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june 9th mummer wrote:Plus, there are a few books to be sent into reprint, Robotech® Macross Saga to be re-designed as a 8½ x 11 sourcebook,

I said back when they started I'd get both, cause when they were asking I though it would be a good Idea that our troops that are also Gamers could fit a manga sized book in their packs better.

But I am glad they are finally getting the new RT books in the proper size to fit on the shelf with the other PB books.

i'll only buy a new copy if the resized version is given more material.. i already have a manga sized version in good condition, so no point in changing.

though this is going to make my website's 'suggestions and errata' page more complicated.. i already need to get with a friend that has a copy of the large format main book o update my page # info for that version.. now there is an extra book to worry about in the same vein.

I'll pick up the full sized when it comes out and ditch my manga.

GB - I can understand the problem....I have a had a few discussions off forum with regards to TSC and since I only have the deluxe hardcover it can get interesting. Mind you if you don't have the deluxe hardcover you also don't have the official stats of 6 star ships either or the space combat rules (though I believe the reprinted those in Gen Pits) and several other non combat vehicles IIRC.

Well, PB has ditched the Manga - which means they are not going to reprint them. Therefore you should ditch the updates to your Manga Errata page, and go Standard Sized. The fact that Kevin and Crew stated that all the 'new material' from TSC Deluxe would end up in the New Generation book, but didn't. Means quite a bit in this regard.

Mind you - I did call and tell Alex: "Don't reprint the material" once we found out there was not going to be a Manga sized version of New Generation.

They really should do it to all of them and fix all the little errors and add more art for everything.

well I think from this point on the Deluxe Hardcover of TSC will just become the Main Book of the RPG. Next up once Macros is reprinted will be Masters then everything is up to regular size again.

jaymz wrote:well I think from this point on the Deluxe Hardcover of TSC will just become the Main Book of the RPG. Next up once Macros is reprinted will be Masters then everything is up to regular size again.

Once they run out of the Masters Manga sized... so probably in 2 years.

Maybe Tiree...maybe.....you never know with the Tactics game they may get a push....and that's assuming they made an exact same print run of Masters versus Macross at the manga size to begin with and that they still have some left. It could be 6 months...who knows.

It'd be nice if they put the YF-4 into the standard-sized Macross book...wouldn't it?

I'd invest in hardcover editions...I HATE 'peeling laminate syndrome' that afflicts so many of my Palladium volumes.

Unless they actually add some new content to it, I think I'll pass. I'm happy enough with my manga size, after separating the pages and having them spiral bound.

taalismn wrote:I'd invest in hardcover editions...I HATE 'peeling laminate syndrome' that afflicts so many of my Palladium volumes.

I can deal with the peeling laminate if they combine Macross, Masters and New Gen into one overall book!

Tiree wrote:

taalismn wrote:I'd invest in hardcover editions...I HATE 'peeling laminate syndrome' that afflicts so many of my Palladium volumes.

I can deal with the peeling laminate if they combine Macross, Masters and New Gen. into one overall book!

There are some easy ways to put in more material for the Full Sized versions... Put in the Exp. Tables that were left out of the Magna sized versions. Like the civilian class from Macross, etc, etc...

If you think there is something that needs to added to the Macross full sized book, I suggest sending Alex a PM with your suggestion.

Shawn Merrow wrote:If you think there is something that needs to added to the Macross full sized book, I suggest sending Alex a PM with your suggestion.

Yes... Macross TRUE mecha from all the eras...oh wait..right. Harmony gold sitting on their pile and blocking Japan.
Never mind...carry on.
ROTFLMBOE!

Seriously though? ALL the Zentraedi ships from the series (JUST like the 1st edition, but included in the main book NOT as a seperate booklet).
We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

DhAkael wrote:We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

The writer was fired, and it was his pet project.

actually, Keven mentioned as Zentraedi sourcebook in the works, so that is probably where most of the zent ships would have ended up. probably also where things like the 'experimental' stuff from Tactics and such would have ended up as well. possibly even some of the UEDF's experimentals as well, given how sourcebooks for 2nd ed seem to be done so far.

if palladium chooses to roll that project into a new 'enhanced' macrosss saga edition.. i'd buy it.

but i'd also expect the product to end up delayed, since it would effectively be a new book.

