleships; IMHO they've got to have more of the class/weight-class....and there will be lesser worlds and independents who can field ships of equivalent or better class, but in fewer numbers,and who generally operate their battlewagons close to home...The CCW and TGE, on the other hand, have the numbers and assets for GALACTIC power projection...making the Protector class more of a long range patrol battleship....the CCW likely has other battleship-class ships of older vintages serving in reserves and as home system defense...or they sign up species like the BOtwhin with the firepower as members, leading to adhoc fleets of CCW affiliates that lack the general standardization of technology, with a few specially equipped CCW capital units serving to coordinate them in fleet actions.

Nice ship, technically a mothership, not a carrier IMO,
but otherwise OK.
My only concern is that the singleships are a tad too fast
compared to their "upper second rate" origins and especially
to the "canon" galactic standards.

taalismn wrote:Thanks...I don't buy the Palladium numbers of battleships;

In this aspect I agree, see my "military spending" topic down there
somewhere.

Adios
KLM

KLM wrote:Nice ship, technically a mothership, not a carrier IMO,
but otherwise OK.
My only concern is that the singleships are a tad too fast
compared to their "upper second rate" origins and especially
to the "canon" galactic standards.

taalismn wrote:Thanks...I don't buy the Palladium numbers of battleships;

In this aspect I agree, see my "military spending" topic down there
somewhere.

Adios
KLM

Brute force technology...the Botwhin may nnot be able to move very fast FTL(the PeaceBinder is the fastest of their ships), but their ships run godawful energetically...the Botwhin don't spare energy for structural integrity fields or gee-compensators...And the singleships are supposed to be munchkiny with their tac-nuke gatling guns...No apologies there

Besides, with so many races, there have to be a few who don't fall into the 'smaller is weaker/slower' mold in terms of their tech...

That's why if the Botwhin ever changed their dotty 'defenders of the underprivileged' role and say became neo-facist conquerors or aligned themselves with the TGE, the CCW would lose sphincter control...ultimately, CCW numbers might win out against Botwhin toughness, but the Botwhin could do a LOT of damage before they went down.

Glad you agree on numbers...I just don't see a power like the CCW with its stated racial tolerance tying itself to a handful of designs that favor human crews or else make sacrifices to accommodate as many member species as possible as a political statement...they'll ideally have large reserves(if not foreard forces)m made up of ships specially designed to capitalize on their builders' physiological and psychological strengths, with the multi-accommodation ships serving as liaison craft or command platforms.

You have a good point of sparing on crew compartments
(after all, human phisiology limits our craft too) but...

Well, frankly the Prometheans are declared to be the "überest"
technologically, and this desing clearly surpasses the Star Ghost
phase fighter in terms of speed.

IMO, given their size, armor and weapons M12 and M16 with
plasma "afterburner" they are still "deadly enough".

Just my two cents about "balance" (yeah right, its RIFTS, even
Phase World )

Adios
KLM

KLM wrote:You have a good point of sparing on crew compartments
(after all, human phisiology limits our craft too) but...

Well, frankly the Prometheans are declared to be the "überest"
technologically, and this desing clearly surpasses the Star Ghost
phase fighter in terms of speed.

IMO, given their size, armor and weapons M12 and M16 with
plasma "afterburner" they are still "deadly enough".

Just my two cents about "balance" (yeah right, its RIFTS, even
Phase World )

Adios
KLM

Glad I haven't written up anything or posted it for the Tane or the Vadishah IMperials...but since both of these munch-tech species reside in other galxies/universes, their appearances in the THree Galaxies are likely be extremely arre occurances....

Though in deference to DarkMaxx and some of his design notes, there will be a few WZ designs that originated in pure vanity(you'll understand when you see them) that will have particularly exotic powerplants/propulsion systems that will give the Promethean designs some stiff competition, but again, such systems are EXTREMELY rare....

IMO let the Promethean desings be the unparalelled "best
the 3Glaxies can offer" (at least technologically) but...

Well, thinking it over, a "newcomer" civilisation can easily
adopt a few research projects not really pusued by the bigger
powers, and build a fleet from slightly more advanced designs
than the centuries old stuff used by the "BIG" players.

However, unless the given GM do not want to start
an intergalactic arms race, even these advanced desings
must be counterable by the big guys, either by adopting
tactics, deploying larger numbers or a minor retrofit or two.

