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I believe I've seen this suggested in the past. I'm curious what the community would expect to find in RIFT's Alaska, especially in regards to tech from the golden age of man.

My personal opinion is that we'd have some stockpiles of US Military vehicles, armor, aircraft, weapons and other equipment.

As NEMA was a peacekeeping outfit, I would think NEMA's gear would have been at least somewhat inferior to what the US Military used for themselves. The Military hardware would have heavier armor, better weaponry (either more damage, better mix of weapons, better range, better payload, or any mix), better abilities (such as faster, stronger, AI controlled weapons, personal drones, force fields?, exotic damage resistance, etc. )

As an example of more capabilities I look to how the Super SAMAS and Striker SAMAS was handled in Coalition War Campaign. The Super SAMAS flies faster, higher, has more weapon systems, and more armor.

If I did a RIFT's Alaska I'd have a under-mountain base discovered with these types of units. (I know the underground thing has been beaten to death, but it works. Also with the size and remote nature of Alaska, additional bases in Alaska could have served as a new experimental weapons staging ground in the Golden-Age.) the purpose of the base was to have assets to protect North American Soil from the threat of Soviet Union aggression and serve as a staging ground for any necessary invasion into Russia and Asia.

How would you "improve" the SAMAS and Glitterboy platforms to better fit in with a military feel and what other type of equipment should we expect to see there? What kind of massive troop transport would they have to serve their invasion parameters? ETC?

We already have an idea of what the US Navy's Golden Age equipment looks like in Rifts Underseas.

NEMA maybe a peacekeeping outfit, but they likely use much of the same hardware. We have two examples of SAMAS that the USAF was working on (New West). It is likely that the CS equipment is really restyled US equipment given they have connections to the pre-Rifts SAMAS and other designs IINM, so its possible the Death's Head Transport is nothing more than a restyled USAF transport.

so its possible the Death's Head Transport is nothing more than a restyled USAF transport.

That an Awesome Idea....I'm stealing it.

Id like to see Rifts Alaska lets fact it that climate requires stuff to be built to survive Armageddon.

ShadowLogan wrote: IINM, so its possible the Death's Head Transport is nothing more than a restyled USAF transport.

I've always figured that, and was hoping for confirmation, with something like a C-5 Galaxy/DHT -looking hybrid craft as the secret ancestor of the DHT. But Rifts Chaos Earth was more neighborhood-to-neighborhood gaming, not city to city, and it's presumed that the larger aircraft are pretty much grounded during the unfolding apocalypse.

I don't think Alaska would have stuff much better than NEMA. As a general rule I considered NEMA's stuff to be the best around at the time...

Also... Suddenly adding, "Oh yeah, well the Government had better stuff!" just reeks of potential power creep which has already made Rifts complicated enough to play/run.

I mean, lets face it, nowadays if it doesn't do a minimum of 4d6 it is considered, by many players, to be "crap" and quite a few won't touch something unless it does 6d6. That is the nature of power creep.

So if we introduce a "Military Chromium Guardsman" that is even one iota better than a conventional Glitterboy, we will have people screaming bloody murder to have it in place of the Glitterboy as it is.

A frozen wasteland filled with beasts, often avoided by all and scarcely patrolled by Tundra Rangers.

We want a Psionics book!

Secondhand Smoke wrote:A frozen wasteland filled with beasts, often avoided by all and scarcely patrolled by Tundra Rangers.

We want a Psionics book!

Mindwerks and Pyscape were sort of the Psionics books, I'm afraid.

How long ago was that?

Book of magic has been compiled and released. Bionics Sourcebook ditto.

Why not a comprehensive book for Psionics?

Riftmaker wrote:Id like to see Rifts Alaska lets fact it that climate requires stuff to be built to survive Armageddon.

Working on a manuscript. KS showed interest in the idea during POH '09. I think someone had written up an Alaska Web world book.

HWalsh wrote:I don't think Alaska would have stuff much better than NEMA. As a general rule I considered NEMA's stuff to be the best around at the time...

Also... Suddenly adding, "Oh yeah, well the Government had better stuff!" just reeks of potential power creep which has already made Rifts complicated enough to play/run.

I mean, lets face it, nowadays if it doesn't do a minimum of 4d6 it is considered, by many players, to be "crap" and quite a few won't touch something unless it does 6d6. That is the nature of power creep.

So if we introduce a "Military Chromium Guardsman" that is even one iota better than a conventional Glitterboy, we will have people screaming bloody murder to have it in place of the Glitterboy as it is.

Really, so the Ticonderoga isn't better than NEMA stuff?

What is the problem with "power creep?" you don't expect things to get better as time goes on? If you were playing a RPG of war from the Civil War to Desert Storm you wouldn't want to... no, expect to see "power creep?" If your playing a game with police against gangs and then in a later book martial law is called you don't think there'd be "power creep" on the side of the "good guys"? In actuality the gangs are chaos the police try to instill order by enforcing the law and martial law imposes order by applying overwhelming force.

masslegion wrote:I believe I've seen this suggested in the past. I'm curious what the community would expect to find in RIFT's Alaska, especially in regards to tech from the golden age of man.

My personal opinion is that we'd have some stockpiles of US Military vehicles, armor, aircraft, weapons and other equipment.

As NEMA was a peacekeeping outfit, I would think NEMA's gear would have been at least somewhat inferior to what the US Military used for themselves. The Military hardware would have heavier armor, better weaponry (either more damage, better mix of weapons, better range, better payload, or any mix), better abilities (such as faster, stronger, AI controlled weapons, personal drones, force fields?, exotic damage resistance, etc. )

As an example of more capabilities I look to how the Super SAMAS and Striker SAMAS was handled in Coalition War Campaign. The Super SAMAS flies faster, higher, has more weapon systems, and more armor.

If I did a RIFT's Alaska I'd have a under-mountain base discovered with these types of units. (I know the underground thing has been beaten to death, but it works. Also with the size and remote nature of Alaska, additional bases in Alaska could have served as a new experimental weapons staging ground in the Golden-Age.) the purpose of the base was to have assets to protect North American Soil from the threat of Soviet Union aggression and serve as a staging ground for any necessary invasion into Russia and Asia.

How would you "improve" the SAMAS and Glitterboy platforms to better fit in with a military feel and what other type of equipment should we expect to see there? What kind of massive troop transport would they have to serve their invasion parameters? ETC?

The thing I don't like about working on the book is that so much of the mythology of Alaskan natives is mirrored by natives in the contiguous united states and Canada, kinda strange how the legends and myths don't REALLY change until you get to mexico.

On NEMA... they are funded by three countries while the U.S. military machine is still funded by one and knowing how dumb we are now with throwing money around to useless things like the U.N. we'd probably end up funding more than half of NEMA too.

Zer0 Kay wrote:

HWalsh wrote:I don't think Alaska would have stuff much better than NEMA. As a general rule I considered NEMA's stuff to be the best around at the time...