Shawn Merrow wrote:If you think there is something that needs to added to the Macross full sized book, I suggest sending Alex a PM with your suggestion.

good idea. some of the stuff on my eratta and suggestions page should definitely be sent in.. (i doubt i can swing the fuel load info, but i bet i can help fix the issues with the OCC mods and a few issues with certain units and equipment)

Shawn Merrow wrote:If you think there is something that needs to added to the Macross full sized book, I suggest sending Alex a PM with your suggestion.

Stats for the YF-4 and YF-6 perhaps?

Gryphon - yeah the battloid image is the wrong one

I figured it was coming as Amazon has no new copies listed anymore. I need Masters in 8.5x11 now too!

Gryphon wrote:More artwork. The Macross book wasn't too bad, but the Masters book had a lot of missing stuff, though I grant most of it was fairly unimportant at the time.

How 'bout correcting the incorrect artwork while they're at it... they used the wrong art for the VF-1 cockpit, for instance. I know a few items that were in the old books are probably off the table because Harmony Gold doesn't have permission to use the art (the GU-12 being one such case, I believe).

Gryphon wrote:And "we" are all still "anxiously" awaiting updated info on the Synchro Cannons too, the platform, the Legios FAST pack version, and similar.

Erm... wasn't all the info you need to use fighter-scale synchro cannons already in the source book? I distinctly recall seeing it.

Seto Kaiba wrote:

Gryphon wrote:And "we" are all still "anxiously" awaiting updated info on the Synchro Cannons too, the platform, the Legios FAST pack version, and similar.

Erm... wasn't all the info you need to use fighter-scale synchro cannons already in the source book? I distinctly recall seeing it.

it is. the Beta's pod mount version is listed as a slightly shrunk down version of the hovervehicle mounted one that gets stats n in in the book.. basically the weapon stats given apply to both.
pg 187 of the manga size.

glitterboy2098 wrote:it is. the Beta's pod mount version is listed as a slightly shrunk down version of the hovervehicle mounted one that gets stats n in in the book.. basically the weapon stats given apply to both.
pg 187 of the manga size.

Ah, thank you. Now I know I'm not going mad.

(Because we all know THAT ship already sailed...)

Tiree wrote:

DhAkael wrote:We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

The writer was fired, and it was his pet project.

(Wail of lost soul being dragged off to Hell....)

taalismn wrote:

Tiree wrote:

DhAkael wrote:We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

The writer was fired, and it was his pet project.

(Wail of lost soul being dragged off to Hell....)

Other folks have volunteered to write it, but no response was ever received from Kevin on that front...

Seto Kaiba wrote:

glitterboy2098 wrote:it is. the Beta's pod mount version is listed as a slightly shrunk down version of the hovervehicle mounted one that gets stats n in in the book.. basically the weapon stats given apply to both.
pg 187 of the manga size.

Ah, thank you. Now I know I'm not going mad.

(Because we all know THAT ship already sailed...)

Seto Kaiba wrote:

taalismn wrote:

Tiree wrote:

DhAkael wrote:We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

The writer was fired, and it was his pet project.

(Wail of lost soul being dragged off to Hell....)

Other folks have volunteered to write it, but no response was ever received from Kevin on that front...

Very said to here that.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

june 9th mummer wrote:Plus, there are a few books to be sent into reprint, Robotech® Macross Saga to be re-designed as a 8½ x 11 sourcebook,

I said back when they started I'd get both, cause when they were asking I though it would be a good Idea that our troops that are also Gamers could fit a manga sized book in their packs better.

But I am glad they are finally getting the new RT books in the proper size to fit on the shelf with the other PB books.

Will only get them if they have new info, or it I have extra money to burn.

Seto Kaiba wrote:

taalismn wrote:

Tiree wrote:

DhAkael wrote:We're never gonna get our Starships of Robotech because Tommy or Kevin or whoever trash-canned that project (rather foolishly I might add), so may as well put them where they belong. In each era book.

The writer was fired, and it was his pet project.

(Wail of lost soul being dragged off to Hell....)

Other folks have volunteered to write it, but no response was ever received from Kevin on that front...

Did the volunteer do a writing sample?
Does the volunteer have recognition within Palladium as a serious writer?
Did the volunteer contact another Robotech writer and offer assistance on such a project?

Tiree wrote:Did the volunteer do a writing sample?
Does the volunteer have recognition within Palladium as a serious writer?
Did the volunteer contact another Robotech writer and offer assistance on such a project?