Mind you, there is nothing wrong with arms races,
just the 3 Galaxies are more or less static by canon
and I found (semi)static settings more usefull.

Just my two cents.

Adios
KLM

I also agree with the numbers. I use KItsunes number for a base and I've added to them myself.

There are some classes that the powers of 3Gs would have a large number of. They would have a few more more numbers in the primary fleets and the number in the IDFs would also be far larger.

There would be a very large number of Battlecruisers in existence, because they are very tough warships and over all cheaper than Battleships. Hech this is where pocket battleships would come into their own for fast patrols and raiders against various powers who are at war or near war footings.

There would a heck of a lot more cruiser classes. These should be considered the primary heavy patrol for the overall nations of 3Gs.

There would be an insane amount of Destroyers to fill in various locations for convoy escorts to escorting the capital ships of the fleet to various independent actions they might be assigned to by their admirality.

For my part, the battlecruiser concept - as in it "original"
form (from like 1910 to 1940AD, Earth, Sol system) is
simply NOT applicable in the 3Galaxies.

As you see, for ships built in that period there had to be
a compromise between firepower, armour and speed, and
the English modell sacrificed armour for speed and guns.

However, "fast battleship" - and some even categorise
the HMS Hood as the first one, but the Bismarck and the
New Yersey are most certainly - had all three.

So I use heavy cruiser instead (or over a "critical" size,
it is a battleship).

--------------------
That aside I guess there are way more ships in the 3 Galaxies
(even in the CAF or the TGE) as in "canon", thought I like to
keep supercapital numbers low...

The reason is - as I wrote a few times earlier - that for example
if the TGE had not 23 but 2300 Doombringers, capturing one
is just not enough to keep the FWC alive, capturing a hundred
of them is not really plausible.

Corvettes, frigates, cruisers, smaller battleships... In abundance.

Adios
KLM

Ah KLM. The HMS Hood was still considered a Battlecruiser by the British up until her sinking by the Bismarck. Jane's WW2 ships classifies her as that. The USS Iowa classes were fast Battleships and had the firepower and the armor for that classification. The Hood only had the weapons, not the armor of a battleship.

Aramanthus wrote:Ah KLM. The HMS Hood was still considered a Battlecruiser by the British up until her sinking by the Bismarck. Jane's WW2 ships classifies her as that. The USS Iowa classes were fast Battleships and had the firepower and the armor for that classification. The Hood only had the weapons, not the armor of a battleship.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlecrui ... sh_designs

The nice thing in history is that there are very few "absolute"
truths - as the link above shows, some people (with probably
more knowledge in the area that we have - combined) still
classify the Hood as a fast battleship.

Whatever...

IMO battlescruisers were essentially a dead end, as technology
quickly surpassed them. This point of wiev applied to the 3Galaxies,
and the static setting of that dimension means no battlecruisers
for the major powers...

Just my two cents.

Adios
KLM

One more thought on battlecruisers:

There are possibly several civilisations, which must
make a compromise between speed, firepower and
protection, especially those who cannot master shield
technology (or heavy armor) for some technological
handycap - they might see the battlecruiser principle
viable.

Especially so, because with high speed, high firepower
designs an interstellar power can rely on spreading its
forces (showing the flag, patrol, etc), and once a threat
is spotted, concentrate ships and destroy targets, so
individual ships do not have to take too much fire.

Viable strategy/tactic if the enviroment allows.

In Star Trek for example, the Romulan "big green" Warbirds
are essentially battlecruisers, relying on cloak to approach and
disengage, brutal firepower to quickly dispose of foes, therefore
they can sacrifice some protection (be it shields, armor, structural
integrity fields and redundant systems).

But as the British battlecruisers, they also paid for this concept
in the DS9 series.

So, back in the Three Galaxies... There can be navies who
were not "educated" like this (and again: this rules out the CAF,
the TGE and the UWW as well as the GRG)

Adios
KLM

IMHO the term 'battlecruiser' as used in sci-fi has NOTHING to do with the original naval definition...it's simply a blanket term used to describe large mean-looking heavily armed spacecraft...Saying your world is being assaulted by 'alien battlecruisers' is a lot cooler and nastier sounding than assaulted by 'alien fast battleships'...so as such it's a wildly inaccurate term for historical records, but it sells better on the mass-media.

And the first victim of war is always the truth...


