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Considering the occupation started in 2031...when do you bring in UEEF mecha?

Just my thoughts on it.....

At the end of the 2nd war (IIRC) there was another out of the system fleet that came in (please feel free to correct me on this). And there is Wolfe's expedition which is alluded to in the series and we see in the Love & War comic.

Wolfe's mission would be to bring in troops and equip to bolster the ASC forces and help rebuild...but then they get word of the Invid coming and start pulling essential personnel off world.

My opinion is that these groups would have brought the earlier built mecha....VR-038 cyclones (possibly -041s as well depending on when it was developed) Alphas and Condors. Also pre -038 cyclones (possibly use the design from the Class Reunion comic as a -035(?) model). And throw in ALL Cyclone weapon systems except the ones on the -057 Super.

What are everyone else's thoughts??

According to dates w/n the various UEEF mecha fluff-texts in the books:
-The VR-03x Cyclone series does date to late 2020s, so should be available.
-The Condor is definitely 2020s in origin.
-The ATT-30 was produced before the UEEF left Earth (2022).
-The MT-20 'cycle was redesigned in 2030.
-The VM-9 Silverback was designed in 2034.
-Mass production of the Alpha starts in 2031, though even by 2038 (10th MD) the change over isn't complete, so the mecha would be rare until post 21st MD.
-2037 Beta declared operational
-The M-70 Kodiak and the MR-40 motorcycle arrive with 10th MD, not sure how far back they predate, so about 2038

ShadowLogan wrote:According to dates w/n the various UEEF mecha fluff-texts in the books:
-The VR-03x Cyclone series does date to late 2020s, so should be available.
-The Condor is definitely 2020s in origin.
-The ATT-30 was produced before the UEEF left Earth (2022).
-The MT-20 'cycle was redesigned in 2030.
-The VM-9 Silverback was designed in 2034.
-Mass production of the Alpha starts in 2031, though even by 2038 (10th MD) the change over isn't complete, so the mecha would be rare until post 21st MD.
-2037 Beta declared operational
-The M-70 Kodiak and the MR-40 motorcycle arrive with 10th MD, not sure how far back they predate, so about 2038

this raises the question ..... The SDF-3 launched in 2022 so what were they using for 9 years?

Chris0013 wrote:this raises the question ..... The SDF-3 launched in 2022 so what were they using for 9 years?

They had a large number of zentraedi allied forces in their respective mecha, and the macros stuff which included a large number of vf-1R's (upgrades began in 2014)

Chris0013 wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:According to dates w/n the various UEEF mecha fluff-texts in the books:
-The VR-03x Cyclone series does date to late 2020s, so should be available.
-The Condor is definitely 2020s in origin.
-The ATT-30 was produced before the UEEF left Earth (2022).
-The MT-20 'cycle was redesigned in 2030.
-The VM-9 Silverback was designed in 2034.
-Mass production of the Alpha starts in 2031, though even by 2038 (10th MD) the change over isn't complete, so the mecha would be rare until post 21st MD.
-2037 Beta declared operational
-The M-70 Kodiak and the MR-40 motorcycle arrive with 10th MD, not sure how far back they predate, so about 2038

this raises the question ..... The SDF-3 launched in 2022 so what were they using for 9 years?

Unknown, probably a mix of older UEDF: RDF and new ASC hardware, in addition to any Zentraedi. I really don't see why the UEEF would have drastically different TO&E from contemporary UEDF before being cut off from Earth by the Invid Invasion.

The UEEF would be using the Conbat (it dates to 2013), in addition to what ever Carpenter's fighter is called. The VHTs are probably in the mix (squadrons active in 2013) given L&W comic has the UEEF with them. It's hard to pin down (via the RPG) when most ASC/RDF mecha entered/retired from service, though I don't see why they wouldn't be using them until their NG-era stuff comes on line.

I wouldn't rule out Alphas from before 2031 either, but they would be more limited in availability. That would push the VF of choice to an unknown or the Logan or Valk. for the bulk of that time, possibly even the AGAC (UEEF may have had received it before the UEDF: ASC given TS#85 didn't introduce new mecha to the battle, and owing to recycled footage in Ep37 we see 20+ distinct units)

I thought the poor availability of the Alpha was explained by the fact that the SDF-3 took them all when it folded to Tyrol.