Well, I can't speak for everyone (and I'm sure that Colonel Wolfe and I weren't the only ones to offer our services for the spaceships book), when I wrote to Kevin I was only investigating the possibility of getting the book un-canceled if they found a suitable writer... and never received a reply. I wasn't about to throw together a complete sample for the series if I was going to be wasting my time on a project the management wouldn't consider revisiting.

The up-sized Macross and Masters books need more crammed into them in addition to the errata to be worth it. They really need to do the rest of the ASC cruisers and artwork as well as fixing the mountain of errors/typos and other gaffes.

Rabid Southern Cross Fan wrote:The up-sized Macross and Masters books need more crammed into them in addition to the errata to be worth it. They really need to do the rest of the ASC cruisers and artwork as well as fixing the mountain of errors/typos and other gaffes.

As a community we should prepare one document with the errors and the fixes. That would be then submitted to K. Siembieda for consideration.

If not, that is time and money Kevin has to pull off another project to do editing for a rewrite.

We want to see a more polished product, Kevin wants to produce one. It is in our community interest to meet him halfway.

ArmySGT. wrote:As a community we should prepare one document with the errors and the fixes. That would be then submitted to K. Siembieda for consideration.

Problem is, because there are a lot of folks here who [disagree with/intensely dislike] the official canon, there wouldn't be a whole lot of agreement on what exactly is wrong and what isn't. Things that get flagged as errors may not be, and Tommy would have to get a copy of the revised book for review before it went to the printers...

Seto Kaiba wrote:

ArmySGT. wrote:As a community we should prepare one document with the errors and the fixes. That would be then submitted to K. Siembieda for consideration.

Problem is, because there are a lot of folks here who [disagree with/intensely dislike] the official canon, there wouldn't be a whole lot of agreement on what exactly is wrong and what isn't. Things that get flagged as errors may not be, and Tommy would have to get a copy of the revised book for review before it went to the printers...

I can just see the flame wars now....I think the purpose, size, and armament of the Condor would take up 20 pages minimum....if it was not locked well before that.

Chris0013 wrote:I can just see the flame wars now....I think the purpose, size, and armament of the Condor would take up 20 pages minimum....if it was not locked well before that.

Exactly. On Robotech.com, at least before it up and croaked, it probably wouldn't have been an issue since that was where the official canon had strong support from the community. Here, we have a lot of folks who disagree with the official canon, either in whole or selectively, as well as a few folks who strongly disagree with Harmony Gold's process for establishing their official canon (e.g. exiling almost all pre-2001 Robotech titles from continuity, and their heavy reliance on the OSM).

Barring a few obvious, indisputable screw-ups like using the wrong cockpit art for the VF-1, the lack of any kind of complete and comprehensive official coverage of Robotech would leave most attempts to identify errors in the RPG books mired in a sea of conflicting interpretations.

Then, you guys have made a strong case for why it has not been done, or ever will be.............

So why then carry on complaining about it?

Whatever...
"But someone on the internet is WRONG!"
Pretty much sums up the geekwhining that surrounds this subject.

If everyone would just shut up and accept EITHER O.S.M. or Robotech (HG script bible) and let it REST, then there'd be no problem.
Everyone is an expert and everyone has an opinion in inter-tube-web-land.

ArmySGT. wrote:Then, you guys have made a strong case for why it has not been done, or ever will be.............

So why then carry on complaining about it?

It gives us something to do?

DhAkael wrote:If everyone would just shut up and accept EITHER O.S.M. or Robotech (HG script bible) and let it REST, then there'd be no problem.
Everyone is an expert and everyone has an opinion in inter-tube-web-land.

But... but... what about all the old comics and novels and first edition RPG that Harmony Gold says aren't even part of the Robotech universe anymore? We can't just ignore those! </sarcasm>

DhAkael wrote:Whatever...
If everyone would just shut up and accept EITHER O.S.M. or Robotech (HG script bible) and let it REST, then there'd be no problem.

fixed for you. HG may have used OSM for some of the gross details, but ultimately it bears as much relevance to robotech as a copy of the Jane's Recognition Guides have for Ace Combat. the OSm is for three unrelated and wildly different shows after all.

glitterboy2098 wrote:

DhAkael wrote:Whatever...
If everyone would just shut up and accept EITHER O.S.M. or Robotech (HG script bible) and let it REST, then there'd be no problem.

fixed for you. [...]

