Re: Why should I be afraid of Psi-Stalkers?
Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:03 am
Depending on the tribe some work with mages to take down bigger tastier snacks.
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Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC. Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
ShadowLogan wrote:Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC. Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
I think originally SN/CoM creatures where supposed to generally have material vulnerabilities (silver, iron, wood, water, etc) that would allow those simple SD weapons to inflict MD, at least going off the Random Monster Generator in the Rifts Main Book (not RUE). Now as the Rifts books have progressed, they don't seem to use that feature very often (IINM), but that might explain how Psi-Stalkers where envisioned to be able to hunt MDC SN/CoM effectively even with SD weapons.
ShadowLogan wrote:Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC. Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
I think originally SN/CoM creatures where supposed to generally have material vulnerabilities (silver, iron, wood, water, etc) that would allow those simple SD weapons to inflict MD, at least going off the Random Monster Generator in the Rifts Main Book (not RUE). Now as the Rifts books have progressed, they don't seem to use that feature very often (IINM), but that might explain how Psi-Stalkers where envisioned to be able to hunt MDC SN/CoM effectively even with SD weapons.
flatline wrote:ShadowLogan wrote:Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC. Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
I think originally SN/CoM creatures where supposed to generally have material vulnerabilities (silver, iron, wood, water, etc) that would allow those simple SD weapons to inflict MD, at least going off the Random Monster Generator in the Rifts Main Book (not RUE). Now as the Rifts books have progressed, they don't seem to use that feature very often (IINM), but that might explain how Psi-Stalkers where envisioned to be able to hunt MDC SN/CoM effectively even with SD weapons.
This makes sense.
--flatline
Course in Palladium YMMV regarding this issue since originally CB1 did classify spellcasters as CoMs but FoM's LordMagus OCC pretty much negated that by inference. Was there anything to imply otherwise prior to WB16?torjones wrote:Ley Line Walkers, Shifters, Techno-Wizards, Temporal Wizards, etc are not Creatures of Magic. Nor are they MDC Supernatural Beings. I know that the Lord Magus would trigger the Psi-Stalker transformation to MDC, as they are Creatures of Magic. the ability to use magic doesn't make you a creature of magic, if you aren't already. Your OCC saying "You become a creature of magic" does.
The same way you cut Psi-Cola, obviously.torjones wrote:how does one "Cut" a Ley Line so that the stalker can begin to feed?
Whatever is available, presumably at the rate a standard spellcaster would absorb it. Double if they're a Line Walker or Mystic Knight.torjones wrote:how much PPE is contained in that Ley Line for the Stalker to feed upon, once that line does get cut?
Stalkers don't drain lines like they do living beings or psi-cola bottles. Ley lines are streams of energy, not containers, so Stalkers scoop up the water as it flows by, so to speak.torjones wrote:Does the stalker reduce only that one ley line to zero PPE or does he disrupt the entire web of lines that that particular line is connected to through the various nexus?
The rules say otherwise.torjones wrote:a stalker can only feed on PPE produced by creatures of magic or supernatural creatures, not ley lines.
Ley lines are not creatures, Stalkers feed upon sources like this differently. They have always been able to absord ley line energy as far as I know.torjones wrote:In order to feed, they must cut the victim, and drain all of their PPE. The stalker can not choose to take only part of a creature's PPE, it's an all or nothing proposition.
That part about the nauseousness (and resulting penalties) is new, not in my RMB, anyone know when that got introduced? It's not an idea I particularly object to, I guess. Gives more incentive to avoid it, which the roleplaying-based "bad taste like sour milk" part didn't do much for.dragonfett wrote:Page 153 of the RUE, bottom of the page, right hand column:They can absorb mystic ley line energy in an emergency to stay alive, but it tastes bad, like sour milk, makes the Psi-Stalker nauseous (-1 on all combat bonuses for 1d6x10 minutes)
It has more to do with the connection you have with your victim.flatline wrote:if I'm standing next to a psi-stalker and another psi-stalker 300' away blows my head off with a rifle, how is it that the sniper gets my PPE and not the psi-stalker standing right next to me? According to RUE, the psi-stalker standing next to me can only get the excess that the sniper psi-stalker doesn't absorb. I think the RUE write-up assumes that psi-stalkers always kill their prey close range.
