'Artistic License" Or What you change

[Cinos]

So, while my usual stint is dissecting probability and harping on rules, I figured, aside as a diversion through insomnia, a good change of pace is in order! If nothing else hopefully get a thread going so there's just more then Remus stealing the show

The basic question is this; In your PF games, what do you change or add (so Old Kingdom / South Wind / left field stuff) to make the world yours? This can be things you do commonly, to things you've done just for a single game that you think is note worthy.

For the duration of this discussion, try to limit it to the effects within the Palladium Fantasy world, and if relevant to that, if you include out of setting things, or consider it a 'closed universe'.

To open, I'll rant a bit about my own changes; First noting that I do consider Palladium (and any game but Rifts) to be a closed Universe, and bar off the majority of things that are included in those. While I don't feel this changes anything on the mundane scale, it really shifts things like the Minion War, the big scale of Gods viewpoints, and things like that (and to say the least of Summoners).

The first I've changed is 'big picture' stuff, how magic works, and the Age of Chaos information (What can I say, I like ancient evils). Magic, that is to say, P.P.E, is not fueled by belif or faith for me, and an incantation with the proper energy and incantation will work, faith in it or not (With mystics being the exception to a level). Further more, I cut out the connection between Psionic Powers and Mystical Powers, and they exist as entirely separate things (though the term P.P.E of course is now a bit confusing). Rather then being a psudo-mental power, I've come to assign P.P.E more as a by-product of souls. While the presence of a soul will assuredly mark the presence of P.P.E, a thing (or place) could have P.P.E without a soul (such as animate constructs, some entities, magical items, stored energy, Ley Lines). However, it is common to find both together, and an abundance of P.P.E can create sort of a Mock Soul, things like Ghosts, Entities, and long lived magical creations, but these tend to be more 'quirks' rather then true souls or identities, and do not have an afterlife awaiting for them, nor have the assured mark of a soul of the 'survival burst', a surge of power when near death (the cause of doubling P.P.E at the time of termination is the energy used to keep the soul in place is suddenly released, peaceful deaths, and other non-sudden deaths don't see as large of a burst as a fierce end, this addition was more a stylistic choice, it promotes one from a game play mechanic to go that extra evil mile and seek painful deaths for sacrifices).

Of course when tampering with big picture stuff, one has to at least brush over gods! I've removed the 'created by people' aspect, and the ties that connect them to worshipers in that way, and they are their own, independent entity. But why you ask, do they want worship? While they don't get P.P.E, they are simply empowered through their worshipers in a more direct way, and begin to transcend laws of reality as they attract more worship (This, by the way, was expanded to all beings, assuming they get enough worshipers and personal will power, even after opening this option to players, no player of mine has yet to pull it off). In addition to this, anyone devoted to a god, with enough personal will (which can be seen as many things, direct level and 'in game' power, story driven things, ME, whatever), their souls can transcend into new forms of being, such as devotee's to Ra becoming Ra-Men, to Set becoming Taunt-Tauns, to the Devil lords, Imps, Ghouls, or what ever (Demons are unique in this, mortals perishing in Hades, as well as those not given proper burial / rites, can become demons even against their will). While you may say this will never effect a group of adventurers, you are largely right. But it can radically effect the world around them, and gives good reason for things to happen the way they happen, why Demons are intent on plunder and devastation, why gods and devil lords seek worship, and where these mythical beings come from.

One of the honestly largest changes to this big picture stuff is the Angelic Orders. Because I tend to think most good guys who are good guys for the sake of needing a good guy are dull, and this is largely what the angels presented in book are. They don't have a noted motive other then "I hate evil dood!", I've added an entire motivation for them, and largely it removes them as 'good' guys, and puts them at a moral grey state. Basically, there are arcane laws set into reality by Xy (In theory) when reality got the jump start. They where added to over time by him during the age of chaos as he (and his kin) created races and worlds to their own ends. These laws are both directly physical ones, gravity, starvation, kenetic energy, but also include arcane laws, what invocations break what physical laws, what components will be 'acceptable' for a ritual, the enforcement of True Name Laws, and binding contracts of the soul, down to a few other laws, such as the Law of Family Blood. Based a bit on old myths (Largely Greek), that it is cursed to shed the blood of your family (A law by the Greeks enforced by the Furies). It is the bound duty of the Angelic orders to evenly enforce these laws as per their own rules, those found in violation are punished, or denied the attempt. Lokum is the first among their order for punishment to those who found 'loop holes' or outright broken them, while Tabo is the adjudicator over altering or clarifying them, and dictating who has violated them. This removes the innate conflict between the Angels and most 'hordes of darkness', forces of light, such as Ra, must conduct their efforts without the limitless winged legions, unless they can find violations in these laws, and lobbies to amend some things (one of 'recent' years, about 15,000 years old, was that Demon and Devil kind may not summon their own kin outside of their realms, and are now forced to use mortals for that end). What's more, is it gives reason for Angels not to swoop in and save the day when there's trouble (which is a logical problem if they are super good guys and super powerful, now they're apathetic at worst, and bureaucratic at best, or rather, at worst ). For those saying ah-ha, but you've now created your own logical problem because it's clearly cannon the angels aided in the over throw of the Old Ones. And I slap your hands and tell you to re-read some of the 'laws' and that I labeled Xy and the others as Kin. To expound on that, this also makes all Angels direct servants of Xy, who are still very loyal in their own way to him, which allows them to become antagonistic against a party of good guys in that regard, and reasons for the good guy gods to not be on completely even terms with the angels given their 'loyalist' ideals, and motions to hide or cover up details through mortal hands to them, and adds internal conflict to these good guys who otherwise are just in agreement with each other (And conflict is always story and RP gold mines, or silver at the least).

