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Just wondering anyone have an issue with giving a veritech Fighter pilot a the marine MOS.

Personally wouldn't do it, but there's no reason you couldn't have a veritech pilot being a marine aviator and just choose some O.C.C. related skills to bulk out the Marine side of things.

My issue with this is that Marine is a branch of service....not an OCC.

I've gone back and forth on opening up all the MOS's from the various OCC's.

Personally I'd throw out every Human OCC found in TSC, Macross and New Gen/Genesis Pits. Then I would utilize the OCC/MOS system from Masters, and rename the OCC's accordingly.

I'd say that's a good question for your Game Master instead of the forum.

That aside, there are UEDF/UEEF marines who pilot Veritechs, that may be the better way to mix marine skills and veritech piloting

With what Jeffar said:

There is something worth note about Robotech Mecha. In order to pilot any RT Mecha, you just need either the Pilot Veritech Skill, or Battloid Skill. If you don't have Mecha Combat, that's fine, you don't get any penalties. Instead you get your standard combat abilities within the Mecha, and any bonuses the Mecha provides is also granted.

Skills are extremely limited within TSC. So take any wins where you can get it.

Tiree wrote:I've gone back and forth on opening up all the MOS's from the various OCC's.

Personally I'd throw out every Human OCC found in TSC, Macross and New Gen/Genesis Pits. Then I would utilize the OCC/MOS system from Masters, and rename the OCC's accordingly.

Wow, I would do exactly the opposite. I hate how every Masters OCC has access to pretty much every skill depending on the OCC chosen and the MOS (or two...or three...) that can combo with it. Why even bother having OCCs at all? I loath the Masters system. Rather, if I ran a Masters campaign, I would just say TASC simply employs Veritech OCCs (adjusting for AJAX/Logan skills instead of Alpha/Beta) and so on.

So taking that into consideration...

GrimmReaper wrote:Just wondering anyone have an issue with giving a veritech Fighter pilot a the marine MOS.

...I would simply roll up a Veritiech pilot who happens to be in the Marines.

Tiree wrote:I've gone back and forth on opening up all the MOS's from the various OCC's.

Personally I'd throw out every Human OCC found in TSC, Macross and New Gen/Genesis Pits. Then I would utilize the OCC/MOS system from Masters, and rename the OCC's accordingly.

I did the same thing. But use the T.C. as the base. Its basic O.C.C., would be like the Marines 12 weeks of Basic plus Basic combat school. Then used the primary skills from the T.A.S.C and the A.T.A.C, (with small changes) as specialty M.O.S.

Chris0013 wrote:My issue with this is that Marine is a branch of service....not an OCC.

in the US it is.
for pretty much the rest of the world, they're a subset of the country's navy or army. assuming they exist at all.

considering the united Earth Defense Force not only does not currently exist, and in the show, is comprised of multinational recruits, the idea that the UEDF has to conform to american divisions of jurisdiction is somewhat silly.

Well I hope ther will have MOS.

glitterboy2098 wrote:

Chris0013 wrote:My issue with this is that Marine is a branch of service....not an OCC.

considering the united Earth Defense Force not only does not currently exist, and in the show, is comprised of multinational recruits, the idea that the UEDF has to conform to american divisions of jurisdiction is somewhat silly.

Actually it's not at all. All ethno-centricism aside, the simple fact remains that the most largest and most experienced naval infantry force in the worlds is the USMC and many of the next largest units are Western units based heavily on the USMC model. Once you remove the Soviet-backed units (which I assume is a given with the history of RT), there's really not much competition left for organizational models.

Having said that, I favor mixing stuff up a bit for flavor and practicality. Frex. I really like the British tradition of replacing the rank of private with "marine" and in many ways, small scale expeditionary units like ship-based mecha forces of battalion strength or smaller seem to work a bit better when organized under the Vietnam-era US Army Armored Cavalry Squadron doctrine.

-MaxGravity

Maxgravity wrote:

glitterboy2098 wrote:considering the united Earth Defense Force not only does not currently exist, and in the show, is comprised of multinational recruits, the idea that the UEDF has to conform to american divisions of jurisdiction is somewhat silly.

Actually it's not at all. All ethno-centricism aside, the simple fact remains that the most largest and most experienced naval infantry force in the worlds is the USMC and many of the next largest units are Western units based heavily on the USMC model. Once you remove the Soviet-backed units (which I assume is a given with the history of RT), there's really not much competition left for organizational models.

If it counts for anything, the creators of at least two of the original three shows would agree wholeheartedly with your assessment.

