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Look up the the leader of the Juicer Liberation Army in Juicer Uprising and in the War on Tolkien(spelling?) series and Aftermath. He has lived much longer than any other Juicer and though deteriorated, is still kicking.

Maybe not "always victorious" as much as "always survives"...always manages, somehow, against all odds, to emerge from the other side of the battle alive to fight another day, even if it means he's knocked out, carried from the battlefield by others, his horse/ride, or is washed off the battlefield in the river, etc...No matter how much he tries to join his comrades in whatever fate awaits him, fate conspires to make sure he's the one still alive at battle's end.
THAT could earn the guy a rep as a jinx(I remember in one Gundam series, they had a character like that, who earned the nickname 'Reaper' because he always managed to outlive his wingmates, and he HATED what was happening) as much as a good luck charm on the battlefield.

taalismn wrote:Maybe not "always victorious" as much as "always survives"...always manages, somehow, against all odds, to emerge from the other side of the battle alive to fight another day, even if it means he's knocked out, carried from the battlefield by others, his horse/ride, or is washed off the battlefield in the river, etc...No matter how much he tries to join his comrades in whatever fate awaits him, fate conspires to make sure he's the one still alive at battle's end.
THAT could earn the guy a rep as a jinx(I remember in one Gundam series, they had a character like that, who earned the nickname 'Reaper' because he always managed to outlive his wingmates, and he HATED what was happening) as much as a good luck charm on the battlefield.

I think that was in 8th MS team wasn't it?

McBride, I lov ethis idea and may pitch it to my GM.....he is running a CS campaign and this woudl work well for a recurring NPC opponent.

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:

jaymz wrote:

taalismn wrote:Maybe not "always victorious" as much as "always survives"...always manages, somehow, against all odds, to emerge from the other side of the battle alive to fight another day, even if it means he's knocked out, carried from the battlefield by others, his horse/ride, or is washed off the battlefield in the river, etc...No matter how much he tries to join his comrades in whatever fate awaits him, fate conspires to make sure he's the one still alive at battle's end.
THAT could earn the guy a rep as a jinx(I remember in one Gundam series, they had a character like that, who earned the nickname 'Reaper' because he always managed to outlive his wingmates, and he HATED what was happening) as much as a good luck charm on the battlefield.

I think that was in 8th MS team wasn't it?

McBride, I lov ethis idea and may pitch it to my GM.....he is running a CS campaign and this woudl work well for a recurring NPC opponent.

Really? To bad we are not closer how cool would it be for two gaming groups running a CS Campaign to meet up and game a mission together!

Man to be honest that would FRAKIN AWESOME!

NOt only that, with your direction we cold all make out own dress unis and show up IN uniform

Zerebus wrote:You're talking about divine intervention. Yes, by definition they can do this. An especially powerful god can even snap his/her/it's fingers and turn the Juicer into a Demi-God right then and there, the juicer harness falling off harmlessly with no loss of physical attributes.

They can also inflict the curse of not dying, as in the PFRPG Dragons & Gods book. The Juicer would simply not die, no matter how grievous their injury or how much damage their body sustains from the juicer's drugs. They would, however, eventually end up crippled.

EDIT: I do not have my Pantheons book handy, but I know that there was a paragraph about powerful characters, including juicers and even 'borgs, being raised to the level of demi-god even though they may not follow the demi-god RCC.

The curse is not the way to go, as it increases the natural lifespan of a species, and doesn't do a thing about injury. A juicer has an altered, and much shorter lifespan, because the conversion eventually burns out the juicer's body. So a juicer with the Curse of Imortallity would still go through their Last Call when they were suppossed to, and would turn into a pile of goo or something (I don't really know what, but I know I don't want to step in it).

Lucky wrote:

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:Really? To bad we are not closer how cool would it be for two gaming groups running a CS Campaign to meet up and game a mission together!

Your GM's can still bump heads together, and the two "sister" commands may end up supporting each other indirectly, one recon'ing for the other, end up speaking with one another over the radio... maybe falling into the other's abandoned fighting positions for a night's bivouac.

"Oh look, somebody left a porno in my foxhole!"

Sadly our game nights may not be consistent enough to that

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:

Zerebus wrote:You're talking about divine intervention. Yes, by definition they can do this. An especially powerful god can even snap his/her/it's fingers and turn the Juicer into a Demi-God right then and there, the juicer harness falling off harmlessly with no loss of physical attributes.

They can also inflict the curse of not dying, as in the PFRPG Dragons & Gods book. The Juicer would simply not die, no matter how grievous their injury or how much damage their body sustains from the juicer's drugs. They would, however, eventually end up crippled.

