Hi everyone
I will give a response to Summersnow's post, I will copy and reply to it here.
I wish you the best of luck on your "not palladium" kickstarter.
Yes this is NOT Palladiums Kickstarter, if you want to assure yourself of that please come over to my Facebook page and see what we are up to.I'd like to point out a few things you should avoid in the kickstarter if you wish it to succeed and offer some thoughts on things you should prepare for.
#1 From your Q&A post
Q: Is the intention of the KS to create a production run to make it into distribution, or solely to fulfill the KS pledges? Assuming the first, what will the break-even numbers for various print runs?
A: It is pointless to do KS just to fulfill the KS pledges alone. Without post-KS distribution, there is no point in doing a KS at all. A game needs to have a life after the KS is over.
Given that one of the complaints people have with RTT is that Palladium has shown zero interest in three + years in the kickstarter backers I'm not sure leading off with something that sounds ever remotely like "retail buyers are more important than the kickstarter backers" is a good strategy
First Summersnow I would say you are cherry-picking my previous replies a bit. As I detailed many times before, NO products will be supplied to retail before the KS backers are given their rewards. But if the game is to continue after the KS then retail copies must be produced. Without sounding condescending, do you know that the more copies of the game I purchase from the manufacturer at one time the cheaper those copies are to produce and thus the more bang for the manufacturing buck. Not all people realize this. So, of course I will produce retail copies at the same time as KS copies. But I will not send out retail copies to distributors before the backers get their rewards. This is NOT the same thing at all as "retail buyers are more important than the kickstarter backers" and to say so is to try and drum up strife for the project. If this is not your intention then I am sorry but it does "sound" like that is your intent.#2
Q: How many production samples of the miniatures have been acquired, and has a manufacturer been decided upon?
A: I still have the final few 3-D sculpts to get done, but the game is nearing the finish stages as far as components go, rules are continuing to be worked on. I am in talks with manufacturers now, but that must be complete before I will launch the KS. I want to have nearly everything finished before I go to KS. My best example of how a KS should be run is Cool-Mini-or-Not and they always have all their ducks in a row before they launch their KS. That is the example I want to follow.
First, given the other big complaint is the "We're 98% complete" line they spun on everyone I feel fairly confident if you use the words "98% complete" at any point in the campaign you can probably kiss you comments section goodbye.
I have nothing to do with the RRT as I have said many, many times and I, me, Carmen Bellaire, NEVER once said I am "98% complete" YOU are the one using those words. When I was asked where I am at with the project I gave an accurate description of how far along me and my guys were at that time.Second, I don't know if you are aware but CMON just announced a delay on Massive Darkness and blamed it on the backers. The fact that CMON is always late, always has lame excuses for the lateness and is a running joke in the KS community for project lateness makes your choice of CMON as a company to emulate when your biggest hurdle will be distancing yourself from a campaign that is 3+ years late does not bode well for the success of the project.
No I did not know of the woes of Massive Darkness and every CMON KS me or my friends have back have went incredibly well, they must be having some problems I have not heard about. I didn't back Massive Darkness as it sounded kind of dull to me, so I have not followed it. It is a shame if they blamed the backers for their delays, but I know nothing of it one way or the other. As far as distancing myself from RRT, its simple as I have said over and over I am not involved with it (other than as a backer like yourself), I have no say over it or control over it. But I do hope it gets resolved as I am a backer too.#3
Q: Have potentially-friendly reviewers been identified and contacted about review copies of the game? Here I'm talking about game reviewers that have generally favorable views for this style of game, and thus might be best able to speak to its strengths, not necessarily reviewers that will provide solely positive reviews.
A: This honestly will be a challenge, not because I don't think its worth doing, but because so much of my available cash as gone into development. But I am hoping that the reviewers I have spoken to will give it a shot using paper stand-ins for the minis. This is one of the hurdles I still have to deal with, but I am sure I will figure something out.
Given palladiums reputation for censorship sticking to reviewers (and presumably beta testers) that you know will only provide a positive review can create a feedback loop / echo chamber in which all you ever get back is what you want to hear, not the truth, which ultimately leads to a lesser game and tie you into palladium's "culture" and make it that much more difficult to separate yourself from them.