Also... Suddenly adding, "Oh yeah, well the Government had better stuff!" just reeks of potential power creep which has already made Rifts complicated enough to play/run.

I mean, lets face it, nowadays if it doesn't do a minimum of 4d6 it is considered, by many players, to be "crap" and quite a few won't touch something unless it does 6d6. That is the nature of power creep.

So if we introduce a "Military Chromium Guardsman" that is even one iota better than a conventional Glitterboy, we will have people screaming bloody murder to have it in place of the Glitterboy as it is.

Really, so the Ticonderoga isn't better than NEMA stuff?

What is the problem with "power creep?" you don't expect things to get better as time goes on? If you were playing a RPG of war from the Civil War to Desert Storm you wouldn't want to... no, expect to see "power creep?" If your playing a game with police against gangs and then in a later book martial law is called you don't think there'd be "power creep" on the side of the "good guys"? In actuality the gangs are chaos the police try to instill order by enforcing the law and martial law imposes order by applying overwhelming force.

Well, and maybe we should see if a mod can split this thread to discuss power creep, but the truth is... Power creep doesn't work that way in real life.

Let me explain...

Let us use the M-1911, a wonderful handgun that still exists today.

The 1911 was created in, well, 1911.

There have been re-designs (such as one 1924) and tweaks to it (in 1953 and later 1991) but none of these "improved the weapon" in the way people think of power creep. The first redesigns were simply things like cutting down the trigger to make the weapon easier for people with smaller hands to shoot. The gun remained largely unchanged for decades on top of decades. To this day, in 2014, over 103 years after the weapon was introduced, the weapon remains mostly the same with improvements being to things like weapon durability...

The M-1911 doesn't "do more damage" now, or anything like that...

And to this day, among handguns of similar caliber and magazine capacity the 1911 is considered to be virtually as good, to the point that it is more or less just a preference.

And that is the problem with power creep.

In the world of Rifts, we aren't talking about the modern world, where people have the internet and ideas are shared more-or-less freely... This is a world where technological advancement would slow to a crawl. Too few educated people. Too few resources. Trade secrets being guarded by force.

The chance of anyone even improving on an old design in any way that is statistically relevant is nearly nothing.

If, using your scenario, the game went to "martial law" I wouldn't expect to see new weapons that do more damage than ever before... I'd expect to see the weapons given to the police change but be things we had already seen.

Kinda the same thing with Rifts.

I wouldn't expect to see, "Well they have Glitterboys that are better."

I'd expect to see, "They have more Glitterboys." or "They have this specific makeup of troops."

I'd see weapons that were previously allowed to SWAT being allowed to common officers...

And that is what I mean by power creep. The more you improve things, to a certain point, the more things get out-modded.

Like I said, Rifts is hard enough to play/run as it is. When a Psi-Sword is supposed to be an awesome weapon of power, but then realistically is kind of a joke, you see power creep.

The only way power creep isn't a bad thing is when everything gets upgraded simultaneously. Kind of like how they did, conveniently, with the Cyber-Knight. They didn't introduce new kinds of CK, they just said, "The CK is now this."

HWalsh wrote:I don't think Alaska would have stuff much better than NEMA. As a general rule I considered NEMA's stuff to be the best around at the time...

Also... Suddenly adding, "Oh yeah, well the Government had better stuff!" just reeks of potential power creep which has already made Rifts complicated enough to play/run.

I mean, lets face it, nowadays if it doesn't do a minimum of 4d6 it is considered, by many players, to be "crap" and quite a few won't touch something unless it does 6d6. That is the nature of power creep.

So if we introduce a "Military Chromium Guardsman" that is even one iota better than a conventional Glitterboy, we will have people screaming bloody murder to have it in place of the Glitterboy as it is.

Well I agree that NEMA gear such as the Chromium Guardsman is clearly top level military gear, it clearly isn't built for peacekeeping.

However I must point out that even in the original Rifts book 6d6 was a fairly standard damage; look at the L20 Pulse Rifle. Back then 3d6 was ok because you could shoot bursts. The real problem with damage is the shift from burst weapons to no-bursts in RUE without considering what happens to guns that can't pulse.

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:

HWalsh wrote:I don't think Alaska would have stuff much better than NEMA. As a general rule I considered NEMA's stuff to be the best around at the time...

Also... Suddenly adding, "Oh yeah, well the Government had better stuff!" just reeks of potential power creep which has already made Rifts complicated enough to play/run.

I mean, lets face it, nowadays if it doesn't do a minimum of 4d6 it is considered, by many players, to be "crap" and quite a few won't touch something unless it does 6d6. That is the nature of power creep.

So if we introduce a "Military Chromium Guardsman" that is even one iota better than a conventional Glitterboy, we will have people screaming bloody murder to have it in place of the Glitterboy as it is.

Really, so the Ticonderoga isn't better than NEMA stuff?

What is the problem with "power creep?" you don't expect things to get better as time goes on? If you were playing a RPG of war from the Civil War to Desert Storm you wouldn't want to... no, expect to see "power creep?" If your playing a game with police against gangs and then in a later book martial law is called you don't think there'd be "power creep" on the side of the "good guys"? In actuality the gangs are chaos the police try to instill order by enforcing the law and martial law imposes order by applying overwhelming force.

Well, and maybe we should see if a mod can split this thread to discuss power creep, but the truth is... Power creep doesn't work that way in real life.

Let me explain...

Let us use the M-1911, a wonderful handgun that still exists today.

The 1911 was created in, well, 1911.

There have been re-designs (such as one 1924) and tweaks to it (in 1953 and later 1991) but none of these "improved the weapon" in the way people think of power creep. The first redesigns were simply things like cutting down the trigger to make the weapon easier for people with smaller hands to shoot. The gun remained largely unchanged for decades on top of decades. To this day, in 2014, over 103 years after the weapon was introduced, the weapon remains mostly the same with improvements being to things like weapon durability...

The M-1911 doesn't "do more damage" now, or anything like that...

And to this day, among handguns of similar caliber and magazine capacity the 1911 is considered to be virtually as good, to the point that it is more or less just a preference.

And that is the problem with power creep.

In the world of Rifts, we aren't talking about the modern world, where people have the internet and ideas are shared more-or-less freely... This is a world where technological advancement would slow to a crawl. Too few educated people. Too few resources. Trade secrets being guarded by force.

The chance of anyone even improving on an old design in any way that is statistically relevant is nearly nothing.

If, using your scenario, the game went to "martial law" I wouldn't expect to see new weapons that do more damage than ever before... I'd expect to see the weapons given to the police change but be things we had already seen.

Kinda the same thing with Rifts.

I wouldn't expect to see, "Well they have Glitterboys that are better."

I'd expect to see, "They have more Glitterboys." or "They have this specific makeup of troops."

I'd see weapons that were previously allowed to SWAT being allowed to common officers...