Fortunately, as I said...any future vessels that exceed Promethean technology in the speed area will be balanced by having miserable speed in other modes(note that the Botwhin ships have only average FTL drive capability, for instance), will be the products of ancient, ancient or distant(i.e. from outside the Three Galaxies) civilizations, or will otherwise be balanced(must use wormholes, undergo partial transformation to anti-matter upon entering real space, have Invid and Haydonites breathing down their necks, etc..), or will, indeed, trigger campaigns of sabotage and industrial guerilla war...The Prometheans also hold the trump card of Phase Technology, something likely only to be duplicated on a small scale by Heroes Unlimited beings.

Also I'll try working sideways...into weapons and drive technologies not considered to be 'standard' by the canonical and static greater Galactic powers either because of cost, complexity, or because of conflict with established manufacturers(like Northrop's F-20 Tigershark fighters getting constantly cut down by the lobbies of other corporations), and because they're alien...

It is maybe the MMORPG I play, but having such a frigate
sized vessel outrun all canon fighters (and everything else)
even at sublight, means that unless there is a sufficiently
long ranged countermeasure against it (be it a tractor beam,
engine-disrupting device/field), such vessels will dominate
the battlefield.

So their very existence would spark an arms race.

IMO.

Of course if this is what you have in mind, that is OK.

Adios
KLM

I'm not terribly worried about the Promethean Edge....RDB:PW states that the assumed upper level of CG drives is 8 LY/H, while Phase Drives do 10 LY/H, while RDB: 3G states that 7+ LY/H drives are considered military and/or experimental/rare...so very few civilizationshave them, fewer still have 8 light year per hour drives, and the Prometheans still have a 2 lLY/H lead.

That's a lot of speed to play around with

Most civilizations, once they find an effective FTL drive system, likely slow down or suspend their research on better sublight drives because they can now fraction-jump with their FTL drives. Other societies, shackled by their resources or cultural preferences, continue to push the envelope.

At sublight speeds, the real problem isn't outrunning fighters...it's outrunning MISSILES...IMHO, the whole business with cruise missiles is suspect...they're treated more like old fashioned torpedos for daring cinematic close-in approaches in the face of heavy defensive fire and Sith aces gunning for the fighter...Maybe that's so of the smaller fighter-portable ordnance, but larger shipborne weapons can, and should, include big honking weapons the size of SLBMs that can boost to Mach 20 or more, crossing the battlefield at near relativistic velocities(of course, at those speeds, why bother with explosive warheads? Let kinetic damage do the damage)....Again, though, cultural cliches of personal glory and honor pervade, and fighters become the measuring standard of performance(though not without some precedent...after all, the American and British militaries thought that wholly missile-armed forces would be the wave of the future, resulting in large cuts of manned aircraft programmes....then experience taught them that multi-purpose manned aircraft were far more versatile, and wholly missile-armed weapons systems were out, cannon-equipped fighters were back in...).

While far be it from me to shoot my own ships down, superfast battlewagons can still be had by clever strategy and tactics...hunt'em with energy weapons or get ahead of them and drop your missiles or mines in front of them where they don't have room to maneuver or dodge...
Of course, the wise speedsters will also recognize this, and devise countermeasure tactics and moves....The war of wits goes on...

Ra-Ming SaVore-class Merchantman Greatship
“Looking to get to the Anvil in a hurry, I hear? We can get you and your battalion there right fast if you don’t mind travelling cooped up with my clan for the trip. The _Radagan Queen_ may be a shade of her past self, but she’s still faster and better than any other deep-liner you can hire, and we didn’t give ALL our nav-data to the Tescarotthemnaruni so we can shave some extra time off the transit. That is, provided, you were telling the truth about taking Hartigal’s side in the Gandon Point corridor.”