EDIT: I do not have my Pantheons book handy, but I know that there was a paragraph about powerful characters, including juicers and even 'borgs, being raised to the level of demi-god even though they may not follow the demi-god RCC.

Ok, thats what I was looking for. I am thinking about creating a character npc. Along the lines of extended life not true immortality, the fact is he feels cursed by the gods and has no real reason to live. But every time he jumps into combat to die with guns a blazing he always comes out the victor for some reason his luck just wont let him die like a warrior. The gods see it as a gift, he sees it as a curse...I mean there are more details that's just a rough outline.

Kraitos?

Maybe have Dionysus or the Indian god Soma(definately a god of juicers if there ever was one)intervene? Maybe as a experiment?

Or even the Babylonian Mummu.

Or a whole different direction, have one of the gods of death(Hdes, Hel, Yama, Horseman Death) etc, step in. Some juicers have come to worship death, so maybe these beings take notice.

What does *GOD* need with a Death's Head Transport?

Sheesh.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYW_lPlekiQ

Kalidor wrote:Sheesh.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYW_lPlekiQ

Yeah, that still doesn't help us figure out your point here, as no one said anything about a DHT.

Laux the Ogre wrote:

The Beast wrote:The curse is not the way to go, as it increases the natural lifespan of a species, and doesn't do a thing about injury. A juicer has an altered, and much shorter lifespan, because the conversion eventually burns out the juicer's body. So a juicer with the Curse of Imortallity would still go through their Last Call when they were suppossed to, and would turn into a pile of goo or something (I don't really know what, but I know I don't want to step in it).

No, otherwise Elves and TAs would have the same lifespan as regular juicers.

Uh, compared to un-juiced elves and TAs they have a shortened lifespan.

My point is I was just making a joke based on the thread title.

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:Awwww...but if a god has the power to do so. Then in theory the spell its self is modifying the human body, nervous system and organs to further withstand the stress created on the body and internal organs by the chemicals in the Juicers system. And technically the definition of immortality is "Immortality (or eternal life) is the concept of living in a physical or spiritual form for an infinite or inconceivably vast length of time." So that being said, if a Juicer was given Immortality his body would always be able to withstand the Juicer side effects. IMO Someone who is truly Immortal can not be Blown up, Shot, Stabbed, Run Over, Operated on, Poisoned, Suffocate, Implode, Nuked..ect..ect...But then again. The definition of Immortality is left open to interpretation as well.

it is at approximately this point that i recommend you say "shut up rules, you're getting in my way", and make up something that fits your campaign. this is not 4th edition D&D, this is rifts. you are allowed to change rules and use your imagination here.

for the record, you may wish to look up the heroes unlimited mega-hero if you're looking for rules you can swipe, though... i think they've got something along the lines of what you're looking for. and hey, if some wacky scientist could theoretically grant that super power, i'm sure a deity-level being must be able to grant that super power somehow as well.

Kalidor wrote:What does *GOD* need with a Death's Head Transport?

A means of carrying His golf clubs or sandwiches?

A Greater or Lesser God could exstened a mortal life any number of years they want. A Godling might be able to do it, but a demi-god just has some god liniage not the powerers of a god so I'd say that they could not effect a mortal in such a way.

Laux the Ogre wrote:

The Beast wrote:

Laux the Ogre wrote:

The Beast wrote:The curse is not the way to go, as it increases the natural lifespan of a species, and doesn't do a thing about injury. A juicer has an altered, and much shorter lifespan, because the conversion eventually burns out the juicer's body. So a juicer with the Curse of Imortallity would still go through their Last Call when they were suppossed to, and would turn into a pile of goo or something (I don't really know what, but I know I don't want to step in it).

No, otherwise Elves and TAs would have the same lifespan as regular juicers.

Uh, compared to un-juiced elves and TAs they have a shortened lifespan.

But compared to juiced-humans it isn't. If you increase the natural lifespan of a juicer aren't you also increasing his/her time 'til "Last Call"? Looks that way in the books....

No, because the juicer conversion isn't a natural process.

SImple.

Have the Juicer undergo (Cold-Blooded) Transformation. Specially if a Titan Juicer.
Now the are Quasi-Undead Beings. Their SDC/HP are combined to become MDC (Titan Juicers rock).
They gain great Healing Powers as a result of the process. Bury them in the ground and they return to life if killed ... Almost truely Immortal.

Cold-Blooded can be found in the Mercenaries Adventures sourcebook. Great OCC idea.

You could Pretend to be a Juicer with a fake Juicer hanrness and most people wont know the difference. Someone would need Juicer Lore to know your not a juicer.