Do you mean psionics? Very few spells uses a save vs ME or psionics. Only the Mind Blast spell statted out in FoM (introduced in the Wormwood comic) comes to mind as one of these. Stalkers do have a higher PE and additional bonuses to save vs magic too, of course.Shark_Force wrote:very high ME means that they can be hard to hit with some of your best spells.
Nekira Sudacne wrote:So...why would a psi-stalker be trying to murder some random shifter trying to open a portal?
Yea, they are predators who feed on PPE to survive, but that dosn't make them psycopaths automatically. While there are (cannonically even) psycopathic kill-crazy bastard psi-stalkers, nothing i've seen indicates the majority go around ganking random wizards.
Of course, unlike cannibals they have the added option of simply capturing you and giving you a small cut you'll easily recover from, as a way of acquiring their renewable food source.Nekira Sudacne wrote:If cannabalism isn't the default for humans, why would it be for psi-stalkers?
Has it ever been clarified whether this is referring to flesh or PPE? Plus you can be a cannibal by consuming people who die without having a policy of killing to eat them. It could just be an efficiency/dead-honoring practice.Mech-Viper Prime wrote:50% of wild psi stalkers are cannibals.
Nekira Sudacne wrote:The thread was about psi-stalkers, not wild psi-stalkers. I consider them two seperate things. those wild psi-stalkers are the equivlent of xenophobic tribes that hate everyone not them, it's an entirely different paradigm.
Would you know where that's indicated? Failed to find confirmation one way or the other on a casual sweep.kaid wrote:When talking about psi stalkers the majority of them are "wild" psi stalkers. Hard to talk about psi stalkers without taking wild psi stalkers into consideration given the vast majority of psi stalkers around fall into that category.
Also wondering where this is indicated. I can see the likelihood but wondering if it was explicitly stated.kaid wrote:nearly all the "civilized ones" are going to be members of the CS.
It helps them cut them by allowing them to survive long enough to do so.Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC.
There are plenty of ley lines to allow them to avoid starvation. Especially with them turning MDC at ley lines now, I could see many of them congregating at ley lines as a means of survival, both in resisting damage and resisting starvation.Kagashi wrote:Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
It's not a solid mutation if you can't stay solid when hit by an MD attack. The ability to turn MDC at ley lines and when attacked by supernatural critters is a lot more benefical to their long-term survival than being able to damage MDC creatures with their bare hands.Kagashi wrote:Just seems the mutation would have been more solid if rather then turning MDC when engaged in melee with a SN critter, that they could simply do damage to that SN critter as if they had SN Strength.
Wild Stalkers who can't access MD weaponry would have to limit themselves to SDC supernaturals/psychics/mages/ley lines.Kagashi wrote:Now, it is more believable that they could damage a SN critter in order to drink the PPE without the benefit of a tool a "wild" stalker might not have access too.
ShadowLogan wrote:I think originally SN/CoM creatures where supposed to generally have material vulnerabilities (silver, iron, wood, water, etc) that would allow those simple SD weapons to inflict MD, at least going off the Random Monster Generator in the Rifts Main Book (not RUE). Now as the Rifts books have progressed, they don't seem to use that feature very often (IINM), but that might explain how Psi-Stalkers where envisioned to be able to hunt MDC SN/CoM effectively even with SD weapons.
Shark_Force wrote:flatline wrote:ShadowLogan wrote:Kagashi wrote:I think the Psi Stalker rewrite was bad, and went in the wrong direction. To me, it does not make sense on how turning MDC around SN critters helps them cut an MDC creature when they are infact still dealing SDC. Without the beneft of an MD capable cutting tool/weapon, they would starve unless they hunted SDC mages exclusively, or drank from Ley Lines.
I think originally SN/CoM creatures where supposed to generally have material vulnerabilities (silver, iron, wood, water, etc) that would allow those simple SD weapons to inflict MD, at least going off the Random Monster Generator in the Rifts Main Book (not RUE). Now as the Rifts books have progressed, they don't seem to use that feature very often (IINM), but that might explain how Psi-Stalkers where envisioned to be able to hunt MDC SN/CoM effectively even with SD weapons.
This makes sense.
--flatline
well, it makes sense except for the fact that supernatural creatures stopped being written with special vulnerabilities long before RUE came out, which is when psi-stalkers got the MDC transformation. go figure.
maybe a large portion of them are also sea inquisitors? =S
Noon wrote:Can we stop deciding what other peoples characters do, for them?