And that is what I mean by power creep. The more you improve things, to a certain point, the more things get out-modded.

Like I said, Rifts is hard enough to play/run as it is. When a Psi-Sword is supposed to be an awesome weapon of power, but then realistically is kind of a joke, you see power creep.

The only way power creep isn't a bad thing is when everything gets upgraded simultaneously. Kind of like how they did, conveniently, with the Cyber-Knight. They didn't introduce new kinds of CK, they just said, "The CK is now this."

?? Martial law doesn't go from police to uparmed police. The responsibility of order is given to the U.S. military.

Power creep in rifts doesn't take a pistol and make a small improvement on it. The real life comparison would be like taking a HMMWV and up armoring it and then putting an electric turret with an HMG in it and maybe the next "creep" would be to go to a hellfire missile turret. The "creep" that was present in SA2 wasn't even creep it was completely different equipment. The power creep in rifts isn't modifying equipment it is coming up with new designs. Your analogy with a single piece of equipment is thereby poor. It would have been more accurate to compare something that actually changed in technology like going from the musket ball to the conical bullet or for a smaller jump from hand packed musket loads to preloaded paper cartridges.

Zer0 Kay wrote:Power creep in rifts doesn't take a pistol and make a small improvement on it. The real life comparison would be like taking a HMMWV and up armoring it and then putting an electric turret with an HMG in it and maybe the next "creep" would be to go to a hellfire missile turret. The "creep" that was present in SA2 wasn't even creep it was completely different equipment. The power creep in rifts isn't modifying equipment it is coming up with new designs. Your analogy with a single piece of equipment is thereby poor. It would have been more accurate to compare something that actually changed in technology like going from the musket ball to the conical bullet or for a smaller jump from hand packed musket loads to preloaded paper cartridges.

I strongly disagree.

The problem with creep in Rifts is from each book adding better and better stuff, until the stuff from the main book is rendered jokingly weak... That is simply what happened.

I mean, look at the stuff imported into RUE and put it up against previous editions of straight Rifts. It gets bad.

I remember, even pre-bursts, a 3D6 M.D. weapon not being that bad... Now... Like I said 4D6 is a joke, and the (according to the book) "Popular" Wilks 1D6 M.D. laser... How popular can it possibly be? It is so underpowered nobody would even consider using it seriously.

HWalsh wrote:I remember, even pre-bursts, a 3D6 M.D. weapon not being that bad... Now... Like I said 4D6 is a joke, and the (according to the book) "Popular" Wilks 1D6 M.D. laser... How popular can it possibly be? It is so underpowered nobody would even consider using it seriously.

I'm not sure what you mean by "pre-bursts", 3d6 was good when you could burst. In this edition I consider a 1d6 pistol and 3d6 rifle to be level 1 weapons; the GM should use the old weapons as basic weapons for low level characters and make the better weapons available at higher levels thereby keeping damage tied to level.

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:Power creep in rifts doesn't take a pistol and make a small improvement on it. The real life comparison would be like taking a HMMWV and up armoring it and then putting an electric turret with an HMG in it and maybe the next "creep" would be to go to a hellfire missile turret. The "creep" that was present in SA2 wasn't even creep it was completely different equipment. The power creep in rifts isn't modifying equipment it is coming up with new designs. Your analogy with a single piece of equipment is thereby poor. It would have been more accurate to compare something that actually changed in technology like going from the musket ball to the conical bullet or for a smaller jump from hand packed musket loads to preloaded paper cartridges.

I strongly disagree.

The problem with creep in Rifts is from each book adding better and better stuff, until the stuff from the main book is rendered jokingly weak... That is simply what happened.

I mean, look at the stuff imported into RUE and put it up against previous editions of straight Rifts. It gets bad.

I remember, even pre-bursts, a 3D6 M.D. weapon not being that bad... Now... Like I said 4D6 is a joke, and the (according to the book) "Popular" Wilks 1D6 M.D. laser... How popular can it possibly be? It is so underpowered nobody would even consider using it seriously.

You forget they are not a joke everything that was burst capable back in RMB was able to multiply their damage up to what x10? Hardly a joke. It is simply that most of the new stuff makes the old stuff look weak because the old stuff didn't calculate burst into damage because it was a separate rule, ever since they removed burst as a separate mechanic everything appears to have gotten powerful because you see the damage listings for burst damage on the weapon.

Zer0 Kay wrote: You forget they are not a joke everything that was burst capable back in RMB was able to multiply their damage up to what x10? Hardly a joke. It is simply that most of the new stuff makes the old stuff look weak because the old stuff didn't calculate burst into damage because it was a separate rule, ever since they removed burst as a separate mechanic everything appears to have gotten powerful because you see the damage listings for burst damage on the weapon.

Yeah that's what I was getting at. Rifts damage balance has never recovered from those changes.

Of course the x10 damage was never a very good option because it took 2 attacks. The short (x2) and long (x5) bursts were generally better and even with the changes from Conversion Book 1 (long burst became x3, full magazine burst became x7) a lot of weapons still made sense. A 3d6 rifle could do a lot of damage but you would burn through the e-clips which was a good risk vs. reward.

grandmaster z0b wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote: You forget they are not a joke everything that was burst capable back in RMB was able to multiply their damage up to what x10? Hardly a joke. It is simply that most of the new stuff makes the old stuff look weak because the old stuff didn't calculate burst into damage because it was a separate rule, ever since they removed burst as a separate mechanic everything appears to have gotten powerful because you see the damage listings for burst damage on the weapon.

Yeah that's what I was getting at. Rifts damage balance has never recovered from those changes.

Of course the x10 damage was never a very good option because it took 2 attacks. The short (x2) and long (x5) bursts were generally better and even with the changes from Conversion Book 1 (long burst became x3, full magazine burst became x7) a lot of weapons still made sense. A 3d6 rifle could do a lot of damage but you would burn through the e-clips which was a good risk vs. reward.

We still burn through ammo with the larger damage rolls since they're multi round bursts. I think it was all because of someone's need to try to make .50 cal do MDC in burst, even though original RT MDC rules made certain that we understood that no matter how many bullets were thrown at an MDC structure, unless a single round could do MDC, no damage is done, except maybe scratching the paintjob.

masslegion wrote:I believe I've seen this suggested in the past. I'm curious what the community would expect to find in RIFT's Alaska, especially in regards to tech from the golden age of man.

My personal opinion is that we'd have some stockpiles of US Military vehicles, armor, aircraft, weapons and other equipment.

As NEMA was a peacekeeping outfit, I would think NEMA's gear would have been at least somewhat inferior to what the US Military used for themselves. The Military hardware would have heavier armor, better weaponry (either more damage, better mix of weapons, better range, better payload, or any mix), better abilities (such as faster, stronger, AI controlled weapons, personal drones, force fields?, exotic damage resistance, etc. )

As an example of more capabilities I look to how the Super SAMAS and Striker SAMAS was handled in Coalition War Campaign. The Super SAMAS flies faster, higher, has more weapon systems, and more armor.

