Is MDC abused too much?

[keir451]

Can MDC be abused? Yes. Is it abused too much? That depends on wether or not you, the GM, allow it to be abused.
I typically play in, by "normal" Rifts/Palladium standards, games that are extrmely high powered but our GM keeps things in balance by limiting what we can reasonably have access to at any given point in time.

If we stay in armor too long we start getting the GB penalties, but generally speaking the games are interesting enough in their general settings that we don't always WANT to be in armor. You can't effectively seduce a pretty bar wench if you're in full body armor or PA unit now can you? Basically for our characters the game world is one in which they actually LIVE in, they have lives and relationships in it, not just show up to fight the occasional bad guy or monster.

We also don't give the PC's an "endless supply" of their gear or PA or Robots. We DO offer repair services but only at selected locations or for select prices (usually less than the ones posted in the books). If they TRULY "lose" a PA or robot unit by having it totally destroyed, they then are faced with having to pay to replace it and not always with an equal or superior unit. It can be a true challenge for, say, a GB pilot who's lost his GB due to combat to have to use a Chipwell PA suit effectively enough over a long enough period of time until he can afford to buy a new GB.

[The Baron of chaos]

Hi Guys,

1. Is MDC abused too much?

Im finding out that it is when all my players want to make characters that are MDC, the more the better. So I've decided to turn everything into SDC. They can try to find the highest AR's next (they don't like AR's).

And the ones who are not MDC, they like to find the most durable armor and like to stay in it 24/7. I try to tell them they can't. It becomes uncomfortable after a time and the need for bathroom breaks and hygiene.

Hmm it already been said, it depend. Of course due to "skewedperspective" most would assume that either you're MDc covered or you're dead, and in a sense this is absolutely true in Rifts earth, but on another side is kind of like expecting someone to ALWAYS carry on a military grade rocket launcher while wearing full combac equipment all the times. No one had ever, will ever do that no matter how bad things is. Huge vhicles like Submarines or Harriers are another question but indivdual soldier eventually like to find a safe place where they do not have to go packagin enough weapon to level a small 21th century town. (and explain the entire concept of Combat Cyborgs...).

2. A side question. What do you do when robot pilots or power armor pilots lose their machines in battle? Do you give them another one afterward? It hasn't happened in my games, but other GM's have done that. They think they have unlimited resources to build them or find them and the players get them if they lose one.

Thanks guys.

Hahhahhaha...No...Really i've rarely heard of GM that autmatically replenish the lost equipment of players. Hell, evne about mutilation and death of PC is not magically restored by GM all that easily...is part of the fun of the rpg for players trying to find a logical solution of the trouble(the simplest one...let's steal new stuff from Black Market/Coalition/Naruni) with all the series of opportunity for adventure that a wise GM can use(the above simplest solution has obviously lot of..hmm...unpleasant...consequences for PC...and potential for cool adventure...)

[Eashamahel]

The artwork is one thing and the game mechanics are another.

Indeed. One is a visual representation of the artists view of the world, which should correspond to what the author has written, and the other are the rules by which the world functions, which what the author writes should also match up to.

Many times the artwork doesn't even correspond to the thing that it's susposed to be a depiction of.

Poor layout design and bad editing choices are another issue entirely.


I'll use Long as an example, my favourite RIFTS artist, and his initial comic series in Triax and the NGR. A great little comic, depicting a battle between NGR troops and Gurgoyles. It's really neat, I liked it when I first read it, and still like it now. Unfortunately, it doesn't match up to anything possible in game sense. There are no mechanics that make it possible (and I remember trying when it came out, 'what if that axe swing was a Power Strike and it was a natural 20 with max damage? Nope, still wouldn't sever the arm.'), which is unfortunate, becasue the series of events it shows seems like how things SHOULD go.

[Vrykolas2k]

The problem is in perception, and often with a GM.
MDC stuff isn't actually common.
Look at the prices. If your armour gets blown to hell, how long really does your character go before he or she can buy a new suit?
If the GM is handling things in a reasonable manner, you're trying to protect that which protects you as much as possible.
Same with MDC creatures. They're just not that common to run across, if your GM is being even moderately realistic.
Ya, every new splat-book has new MDC creatures or gear, but that doesn't mean you find the stuff in a flea-market or run into Devil Unicorns going down the street to get smokes and road-beers.
Usually if a group is trying to wear EBA at all times, it's because they've got a GM who's throwing way too many high-level threats at them.

[Eashamahel]

Same with MDC creatures. They're just not that common to run across, if your GM is being even moderately realistic.
Ya, every new splat-book has new MDC creatures or gear, but that doesn't mean you find the stuff in a flea-market or run into Devil Unicorns going down the street to get smokes and road-beers.

I would have agreed with you here in the beginning, but that was before non-supernatural MDC D-Bees starting popping up in the world. Originally, when even most of the Giant Races were SDC/HP based, and only the most powerful/magical were MD beings, then yes, it would have been rare to encounter MDC beings, but with things like the Grackletooth and other (again) non-supernatural, mortal D-Bees, it' significantly more likely.

[Alrik Vas]

Yeah, I ignore most of that stuff. Pretty much all flesh is SDC, most (but certaintly not all) hardware is MDC. If you're a demon or something, you get to be MDC. Otherwise don't get hit bro!