The SaVore-class is one of the more common of the remaining Ra-Ming Greatships, though it isn’t the largest of the Ra’Ming’s merchant-cruisers. These stately ships, with their long fluted hulls and graceful fore and aft fan-shaped drive and sensor superstructures, once plied the galactic trade lanes under the captaincy of the elegant Ra-Ming, mercantile-spacer elites.
The Greatships of the Ra-Ming are built for the difficult intergalactic long haul routes, with FTL drives that rival the best CCW and TGE military propulsion systems. These speeds were made possible only by the constant attention paid to the engines by Ra-Ming engineers, who treated their engines with near-religious devotion, and by the Ra-Mings’ superb navigation skills, using routes that optimized energy efficiency through regions of space/time that offered minimal drag to the FTL drives. Through judicious use of these routes, and of the Ra-Ming affiliated network of wormholes and warp-gates, the Ra’Ming could move massive consignments of cargo between the Three Galaxies at a fraction of the cost and time of other carriers.
Sadly, the Ra-Ming became involved in a catastrophic war to protect their mercantile routes just as they were peaking in power. The Greatships were forced to be converted into warships, and a good number of them were destroyed in combat. With the loss of so many of their super-freighters and the revenues they SHOULD have been earning as transports, the Ra-Ming economy faltered, stumbled, and ultimately collapsed. Naruni Enterprises immediately stepped in and snapped up the failing Ra-Ming enterprises, including their Greatships and production yards, in lieu of payment on the Ra-Mings’ staggering armaments bills.
Since their acquisition of most of the Ra-Mings’ assets, the Naruni have run these ships hard in servicing their far-flung industrial empire. The ships still have an edge in speed and capacity over most other vessels of equivalent size, but the Naruni pay less attention to their maintenance; sadly, most of the fleet(75%) has fallen into disrepair and now barely ekes out a fraction of a light-year-per-hour better than other vessels. In some cases, the Naruni have remedied the situation by simply ripping out the old drives and replacing them with Promethean Phase-Drives, which actually makes the ships faster, but this is an expensive and unpopular solution.
Those Greatships outside Naruni hands have hardly fared much better. Many of them have now become wandering gypsy-communities of embittered and disposssessed Ra-Ming who refuse to work for Naruni landlords, or even to set foot on former Ra-Ming territory while it is still ‘legally’ the property of Naruni Enterprises. Cargo bays are now converted into living quarters, and capacity that would normally be allocated to revenue-generating cargo, now holds food stores and additional life support. Lack of spare parts from the homeworlds and equal hard-running on backwater trade lanes has led to their crews forced to improvize with non-standard parts, and cannibalize any Greatships that become too worn to travel on(accompanied by the painful proccess of taking on what members of the stricken ships’ crews the remaining Greatships can take into their own crews, and leaving behind those they cannot accommodate).
The surviving Greatships still retain the long sweeping lines of their original configurations, but centuries of neglect have taken their toll. The once sparkling ivory- and gold-schemed hulls have yellowed and dulled, marred by rust and chemical scarring, once-proud family- and line-crests chipped and painted over. Gun turrets and weapons blisters bulge from the once clean slopes and sweeps of the hull, and many ships sport ugly growths of auxiliary system superstructures and external cargo hooks.
Naruni Enterprises continues to produce SaVore-class freighters at the old Rathan shipyards, but at a much slower rate than under the Ra-Ming ownership, and the newer ships are much less capable than the original Ra-Ming ships.
The following describes the general layout and configuration of a late-model Ra-Ming SaVore towards the latter half of the NaiShek War. SaVores possessed a stout aerospace frame and advanced engines, with long range sensors for a transport, but possessed modest armor for vessels of their size. Owing to war-time pressures, the Ra-Ming upgraded armor around vital parts of the hull, such as the bridge and engineering sections, but other regions of the vast hull proved too cost prohibitive to significantly armor, so the Ra-Ming focused their efforts on improving the variable forcefields instead. Armament, though abundent, was conventional in design and capabilities, the Ra-Ming lacking the time and resources to invest in the development of new weapons systems when Naruni and other outside sources were offering armaments at a fraction of the cost of new R&D. The depicted configuration was felt to be a good balance between point defense and offensive capabilities against the vicious NaiShek marauders, while still retaining the ships’ heavy cargo and long-haul capabilities. Most ships of this time also carried several squadrons of fighters, mostly Naruni-supplied Broadswords and Fire-Eaters. Subsequent free Ra-Ming craft carry a variety of older-model CCW and Oni-built fighters for support.

