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Perhaps I'm just paranoid but I'm not sure I'd be willing to use a power that had a 1 in 666 chance (0.15%) of killing you even under the best circumstances.

If you were running a game and your teleporter rolled 00 then 87 would you say "your dead"?

The one time I had a teleporter in my game I disregarded the "instant death" feature of this power. No other power offers the chance to kill you outright every time you use it. In the Rifts game I play in, we did have a character teleport using the spell and he rolled 99 twice. We were stunned into silence. So to answer the subject, yes, I have seen it.

I had a warrior with a magical object with teleport capabilities teleport onto the back of a flying dragon. he rolled a 100. I rolled to see what direction he was off. He teleported down 2 feet from his intended target, into the dragons neck. It was a horrible death for both of them.

Yes. Exceptions. Invulnerable, multiple lives, lycanthropy&plant forms give a secondary roll. Basically if you cant be hurt regrow limbs or can rise from the dead. Anybody else sorry. Told you its not that good of an ability.

A much better alternative would be the "Teleporter" power from Heroes of the Megaverse, page 66. It takes two attacks to teleport but there's no roll for failure or instant death. It's far superior in almost every way.

Has not had my char die from being t-ported into an object. But... one of my chars use T-port sup to t-port bits of a starship down into the mantle of the planet .

We always house ruled that as long as your destination is line of sight, you don't have to roll.

I did once see a character roll the "instant death" result, but the character also had Intangibility (or maybe Vibration? don't remember clearly as it wasn't my character) and the GM let him roll some sort of save to see if he could engage the power fast enough to survive. He made his save and survived.

I'm not sure how I'd have handled it if I were the GM.

--flatline

What about teleporting people into stuff?

I have had Characters die on botched teleports before. As a GM I tend to use the "what's the most fun option" theory. As such I rarely kill them outright. I might have them bounce someplace else, they might get kidnapped, they might be stuck in time, bounce back to their starting point (wounded or not, stunned or not) or any number of other options. I will discuss this sort of thing ahead of time with the players if they select a power that has a "oops you die" setting.

Glistam wrote:A much better alternative would be the "Teleporter" power from Heroes of the Megaverse, page 66.

Or, from PU3, the "Portals" power.

I never can get my teleport ability to work...

I figured if I ever wanted a character with the teleport power I would also select Intangibility to avoid this problem.

Well it wasn't a HU game, but i had an entire party WIPEOUT!!! when one of the PC used a rune sword that had the power
to superior: teleport while the party was in Hades. They just found this magic weapon a Rakasha had asked them to get for
it. Instead of walking back, they decided to use the sword. I even warned them that the percentage chance was low but
they used it any way. Well they rolled a failed teleport and I said roll the misplace teleport and 00 came up. The wielder of
the sword teleported the whole party into a mountain. Guess the Rakasha is even going to get his magic weapon. Well they
wanted to get out of Hades but that was not the way they wanted to go.

Tor wrote:I figured if I ever wanted a character with the teleport power I would also select Intangibility to avoid this problem.

I've thought that, but it's always struck me as a little weird. You want a knack for materializing on the other side of a locked door -- inside a bank vault, or out of a jail cell, or whatever -- and to make it safe, you also take the ability to materialize on the other side of locked doors? You want to escape from wrestling holds and force fields, so you select another power for doing that? No mere human can enter your secret base of operations, but you can do it one way because you can do it a second way?

(Why die in a fall when you can disappear from up high and reappear on the ground unharmed? All you have to do is get the power of being unharmed by falls!)

Glistam wrote:A much better alternative would be the "Teleporter" power from Heroes of the Megaverse, page 66. It takes two attacks to teleport but there's no roll for failure or instant death. It's far superior in almost every way.

What a surprise, a Cosmic level 'mega power' is superior to a vanilla super power? But yes, assuming that your GM is running a Hero's of the Megaverse game instead of an HU game, then yes by all means take the superior powers.

I just rule that you can't enter a solid object with a teleport. Instead, if you botch the roll, i just have you reappear inside-out. But only if if's the HU version. Spells usually work out fine.

I made a kind of handshake rule with my player who teleports.

No instant death results, under the proviso that she cannot take unwilling passengers.