I use a combination of UEDF with newer UEEF as well as interim units (ala Strikeforce from 1st ed) and a few other things thrown in (Micronian PA etc) as well as Zentraedi Units. Mind you I also have them leaving with over 400 ships 70 000 mecha/craft and 70 000 PA's (micronian et al)

Alpha's were in development during the late 2010's, and probably were available by the early 2020's.. they just didn't start getting mass produced until the 2030's. i'd say they underwent Low Rate Initial production for those 10 years, as they refined the design. so you could have squadrons of Alpha's, they just wouldn't be found on every ship.
this would also explain why the Alpha's model numbers in the RPG carry letter codes for the version that are so near the end of the alphabet..

Chris0013 wrote:Considering the occupation started in 2031...when do you bring in UEEF mecha?

My usual habit is to treat the contents of the RPG as inaccurate where they contradict what's in the official continuity, so I'd be bringing in the UEEF's mecha throughout the late 2020s and 2030s. The Pioneer mission's forces would be using the non-variable fighters seen in Carpenter's returning forces, the Condor and Conbat, and the early Eta and Iota-model Alpha fighters (yes, those are Greek letters). I's give 'em the Zeta-type and the Beta in the mid-2030s, and then Shadow Alpha and Beta units, along with the Silverback, in the 2040s.

Seto Kaiba wrote:

Chris0013 wrote:Considering the occupation started in 2031...when do you bring in UEEF mecha?

My usual habit is to treat the contents of the RPG as inaccurate where they contradict what's in the official continuity, so I'd be bringing in the UEEF's mecha throughout the late 2020s and 2030s. The Pioneer mission's forces would be using the non-variable fighters seen in Carpenter's returning forces, the Condor and Conbat, and the early Eta and Iota-model Alpha fighters (yes, those are Greek letters). I's give 'em the Zeta-type and the Beta in the mid-2030s, and then Shadow Alpha and Beta units, along with the Silverback, in the 2040s.

Damn you Seto....you made my brain tweak the existing Alpha for an earlier model....take the basic airframe and remove the nose lasers....give it a head designed like the VF-1A with 2 head lasers that lay against the fuselage in jet/guardian modes. VF/6-D

Chris0013 wrote:Damn you Seto....you made my brain tweak the existing Alpha for an earlier model....take the basic airframe and remove the nose lasers....give it a head designed like the VF-1A with 2 head lasers that lay against the fuselage in jet/guardian modes. VF/6-D

You're welcome.

On reflection, I'd probably tentatively pencil in some of the earlier models of Ride Armor from the doujinshi Unnamed Unit, Second Squadron: VR-052 MOSPEADA as interim or test models prior to the introduction of the VR-038 Bartley.

They also had a "prototype" like unit in the Imai files as well that may or may not get used by Palladium.....

jaymz wrote:They also had a "prototype" like unit in the Imai files as well that may or may not get used by Palladium.....

Meh, I don't like the contents of the Imai Files much... they don't really fit the aesthetic of the completed original series or anything from the other sagas. The stuff in that dōjinshi fits better.

Seto Kaiba wrote:

Chris0013 wrote:Damn you Seto....you made my brain tweak the existing Alpha for an earlier model....take the basic airframe and remove the nose lasers....give it a head designed like the VF-1A with 2 head lasers that lay against the fuselage in jet/guardian modes. VF/6-D

You're welcome.

On reflection, I'd probably tentatively pencil in some of the earlier models of Ride Armor from the doujinshi Unnamed Unit, Second Squadron: VR-052 MOSPEADA as interim or test models prior to the introduction of the VR-038 Bartley.

I posited the cyclone from the Class Reunion comic as an earlier -030 series...or tweak the -038 by removing the nubs on top of the shoulders and changing the grey circles with slits to more lightbulb lookinng things and moving the circular thrusters on the back more under the seat than to the sides.


Also....I think there is evidence the -041 was on Earth before the Invid Invasion.....I just popped Paper Hero in and in Lunk's flashback he specifically says "It was during the invid invasion after we fought the Robotech Masters"... however he also says he mad the promise "a year ago" throwing the whole timeline out the window.

