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I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

*shrug*

I treat him as a heretofore unknown Atlantean. That gives him a much longer lifespan as a Juicer of any stripe.

Hell, make him an Atlantean with a Mutants in Orbit conversion and he'd live a pretty damned long time.

/Sub

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Well, in the Aftermath fluff i've read, even Julian seems to be unsure as to why he's not dead. Could be anything.

There are alot of gentic material floating around rifts earth its possible that his parents were partialy mutants from the rifts with an extremely human appearance.
Godly intervention.
Uti chip previusly mentioned.
Clones.
Archie robot that is programed to think himself mortal.
Ect.

Or perhaps it is just a favored NPC who the powers that be decided would not die.

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Read more about him in either the Siege On Tolkeen series or Rifts: Aftermath.

He never got the Phoenix Chip at all, and the reasons for his continued survival into PA 109 remain an open-ended mystery (although the authors themselves imply to the reader that he will go out in the proverbial blaze of glory [also literally in Julian's case as a Mega-Juicer] while leading refugees out of Tolkeen.

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Read more about him in either the Siege On Tolkeen series or Rifts: Aftermath.

He never got the Phoenix Chip at all, and the reasons for his continued survival into PA 109 remain an open-ended mystery (although the authors themselves imply to the reader that he will go out in the proverbial blaze of glory [also literally in Julian's case as a Mega-Juicer] while leading refugees out of Tolkeen.

I've not read anywhere that he did or did not get the phoenix chip. I'm simply proposing a reason for this continued longevity based on the information in SoT and Aftermath. I'm also proposing a further adventure idea to supplement the juicer uprising and re-introduce the Vallax aliens.

It's not hard to imagine that the mega-juicer process triggered some latent mutation that activated the power of Longevity or Immortality in Julian allowing him to survive longer than the normal juicer. Science-fiction and comics are rife with characters who end up developing super-powers from far less than what a juicer of any variety undergoes, so Julian was just lucky enough that he had the genetics that lined up with the juicer process he underwent (just like some dragon juicers are able to actually get an extended lifespan from consuming raw dragon's blood which shouldn't be possible).

I think the idea is that we don't know why. Maybe he *DID* get the Vallax chip and didn't know it. Maybe he had a few gallons of Chichen Itza water. *shrug*

/Sub

Personally, I go with that he got a critical roll on the length of his juicer life. By that I mean that he's just lucked out and has lived longer than could be expected, and is likely to die at any time. Maybe his impants got jazzed by a ley line storm, or maybe they uniquely match his particular body. I'd rather keep it a mundane reason than a fantastical one. Regardless, he's a dead man walking.

Mack wrote:Personally, I go with that he got a critical roll on the length of his juicer life. By that I mean that he's just lucked out and has lived longer than could be expected, and is likely to die at any time. Maybe his impants got jazzed by a ley line storm, or maybe they uniquely match his particular body. I'd rather keep it a mundane reason than a fantastical one. Regardless, he's a dead man walking.

Mack we're talking Rifts, a fantasy kitchen sink, the idea that Julian was turned into a mutant or was unknowingly a mutant before becoming a mega-juicer is just as mundane as anything else (and jazzing by a ley line storm doesn't sound particularly mundane).

Julian is so impressive that an undisclosed deific power has tapped him and is currently testing him. They might reveal themselves to him in time, if he proves himself worthy, or he might fall short and... well... boom.

Gryphon wrote:Hell, he could have been a human mutant with immortality for all we know. Your only going to get to live for 10% of your projected lifespan Julian...that works out to being 800+ years or so...

a mutant with immortality has an infinite lifespan. 10% of infinity is infinity. however the mutant power of immortality comes with immunity to poisons and drugs, so the juicer conversion would not have worked period.

Gryphon wrote:Sorry, I was thinking Marvel, where you get immorality as thousands of years. Though I swear there was something similar somewhere in Palladium...the Unlimited setting maybe?

There is, and I quoted it to you. you get infinite lifespan and are immune to poisons, toxins, drugs, and radiation

Now if he had the minor power of longevity, his lifespan would be about double the healthy lifespan of a human, so he'd live for about twice as long as a normal mega juicer.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:

Gryphon wrote:Sorry, I was thinking Marvel, where you get immorality as thousands of years. Though I swear there was something similar somewhere in Palladium...the Unlimited setting maybe?