/looks at wall of text, then time. Well I guess that's enough outta me for now. Going to go see if this insomnia has worn off yet and end with DISCUSS! Or rather, smash out pages of your own changes and personal viewpoints on the setting and what you've done with it.

[Severus Snape]

For starters, in my games PF is a closed universe. No rifting, no super powers, no zentraedi coming to take over the planet. While megaversal crossovers can and do happen (and are even encouraged), I feel that it doesn't make much sense to have a dwarven fighter trying to go up against a full conversion cyborg. I guess you could say that as god of the world, I kinda use the prime directive when it comes to other-worldy beings coming to PF.

The second (and probably most important) change I've made is related to the undead. Or, more accurately, the multiple changes I've made to the undead:

1. The undead do not have hit points. Hit points are, as common knowledge has told all of us gamers since the early days of gaming, life essence points. Or, more accurately, the amount of life you have in you. Someone with 1 hit point is near death, while someone with 80 hit points would be vibrant and healthy. And the undead don't have any life essence. They have SDC only. With one exception, that being vampires (feeding on blood gives them an inherited sense of life essence).

2. Not all undead are supernatural creatures. Especially those created by magic, such as skeletons or zombies. Again, some are (such as vampires or mummies, due to their nature), but not all are.

3. Once destroyed, the undead do NOT come back to life. So that means if you kill a group of zombies, they aren't going to be up and walking around 24 hours later. Same goes for mummies, vampires, spectres, and all other undead except in extremely rare cases.

Can you tell that I've got a problem with the undead as presented in PFRPG?

[Cinos]

To be honest very little is changed in my games from the books.
I only change the AR rule becuase I hate the way it works as written. Armor AR works like natural AR and it (armor) only takes damage if the roll is high enough to beat it's AR.

Pressed for time so I'll reply to some others later, but pointing this out; This is a rules change, not a story / setting change. Don't get me on a rules rant here! Though I agree on the basis of 'rules not working' though disagree on the route taken, drop me a PM if you want to have a back and forth on the why's.

I largely agree with the changes two of you had to undead, I'm looking down the barrel of re-writing Vamps for my games, removing the already standard removal of HP for undead, but leaving it for Vamps is interesting. But again, this is a -rules- change, not a -lore- change.

Smashed; you and I see LoD in much the same light as to who runs that show.

[Cinos]

Yeah I am aware it is a rules change, and not story. For the most part I do make all vamps the product of Vald-Tegoor (think I spelled that wrong) and not some other V.I. and I have worked on small things dealing with his realm.

That's the stuff I'm trying to drum! Another change I've also done, mainly because I'm not actually all too thrilled with Vampire Intellegences as a whole. They work in Rifts just fine, but don't seem to fit right in Fantasy all that well to me, even more so after I've sealed the setting off from other settings, limiting the point of origin of VI's so heavily. Vlad-Tregor if I recall though, not at my place, so D&G isn't at hand.

But come now! Reasons and rational chaps! That's the heart of discussion! This the PF forums, where paragraph posts are the norm! I'm sure you fellows have more then that to say.

[Cinos]

If focusing simply on rule changes I have a handful. How attacks per melee work and magic... in general.

<Slaps hands and takes away keyboard>

I'm shouting at people who post rules changes I AN'T LOOKING TO TALK ABOUT RULE CHANGES. Man, I talk about them all the time, so I guess I have this coming. LORE changes, Fluff, story, setting, all that fun stuff. Just set the rules aside for a moment.