It's worked out just fine (fer her on at least three occasions)

Batts

Regularguy wrote:it's always struck me as a little weird. You want a knack for materializing on the other side of a locked door -- inside a bank vault, or out of a jail cell, or whatever -- and to make it safe, you also take the ability to materialize on the other side of locked doors?

Sure, they work differently, after all. Intangible people are still visible, so teleporting helps you get past cameras and spotters, like perhaps one who might EE electricity your intangibutt.

Tor wrote:

Regularguy wrote:it's always struck me as a little weird. You want a knack for materializing on the other side of a locked door -- inside a bank vault, or out of a jail cell, or whatever -- and to make it safe, you also take the ability to materialize on the other side of locked doors?

Sure, they work differently, after all. Intangible people are still visible, so teleporting helps you get past cameras and spotters, like perhaps one who might EE electricity your intangibutt.

Well, yes, of course they don't overlap 100%, or my comment would've been too obvious to be necessary. But imagine you could teleport safely with something that doesn't really overlap the other power at all.

I mean, if you want Grant Powers, plus something to remedy the direct-to-hit-points damage that's the big drawback of that power, my observation wouldn't exactly come into play; ditto for the classic idea of having Transmutation provide materials for Copy Physical Structure or Gem Powers -- or taking a power for genuinely attacking people while in APS: Mist form, or whatever.

But nobody says CEF: Fire stands a good chance of killing you every time you use it, unless you also take APS: Fire, or maybe Divine Aura has a chance of killing you every time you use it, unless you also take Control: Others.

There isn't anyone out there who selects Grant Powers without selecting that Major Super-Regeneration power from AU is there?

Tor wrote:There isn't anyone out there who selects Grant Powers without selecting that Major Super-Regeneration power from AU is there?

I do all the time. Since I select my powers based on character concept and not with a goal to minimize the restrictions, nor with the goal of evading any of the powers limitations. And as a GM I generally don't allow super powers to heal the 'investment costs' anyway. If a power/spell/ability/whatever costs sdc/hp...then the damage can't be healed by any other power that player has. I am very much a "limitations exist for a reason" and "do what you must, but pay for it" kind of GM.

I select my powers based on character concept

not with a goal to minimize the restrictions

nor with the goal of evading any of the powers limitations

Well that's not very munchkin of you sir, I find it hard to relate.

BTW aren't points 2 and 3 the same thing?

I generally don't allow super powers to heal the 'investment costs' anyway. If a power/spell/ability/whatever costs sdc/hp...then the damage can't be healed by any other power that player has.

Hey, just because that's how it works for GODS doesn't mean that's how it has to work for MUTANTS.

Tor wrote:There isn't anyone out there who selects Grant Powers without selecting that Major Super-Regeneration power from AU is there?

A concept I proposed a while back hereabouts: take Teleport to materialize in something, which equals instant death for you and your enemy. And take Divine Aura to get an ever-replenishing supply of guys who believe whatever you tell them and never doubt you and do anything you ask without question including sacrificing their lives.

And take Grant Powers, so they can instant-death Teleport on your behalf.

Technically I think the 'instant death' only applies to the teleporter, not to the target destination.

Regularguy wrote:

Glistam wrote:A much better alternative would be the "Teleporter" power from Heroes of the Megaverse, page 66.

Or, from PU3, the "Portals" power.

Personally, I think the Portal power from Armagddon Unlimited is much better.

eliakon wrote:

Glistam wrote:A much better alternative would be the "Teleporter" power from Heroes of the Megaverse, page 66. It takes two attacks to teleport but there's no roll for failure or instant death. It's far superior in almost every way.

What a surprise, a Cosmic level 'mega power' is superior to a vanilla super power? But yes, assuming that your GM is running a Hero's of the Megaverse game instead of an HU game, then yes by all means take the superior powers.

I'm glad you agree.

Tor wrote:Technically I think the 'instant death' only applies to the teleporter, not to the target destination.

Not sure I agree -- but, for the sake of argument, how many pounds of enemy are you allowed to teleport along with you?

Regularguy wrote:

Tor wrote:Technically I think the 'instant death' only applies to the teleporter, not to the target destination.

Not sure I agree -- but, for the sake of argument, how many pounds of enemy are you allowed to teleport along with you?