There is, and I quoted it to you. you get infinite lifespan and are immune to poisons, toxins, drugs, and radiation

I think he's saying something with an actual lifespan but not unlimited.

IIRC, Godlings get that...50K year lifespan.

/Sub

Subjugator wrote:

Nekira Sudacne wrote:

Gryphon wrote:Sorry, I was thinking Marvel, where you get immorality as thousands of years. Though I swear there was something similar somewhere in Palladium...the Unlimited setting maybe?

There is, and I quoted it to you. you get infinite lifespan and are immune to poisons, toxins, drugs, and radiation

I think he's saying something with an actual lifespan but not unlimited.

IIRC, Godlings get that...50K year lifespan.

/Sub

He actually said he was refering to a Marvel superhero's power

Either way, I personally have a very low opinion of superpowers in Rifts. It's okay for occasional stuff, flavour text, and interesting villains, but it seems that everyone's first reaction when given a new option in Rifts is to go 'ooooh superpowers'.

For me, I like to explore non-superpowered options (magic, psi, genetics, technology, sure). If I want superpowers, I'll play HU2.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:He actually said he was refering to a Marvel superhero's power

In that same post he said the following:

Though I swear there was something similar somewhere in Palladium...the Unlimited setting maybe?

/Sub

Comrade Corsarius wrote:Either way, I personally have a very low opinion of superpowers in Rifts. It's okay for occasional stuff, flavour text, and interesting villains, but it seems that everyone's first reaction when given a new option in Rifts is to go 'ooooh superpowers'.

For me, I like to explore non-superpowered options (magic, psi, genetics, technology, sure). If I want superpowers, I'll play HU2.

You've an odd idea of what constitutes a super-power if you think a spell-caster or psionic isn't super-powered. Marvel Girl/Phoenix from Marvel's main power is psionics specifically telekinesis and telepathy, you really think she isn't super-powered and is a non-super instead?

Comrade Corsarius wrote:Either way, I personally have a very low opinion of superpowers in Rifts. It's okay for occasional stuff, flavour text, and interesting villains, but it seems that everyone's first reaction when given a new option in Rifts is to go 'ooooh superpowers'.

For me, I like to explore non-superpowered options (magic, psi, genetics, technology, sure). If I want superpowers, I'll play HU2.

*clicks like*

Here's an equally simple and mundane explanation. He just has great genetics. Remember, the average lifespan now is around 80, but the maximum is about 115. If you multiply that 200 in Rifts by 1.5, that's 300. So that would give him 10.5 years of life instead of 7. He's well within the last call range until the middle of 110 PA.

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Read more about him in either the Siege On Tolkeen series or Rifts: Aftermath.

He never got the Phoenix Chip at all, and the reasons for his continued survival into PA 109 remain an open-ended mystery (although the authors themselves imply to the reader that he will go out in the proverbial blaze of glory [also literally in Julian's case as a Mega-Juicer] while leading refugees out of Tolkeen.

I've not read anywhere that he did or did not get the phoenix chip. I'm simply proposing a reason for this continued longevity based on the information in SoT and Aftermath. I'm also proposing a further adventure idea to supplement the juicer uprising and re-introduce the Vallax aliens.

Rifts: Aftermath, page 39.

That's not Julian's opinion, that's the God's-eye view telling we the readers that he didn't get the chip.

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Read more about him in either the Siege On Tolkeen series or Rifts: Aftermath.

He never got the Phoenix Chip at all, and the reasons for his continued survival into PA 109 remain an open-ended mystery (although the authors themselves imply to the reader that he will go out in the proverbial blaze of glory [also literally in Julian's case as a Mega-Juicer] while leading refugees out of Tolkeen.

I've not read anywhere that he did or did not get the phoenix chip. I'm simply proposing a reason for this continued longevity based on the information in SoT and Aftermath. I'm also proposing a further adventure idea to supplement the juicer uprising and re-introduce the Vallax aliens.

Rifts: Aftermath, page 39.

That's not Julian's opinion, that's the God's-eye view telling we the readers that he didn't get the chip.

Groovy. I stand corrected. I no longer own Aftermath but if that's the case, then fair enough.

Julian might be still alive, but it's not a pleasant existence. Isn't there a short story about him somewhere explaining why he sleeps next to a body bag? Although mega-juicers don't just die, they esplode. Was he intended to be a mega juicer from the start? It's been years since I've read the Juicer Uprising or any Tolkeen.