[JuliusCreed]

The only real change I've made to the world was to turn Ophid's Grasslands from a tundra type land with small scattered bands of goblinoids and humans into a sort of steppes type land dominated by tribes/bands of horse lords. Kind of a combination of the Riders of Rohan mixed with Atilla the Hun. This makes the Western Empire a bit more leery of expanding into the region, but rumors of the horse lords are trickling into the Wolfen Empire from Kankoran scouts and Coyle hordes in the western regoins of the Northern Wilderness. Long term plans could be made for alliances between the Wolfen and the horse lords if the rumors persist long enough for the Empire to take notice.
The culture of the horse lords is largely based off of the Huns of ancient times (and heavilly influenced by the movie "Atilla" starring Gerard Butler, an excellent flick by the way. I highly reccommend it) A few OCC's have been bouncing through my head to flesh the land out a bit more, mostly odd combinations of Knights/Palladins and Nomadic Tribesmen, but nothing concrete as yet. Commerce is a simple barter system between the indigenous peoples and while gold, silver and jewels do have value among them, it is more as a novelty item thing for them than a form of currency. Real value for these people lies in the essentials of life; food, water, weapons and good horses. Gold is just that shiny yellow metal that the tribe's chief has a pretty statue made of. Silver is that stuff that those strange 'civilized folks from the East' use as utensils to eat with. And jewels are those sparkly things that the chief has decorating the hilt of his sword. The people of the east and south may find it valuable, but if all it does is look pretty, it has no real use to the people of Ophid's Grasslands.
Besides being horse masters, the tribes of Ophid's Grasslands are also quite proficient archers, particularly with the Short Bow and a modified Short Bow called a Horse Bow used by mounted archers. About 30-50% smaller than a standard short bow, the Horse Bow is constructed with several layers of laminated hardwood. This method is employed for two reasons; First, because of the scarcity of materials. Trees are hard to come by in the Grasslands and when they are encountered they are often gnarled and scraggely growths, barely reaching 10-15 feet in height. (Picture the Tree of Woe from Conan the Barbarian. Perfect example) Second, the method of construction actually results in a very strong bow that is actually more powerful than it looks, doing damage equal to a standard short bow and having nearly the same range. The greatest advantage of the Horse Bow is its ease of use from horseback, capable of being fired from horseback without the usual penalties, even at a full gallop. Rarely found outside of Ophid's Grasslands, a Horse Bow costs about 25-45 gold depending on the seller. Arrows will cost between 5-15 gold. Getting one of these bows in Ophid's Grasslands could very well cost the buyer his horse depending on the reputation of the bow's maker. Master bow makers are highly revered and often hold important positions within their tribe.

[Cinos]

Changing Ophids into a step land is interesting, as well as the political climate that could be changed by having a prevalent and credible military threat. I could see many nations trying to get contacts with them, if nothing else but to harasser and keep the West in check for their northern growth (Byzantium would have a particular vested interest in that). I would ask what the Wests interest to deal with the barbarians would be then? Given that step land is not great farmland without immense work and time, and that they're already in a conflict to the south over the jungle there (which if I recall, is being waged over gem stocks there).

[JuliusCreed]

Changing Ophids into a step land is interesting, as well as the political climate that could be changed by having a prevalent and credible military threat. I could see many nations trying to get contacts with them, if nothing else but to harasser and keep the West in check for their northern growth (Byzantium would have a particular vested interest in that). I would ask what the Wests interest to deal with the barbarians would be then? Given that step land is not great farmland without immense work and time, and that they're already in a conflict to the south over the jungle there (which if I recall, is being waged over gem stocks there).

I have the Western Empire seeing the horse lords of the grasslands as nothing more than uncivilized barbarians and, by comparison, they are. Currently they are being viewed as a non-threat, but they are still worth keeping an eye on, especially when it comes to any relations they have with other political entities. (The recent HBO series "Game of Thrones" was a particularly inspired influence on the political viewpoints) Basically, the barbarian hordes are considered no threat to the Western Empire at the moment due to the fact that they have no way of invading the Empire directly because of a lack of seaworthy ships to do so. (At best, the barbarians have small fishing boats) They also have a distinct lack of decent weapons, particularly anything made with iron or steel. Not that you won't find swords or daggers among these people. They're just very rare and usually not very high on the quality scale. An ambitious (and charismatic) enough leader with the right technology (ie; ships and high quality weapons) could change that and turn the attentions of the Empire to a very real threat of thousands of screaming barbarians armed with decent weapons charging the gates with a bloodthirsty vengeance. Topping that scenario off is the fact that each of the 'barbarian' warriors is, in many ways, the equal of a soldier, if not a knight or palladin, when it comes to their preferred method of combat, that being from horseback. Until the barbarians acquire ships however, the Empire maintains a cautious eye on the hordes and the contacts they make with other peoples.
The biggest saving grace the people of the Grasslands have in staying under the Empire's radar is the fact that their existence is still relatively obscure. This is compounded by the fact that they maintain a nomadic lifestyle and have very few permanent dwellings or villages and nothing that could even be considered a major city making them extremely difficult to establish, much less maintain, any kind of political relations with. Encounters with outsiders is intentionally kept to a minimum by these people due to fear and distrust, very much like the ancient Aztecs when the Spanish arrived, or the Native Americans when the Europeans landed. The only outsiders they really have any kind of contact with are wandering scouts from neighboring areas, particularly Kankoran from the Wolfen Empire, skirmishers of the Coyle hordes and infiltrators from the Western Empire, along with wandering traders, trappers, ambitious merchant caravans and adventurers who just happen to come across them in their travels.