If I did a RIFT's Alaska I'd have a under-mountain base discovered with these types of units. (I know the underground thing has been beaten to death, but it works. Also with the size and remote nature of Alaska, additional bases in Alaska could have served as a new experimental weapons staging ground in the Golden-Age.) the purpose of the base was to have assets to protect North American Soil from the threat of Soviet Union aggression and serve as a staging ground for any necessary invasion into Russia and Asia.

How would you "improve" the SAMAS and Glitterboy platforms to better fit in with a military feel and what other type of equipment should we expect to see there? What kind of massive troop transport would they have to serve their invasion parameters? ETC?

Actually rifts canada covers areas very close to alaska if not in alaska proper. So we know about the golden age base and equipment the mounties had which would be very similar equipment wise to what you would find in alaskan bases if any survived. Rifts canada also deals pretty well with the inuit people from that area. One thing to note though is there is a strong chance that no tech bases in alaska survived. The vast majority of all development in alaska is on the coasts due to how hard/impossible it is to build and maintain roads in vast areas of that state so most major cities/bases depend on sea transport for shipping of bulk goods. With what happened after the cataclysm it is unlikely there is anything salvageable of those areas that previously were on the coast and now are likely underwater. Also the western side of alaska is highly prone to large earthquakes as is and with those ripping through the area after the cataclysm what the sea did not claim likely was destroyed by earth quakes.

Secondhand Smoke wrote:How long ago was that?

Book of magic has been compiled and released. Bionics Sourcebook ditto.

Why not a comprehensive book for Psionics?

The GMG is pretty much the comprehensive guide for psionics combined with the RUE. The problem is there really has been little in the way of general usage non OCC specific psionic additions other than psyscape. Mindwerks had some implants that altered psionics a bit but the only supplement other than the main books that had any actual new psionics usable by any psionic OCC was psyscape.

There have been a few others like lemurias spouter OCC that have some specific to their OCC new psionic powers available but there is almost no point listing them in a compilation volume unless you include the OCC itself.

As much as I would love to see another federation of magic type source book that adds magic invocations psionics are really the type of characters in most dire need of a "toy box book". It seems like they are on a bit of a north america kick again hell maybe a minion war psi batallion book would be a good way to introduce some new psi stuff to the game that could be picked up by other psychics not just specific OCC.

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:Power creep in rifts doesn't take a pistol and make a small improvement on it. The real life comparison would be like taking a HMMWV and up armoring it and then putting an electric turret with an HMG in it and maybe the next "creep" would be to go to a hellfire missile turret. The "creep" that was present in SA2 wasn't even creep it was completely different equipment. The power creep in rifts isn't modifying equipment it is coming up with new designs. Your analogy with a single piece of equipment is thereby poor. It would have been more accurate to compare something that actually changed in technology like going from the musket ball to the conical bullet or for a smaller jump from hand packed musket loads to preloaded paper cartridges.

I strongly disagree.

The problem with creep in Rifts is from each book adding better and better stuff, until the stuff from the main book is rendered jokingly weak... That is simply what happened.

I mean, look at the stuff imported into RUE and put it up against previous editions of straight Rifts. It gets bad.

I remember, even pre-bursts, a 3D6 M.D. weapon not being that bad... Now... Like I said 4D6 is a joke, and the (according to the book) "Popular" Wilks 1D6 M.D. laser... How popular can it possibly be? It is so underpowered nobody would even consider using it seriously.

A pistol doing 1d6 MDC would likely be popular amongst people who want some defense from hostile critter but don't need or cannot afford more. If a bear comes at you a 1d6 MDC pistol will still one shot it. Also it will kill anybody not wearing MDC body armor dead instantly on even a glancing hit so as a weapon thats easily concealable in town where most people are not going to be wearing any MDC armor and what armor they are using is likely similar to the new NG armored clothing stuff which is single to low double digit MDC values pretty sufficient punch for that environment.

Weapons that do 3d6 or 4d6 MDC are still fine for most uses not every enemy is going to be running around in heavy EBA armor and vs opponents in light or medium body armor something that does 3d6 or 4d6 is plenty damaging.

Damage values got a bit squirrely for a while but the damage range of hand weapons seems to have gotten reigned in a bit post RUE which does have some adverse impacts of some guns here and there but overall was necessary to reign in stat inflation that happens naturally over time in any system if its out long enough.

You could make a character out of the old RMB using only gear from that time frame and still be a totally usable character. MDC armor has gone up about 20% for the highest end combat armors and MDC for weapons is in general around the same other than pulse weapons and the first pulse weapon from the source book 1 that came out shortly after the RMB is still one of the most powerful hand held weapons in the game at 1d6x10 damage. Also in the old RMB I believe you could get one of the old NG heavy ion weapons that was 1d4x10.

While some weapons may not be the best thing out there does not make them useless.

kaid wrote:You could make a character out of the old RMB using only gear from that time frame and still be a totally usable character.

Right.
But if you use only the very best gear in the RMB, you're going to net out as average overall compared to somebody who's geared up from other books.
That's power creep in action.

MDC armor has gone up about 20% for the highest end combat armors and MDC for weapons is in general around the same other than pulse weapons and the first pulse weapon from the source book 1 that came out shortly after the RMB is still one of the most powerful hand held weapons in the game at 1d6x10 damage.

ONE of... but it's gone from being THE best, to being outdone by a decent number of weapons.

Also in the old RMB I believe you could get one of the old NG heavy ion weapons that was 1d4x10.

Right.
Which used to be top-notch... but now it's pretty average.

kaid wrote:

masslegion wrote:I believe I've seen this suggested in the past. I'm curious what the community would expect to find in RIFT's Alaska, especially in regards to tech from the golden age of man.

My personal opinion is that we'd have some stockpiles of US Military vehicles, armor, aircraft, weapons and other equipment.

As NEMA was a peacekeeping outfit, I would think NEMA's gear would have been at least somewhat inferior to what the US Military used for themselves. The Military hardware would have heavier armor, better weaponry (either more damage, better mix of weapons, better range, better payload, or any mix), better abilities (such as faster, stronger, AI controlled weapons, personal drones, force fields?, exotic damage resistance, etc. )

As an example of more capabilities I look to how the Super SAMAS and Striker SAMAS was handled in Coalition War Campaign. The Super SAMAS flies faster, higher, has more weapon systems, and more armor.

If I did a RIFT's Alaska I'd have a under-mountain base discovered with these types of units. (I know the underground thing has been beaten to death, but it works. Also with the size and remote nature of Alaska, additional bases in Alaska could have served as a new experimental weapons staging ground in the Golden-Age.) the purpose of the base was to have assets to protect North American Soil from the threat of Soviet Union aggression and serve as a staging ground for any necessary invasion into Russia and Asia.