Yeah, some people might think psi stalkers are nice and it's good to suggest there might be a range of attitudes amongst them.
But telling them how their psi stalker character WILL act ('you will see them as food!') is prima donna-ish.
torjones wrote:Most of what you say is correct, but consider the very short range on that tracking ability... less than half a mile if I'm expending ppe/isp. If I'm not casting, then it's less than 200'. Once I stop casting, the stalker is back down to 200' or less, depending on level. Thats a help, potentially, but I'm thinking in the long run, luck would be a bigger factor. That and legitimate hunting and bounty hunting techniques. Again, I'm not saying it isn't helpful, I just am of the opinion that it's not as big a benefit as some people seem to think it is.
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Nekira Sudacne wrote:[
By that logic everyone on earth should be a cannibal. after all it's in your own self-interest to eat dead people instead of burying them--free food. what idiot would turn that down?
If cannabalism isn't the default for humans, why would it be for psi-stalkers? That's my point. nothing in their discription leads one to beleive they see killing a mage as no different than killing a cow.
Eashamahel wrote:torjones wrote:Most of what you say is correct, but consider the very short range on that tracking ability... less than half a mile if I'm expending ppe/isp. If I'm not casting, then it's less than 200'. Once I stop casting, the stalker is back down to 200' or less, depending on level. Thats a help, potentially, but I'm thinking in the long run, luck would be a bigger factor. That and legitimate hunting and bounty hunting techniques. Again, I'm not saying it isn't helpful, I just am of the opinion that it's not as big a benefit as some people seem to think it is.
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I had always thought that the Psi-Stalkers tracking skills, wilderness techniques and understanding of monsters/mages and magic was what was going to lead them to their prey and track them down, and that the magic sensing abilities were only for use in the final chase, the 'close in for the kill' moment, when the mage/supernatural creature might realize it was in danger and attempt to use magic to escape. I agree that trying to rely on just your 'sense supernatural' abilities would see you go hungry.Nekira Sudacne wrote:[
By that logic everyone on earth should be a cannibal. after all it's in your own self-interest to eat dead people instead of burying them--free food. what idiot would turn that down?
If cannabalism isn't the default for humans, why would it be for psi-stalkers? That's my point. nothing in their discription leads one to beleive they see killing a mage as no different than killing a cow.
You... might not have a solid grasp of nutrition and biology. Humans aren't that helpful to other humans to consume. Besides not being that helpful, human cannibalism can easily lead to spread of disease and other issues. Everyone on earth should NOT be a cannibal, it would be terrible for us. Psi-Stalkers need worry neither about disease nor incomplete amino acid chains when consuming the PPE of a human.
Technically seeing someone as food is more perception/thought, not action. You can see someone as food and opt not to eat them... right away. Just ask the Mock Zombie.Noon wrote:telling them how their psi stalker character WILL act ('you will see them as food!') is prima donna-ish.
Eashamahel wrote:You... might not have a solid grasp of nutrition and biology. Humans aren't that helpful to other humans to consume. Besides not being that helpful, human cannibalism can easily lead to spread of disease and other issues. Everyone on earth should NOT be a cannibal, it would be terrible for us. Psi-Stalkers need worry neither about disease nor incomplete amino acid chains when consuming the PPE of a human.
Tor wrote:Technically seeing someone as food is more perception/thought, not action.Noon wrote:telling them how their psi stalker character WILL act ('you will see them as food!') is prima donna-ish.
Shark_Force wrote:PCs are exceptions to the rule. your PC may view others (be they PCs or NPCs) however you wish, i really don't care one way or the other.
that does not magically change what the setting says regarding how a typical individual will perceive a certain person, and i can't for the life of me imagine why it would be even the tiniest bit relevant to bother bringing up that your PC might not view someone as food. why would that even matter? the question isn't about one specific psi-stalker, it's about psi-stalkers in general, and psi-stalkers in general act in a certain specific way.
this has absolutely nothing to do with anyone trying to tell anyone how to play their PC, and it baffles me why people seem to want to make it about that.
Noon wrote:If you're into dualism, technically yes.Tor wrote:seeing someone as food is more perception/thought, not action.
Eashamahel wrote:A (comparatively) large group of super-human psychic-wilderness cannibals exist. That should be concerning.