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:No its not, but what is being said is this. By the god increasing the life span of the juicer he is not increasing just the Juicers natural life span as a human. I am talking about repairing damaged organs, nervous system and anything else the Juicer process has basically done damage too. Then increasing his life span and the durability of the said juicers body by X amount of year or until the god gets bored with him.. lol

The curse doesn't grant any special healing powers, therefore you still die at the normal juicer rate.

I would say we take this a step further. It is actually presented in Pantheons of the Megaverse that a DEMIGOD can become a Juicer (If my memory serves me correctly, that is). How this is even remotely possible I have no freakin idea, since Demigods are Supernatural Creatures... Anyway, moving on.

Have a God Elevate your NPC to the status of a Demigod. Demigods have a lifespan of... what? 1000 years? If that's so, let's break this down to a mathematical formula.

Let's say the lifespan of your average human being on RIFTS Earth is... 60 years.

Most Juicers live 5-7 years before burning out. Okay, we'll settle on 6 for a nice, round, middle number.

6/60 = 1/10

That's a 90% decrease in lifespan. So we'll use the same basic formula for that of ALL juicers, regardless of race (This could be argued left and right, in my opinion. I know this. You know this. But let's just assume that there is a standard rate).

That means that we'll take 90% of the Demigods lifespan go STRAIGHT down the drain.

That means you're new Demigod Juicer NPC has a lifespan of 100 years. The major downfall I see to this is that many juicers spend the last one or two years of their lifespan going through "Last Call". Which means, your new NPC will spend the last 15-30 years SUFFERING through Last Call.

That's just SICK

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:

Johnathan wrote:
That means you're new Demigod Juicer NPC has a lifespan of 100 years. The major downfall I see to this is that many juicers spend the last one or two years of their lifespan going through "Last Call". Which means, your new NPC will spend the last 15-30 years SUFFERING through Last Call.

That's just SICK

Ok lets put it this way. Can a god Cure a Juicer of Last Call? Restoring any damage done to Internal Organs, Nervous System..ect..ect by the Chemicals to a state like it was before the Juicer underwent the Juicer Conversion?

I say yes since afterall this IS a god that is doing it not some godling underling....

Ultimately, with your question being posed in this fashion, I would say it was within a God's power to accomplish this. Some sort of Deific Restoration, as it was. Many Gods are capable of bring the dead back to life and Juicers are often referred to as Dead Men, due to their short life span.

So sure. Why not, right?

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:Im not going off of a curse listed in the book....

Then why are you wasting my time?

If you go back to my original post here I was responding to something that Zerebus had said about the Deific Curse: Confer Imortallity power. At no point did I say that a god couldn't grant imortallity to a juicer, just that the deific curse wasn't the way you want to go about doing that (that is unless a juicer really ticked off a god).

I still say Cold-Blooded is the way to go.

God Tricks the Juicer into becoming a Cold-Blooded. Tells the Juicer this will Cure him of the damage done to him while undergoing Detox at the same time. That the "cold-blood" will place him into a healing sleep.

This way the Juicer will "Willingly" volenteer (a requirement), but be tricked into a new existance as a Cold-blooded Super-Soldier.

Also.
A Cold-Blooded Foe can keep reoccurring in the story as long as the group knows nothing about Cold-Bloodeds. I'd require a special Lore Skill to know things about them. Lore Cold-Blooded.

Not that I want to get this topic off track or anything. But I actually had to dig up the Cold-Blooded R.C.C. just to figure out what the heck it was. And it dawned on me... the process would not work on Juicers. Well... It would work, but the Juicer would have to detox first and would probably not get all of their awesome Juicer bonuses after becoming a Cold-Blooded.

But then again, they wouldn't need it either.

Anyway! Mcbride! I have another long-shot solution to your problem. Allow your God to empower your Juicer character with two super abilities. One major. One minor. Regeneration Ultima. This would force your Juicer's body to continually repair the damage done to it... at the frightening level of 2d6 a melee round (the same as a Vampire). This would rapidly heal ALL damage done to them, even drug-induced damage as the healing is non-selective about WHAT it heals. It just heals EVERYTHING. And Also impart upon the minor power of Longevity. The Juicer won't live forever. However, with this combination of powers, your NPC could live for many years longer than a normal Juicer. I would say... 25-30 years total.

Johnathan wrote:Not that I want to get this topic off track or anything. But I actually had to dig up the Cold-Blooded R.C.C. just to figure out what the heck it was. And it dawned on me... the process would not work on Juicers. Well... It would work, but the Juicer would have to detox first and would probably not get all of their awesome Juicer bonuses after becoming a Cold-Blooded.

But then again, they wouldn't need it either.