First question is. Can you purposefully make an Instant Death teleport? If its an error, then it might not be replicable at will. As a GM I would, personally say that you have to make a 'legal' teleport choice. IE you can only target places that are clear of obstructions, as for why the short answer is 'because the power works that way'. Accidents can happen of course....but since this sort of suicide power is not mentioned, where as other powers DO mention suicide options (APS: Fire's Nova Blast comes to mind first.) it might not BE an option.

eliakon wrote:Can you purposefully make an Instant Death teleport? If its an error, then it might not be replicable at will.

I dunno. I mean, it's right there, y'know? If it's a location that's clearly visible from your starting point, then it's hard for me to read that as anything but straightforward.

Regularguy wrote:

Tor wrote:Technically I think the 'instant death' only applies to the teleporter, not to the target destination.

Not sure I agree -- but, for the sake of argument, how many pounds of enemy are you allowed to teleport along with you?

Not sure what you mean... is the enemy a guest in the original teleport or the target destination of it?

I don't like the idea of giving my players such a high percentage chance of killing themselves for simply playing the character they rolled, especially if it is done randomly (which is house rule #1 for supers in my group).

Trying to teleport past that wall and fail? Probably going to just let you just slam into the wall and be knocked down (which can be just as deadly, and has killed at least one would be Nightcrawler).

Trying to teleport from one spaceship to another while traveling at warp speed and fail? Yeah you're dead (I didn't feel bad when he died either).

How many times did Nightcrawler die from bamfing all over the place? None, but he also mostly kept his bamfing to line of sight or next room over rather than halfway across North America.

McFacemelt wrote:I don't like the idea of giving my players such a high percentage chance of killing themselves for simply playing the character they rolled, especially if it is done randomly (which is house rule #1 for supers in my group).

Trying to teleport past that wall and fail? Probably going to just let you just slam into the wall and be knocked down (which can be just as deadly, and has killed at least one would be Nightcrawler).

Trying to teleport from one spaceship to another while traveling at warp speed and fail? Yeah you're dead (I didn't feel bad when he died either).

How many times did Nightcrawler die from bamfing all over the place? None, but he also mostly kept his bamfing to line of sight or next room over rather than halfway across North America.

Well on the latter that's because he didn't have anywhere close to that kind of range (2 miles was his extreme limit and he almost never teleported blind unless it was an extreme emergency), but he did generally stay within his teleportation limits which was mainly what was in plain sight. Unlike Vanisher who could teleport across the planet with ease and never had to worry about knowing where he was going as his power always ensured he arrived somewhere safe at the target location.

Have disregarded the instant death from the get go. For those times characters have rolled "Instant Death" was rolled, the character failed to teleport and I had them roll damage (4d6 to HP and SDC).

But I disagree with the instant death part of the ability.

Tor wrote:

Regularguy wrote:

Tor wrote:Technically I think the 'instant death' only applies to the teleporter, not to the target destination.

Not sure I agree -- but, for the sake of argument, how many pounds of enemy are you allowed to teleport along with you?

Not sure what you mean... is the enemy a guest in the original teleport or the target destination of it?

I'll take either.

yep right into a pylon in a parking garage. I understood that was part of the power and that was a risk. its fine. Don't take the power if you don't want the consequences

Considering how Palladium generally hates instant-kill things I have to wonder why they stuck Teleportation with the risk of an instant kill every time you use it. I guess they only hate you getting to instant kill others but are fine with things rigged just to kill the PC instantly.

Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

KillWatch wrote:Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

And look how many GM treat doing that as hunting season on PC, one-shot killing them to punish them for it.

haven't met any of them.

Nightmask wrote:

KillWatch wrote:Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

And look how many GM treat doing that as hunting season on PC, one-shot killing them to punish them for it.

The only point blank instant kills are when the PC/NPC dives on a grenade. Point BLank Shots do damage (1.5 I believe) direct to HPs but are not instant kills (unless the PC/NPC does not have enough HPs).

Ranger wrote:

Nightmask wrote:

KillWatch wrote:Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

And look how many GM treat doing that as hunting season on PC, one-shot killing them to punish them for it.

The only point blank instant kills are when the PC/NPC dives on a grenade. Point BLank Shots do damage (1.5 I believe) direct to HPs but are not instant kills (unless the PC/NPC does not have enough HPs).