Chris0013 wrote:I posited the cyclone from the Class Reunion comic as an earlier -030 series...or tweak the -038 by removing the nubs on top of the shoulders and changing the grey circles with slits to more lightbulb lookinng things and moving the circular thrusters on the back more under the seat than to the sides.

The one I was thinking of from that dōjinshi was a bit chunkier than the 038 model, and didn't carry any built-in armament or anything like that. It also didn't use a type-3 HBT cell either, it had a big battery pack and a more traditional-looking machine gun.

Chris0013 wrote:Also....I think there is evidence the -041 was on Earth before the Invid Invasion.....I just popped Paper Hero in and in Lunk's flashback he specifically says "It was during the invid invasion after we fought the Robotech Masters"... however he also says he mad the promise "a year ago" throwing the whole timeline out the window.

*shrug* The whole Robotech timeline went to pot long before that, man... look at the broadcast version of Episode 36... they left in the closing title card from Macross that says "So Long, 2012", establishing that the events of that episode happened in 2012 not 2014 as the present timeline claims, throwing the rest of it off by two years.

Seto Kaiba wrote:

jaymz wrote:They also had a "prototype" like unit in the Imai files as well that may or may not get used by Palladium.....

Meh, I don't like the contents of the Imai Files much... they don't really fit the aesthetic of the completed original series or anything from the other sagas. The stuff in that dōjinshi fits better.

Actually the more Cyclone specific stuff does actually fit pretty well with what we end up seeing in the series. Though the file you are talking about is quite neat as well.

Seto wrote:*shrug* The whole Robotech timeline went to pot long before that, man... look at the broadcast version of Episode 36... they left in the closing title card from Macross that says "So Long, 2012", establishing that the events of that episode happened in 2012 not 2014 as the present timeline claims, throwing the rest of it off by two years.

Not really, in this case the visuals don't match the dialogue cues. There are instances of dialogue that would make the year 2013 vs the one visual shot for 2012. One of which is how long Rick has known Minmei (put at 4years, 2009 + years = 2013). Narrator even says its been 2 years after FoA, and Homecoming establishes the events as 12.5monts later (Ep1-3). Off hand I don't recall stated elapsed time window between Ep15 & Ep27 via dialogue.

Chris0013 wrote:Also....I think there is evidence the -041 was on Earth before the Invid Invasion.....I just popped Paper Hero in and in Lunk's flashback he specifically says "It was during the invid invasion after we fought the Robotech Masters"... however he also says he mad the promise "a year ago" throwing the whole timeline out the window.

depends on how long 'the invid invasion' is reckoned to be. the invid don't seem to have an equal presence all over, so it is possible that their conquest of earth was much more gradual than fans of the show often assume. they may have taken over the area around reflex point very rapidly, but absorbed the rest of the world over the span of 10-11 years.
it is also possible the UEEF never declared the 'invasion' to have ended at any point, and what we the fans refer to as an invid occupation of earth is still called 'the invid invasion' by most on earth and in the UEEF, out of a desire to reject the idea that earth was lost to the invid.

frankly, the 1 year timeframe fits that episode well. not only do we not really see 10 years of age difference between flashback lunk and current lunk, but you have to wonder why, if he'd been in south america all along, he never made it to that town earlier. if the loss of his friend occured only a year before, then the fact he'd not made it there yet makes more sense. the trip might well have taken that long.. especially if he had to stay in communities along the way and do various jobs to get fuel and supplies.

jaymz wrote:Actually the more Cyclone specific stuff does actually fit pretty well with what we end up seeing in the series. Though the file you are talking about is quite neat as well.

Meh, you mean the designs that don't (and can't) actually transform? I'll pass on those. The whole cool factor of the design is the transforming motorbike dynamic, though I wish I could get my hands on art for the earlier models in the same style that they did the 052 series on the cover of MOSPEADA: Complete Art Works.

Gryphon wrote:The sexy...uh, sleek one with the cabled blaster and the stinger like missile launcher?

The VR-052T model on the cover, with the usual 40mm beam pistol in one hand and more modern missile launcher in the other.