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Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 6:09 pm
by Orin J.
i'm really more baffled he wants to rewrite new west and austrailia, but canada and atlantas aren't on the chopping block.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 6:30 pm
by Library Ogre
Orin J. wrote:i'm really more baffled he wants to rewrite new west and austrailia, but canada and atlantas aren't on the chopping block.
The difference is that neither Canada nor Atlantis are real places.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 4:19 pm
by Hell knight
Ah i see well i got a cobra chicken with your name on it lol.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 4:35 pm
by Father Goose
Hell knight wrote:Ah i see well i got a cobra chicken with your name on it lol.
I feel targeted by this comment.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 5:01 pm
by drewkitty ~..~
There are some text changes in the RBM SB. The Rocket Mortar that was mistakenly called a Rocket Propelled mortar.
Then there was some stupid text talking about ammunition that didn't follow reality. Even if the text sort of mirrors common usage, it directions point the reader in a false meaning.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 5:54 pm
by Hotrod
Orin J. wrote:i'm really more baffled he wants to rewrite new west and austrailia, but canada and atlantas aren't on the chopping block.
It's not that I wouldn't do anything to Canada or Atlantis. The Tundra Rangers would get some revision in Canada (more faction development/history), and the broader book would get more development in general; it seems like a fairly bland product overall with little to make it stand out. Atlantis would get some adjustments, particularly with the True Atlantean section (I'd like more emphasis on the price of the power that comes with being a True Atlantean; it reads like "human, but better in every measurable way).
Those would be edits. What I'd do with New West and Australia would be full-blown rewrites.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:03 pm
by Wise_Owl
Captain_Nibbz wrote:Curbludgeon wrote:I'd get rid of all the racist stuff, and dial back on the stereotypes.
Ok, to open this can of worms, what are the racist stuff and stereotypes that you refer to? I'm finding out more and more lately that I don't notice when something falls into this category and I just kind of accept that it is what it is in the context of the game world without applying it to real world stuff.
I'm just kind of curious to see what there is that I'm not seeing?
Alot of the setting itself is based in a degree of dated middle-America view of the world, but to be very specific; Spirit West has a very specific set of problems going back to the early characterisation of Native Americans. Both in terms of overgeneralization, and in terms of... well just the general portrayel. Pantheons of the Megaverse treats one of the Worlds Largest Religions(Hinduism) as a spot to pilfur for idea's and yet doesn't do the same for the Abrahamic faiths. Gypsies... that's basically a Racial slur, and their use in fiction is deeply derived from 18th and 19th century steroetypes, even the 'postiive' ones. The Africa book is bad in so far as it takes the second largest continent on the planet and basically condenses it to "Their are like tribes and stuff and then these monsters here and here and oh, lets fill a good portion of the book with unrelated stuff about the Four Horsemen of the Apocylpse". To have Africa be the only continent without a resurgent Tech power is beyond bad optics. Hope that helps as simple examples? Alot of these are not necisarily done out of malice, some are products of the original period in which they were produced(Spirit West especially) but others are just uncessary both then and now....
As to the OP's question; I have really broad answers that come down in to how I dealt with Rifts back when I was deeply invested. As a setting Rifts suffers from a number of oddities; for one a very unclear sense of what the state of geopolitics prior to the Cataclysm was, that tends towards making all Rifts politics seem to extend from Politics circa 1988. There are abberancies in this, but yeah, this seriously impacts the setting by making things not always make sense and not giving a clear sense of what came before.
I would give some attention to aspects of sociology and such for major players; The CS is ripe for this sort of stuff. What's the conomy of a Command Economy military state with no major trading partners and an anti-intellectual ideology central to it's existance going to look like? There is alot to develope there, but it doesn't classicaly get done because the Coalition states doesn't exist as an actual state, or even a fictional one, but as a Cartoon Villian.
I would excise almost all of the Western Stuff. While aspects of it were interesting, a whole section of the planet that engages in the steroeyptical behavoir of western movies stretched even my increduality.
Rifts has always been the 'Heavy Metal van' of RPG's, I'd probably lean into that. And I'll admit there are contrasting impulses in my desire for 'Belieable' world-building and following that Gonzo ethos.
As already mentioned Fix up Africa. Develope India, the Middle East the South East Asia. Develope the Orbital Community and the SOlar System a bit more.