How would you "improve" the SAMAS and Glitterboy platforms to better fit in with a military feel and what other type of equipment should we expect to see there? What kind of massive troop transport would they have to serve their invasion parameters? ETC?

Actually rifts canada covers areas very close to alaska if not in alaska proper. So we know about the golden age base and equipment the mounties had which would be very similar equipment wise to what you would find in alaskan bases if any survived. Rifts canada also deals pretty well with the inuit people from that area. One thing to note though is there is a strong chance that no tech bases in alaska survived. The vast majority of all development in alaska is on the coasts due to how hard/impossible it is to build and maintain roads in vast areas of that state so most major cities/bases depend on sea transport for shipping of bulk goods. With what happened after the cataclysm it is unlikely there is anything salvageable of those areas that previously were on the coast and now are likely underwater. Also the western side of alaska is highly prone to large earthquakes as is and with those ripping through the area after the cataclysm what the sea did not claim likely was destroyed by earth quakes.

Incorrect. We know, according to spirit west that there is at least 1 tech base in Alaska.
THE major city would be mostly untouched by tidal waves and rising water as it is protected in an inlet and over 120 feet where it meets the water in most places. Elmo and Rich are the same except Rich comes down to sealevel on the north end near Eagle River, which is deeper into the inlet. It is more likely that Anchorage and JBER (J-bear) was descimated by Earthquakes and all the volcanoes probably went off at the same time covering the place in ash and darkening the skies for weeks.
But Elmo has... never mind. I'll just say it isn't implosible for their to be survivors, though I doubt even half of the 500,000 in Anchorage survived.

HWalsh wrote:Let us use the M-1911, a wonderful handgun that still exists today.

The 1911 was created in, well, 1911.

There have been re-designs (such as one 1924) and tweaks to it (in 1953 and later 1991) but none of these "improved the weapon" in the way people think of power creep. The first redesigns were simply things like cutting down the trigger to make the weapon easier for people with smaller hands to shoot. The gun remained largely unchanged for decades on top of decades. To this day, in 2014, over 103 years after the weapon was introduced, the weapon remains mostly the same with improvements being to things like weapon durability...

The M-1911 doesn't "do more damage" now, or anything like that...

And to this day, among handguns of similar caliber and magazine capacity the 1911 is considered to be virtually as good, to the point that it is more or less just a preference.

And that is the problem with power creep.

Well said.

Killer Cyborg wrote:

HWalsh wrote:Let us use the M-1911, a wonderful handgun that still exists today.

The 1911 was created in, well, 1911.

There have been re-designs (such as one 1924) and tweaks to it (in 1953 and later 1991) but none of these "improved the weapon" in the way people think of power creep. The first redesigns were simply things like cutting down the trigger to make the weapon easier for people with smaller hands to shoot. The gun remained largely unchanged for decades on top of decades. To this day, in 2014, over 103 years after the weapon was introduced, the weapon remains mostly the same with improvements being to things like weapon durability...

The M-1911 doesn't "do more damage" now, or anything like that...

And to this day, among handguns of similar caliber and magazine capacity the 1911 is considered to be virtually as good, to the point that it is more or less just a preference.

And that is the problem with power creep.

Well said.

So then a sub machinegun is power creep from the 1911? An O'Dwyer pistol would be power creep?

We gradually climbed the "tech tree" but the distance between branches going up grows shorter as time goes on. For Rifts they stated by using the branches at the tops for spears and then as they looked below the canopy in one section they found a big leap from spear and then in another they find tech that was even higher up and in some locations they have people who can actually develop on to that and they aren't going to be doing little minor things like cutting down triggers because it doesn't make the weapon more effective against the threat surrounding them. They aren't going to add vents to reduce weapon climb. No instead the big warmachines are going to work on make better killy things and leave the modifications to individuals.

Zer0 Kay wrote:
So then a sub machinegun is power creep from the 1911? An O'Dwyer pistol would be power creep?

We gradually climbed the "tech tree" but the distance between branches going up grows shorter as time goes on. For Rifts they stated by using the branches at the tops for spears and then as they looked below the canopy in one section they found a big leap from spear and then in another they find tech that was even higher up and in some locations they have people who can actually develop on to that and they aren't going to be doing little minor things like cutting down triggers because it doesn't make the weapon more effective against the threat surrounding them. They aren't going to add vents to reduce weapon climb. No instead the big warmachines are going to work on make better killy things and leave the modifications to individuals.

You have a little faulty logic however.

You assume that modern companies don't constantly try to make better killing weapons... They do.

The problem, in reality, is that there are limits.

You want to make a handgun do more damage? You either modify the bullet directly (hollow point, armor piercing, etc) which *always* comes with a downside. Alternatively, you make the bullet bigger, or have more powder in it...

Now look at Rifts reality... Energy weapons use E-Clips (short or long) with a universal storage capacity... Meaning they have to have more or less universal designs.

Put it this way...

If I have a 9mm any other 9mm is going to be, more or less, the same in stopping power.

The same should be in rifts...

If NG makes a pistol that uses a standard E-Clip, that gets 10 shots out of it, than ANYONE ELSE should be able to get a similar result.

That's just how technology works.

Same base energy. Same base amount. Unless they come up with a new capacitor or something that nobody else can figure out others will copy it.

This happens in our world too.

Sony owns the blu-ray and the reason nobody else marketed their own blu-ray players wasn't because they couldn't figure it out. It was because of copyright and patent laws which, in Rifts, don't exist.

ummm... guys.... I thought this was about Alaska?

You guys are worst than herding cats.

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:
So then a sub machinegun is power creep from the 1911? An O'Dwyer pistol would be power creep?

We gradually climbed the "tech tree" but the distance between branches going up grows shorter as time goes on. For Rifts they stated by using the branches at the tops for spears and then as they looked below the canopy in one section they found a big leap from spear and then in another they find tech that was even higher up and in some locations they have people who can actually develop on to that and they aren't going to be doing little minor things like cutting down triggers because it doesn't make the weapon more effective against the threat surrounding them. They aren't going to add vents to reduce weapon climb. No instead the big warmachines are going to work on make better killy things and leave the modifications to individuals.

You have a little faulty logic however.

You assume that modern companies don't constantly try to make better killing weapons... They do.

The problem, in reality, is that there are limits.

You want to make a handgun do more damage? You either modify the bullet directly (hollow point, armor piercing, etc) which *always* comes with a downside. Alternatively, you make the bullet bigger, or have more powder in it...

Now look at Rifts reality... Energy weapons use E-Clips (short or long) with a universal storage capacity... Meaning they have to have more or less universal designs.

Put it this way...

If I have a 9mm any other 9mm is going to be, more or less, the same in stopping power.

The same should be in rifts...

If NG makes a pistol that uses a standard E-Clip, that gets 10 shots out of it, than ANYONE ELSE should be able to get a similar result.