Again you are equating Rogue Heroes with Palladium Books, I, Carmen Bellaire am NOT Palladium Books. When asked the situation with reviewers I gave a frank and straight forward answer, you sound like you would prefer me to lie. I am not going to do that. Getting enough FREE review copies made IS going to be a challenge for me. I am ONE guy with a couple of buddies helping me to build a brand new gaming company and I am the ONLY one funding it. I had to PAY for the Rifts IP and PAY for 3-D sculpts, art, tile designs, everything and I am tight on funds, so this IS a challenge.#4 RTT / Distancing yourself from Palladium
A: I agree that it will be an obstacle. There will be a specific group of players that will NEVER back my KS because of it and there is nothing I can do to prevent that, but Rifts is an IP I love and I will still go through with the KS. Indeed I am using Kickstarter, because if it fails to reach its funding goal, no one is charged and no backer is out his money. If it does fund, then I am off to the races and get to make the game I have always wanted to play. The Savage Rifts KS has boosted my belief that I can have a successful KS even with the RTT baggage.
A: Yes being viewed as PALLADIUM or a shill for them is a problem, that is why I am trying to be open and honest about the project to everyone who wants to know about it before the KS begins. I am first posting here for an obvious reason (or at least I thought so), if I first started a Facebook page and put everything up there, none of you would have seen it. I am first posting here for exposure and so that everyone knows what is going on. Next weekend is when I planned on launching the Facebook page, that gives everyone 10 days to know what's up and to head over to the Facebook then. After that goes up I will not be posting here and will move the discussion over there. This was just a necessary painful first step.
A: Well there has only been one KS with minis and Palladium IP, the RTT, so at the moment it's one isolated case that was handled poorly and needs Palladium's attention. That being said lots of other companies have had bad first outings on KS, while the RTT is not strictly speaking MY baby, it is a great example of what NOT to do. Although I do believe Palladium with come through in the end (my opinion obviously). All that aside, I definitely intend to show that Rogue Heroes is creating this game, not Palladium. This post is just a first step. But I will not suddenly bad mouth them either just to gain supporters since I don't believe in BS like that and I think you guys don't either. I will however show you guys that I am Rogue Heroes, not Palladium.[/color]
The people who won't back your KS because of RTT aren't the problem. Its the ones who will use you to send a message to Palladium and actively work to destroy your kickstarter you need to worry about.
I agree with you on this completely, but its the fires I have to face to make this game. I wish it were different but its not, so I will face the fire and push on!Now I've pointed out several things above and they all have one common theme, the answers you gave are all answers an RTT backer would expect from Palladium. Retail is more important than backers, the overconfidence "98% done ya'll", the "us vs. them" mentality of "we've got to make sure people who review/test the game are on our side and will give us a review we want to hear instead of the truth".
Retail is NOT more important than KS backers, as an avid KS backer (go check our Rogue Heroes on KS), I would never put retail before the KS backers. The overconfidence is certainly not mine, I am doing everything I can to succeed but this could go down if flames if I don't use due diligence, and boy I know it. You have point out many of Palladium's failings NOT Rogue Heroes. The fact that I am willing to reply and take this before the Kickstarter even launches should make that blantetly clear.These have the potential to be huge issues for you because convincing people you are physically separate from the people who did RTT will be far easier than convincing people you think differently than the people who left the backers of RTT stranded and who give no indication of caring about the backers of RTT and that your project will be different will be much harder.
I agree with you, but all I can do at this point is be open and honest, and reply to your questions. If you still think I am no different from Palladium then I will never win you over, but I will try.Especially when so much of what you say about your kickstarter sounds to me like you haven't learned anything at all from the mistakes made on the RTT kickstarter and are just repeating Palladiums thoughts and following there work culture that lead to some of those mistakes.
You are completely wrong here. I am not a part of Palladiums "work culture" hell I dont even live in the same country as them. I am Canadian!
Its too bad you feel that way. And appearently you have your mind made up but you are wrong, end of story.Things you should think about:
What do you tell kickstarter when your kickstarter gets reported by backers of RTT?