[Vrykolas2k]

Same with MDC creatures. They're just not that common to run across, if your GM is being even moderately realistic.
Ya, every new splat-book has new MDC creatures or gear, but that doesn't mean you find the stuff in a flea-market or run into Devil Unicorns going down the street to get smokes and road-beers.

I would have agreed with you here in the beginning, but that was before non-supernatural MDC D-Bees starting popping up in the world. Originally, when even most of the Giant Races were SDC/HP based, and only the most powerful/magical were MD beings, then yes, it would have been rare to encounter MDC beings, but with things like the Grackletooth and other (again) non-supernatural, mortal D-Bees, it' significantly more likely.

North America is a pretty big place, and there just aren't that many grackle-tooths around according to D-Bees of North America.

[Eashamahel]

The Grackle Tooth is clearly just one example, but it is my go-to for non-supernatural MDC beings, probably because one of me long time friends absolutely loves them (and Australia, and HtH: Commando, and on and on), so they are always at the top of my head.

Some others that immediately spring to mind are the old Sword Fists from CWC (though there are only a few hundred of them in the 'Burbs, I believe), and the Vanguard Brawler. Actually, upon checking, there are a half million Brawlers spread mostly around the 'mid-west'.

And then there are the Gorrila men, who basically have a rule similiar to what the Sword Fists should have, which is the situational ability for an SDC creature to inflict MDC with it's bare hands. That would be great on the Sword Hand, if their blades were made of some super sharp MDC material while them themselves were high SDC (super tough bone structure and such to support the blades), but on the Gorilla's, it's hiliariously bad.

The point is, although MDC D-Bees are 'rare' in that there are not a lot of them, they are 'common' enough to be well known and it not be an extraordinary event to run into one (or more) anywhere a character happens to go in NA.

[The Baron of chaos]

Oh boys...I skip the board for a while, due to normal day-by-day trouble, and I still find the usual discussion...Is comforting somehow. nyway many poitn i could and wanted say seem to have ben alreayd arisen and highlighted by better "bards" than me seem I'll just repeat some.
Megadamag eis not that common, as technology and magical constructs(another form of technology IMHO). Living MEgadamage being(alien and superhumans) exist in larger amount, too bad that the most powerfull ones(kryptonian/kajiu level just to quote some of my recent fav movies ) ARE NOT FRIENDLY for the most part (Ah Gargoyles...as big as a building, flying, and as tough as a tank and twice as strong...and there are millions of them...fighitng horde-style...what's not to love!). It goes long way to explain the not-so-paranoid-after-all behaviour of humans of Rifts earth and their feeling costantly under-siege(it does not help that nukes do not help close Rifts or prevent them to open again, making its use a bad-aid on a gaping wound essentially)
Being a megadamage being is great for fighting, not so great if you want(or plan 9 to do somethign else other than fighting, as except a few, most stand out quite a lot in crowd
Location is important as somethings are more common sight and found in some placxes than others, and even with Rifts teleport travelling can be hard(example full comversion borgs are common sight in Russia, at least in Warlord controlled area, slightly less in Triax controlled territory, unless they are part of military.)
This lead to the simple fact tha tnot all tech is equal, and unless you know a very skilled operator, or cyber doc, is not so easy reapir a piece of cool MDC tech outside its peculiar area, in some case if you've a samas armor you won't be able to get it repaired unless you're dangerously close to coalition controlled territory. Wilks most advanced weapons are hard ot find in europe and impossible to find replacement compatible pieces(in some places, if you know right people you can order, but you've to pay way too much, better then buy some cheaper local weaponry at that point)
Curiously, skilled "adventurer" classes like Operator, Cyber Doc, Doctor, Rogue Scholar and Scientist, well, are not that widespread too. They are highly specialist, and you find them in large number only in FEW place in the world(like Lone Star). And the more skilled the rarest. Probably there ar elike 4-5 12th level Operator or Scientist in the whole rifts earth! Some tech to too complicated to be repaired unless you got 98%+ in engineering and at least pair of science skill.
Skill apart resources too can be hard to come by. Believe it or not, those nucelar celss are not that easy to manufacture, and infact if one can, better cannibalze compatible components(the most florishing aspect of being mercenary, always ensure you can loot your fallen opponents tech).
Magic is same story as tech. Is not that common, it seem as supernatural mosnter are all natural spellcasters, while mages know how to make a scene anyway. You hardly fail to notice them when they act. And they gather in groups of spellcasters too. So it seem there many of them. It is kind of like judging the level of culture amongst citizens...using only the univerity students and professors as reference test unit. Of course it would be freaking skewed and wrong.
As for the rule themselves, sure they need lot of refinemnt, not complete negation of it, as I find MDC system make awfully sense for all those beyond human things we seen in sci fi and superheroic/shohen manga stories. It is just that as most rPG system sacrificed a lot for fast playability and didn't cover important stuff(like mutilation/limb removal/breaking stuff/making hle through stuff without actually destroying the whoel thing and so on...). It happen. Till we get small flipbook covering all that stuff(possibly on a special PDF rifter one could wish can't I?) is left to the GM do his job as being the law of physics of his game session. Is nott ha tmuhc effort really, and actually a perverse fun somehow let's admit it.