That's just how technology works.

Same base energy. Same base amount. Unless they come up with a new capacitor or something that nobody else can figure out others will copy it.

This happens in our world too.

Sony owns the blu-ray and the reason nobody else marketed their own blu-ray players wasn't because they couldn't figure it out. It was because of copyright and patent laws which, in Rifts, don't exist.

Not quite. A Teflon coated AP bullet neither uses more powder or a larger round, same goes for the hollowpoint.

With energy weapons their is no round to change. Instead you have different lasing media, different types of radiation and radiation emmiters and power supply systems for lasers. For PBWs there is choice of particles, magnetic accelerators, timing, beam width and one thing that PB doesn't do that a real PBeam would do is use a laser to ionize a path prior to particle ejection allowing for a more cohesive and longer ranged beam. If ya haven't gotten it yet there are actually more things to alter and tinker with on an energy weapon to make it a better killing machine than there is on a regular gun.

Wait so rereading your post are you saying there should be no power creep because everyone can copy now? How is the CS or NG or Wilks gonna copy something from SA with the noted difficulty of getting there and back? Besides it isn't copy right that does it now it's if you steal our tech me and the groups allied with me ate going to come and kill you and if we happen not to be the nice sort we'll kill your company and family too... Unless you have more people backing you... Then we'll. Just grumble and try to assassinate you.

Phaze wrote:ummm... guys.... I thought this was about Alaska?

You guys are worst than herding cats.

What? No way we... Squirrel!

Zer0 Kay wrote:

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:
So then a sub machinegun is power creep from the 1911? An O'Dwyer pistol would be power creep?

We gradually climbed the "tech tree" but the distance between branches going up grows shorter as time goes on. For Rifts they stated by using the branches at the tops for spears and then as they looked below the canopy in one section they found a big leap from spear and then in another they find tech that was even higher up and in some locations they have people who can actually develop on to that and they aren't going to be doing little minor things like cutting down triggers because it doesn't make the weapon more effective against the threat surrounding them. They aren't going to add vents to reduce weapon climb. No instead the big warmachines are going to work on make better killy things and leave the modifications to individuals.

You have a little faulty logic however.

You assume that modern companies don't constantly try to make better killing weapons... They do.

The problem, in reality, is that there are limits.

You want to make a handgun do more damage? You either modify the bullet directly (hollow point, armor piercing, etc) which *always* comes with a downside. Alternatively, you make the bullet bigger, or have more powder in it...

Now look at Rifts reality... Energy weapons use E-Clips (short or long) with a universal storage capacity... Meaning they have to have more or less universal designs.

Put it this way...

If I have a 9mm any other 9mm is going to be, more or less, the same in stopping power.

The same should be in rifts...

If NG makes a pistol that uses a standard E-Clip, that gets 10 shots out of it, than ANYONE ELSE should be able to get a similar result.

That's just how technology works.

Same base energy. Same base amount. Unless they come up with a new capacitor or something that nobody else can figure out others will copy it.

This happens in our world too.

Sony owns the blu-ray and the reason nobody else marketed their own blu-ray players wasn't because they couldn't figure it out. It was because of copyright and patent laws which, in Rifts, don't exist.

Not quite. A Teflon coated AP bullet neither uses more powder or a larger round, same goes for the hollowpoint.

With energy weapons their is no round to change. Instead you have different lasing media, different types of radiation and radiation emmiters and power supply systems for lasers. For PBWs there is choice of particles, magnetic accelerators, timing, beam width and one thing that PB doesn't do that a real PBeam would do is use a laser to ionize a path prior to particle ejection allowing for a more cohesive and longer ranged beam. If ya haven't gotten it yet there are actually more things to alter and tinker with on an energy weapon to make it a better killing machine than there is on a regular gun.

Wait so rereading your post are you saying there should be no power creep because everyone can copy now? How is the CS or NG or Wilks gonna copy something from SA with the noted difficulty of getting there and back? Besides it isn't copy right that does it now it's if you steal our tech me and the groups allied with me ate going to come and kill you and if we happen not to be the nice sort we'll kill your company and family too... Unless you have more people backing you... Then we'll. Just grumble and try to assassinate you.

I didn't say hollow points and Teflon increase powder or bullet size. They replace the bullet. Hollow points are modified bullets.

The fact is the same though, you would have different e-clips.

Other than that, you aren't getting better performance without someone ripping it off. If a company like NG got hold of a SA weapon, I promise you, they'd crack how it works and remarket it... Instantly.

We see this in the real world though...

Example: PS3 was blu-ray which was factually superior to DVD and HD-DVD. Companies did not support HD-DVD and now even Microsoft's XBox One uses blu-ray. Why? Better technology is better.

Companies do not market inferior products.

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:

HWalsh wrote:

Zer0 Kay wrote:
So then a sub machinegun is power creep from the 1911? An O'Dwyer pistol would be power creep?

We gradually climbed the "tech tree" but the distance between branches going up grows shorter as time goes on. For Rifts they stated by using the branches at the tops for spears and then as they looked below the canopy in one section they found a big leap from spear and then in another they find tech that was even higher up and in some locations they have people who can actually develop on to that and they aren't going to be doing little minor things like cutting down triggers because it doesn't make the weapon more effective against the threat surrounding them. They aren't going to add vents to reduce weapon climb. No instead the big warmachines are going to work on make better killy things and leave the modifications to individuals.

You have a little faulty logic however.

You assume that modern companies don't constantly try to make better killing weapons... They do.

The problem, in reality, is that there are limits.

You want to make a handgun do more damage? You either modify the bullet directly (hollow point, armor piercing, etc) which *always* comes with a downside. Alternatively, you make the bullet bigger, or have more powder in it...

Now look at Rifts reality... Energy weapons use E-Clips (short or long) with a universal storage capacity... Meaning they have to have more or less universal designs.

Put it this way...

If I have a 9mm any other 9mm is going to be, more or less, the same in stopping power.

The same should be in rifts...

If NG makes a pistol that uses a standard E-Clip, that gets 10 shots out of it, than ANYONE ELSE should be able to get a similar result.

That's just how technology works.

Same base energy. Same base amount. Unless they come up with a new capacitor or something that nobody else can figure out others will copy it.

This happens in our world too.

Sony owns the blu-ray and the reason nobody else marketed their own blu-ray players wasn't because they couldn't figure it out. It was because of copyright and patent laws which, in Rifts, don't exist.

Not quite. A Teflon coated AP bullet neither uses more powder or a larger round, same goes for the hollowpoint.

With energy weapons their is no round to change. Instead you have different lasing media, different types of radiation and radiation emmiters and power supply systems for lasers. For PBWs there is choice of particles, magnetic accelerators, timing, beam width and one thing that PB doesn't do that a real PBeam would do is use a laser to ionize a path prior to particle ejection allowing for a more cohesive and longer ranged beam. If ya haven't gotten it yet there are actually more things to alter and tinker with on an energy weapon to make it a better killing machine than there is on a regular gun.