Because if he died Ricky and Bubbles would be lost.

Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

wyrmraker wrote:Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

While the flavour text contradicts this, I heartily approve of this suggestion. If it's done right, it's ALWAYS cool. (I grew up with phantom, ghost who walks, man who cannot die. My parents are from the early 1930s and they transferred their heroes onto me).

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

While the flavour text contradicts this, I heartily approve of this suggestion. If it's done right, it's ALWAYS cool. (I grew up with phantom, ghost who walks, man who cannot die. My parents are from the early 1930s and they transferred their heroes onto me).

EDIT: Now I think of it, Ace Rimmer did something similar, too. What a guy.

Flavor text is just that: Flavor. I never liked flavorish fluff; I prefer facts.
And yeah. I love the idea of Julian the First being a position, carefully maintained by a shadowy group of pro-Juicers. Or just something formulated by the original Julian the First (whenever the first one actually lived, or even if he was a mega-juicer) as a hugely symbolic P.R. campaign.

Or it could be that juilian the first is actualy a symboite living in the mega juicer that is actualy in charge, passed down from juicer to juicer......

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

cornholioprime wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:I was reading over Juicer Uprising the other day and a thought struck me.... Julian (according to Aftermath) is far too old to be a mega-juicer anymore. The fact he's still alive (and not suffering the really horrible last call of the mega-juicer) is attributed as something of a miracle.

What if it's not?

I propose that Julian was a recipient of a phoenix chip from the UTI operation, that has then malfunctioned. Such a chip boosts the life of juicers by a few years, but after that... boom (er.. quite literally in the case of a mega).

If this were the case, then more adventuring possibilities open up. What if he's actually being controlled by the Vallax still? What if the entire juicer uprising was a front for something even more devious?

Opinions?

Read more about him in either the Siege On Tolkeen series or Rifts: Aftermath.

He never got the Phoenix Chip at all, and the reasons for his continued survival into PA 109 remain an open-ended mystery (although the authors themselves imply to the reader that he will go out in the proverbial blaze of glory [also literally in Julian's case as a Mega-Juicer] while leading refugees out of Tolkeen.

I've not read anywhere that he did or did not get the phoenix chip. I'm simply proposing a reason for this continued longevity based on the information in SoT and Aftermath. I'm also proposing a further adventure idea to supplement the juicer uprising and re-introduce the Vallax aliens.

Rifts: Aftermath, page 39.

That's not Julian's opinion, that's the God's-eye view telling we the readers that he didn't get the chip.

Groovy. I stand corrected. I no longer own Aftermath but if that's the case, then fair enough.

Furthermore, when the Uprising first started, The general in charge panicked and hit the Kill switch, killing every chip-upgraded Juicer on the spot. Those who became Techno-zombies didn't get back up until after the Juicers captured Newtown.

wyrmraker wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

While the flavour text contradicts this, I heartily approve of this suggestion. If it's done right, it's ALWAYS cool. (I grew up with phantom, ghost who walks, man who cannot die. My parents are from the early 1930s and they transferred their heroes onto me).

EDIT: Now I think of it, Ace Rimmer did something similar, too. What a guy.

Flavor text is just that: Flavor. I never liked flavorish fluff; I prefer facts.
And yeah. I love the idea of Julian the First being a position, carefully maintained by a shadowy group of pro-Juicers. Or just something formulated by the original Julian the First (whenever the first one actually lived, or even if he was a mega-juicer) as a hugely symbolic P.R. campaign.

Except it's not just 'flavor text', it's a fact that Julian The First isn't (currently) a title passed on to a succession of mega-Juicers but instead the name of a Mega-Juicer of great renown who has managed to live longer than everyone expects juicers to live.

Nightmask wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

While the flavour text contradicts this, I heartily approve of this suggestion. If it's done right, it's ALWAYS cool. (I grew up with phantom, ghost who walks, man who cannot die. My parents are from the early 1930s and they transferred their heroes onto me).

EDIT: Now I think of it, Ace Rimmer did something similar, too. What a guy.

Flavor text is just that: Flavor. I never liked flavorish fluff; I prefer facts.
And yeah. I love the idea of Julian the First being a position, carefully maintained by a shadowy group of pro-Juicers. Or just something formulated by the original Julian the First (whenever the first one actually lived, or even if he was a mega-juicer) as a hugely symbolic P.R. campaign.