As far as I was aware, there is no official rule in HU that has a Point Blank shot have any modifier what so ever. There is an optional rule in the COMW that has point blank shots do double damage when fired into vital points. While there are many house rules, about Point Blank shots, there are, as far as I know, no official rules on them.

eliakon wrote:

Ranger wrote:

Nightmask wrote:

KillWatch wrote:Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

And look how many GM treat doing that as hunting season on PC, one-shot killing them to punish them for it.

The only point blank instant kills are when the PC/NPC dives on a grenade. Point BLank Shots do damage (1.5 I believe) direct to HPs but are not instant kills (unless the PC/NPC does not have enough HPs).

As far as I was aware, there is no official rule in HU that has a Point Blank shot have any modifier what so ever. There is an optional rule in the COMW that has point blank shots do double damage when fired into vital points. While there are many house rules, about Point Blank shots, there are, as far as I know, no official rules on them.

For guns it's normal damage to S.D.C./H.P., and half that damage direct to H.P.. There is also a table to roll on for additional effects. For explosives it's double damage direct to H.P.. Shots to the head and heart follow the point blank damage rules but have a separate table. This is from Villains Unlimited (for HU2), pages 16 and 17.

Sounds like neither are instant deaths, though realistically for normal people (esp low PE) they would promise death in most circumstances.

Glistam wrote:

eliakon wrote:

Ranger wrote:

Nightmask wrote:

KillWatch wrote:Really? Point blank shots are instant kills

And look how many GM treat doing that as hunting season on PC, one-shot killing them to punish them for it.

The only point blank instant kills are when the PC/NPC dives on a grenade. Point BLank Shots do damage (1.5 I believe) direct to HPs but are not instant kills (unless the PC/NPC does not have enough HPs).

As far as I was aware, there is no official rule in HU that has a Point Blank shot have any modifier what so ever. There is an optional rule in the COMW that has point blank shots do double damage when fired into vital points. While there are many house rules, about Point Blank shots, there are, as far as I know, no official rules on them.

For guns it's normal damage to S.D.C./H.P., and half that damage direct to H.P.. There is also a table to roll on for additional effects. For explosives it's double damage direct to H.P.. Shots to the head and heart follow the point blank damage rules but have a separate table. This is from Villains Unlimited (for HU2), pages 16 and 17.

Correct, but those rules are clearly labeled as 'optional' as in they are not part of the core rules and are just there to be available for GMs that choose to make point blank shots more dangerous. Which I guess would make them 'less optional' than the COMW rules, but they still fall short of being 'official rules'

All rules are optional, whether they are labelled as such or not.

Glistam wrote:All rules are optional, whether they are labelled as such or not.

Sort of. Some rules are the 'core rules' that everyone uses (unless they house rule them out, or change them) those rules though can generally be assumed to be in use for any discussion since they ARE the basic set up of the game, and that allows for a common ground of discussion. Then there are the optional rules, that are offered as guides on how to do something outside the normal rule set. Those however are strictly optional, thus can not be assumed to be in use in all games.
So a statement that ''players will have SDC" is a fair statement, since SDC will be used in all games (unless house ruled OUT)
but a statement "Point Blank Shots do HP damage and are thus instant death" Is not, since that only applies to games that choose to ADD that rule to the basic set of rules. Which is why I said there is no official rule on them.

Palladium really ought to avoid 'optional' and stick with 'canon to base setting' or something along those lines.

Like in Wormwood, YOU CAN NOT PLAY HOST OR DARK PRIEST. Well... if the GM says you can, then you can. It's just not um... canon or something? *shrug* That's one of the oddest restrictions really. Host and Dark Priests are clearly canonical to the setting it's just... there's a rule against playing them... even though GMs can ignore any rule they like and let players play whoever they like.

It sounds like more of a "don't bug your GM about this, the game wasn't designed to cater to these character types as protagonists" type thing.

SDC will be used in all games (unless house ruled OUT)

Though it be, characters would only possibly have it in armor/shield form in the original PRPG

sometimes there is a good idea that might add a layer of complexity to the game that might intimidate some GMS or **** off some players

Nightmask wrote:Considering how Palladium generally hates instant-kill things I have to wonder why they stuck Teleportation with the risk of an instant kill every time you use it. I guess they only hate you getting to instant kill others but are fine with things rigged just to kill the PC instantly.

Palladium is pretty much full of one hit and you are dead powers and abilities.

Batts

nightfactory: and that's how you know who the heroes are