Rogue Heroes has no problem with someone "reporting" my KS as I have done nothing wrong.What to do with the RTT backers who go over the line on the comments section?
What is "over the line"? That is for Kickstarter itself to deal with, just like I asked for no posts to be deleted here, I will not be telling KS to ban people or delete posts but if they do that is their prerogative. As it is in Kickstarter's interests to keep the comments civil.How do you handle shipping?
As stated before I am looking at several shipping options and am leaning toward Ship Naked, although I have not yet made the final choice.How do you handle refunds? (kickstarter requires refunds on failed projects, RTT is considered a failed project by many, yet no refunds. How will you be different?)
When a project on Kickstarter fails to fund no one is charged, that is why I am using it over Indiegogo or other crowdfunding sites. So there is no problem there. And as far as the RRT I have no control over it so comparing the KS I will run or its success is misplaced.Are you willing to carry an independent auditor to audit the project every step of the way?
Rogue Heroes is a licensed corporation in Canada and as such I already am subject to my government's audits on every penny the KS will bring in and spend. No further auditor is required. Do you ask that of ALL Kickstarters or is that just to single mine out? Rhetorical question.Will retail receive products before backers, i.e. will you sell at a convention before shipping to backers?
NO and NO I am avid KS backer and I hate those practices!How many pieces will the mini's be? Refunds if that changes?
As stated on my Facebook page, they will be one-piece minis, pre-assembled at the factory, those are the only type of manufacturing quote I have been soliciting. I do not like assembling board game minis. So no need to change it.How late will the project be? (hey, your fault you picked CMON as a "role model") Refunds if your late?
You are just baiting me here. Like all KS it could be late. But I have take time to research average manufacturing and shipping times, taking into accound things like Chinese New Year which always mess things up. I am also planning on setting the delivery date long to give a "realistic" expectation of how long it will take to actually fulfill ALL KS rewards. And refunds would depend on how late and why, you know that is an impossible question to answer at this moment.Are you thick skinned enough to handle the abuse from RTT backers you might receive WITHOUT reacting? Once discussion devolves into argument, you lose.
I will deal with it.How much experience do you have in miniature games, again if your resume consists of "I worked for palladium during RTT" and "RTT is the only mini game I've worked on" then your resume is "I worked for a company whose reputation is not be the best on a game they couldn't finish and whose track record with Kickstarter is nothing short of a disaster". - not a good sign.
My "side job" is in the board gaming industry designing board games and assisting in miniatures projects. This is why I have not written for Palladium in many years, he does not pay enough and I make much more in board games. My head sculptor Ben Calvert-Lee has worked for Mantic, Bushido and many others miniature companies. So yes Rogue Heroes as plenty of experience. Just go over to the Facebook page and see what we are working on. Then you can see the quality we are producing. I have already put my money behind this, so I am quite sure of my abilities in this field. So it is a Good Sign.I will also reply to n815e's short comment:
In reality, Carmen would need to assure backers that he will ensure that funding will go entirely to fulfilling rewards before any is applied to retail stock... And do it that way.
n815e, as I stated above ALL KS backers WILL get their rewards first! But all manufacturing will be done simultaneously so that I can get the cost benefits of mass production. This is the only way the backers can get the best price on their copies of the game. Otherwise, the KS backers would actually pay MORE than retail purchasers because the second run of the game does not have to pay the 3D printing fees, molding fees, and manufacturing set up fees. Once the molds are made they last for hundreds of runs, so there are no further fees associated with the molds. This is something many, many people who have never been through the manufacturing process do not realize. Indeed as sizable chunk of the cost for a first production run of any game/product is actually these additional fees. So the goal of a good KS is to produce approximately twice the number of games actually need so that these costs can be recouped through retail sales instead of all being put onto the shoulders of the KS backers. I know this because I have been through it before with other companies. That being said I still refuse to see retail get their products before the KS backers. Since I am NOT relying on the KS to make a living, I have a normal day job, and my sculptors and artists are being paid as I go, I will have no pressure on me to do otherwise.Okay that covers the replys for now. So until I post again, please come over to the Facebook page and look around and have a good day.
https://www.facebook.com/RogueHeroesPublishing/Carmen