Type: RM-GS-C101
Class: Long Range Merchant Cruiser
Crew: 500 + 2,400 passengers (Refugee/Free-Clan Ra-Ming ships carry as many as 9,000)
MDC/Armor by Location:
Main Body 72,000
Bridge 10,000
Long Range Laser Arrays(10) 800 each
Long Range Gravitic Cannon(8 ) 800 each
Long Range Missile Launchers(8 ) 500 each
Short Range Missile Launchers(14) 200 each
Rapid-Fire Ion Cannons(16) 200 each
Point Defense Lasers(30) 180 each
Point Defense Rapid-Fire Guns(plasma or gravitic)(50) 180 each
Tractor Beams(20) 120 each
Hangar Bays (4) 6,000 each
Cargo Airlocks(18) 500 each
Variable Forcefields 7,000 per side, 42,000 total
Height: 500 ft
Width: 1,000 ft at fan-tips, 600 ft at midsection
Length: 5,000 ft
Weight: 14.8 million tons
Cargo: 6 million tons
Another 500,000 tons can be carried externally on cargo hardpoints
Powerplant: Advanced Nuclear Fusion w/ 50 year energy life
Speed:
(Atmosphere) Hover to Mach 3; transatmospheric.
(Sublight) Mach 8
(Kitsune Values: 60% of light speed; Accelerates/decelerates at 0.8% of light speed per melee)
(FTL) 7 light years per hour
75% of Naruni-owned vessels and surviving independent Ra-Ming craft have fallen to 6.3 light years per hour speed as a result of declining maintenance and efficiency.
(Underwater) Not Possible
Market Cost: 1 billion credits
Systems of Note:
Standard Starship Systems, plus:

*Long Range Sensors---Ra-Ming Greatship sensors have 25% greater range than equivalent civilian systems.

*Tractor Beams(20)----Effectively rated for 1,000 tons dead weight, but can be used for imparting small changes in momentum/direction to ships/structures several times that mass. Range: 2 miles

Weapons Systems:(Merchant-Cruiser Configuration at the end of the NaiShek War)
1) Long Range Laser Arrays(10, 4 aft, 6 forward)---Originally, the Ra-Ming favored short-range ion cannons, but the needs of war and the pressing need for longer-ranged, harder-hitting, weaponry led to the Ra-Ming replacing the ion cannons with laser cannon.
Range: 6 miles in atmosphere, 12 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 12 miles in atmosphere, 12,000 miles in space)
Damage: 2d4x100 MD per blast
Rate of Fire: 4 times per melee
Payload:Effectively Unlimited

2)Long Range Gravitic Cannon(8, 4 aft, 4 forward)
Range: 8 miles in atmosphere, 16 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 16 miles in atmosphere, 16,000 miles in space)
Damage: 1d6x100 MD per burst
Rate of Fire: Six times per melee
Payload: 500 bursts per cannon

3) Long Range Missile Launchers(8, 4 forward, 4 aft)
Range: Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 3,400 miles in atmosphere, 1,800,000 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-12
Payload: 120 missiles per launcher, 960 total; additional missiles may be carried and loaded from cargo, but will take at least 30 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 12 missiles)

4) Short Range Missile Launchers(14)---Mounted in several rings around the midsection are a series of SRM launchers for point defense.
Range:Varies by Missile Type
(Kitsune Values: 10 miles in atmosphere, 500 miles in space)
Damage:Varies by Missile Type
Rate of Fire: Volleys of 1-10 each launcher
Payload: 100 per launcher. Additional missiles may be stored in the cargo holds and reloaded within 30 minutes(1 ton of cargo per 48 missiles)

5) Rapid-Fire Ion Cannons(16)---These are all that are left of the original ion-weaponry sported by the Ra-Ming craft; a secondary battery of point defense cannons.
Range: 5 miles in atmosphere, 15 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 15 miles in atmosphere, 15,000 miles in space) Damage: 2d4x10 MD per burst
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

6) Point Defense Lasers(30)
Range:12,000 ft :in atmosphere, 36,000 ft in space
(Kitsune Values: 8 miles in atmosphere, 8,000 miles in space) Damage: 2d6x10 MD per burst
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload: Effectively Unlimited

7) Point Defense Rapid-Fire Guns(plasma or gravitic)(50)---During their war with the NaiShek marauders, the Ra-Ming outfitted their ships with point defense plasma cannons purchased from the Naruni, but when the Ra-Ming learned that the Naruni were behind the NaiShek attacks on Ra-Ming shipping, most free Ra-Ming captains had the Naruni weapons ripped out and replaced with less powerful, but more common, rail-gun cannons. SaVore-ships in Naruni service retain the plasma cannons
a) Plasma Cannons
Range: 2,000 ft in atmosphere, 1 mile in space
(Kitsune Values: 1 mile in atmosphere, 100 miles in space)
Damage: 3d6x10 MD per pulse-burst
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload: Effectively Unlimited
b) Rail Guns
Range: 1 mile in atmosphere, 3 miles in space
(Kitsune Values: 3 miles in atmosphere, 300 miles in space)
Damage: 2d6x10 MD per 40 rd burst
Rate of Fire: EGCHH
Payload: 800 bursts per cannon. Reloading/Replacing a drum with fresh ammunition from stores takes 30 minutes..