Anyway! Mcbride! I have another long-shot solution to your problem. Allow your God to empower your Juicer character with two super abilities. One major. One minor. Regeneration Ultima. This would force your Juicer's body to continually repair the damage done to it... at the frightening level of 2d6 a melee round (the same as a Vampire). This would rapidly heal ALL damage done to them, even drug-induced damage as the healing is non-selective about WHAT it heals. It just heals EVERYTHING. And Also impart upon the minor power of Longevity. The Juicer won't live forever. However, with this combination of powers, your NPC could live for many years longer than a normal Juicer. I would say... 25-30 years total.

Juicers could go for the Muder-Wraith conversion though...

Considering what a huge deviation that is from what the person wants to accomplish, I consider it a fairly moot point. YES, it's possible. A Juicer could attain a sort of quasi-immortality by turning themselves into Undead Murder-Wraiths.

However, there is still the simple fact that the NPC McBride is looking to create isn't going to be an Undead, isn't going to submit to the Murder-Wraith or Cold-Blooded processes and for all intents and purposes HATES the fact that he keeps LIVING but is too CHICKEN **** to put a laser pistol to his temple and just pull the trigger.

Why then, in all logical reasoning, would his NPC submit themself to the Murder-Wraith process...? So he can die... be reborn... and then go walk into the sun to incinerate himself?

Simple answer for NPCs is simple.

PLOT DEVICE

A God uses his Diety-powers to make the Juicer truely Immortal.
Why does not matter. This can revealed in time if ever.
How does not matter. Chalk it up to an unrevealed Deity power of certain Gods.
Maybe a Whole Pantheon has decided this Juicer is worthy or guilty enough to warrent such a Boon/curse. That they all bring him brought him back to life for a purpose.

Go. Go out a play "clash of the titan the remake" and enjoy yourself.

I still say the god Soma is the best bet. A god of drugs> Perfect for Juicers. MAybe put some of his soma potion in the drug harness.

I'd be surprised if Soma didn't have demi-god juicers as minions.

Forget Soma. Loki.

"But All-Father, I did a good deed for the human! See how he no longer finds himself fated to die after so short a life! Is it my fault, then, that the mortal is mad enough to welcome the embrace of his own demise? Woe that I had not bargained with greater powers, that I had not made the enchantment so strong e'en I can not break it! For surely, this must be like a Hell to him, and I had no intention to inflict such a thing. I merely wished to perform a good service unto him, as you yourself are always behooving me to do, yes?"

And then he goes home and laughs his Asgardian butt off for two straight hours. Worse, he gets bored quickly, and being a god, plain forgets the mortal in question.

nah. i doubt loki forgets his jokes.

he's probably got a remarkably selective memory, but i doubt he has a bad memory

Man I hope your block lifts. That's a great sounding background! Question. Are we talking a standard Conversion, or one of the variants? Just currious...

the will of his people not to see him die

a Group of magic using followers on the JLA are secretly casting the Restortion invocation on him whenever they get a chance. the restortion spell is one of the most powerful healing magics there is, healing the damage/stress that the juicer augmdentaion is having on his body, delaying the onset of "Last Call". Unfortunatly they didn't start casting it until after he was past the point of Juicer no return, so the spell is not as effective as it once was. the conflict beween the magic and the juicer chemicals is what is currently slowly crippling him.

Col. McBride Tyson wrote:I gotta question, could theoretically a god/demigod who is impressed with a Juicer and impressed with the Juicers abilities, skills and fortitude grant him the gift of living longer then a typical Juicer say 30+ more years from the date he starts last call? I have one hell of an Idea for an NPC, and I understand House Rules, bla bla bla. I am talking the gods as they are presented in the Pantheon Book. I have a copy of the Pantheon book but someone borrowed it and I do not have the book on hand to flip through right now.

The gods might allow it, but I wouldn't want to be part of any group where the GM lets it happen

Johnathan wrote:I would say we take this a step further. It is actually presented in Pantheons of the Megaverse that a DEMIGOD can become a Juicer (If my memory serves me correctly, that is). How this is even remotely possible I have no freakin idea, since Demigods are Supernatural Creatures... Anyway, moving on.

They can become Maxi-Killers. You can be MD to start with and become a Maxi-Killer. Otherwise gargoyles and brodkil couldn't become them, and they can.

Have a God Elevate your NPC to the status of a Demigod. Demigods have a lifespan of... what? 1000 years? If that's so, let's break this down to a mathematical formula.

I thought their lifespan was unlimited to start. I thought godlings had one of 50,000 years. *shrug*

/Sub

They could hypothetically within the rules as written become juicers...it'd just negate their powers (if one follows that option). As such, Maxi-Killer is fully available.

/Sub