Wait so rereading your post are you saying there should be no power creep because everyone can copy now? How is the CS or NG or Wilks gonna copy something from SA with the noted difficulty of getting there and back? Besides it isn't copy right that does it now it's if you steal our tech me and the groups allied with me ate going to come and kill you and if we happen not to be the nice sort we'll kill your company and family too... Unless you have more people backing you... Then we'll. Just grumble and try to assassinate you.

I didn't say hollow points and Teflon increase powder or bullet size. They replace the bullet. Hollow points are modified bullets.

The fact is the same though, you would have different e-clips.

Other than that, you aren't getting better performance without someone ripping it off. If a company like NG got hold of a SA weapon, I promise you, they'd crack how it works and remarket it... Instantly.

We see this in the real world though...

Example: PS3 was blu-ray which was factually superior to DVD and HD-DVD. Companies did not support HD-DVD and now even Microsoft's XBox One uses blu-ray. Why? Better technology is better.

Companies do not market inferior products.

Sorry your right, you said in the alternative. What's the downside of Teflon coated?

No it doesn't require a different w-clip that is like sating a new computer requires a different power source every generation. Funny how we're still using what 110V in the US. A laser can use the same power supply, use the same amount of power and still cause different damages based on a variety of other components in it.

If a company like NG... Huh well is that why in canon it states that the NG hasn't been able to figure out how to build a rifle size scatter laser from the mech size one they stole from Wilks?
They can steal, they can copy but apparently they're poor at development. Sure everyone can steal, apparently they don't because we don't see every company coming out with knock offs of everyone else's stuff. So apparently even companies in Rifts don't like to be known as un original or thieves.

Haha you think the media market is driven by what tech is better. Oh, your funny. It is who ever can garner the largest market share. Otherwise explain inferior VHS winning over Betamax.

Phaze wrote:ummm... guys.... I thought this was about Alaska?

You guys are worst than herding cats.

I do think I may be semi purposefully unconsciously derailing it. As I said I'm trying to write the manuscript and if someone comes up with an idea here and I have one similar, especially now since I've been here. Then I get in trouble. If I have to ask to use it and I didn't put it down first obviously I can't claim originality. So... I dunnoh.

Hey current free lancers can ya help me out here?

Zer0 Kay wrote:Sorry your right, you said in the alternative. What's the downside of Teflon coated?

Teflon coated ammo was actually superior due to not being a lead base slug. The Teflon didn't do much, the harder core did, but I digress.

The downside of any kind of enhanced penetration is that they do less damage. A round that tumbles when it pierces shreds internal organs and does tremendous damage. Weapons with high penitration do less damage because they tend to go clean through.

So they are better against armored targets but poorer against non-armored targets.

Right. Not straight power creep. Better penetration, less damage.
It's balanced.

An alternate view to the idea that the regular Army would have superior weaponry would be that they have greater AMOUNTS of weaponry, not necessarily BETTER weaponry. NEMA's more than an amped-up SWAT team; they're elite intervention specialists, tactical experts, ready to drop in on terrorists and miscreants who have acquired mega-technology(stolen, perhaps, from the regular military arsenals).

What the regular military WILL have that differs from the NEMA equipment will be the heavy artillery; barrage missile launchers, AA weaponry, tube artillery, smart bomb launchers, medium and long range missiles, heavy transports, ships(New Navy). Stuff you use for leveling neighborhoods and cities, not spot-zapping targets.
Of course, it all depends on what direction national policies were going, with regards to the world situation. Current thinking in our present day is a smaller, more highly trained, more responsive tactical military, backed by strategic assets like air strike capability, aircraft carriers, and the sleeping giant of the nuclear arsenal.
The direction NEMA was taking.
Of course, as MDC technologies became more prevalent, and NEMA intervention teams found themselves with the potential of being overwhelmed by increasingly better armed opposition forces, the trend might have reversed, towards a bigger regular military equipped again for the tactical role to meet the larger threat forces with both numbers AND high tech. That's when you'd start seeing the various services agitating for more specialized and service-specific designs in the traditional inter-service rivalries for the defense spending budget.

Killer Cyborg wrote:Right. Not straight power creep. Better penetration, less damage.
It's balanced.

Oh no then we shorten the gas tube on a rifle and increase the fire rate... Power creep. Oh know some dude named Gattling mad a multirifle cannon... power creep.
Oh no someone just developed weaponized lasers... Power creep.
What Germany just launched a ling range rocket over the channel... Power creep.
If there is no advancement in the weapons not between books so much but definitely through time, there is no point in printing a book never mind an RPG, and if your just buying it for the story... That's called a novel.

Zer0 Kay wrote:

Killer Cyborg wrote:Right. Not straight power creep. Better penetration, less damage.
It's balanced.

Oh no then we shorten the gas tube on a rifle and increase the fire rate... Power creep. Oh know some dude named Gattling mad a multirifle cannon... power creep.
Oh no someone just developed weaponized lasers... Power creep.
What Germany just launched a ling range rocket over the channel... Power creep.
If there is no advancement in the weapons not between books so much but definitely through time, there is no point in printing a book never mind an RPG, and if your just buying it for the story... That's called a novel.

Those things you list aren't actually power creep.

Zer0 Kay wrote:

Killer Cyborg wrote:Right. Not straight power creep. Better penetration, less damage.
It's balanced.

Oh no then we shorten the gas tube on a rifle and increase the fire rate... Power creep. Oh know some dude named Gattling mad a multirifle cannon... power creep.
Oh no someone just developed weaponized lasers... Power creep.
What Germany just launched a ling range rocket over the channel... Power creep.
If there is no advancement in the weapons not between books so much but definitely through time, there is no point in printing a book never mind an RPG, and if your just buying it for the story... That's called a novel.

Weapons do improve over time. In a pretty much universal way.

Someone here got it right, NEMA and the Military had the use equipment. The Military had more of the bigger units, but they had the same kind of equipment.

See, I don't need *better* equipment in a new book. I need new OCC's not more powerful ones, just new ones. I want balanced things... If it has more armor, it should be slower. If it hits hard, it needs to be less accurate, or have less shots.

masslegion wrote:I believe I've seen this suggested in the past. I'm curious what the community would expect to find in RIFT's Alaska, especially in regards to tech from the golden age of man.

My personal opinion is that we'd have some stockpiles of US Military vehicles, armor, aircraft, weapons and other equipment.

As NEMA was a peacekeeping outfit, I would think NEMA's gear would have been at least somewhat inferior to what the US Military used for themselves. The Military hardware would have heavier armor, better weaponry (either more damage, better mix of weapons, better range, better payload, or any mix), better abilities (such as faster, stronger, AI controlled weapons, personal drones, force fields?, exotic damage resistance, etc. )

As an example of more capabilities I look to how the Super SAMAS and Striker SAMAS was handled in Coalition War Campaign. The Super SAMAS flies faster, higher, has more weapon systems, and more armor.