[JuliusCreed]

That's a great take on the Ophid Grasslands. Definitely going to make me rethink how I run that area in the future. Have you established what relationship the horse lords (I'm assuming they are a humanoid horse riding culture) have with the centaur tribes? Are they hostile? Tolerant of one another? Part of the same tribe?

The horse lords are indeed humans, yes. Their relationship with the centaurs of the region I've gone back and forth with in my various campaigns.
On one hand, the centaurs are seen as living representatives of horse lord gods/angels, being the ultimate representation of the horse lord ideal relationship between a man and his horse. The centaurs enjoy an elevated status with the horse lords, often holding positions of power and prestige among them as warrior champions, high priests, master craftsmen and even occassionally tribe chieftan.
In another campaign, I have the horse lords and centaurs in a roller coaster rivalry, bickering and even occassionally going to war over the usual tribal reasons, primarily territorial borders, established hunting grounds, water rights and so on. The conflicts between them range anywhere between brutal Olymic styled games of showmanship to see whose tribe has the superior hunters, the better archers, the faster scouts, etc. all the way up to full scale wars between tribal units. Of course these wars are usually limited to one or two major battles and a handful of skirmishes between the warring bands before things simmer down and the respective winners and losers go about their regular lives. While barbaric, the people of this land are pragmatic. War is wasteful. Whoever loses the most warriors after a few battles pretty much has to pull back and admit defeat in order to survive. The winners often just take their spoils and enjoy their elevated status and prosperous times that come from having larger hunting areas and control over more lands. Rarely does a band set out for simple conquest. The idea is pretty much alien to them. Their lives are difficult enough with just basic survival in this harsh environment. Why complicate matters and waste lives and resources trying to figure out who should be in charge of everybody in the region? Not that it hasn't been tried, mind you. It's just when it has been tried, the other lords of the area usually get wind of it and temporarily band together to remind the would-be conquerer of the fierce independence the tribes like to enjoy.

[Blindscout]

Setting wise I don't really change all that much. I make topographical changes, the Shattered Mountains are taller, the continent itself is larger. I add in villages/towns/cities as I see need for them. I fill in blank spots, more than anything else.

[Cinos]

If focusing simply on rule changes I have a handful. How attacks per melee work and magic... in general.

<Slaps hands and takes away keyboard>

I'm shouting at people who post rules changes I AN'T LOOKING TO TALK ABOUT RULE CHANGES. Man, I talk about them all the time, so I guess I have this coming. LORE changes, Fluff, story, setting, all that fun stuff. Just set the rules aside for a moment.

Gah! Confusion setting in! I misread a comment you made earlier that led me to think you were looking for rule changes. Now I kneel here and humbly beg your forgiveness great Cinos. I would also like my keyboard back

Very well. I am magnanimous if nothing else. Lesson learned! Surely someone so eager to jump the gun on rules changes has settings changes to add!

/cautiously gives the keyboard back with a wary eye.

[Cinos]

Very well. I am magnanimous if nothing else. Lesson learned! Surely someone so eager to jump the gun on rules changes has settings changes to add!

/cautiously gives the keyboard back with a wary eye.

LAIR!!!

Ok, you got me.

[Cinos]

LAIR!!!

Ok, you got me.

In his setting he is magnanimous... it's one of his changes

In the words of Muldoon; Clever girl.

[Eryk Stormbright]

In my PF games i've made a whole new continent with a hidden history from the rest of the world. back at the end of the Chaos War when the Old Ones were put to sleep, one of them just happened to be on this continent when the spell hit it and as he was going down, legend has it that it put a curse on the land, shutting down most of the lay lines that went to it, and forever changing most of the topography of the land, and it's people. Where its body landed, a mountain range was formed, but instead of normal rock mountains, this range was made of Crystal. those who live near the range have very powerful Psionics. most people(even some types of plants and animals) are major and Master Psionics. Magic users are considered second class compaired to everyone else. Now... the reason why no one has found this "new land" is because it's like a Phase Town in Rifts, there are only afew ways to get there from the main land. there are new O.C.C.s and R.C.C.s i've made, people at the last Open House seemed to like them