Er... just puttin' this out there, but you DO realize that the OSM is the Robotech "script bible", right? That's the way it's been since the word "go" in '85, and the OSM's influence over Robotech has only grown with time. The official stats are OSM-derived, to the extent that if one took out the minor typos and the bits where the uRRG idiots didn't want to accept that there are such things as animation errors, the two would be virtually indistinguishable. The only area that isn't almost exclusively OSM derived is the Masters Saga, and correcting that to match what's actually said in the show would... wait for it... take it closer to the OSM.

It's not surprising, really. After all, Harmony Gold never intended to make something separate from the original shows when they were making the series, and the collective experience of decades of failed experiments and customer feedback proves definitively that Robotech has never been, and will never be, an entity separate from the original three shows used in its creation. They learned the hard way that trying to put distance between Robotech and the original Macross, Southern Cross, and MOSPEADA means putting distance between Robotech and what made Robotech even remotely interesting to begin with. Harmony Gold has known for ages that what the fans want isn't a stand-alone RT series, they want more stories featuring the familiar characters, mecha, and settings of the original three shows. They did their best to deliver that, and hit roadblocks created by their limited rights to the material every time. The only time they dared try an all-original Robotech with no ties to the OSM (Robotech 3000), it was the most abysmal failure the franchise ever experienced.

Anyone who thinks Robotech is an entity separate from the originals, and could stand alone without the OSM is just kidding themselves.

glitterboy2098 wrote:HG may have used OSM for some of the gross details, but ultimately it bears as much relevance to robotech as a copy of the Jane's Recognition Guides have for Ace Combat.

Not quite... it'd be more correct to say that the OSM bears as much relevance to Robotech as the creator's notes, player's guide, and walkthrough for a video game would to a re-release of the same game with a little bonus content... kinda like Ace Combat 2 and Ace Combat: Assault Horizon Legacy, to borrow your specific example. (I'm actually playing the latter right now.)

Kevin put in the latest Press Release that Jeff Burke is going to be a new writer / designer for all things Robotech - congratulations. He also mentioned the new Macross reprint, and it will have no new material. This is quite a bummer IMO, and I hope that Jeff can at least go through the OCC's and make the changes noted a bit more clearer as to what is to be expected. Right now it's clear as mud, and as with everything the first printing could always use a huge editing help.

So they dropped Irvin?

Any word on Robotech Masters in 8.5 x 11?

I will buy Macross when it is available.

Won't be before it goes to reprint which I'd say is likely next year some time

7 days till Macross 8.5x11 is up for order!

I am not going to run a Macross era campaign anytime soon but I will grab this for the future.

So...since they have the YF-4 battloid and guardian for the tactics game it should be in the new book.

Chris0013 wrote:So...since they have the YF-4 battloid and guardian for the tactics game it should be in the new book.

In the macross book.....no. In a supplement book for the malcontent uprising, yes.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

Chris0013 wrote:So...since they have the YF-4 battloid and guardian for the tactics game it should be in the new book.

In the macross book.....no. In a supplement book for the malcontent uprising, yes.

When that sourcebook comes out, I'll happily spend some money on it.

Arnie100 wrote:

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

Chris0013 wrote:So...since they have the YF-4 battloid and guardian for the tactics game it should be in the new book.

In the macross book.....no. In a supplement book for the malcontent uprising, yes.

When that sourcebook comes out, I'll happily spend some money on it.

Me too. But I shall not be waiting with baited breath for one. Knows too much how erratic PB publishing stuff is.

I'm not a fan of the manga sized books because they appear to wear out easily. My 1st edition copies of Strike Force and New World Order which I bought back in 1996 are in better condition then any of the three robotech manga size books I own.

So when the deluxe edition of TSC came out I bought it and gave the manga copy to a friend. I ordered the full size Macross book last night and will 'retire' the manga copy by giving it away.

Never thought manga size should have ever been marketed, reasons most of you have already heard me rant about. Ill gladly replace them with standard sized books when Palladium gets enough material to make an online order worth it to spread the cost of the shipping.

Soooooo....in like 3-4 years...at the rate they produce books these days.

Robotech: The Macross Saga in the 8 1/2 x 11 inch format is available now.

https://palladium-store.com/1001/produc ... ebook.html




Alex Marciniszyn