If I did a RIFT's Alaska I'd have a under-mountain base discovered with these types of units. (I know the underground thing has been beaten to death, but it works. Also with the size and remote nature of Alaska, additional bases in Alaska could have served as a new experimental weapons staging ground in the Golden-Age.) the purpose of the base was to have assets to protect North American Soil from the threat of Soviet Union aggression and serve as a staging ground for any necessary invasion into Russia and Asia.

How would you "improve" the SAMAS and Glitterboy platforms to better fit in with a military feel and what other type of equipment should we expect to see there? What kind of massive troop transport would they have to serve their invasion parameters? ETC?

OK back to the OP.

I'm fairly sure NEMA was the pinnacle of military tech in the Golden Age. There's nothing "peace keeping" about the Glitterboy or Silver Eagle; they are clearly military grade assault weapons. Neither have any anti-riot weapons such as smoke or tear gas grenades, rubber bullets etc. or SDC capabilities making them useless for anything but taking on other MDC units unless your idea of peace keeping is to blow people into pulp. In the Golden Age only a handful of the worlds top militaries had MDC technology, so the only point in building them was war with another world power.

That being said there could be a lot of military things in the base that aren't currently in the books that could be stationed there: very long range artillery (rail guns firing guided shells), MDC surveillance drones and assault drones, MD anti-aircraft guns etc.

Personally I've seen enough world books with new military toys in them in, give me some new and interesting. Something weird and unexpected that would make Alaska stand out as an area to go adventuring in and with lots of plot hooks.

grandmaster z0b wrote:[

Personally I've seen enough world books with new military toys in them in, give me some new and interesting. Something weird and unexpected that would make Alaska stand out as an area to go adventuring in and with lots of plot hooks.

It's where the US military is hiding an alien spacecraft(everybody's looking in the American West, but it's really stashed deep inside the Alaskan wilderness).

taalismn wrote:

grandmaster z0b wrote:[

Personally I've seen enough world books with new military toys in them in, give me some new and interesting. Something weird and unexpected that would make Alaska stand out as an area to go adventuring in and with lots of plot hooks.

It's where the US military is hiding an alien spacecraft(everybody's looking in the American West, but it's really stashed deep inside the Alaskan wilderness).

Agreed!

Give us new and different!

I wanna see like interesting enemies! Cool new settings!

I love the ARCHIE 3 stuff in SB-1.

I love the Xi... The Xit... The bug people!

If Alaska is to be a book, I wanna see something cool in it. Not new hardware. New stuff to see and do.

taalismn wrote:

grandmaster z0b wrote:[

Personally I've seen enough world books with new military toys in them in, give me some new and interesting. Something weird and unexpected that would make Alaska stand out as an area to go adventuring in and with lots of plot hooks.

It's where the US military is hiding an alien spacecraft(everybody's looking in the American West, but it's really stashed deep inside the Alaskan wilderness).

Agreed!

Give us new and different!

I wanna see like interesting enemies! Cool new settings!

I love the ARCHIE 3 stuff in SB-1.

I love the Xi... The Xit... The bug people!

If Alaska is to be a book, I wanna see something cool in it. Not new hardware. New stuff to see and do.

How about the Frozen Nazi Repository....where the U.S. government stashed all those diehard German fascists they pried out of the Antarctic colony redoubt after WW2, then planted them deep in the permafrost in suspended animation, to be forgotten during the centuries?

If we are going *just* on tech...

I'd like to see things that would shake up the balance of power, without destroying the balance of power.

If you want to go with experimental tech, have this be the place there they were working on "future weapons" things that can do things like, for example, combat the biggest toys on the planet. In this case the Glitterboy.

Maybe they were working on kinetic impact dispersing armor... Basically the same thing as a Glitterboy... Only it works on Rail Guns and ballistic impacts instead of lasers... With an Omi-Purpose Weapons System...

Example:

"Killer" Power Armor
USA-KIR-01

Power armor designed to handle impact and kinetic based weaponry. Damage from railguns, missiles, or other kinetic based attacks deal only 1/2 of their normal damage to the KIR-01. The KIR-01 looks like a black matte colored Glitterboy with strange "scale-like" plating.

M.D.C. By Location:
Omi-Purpose Cannon - 100
*Head - 140
Arms - 150 Each
*Hands - 40 Each
Legs - 220 Each
Main Body - 400
Ammunition Drum - 150 (back)

A single asterisk ( * ) indicates a target that is difficult to strike. Requiring an attacker to make a called shot, even then they will be at -4 to strike.

Omi-Purpose Cannon
A rail gun that has a range equal to 1.5 miles, and deals 2d6x10 M.D. on a burst (burst fire only) this is similar to the Boom Gun of the Glitterboy.

The Omi-Purpose Cannon also has a laser mounted to the underside, this laser has a range of 1,800 feet and on a single blast deals 3d6 M.D.C. on a burst 1d6x10 M.D.C.

Yadda yadda yadda

(Yeah I wasn't going for a full description.)

-----

But this is the kind of thing I want to see in future books.

I want to see different, and unique, but not necessarily more powerful. In this case, for example, this Power Armor is basically a scaled down Glitterboy, designed, specifically, to be able to actually take down Glitterboys.

The Boom Gun on average would do 45 damage per shot to this, while this would do 60 damage per shot to the Glitterboy. Glitterboys would have serious reason to be concerned about facing one of these because they can, and likely will, win, but they will take heavy damage because the Boom Gun is severely hampered when facing these.

Other Power Armors? Eh some will have a better time than others...

However will it do much better against all of them? Absolutely not.

That is the point. In books I want to see things that don't make other things obsolete but which offer more options to me as a player and a GM. I don't need standard rifles that do 2d6x10 M.D... I just need stuff to make the game more interesting.

HWalsh wrote:If Alaska is to be a book, I wanna see something cool in it. Not new hardware. New stuff to see and do.

You know what I'd like to see from an Alaska book?
Or pretty much any world book?

I'd like to see NO humans.
Possibly even NO humanoids.

Oh geez stop posting so much detail for ideas. You realize every time you do that someone can't right about it unless they put you in on it?

Killer Cyborg wrote:

HWalsh wrote:If Alaska is to be a book, I wanna see something cool in it. Not new hardware. New stuff to see and do.

You know what I'd like to see from an Alaska book?
Or pretty much any world book?

I'd like to see NO humans.
Possibly even NO humanoids.

sorry, not completely happening, after all we already know one base exists.

taalismn wrote:How about the Frozen Nazi Repository....where the U.S. government stashed all those diehard German fascists they pried out of the Antarctic colony redoubt after WW2, then planted them deep in the permafrost in suspended animation, to be forgotten during the centuries?

Now that is funny.