Auxiliary Craft:
40 Aerospace Fighters(or 20 personnel shuttles)
10 Cargo Shuttles
6 Heavy Tugs

Variants:
The Ra-Ming consider the Naruni-manufactured ships produced at the Naruni-owned and operated Rathan shipyards to be pale imitations of the originals. Indeed, budget-cutting, use of low-cost offworlder labor, and subtle sabotage by the few remaining Ra-Ming workers who still service the homeworld shipyards for the new owners has led to newer NE-GS-C101-Cs having a top speed of only 6.1 light years per hour in FTL, a top sublight speed of Mach 6.5, and 20% less overall armor.
Older SaVores display a variety of equipment replacements and modifications. Many independent SaVore operators have added additional weaponry; particle beam cannons, additional laser batteries, mini-missile turrets, and other gear.
The Ra-Ming also produced a number of dedicated warships from converted SaVores during the NaiShek War, sacrificing cargo space to mount ten to twenty medium particle beam cannons in lateral batteries, multiple light ion cannon mounts, and fore-and aft- heavy laser turrets. Most of these ships were destroyed in combat, and Naruni snapped up the survivors, but it’s rumored that two or three survived in free Ra-Ming hands and have been working with various mercenary concerns over the centuries.

Fixed a problem with the LRMLaunchers on the PeceBinder...

taalismn wrote:At sublight speeds, the real problem isn't outrunning fighters...it's outrunning MISSILES...

Do we have any "canon" tables regarding the missiles speeds in
space? Especially for the 3Galaxies, with their 20 kg LRMs?

Also... Well, if you see the description of the mini-missiles
in DMB", Silverhawk PA, it states that the faster fighters
and spaceships can outrun mini-missiles.

And then later, the Khartum Terek's main guns are listed
with 3.200 km's range in space... Whoa...

And finally, we have a rather good clue at the Scorpion
class fighter, that cruise missiles are about a half ton each,
and a bit later, at the runner ship, "1 ton per 48 missiles"
(a bit over 20 kg).

Too bad, that today submarines range from 500 to 20.000 tons,
and equipped with torpedoes ranging from 500 to 4000 kgs.
(With about 1500-1700 kgs being the most common weight
for 533mm torpedoes), so cruise missiles are a bit too small
for anti-ship role.

Adios
KLM

Hmmm...I see an opportunity for something akin to the situation where the Japanese introduced their 'LOng Lance' torpedoes to naval warfare and startled the major powers...Faster missiles...

WEll, we DO have a Forge War pushing at the balance of the applecart...(wink, wink)

Not neccessarily. We (or in the incoming books) can settle
hazy stuff, and declare that "it was like that from the beginning".

Both Star Trek and Star Wars did this, so why not...

Adios
KLM

Especially now that they're 'enhancing' the TOS special effects...

But I agree...having faster missiles makes more sense and brings back the countermeasures race for small craft. THis is as it SHOULD be, with faster ships simply spurring better missiles to close the gap.

you know, i really have to write up my Chor'ii ships some day. peices of junk that all the locals around them fear greatly. luckly their FTL is the "one light year in around a month" type, so they don't haven't spread far.

of course, i need to write up my Chor'ii Totality first, to put it into perspective...

Hey, the more the merrier...
And FTL speed is not necessarily a sign of suepriority, especially if your runner-ship's big bad 7 light years an hour CG-drive conks out and you're surrounded by the 'slowpoke' system patrol cruisers of the locals, each armed with enough firepower to stand off a Warshield...

DarkMaxx has been MIA for a while...We're hoping he'll get back to us sometime in the near future, but matters in the real world may be keeping him...

Your compliments on his work, however, are shared by many of us here and will be passed on to should the opportunity present itself.

That is another nice ship Taalismn! I'll contribute as soon as I feel up too it.