Oh... define the 'Tech Level' Paragidm. There was one at the start, but it broke down really quickly, especially in terms of game statistics.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:30 pm
by drewkitty ~..~
Orin J. wrote:i'm really more baffled he wants to rewrite new west and austrailia, but canada and atlantas aren't on the chopping block.
it might not be causal and only happenstance....but
not written by KS: new west and austraili
written by KS: canada and atlantas
I think the four of the 1st 5 that haven't been updated still need an update, even if only to bring them to RUE.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:30 pm
by Captain_Nibbz
Wise_Owl wrote:Captain_Nibbz wrote:Curbludgeon wrote:I'd get rid of all the racist stuff, and dial back on the stereotypes.
Ok, to open this can of worms, what are the racist stuff and stereotypes that you refer to? I'm finding out more and more lately that I don't notice when something falls into this category and I just kind of accept that it is what it is in the context of the game world without applying it to real world stuff.
I'm just kind of curious to see what there is that I'm not seeing?
Alot of the setting itself is based in a degree of dated middle-America view of the world, but to be very specific; Spirit West has a very specific set of problems going back to the early characterisation of Native Americans. Both in terms of overgeneralization, and in terms of... well just the general portrayel. Pantheons of the Megaverse treats one of the Worlds Largest Religions(Hinduism) as a spot to pilfur for idea's and yet doesn't do the same for the Abrahamic faiths. Gypsies... that's basically a Racial slur, and their use in fiction is deeply derived from 18th and 19th century steroetypes, even the 'postiive' ones. The Africa book is bad in so far as it takes the second largest continent on the planet and basically condenses it to "Their are like tribes and stuff and then these monsters here and here and oh, lets fill a good portion of the book with unrelated stuff about the Four Horsemen of the Apocylpse". To have Africa be the only continent without a resurgent Tech power is beyond bad optics. Hope that helps as simple examples? Alot of these are not necisarily done out of malice, some are products of the original period in which they were produced(Spirit West especially) but others are just uncessary both then and now....
This very much helps! Thanks Wise Owl
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 4:59 pm
by jaymz
The Ontario section particularly in Rifts Canada suffers from "I couldn't be bothered to look at a damn map" making the placement and makeup of at least two communities nigh ridiculous, not to mention so unlikely to exist as they are that close to Lazlo as to be stupid, right of the hop.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 5:26 pm
by Library Ogre
I would heavily de-emphasize the number of fascist regimes, and spend more time on the people who opposed them.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 5:42 pm
by jaymz
Mark Hall wrote:I would heavily de-emphasize the number of fascist regimes, and spend more time on the people who opposed them.
And why is that every "good" place seems to have some evil behind it or trying to manipulate it....to the point people want that garbage for Lazlo as well....
Come on not every damn good sized place is going to have secret evil, or secret controllers, or or or or ugh
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:31 pm
by Orin J.
jaymz wrote:Mark Hall wrote:I would heavily de-emphasize the number of fascist regimes, and spend more time on the people who opposed them.
And why is that every "good" place seems to have some evil behind it or trying to manipulate it....to the point people want that garbage for Lazlo as well....
Come on not every damn good sized place is going to have secret evil, or secret controllers, or or or or ugh
and those that do don't mean said "secret evils" are in any way competent or effective. frequently the reverse is true, and the "good" groups are far more effective than the "evil" ones....
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:02 pm
by jaymz
The point being not every major location has to have the damn things. Its over used, predictable trope that I and imo everyone else can do without for once.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 3:17 am
by Zer0 Kay
jaymz wrote:The point being not every major location has to have the damn things. Its over used, predictable trope that I and imo everyone else can do without for once.
So how about a blatant neutral an obvious evil and hidden good giys?
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:45 am
by Hotrod
Zer0 Kay wrote:jaymz wrote:The point being not every major location has to have the damn things. Its over used, predictable trope that I and imo everyone else can do without for once.
So how about a blatant neutral an obvious evil and hidden good giys?
This is something I'd like to see more of in Rifts.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:12 am
by Zer0 Kay
Hotrod wrote:Zer0 Kay wrote:jaymz wrote:The point being not every major location has to have the damn things. Its over used, predictable trope that I and imo everyone else can do without for once.
So how about a blatant neutral an obvious evil and hidden good giys?
This is something I'd like to see more of in Rifts.
That's what I was trying to do with AK.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2021 6:06 pm
by Library Ogre
Perhaps a trifle obvious, but I would severely rework the solar system. The whys and hows that Earth is kept in quarrantine are close to nonsense, and the orbital colonies don't make much in the way of sense.
Re: What would you change?
Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2021 7:14 pm
by Mack
Topic Locked for thread necromancy.