Except it's not just 'flavor text', it's a fact that Julian The First isn't (currently) a title passed on to a succession of mega-Juicers but instead the name of a Mega-Juicer of great renown who has managed to live longer than everyone expects juicers to live.

I would agree with you, except that PB contradicts themselves from one book to the next, and even occasionally contradicting themselves within the same book. Flavor text references can (and have) changed radically from one book to the next, from one printing to the next.
And yeah, nobody knows why Julian isn't dead yet. Not even he himself. On the other hand, if you get a skilled mind melter, a mind bleeder, and a good hypnotist in on this, maintaining the illusion of identity wouldn't be hard.

EDIT: I am honestly surprised that Julian the First was mentioned again. The JAL has been almost completely ignored from a brief mention (frame-job) in Lone Star. PB has a tendency to ignore that which is inconvenient to their metaplots. Kind of like the 28,000 strong NEMA army in cryostasis. Never mind that they would all be dead because of the Mechanoids invading and temporarily occupying ARCHIE's hidden areas. But that portion of the logic was promptly ignored in favor of the Republicans metaplot.

wyrmraker wrote:

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:Or it could, theoretically, be a Dread Pirate Roberts thing. Julian The First is a title passed 'generationally', carefully planned to be a perpetual symbol that juicers can rally behind.

While the flavour text contradicts this, I heartily approve of this suggestion. If it's done right, it's ALWAYS cool. (I grew up with phantom, ghost who walks, man who cannot die. My parents are from the early 1930s and they transferred their heroes onto me).

EDIT: Now I think of it, Ace Rimmer did something similar, too. What a guy.

Flavor text is just that: Flavor. I never liked flavorish fluff; I prefer facts.
And yeah. I love the idea of Julian the First being a position, carefully maintained by a shadowy group of pro-Juicers. Or just something formulated by the original Julian the First (whenever the first one actually lived, or even if he was a mega-juicer) as a hugely symbolic P.R. campaign.

Curiouser and curiouser. The flavour text indicates that Julian is suffering from the aches, pains, and nosebleeds of Last Call..... REGULAR juicer last call. Mega-juicers have a very distinctive Last Call that starts with glowing red eyes, goes through to not being able to wear clothes, and ends with 'boom'.

Hmm. Given Julian's symptoms, his body could be entering into a unique stage of Last Call. We were never given a developmental timeline for the juicer variants, so I have always treated Mega-Juicers as a fairly new creation (within the last 20-30 years).
Consider this. He is now a 12th lvl Mega-Juicer in about year 6 or 7. How many juicers last that long? What if his shortness is a brand new kind of molecular collapse, and when he burns out he goes off with the force of a fusion bomb, as opposed to the gradual flaming burnout?

wyrmraker wrote:Hmm. Given Julian's symptoms, his body could be entering into a unique stage of Last Call. We were never given a developmental timeline for the juicer variants, so I have always treated Mega-Juicers as a fairly new creation (within the last 20-30 years).
Consider this. He is now a 12th lvl Mega-Juicer in about year 6 or 7. How many juicers last that long? What if his shortness is a brand new kind of molecular collapse, and when he burns out he goes off with the force of a fusion bomb, as opposed to the gradual flaming burnout?

Mega-juicers already go 'foom' doing, I believe, 4d6x10 to a reasonable radius. It's why most towns don't let them in if they're showing signs of last call.

Comrade Corsarius wrote:

wyrmraker wrote:Hmm. Given Julian's symptoms, his body could be entering into a unique stage of Last Call. We were never given a developmental timeline for the juicer variants, so I have always treated Mega-Juicers as a fairly new creation (within the last 20-30 years).
Consider this. He is now a 12th lvl Mega-Juicer in about year 6 or 7. How many juicers last that long? What if his shortness is a brand new kind of molecular collapse, and when he burns out he goes off with the force of a fusion bomb, as opposed to the gradual flaming burnout?

Mega-juicers already go 'foom' doing, I believe, 4d6x10 to a reasonable radius. It's why most towns don't let them in if they're showing signs of last call.

You are correct. Now imagine a Legendary Mega-Juicer going ka-boom. Less like a fusion block, and more like a low-end MD nuke. Something in the lines of wiping out half of the city of Kingsdale from the concussive wavefront alone.