The Unified (UN) Forces in the original Macross are modeled VERY heavily on the American military, with only one or two very distinct Japanese aspects despite it being a Japanese show. They copied everything right down to the tri-service designation system and unit markings for planes and armored fighting vehicles. The Mars Colony forces in MOSPEADA did it too, though they were more modeled on World War II-era American forces (to the extent of painting invasion stripes on the mecha).

Kagashi wrote:

Tiree wrote:I've gone back and forth on opening up all the MOS's from the various OCC's.

Personally I'd throw out every Human OCC found in TSC, Macross and New Gen/Genesis Pits. Then I would utilize the OCC/MOS system from Masters, and rename the OCC's accordingly.

Wow, I would do exactly the opposite. I hate how every Masters OCC has access to pretty much every skill depending on the OCC chosen and the MOS (or two...or three...) that can combo with it. Why even bother having OCCs at all? I loath the Masters system. Rather, if I ran a Masters campaign, I would just say TASC simply employs Veritech OCCs (adjusting for AJAX/Logan skills instead of Alpha/Beta) and so on.

So taking that into consideration...

I fully agree. I am not into the Southern Cross System. And i found it funny how it was basically doing exactly the same thing as first edition did. I wanted to see a one character creation system for all OCCs in 2nd edition for Robotech.

Kagashi wrote:

GrimmReaper wrote:Just wondering anyone have an issue with giving a veritech Fighter pilot a the marine MOS.

...I would simply roll up a Veritiech pilot who happens to be in the Marines.

This is how i have it. Its in the RtSC under the veritech pilot description.

"Veritech Pilots are either UEEF Fleet or Marine Corps Aviators."

The Veritech A-6Z seems to be a Marine Veritech.

The OCC system presented in the Masters Saga source book is closer to how RL military organizations are as opposed to the OCC's we see in the Shadow Chronicles book.

In my 9 year old play by post Macross era game (which is still running BTW) I have made a UEDF Marine OCC, that covers everything except Destriod, VT and aircraft pilots, and the only reason why is because I'm not going to make my players rebuild their characters again like I had them do when I switch over to the 2E RPG (well sort of, I fixed a lot of stuff). Currently I only have a few differences in OCC skills to differentiate between veritech pilots from the different branches of the UEDF (Tactical Corps/Army, Navy, Spacy Marines, Air Force).

Actually it's not at all. All ethno-centricism aside, the simple fact remains that the most largest and most experienced naval infantry force in the worlds is the USMC and many of the next largest units are Western units based heavily on the USMC model. Once you remove the Soviet-backed units (which I assume is a given with the history of RT), there's really not much competition left for organizational models.

What is really interesting is that the Colombian Marines are mirroring themselves off of the USMC......so there is a precedent for the U.S. Military for that matter to heavily influence the UEDF. http://archive.marinecorpstimes.com/art ... ne-mentors

If I were to run a Macross era game set in 2009 I would have the UEDF military be composed of military units from various nations. So for example Skull squadron would have been a U.S. Navy unit equipped with VF-1's, and there would be other VT's squadrons which exclusively had personnel from other nations and military branches. The situation ont he SDF-1 after the space fold would have tossed this idea out and units would be mixed. Back on Earth things would remain the same until after the rain of death.

jedi078 wrote:The OCC system presented in the Masters Saga source book is closer to how RL military organizations are as opposed to the OCC's we see in the Shadow Chronicles book.

In my 9 year old play by post Macross era game (which is still running BTW) I have made a UEDF Marine OCC, that covers everything except Destriod, VT and aircraft pilots, and the only reason why is because I'm not going to make my players rebuild their characters again like I had them do when I switch over to the 2E RPG (well sort of, I fixed a lot of stuff). Currently I only have a few differences in OCC skills to differentiate between veritech pilots from the different branches of the UEDF (Tactical Corps/Army, Navy, Spacy Marines, Air Force).

Actually it's not at all. All ethno-centricism aside, the simple fact remains that the most largest and most experienced naval infantry force in the worlds is the USMC and many of the next largest units are Western units based heavily on the USMC model. Once you remove the Soviet-backed units (which I assume is a given with the history of RT), there's really not much competition left for organizational models.

What is really interesting is that the Colombian Marines are mirroring themselves off of the USMC......so there is a precedent for the U.S. Military for that matter to heavily influence the UEDF. http://archive.marinecorpstimes.com/art ... ne-mentors

If I were to run a Macross era game set in 2009 I would have the UEDF military be composed of military units from various nations. So for example Skull squadron would have been a U.S. Navy unit equipped with VF-1's, and there would be other VT's squadrons which exclusively had personnel from other nations and military branches. The situation ont he SDF-1 after the space fold would have tossed this idea out and units would be mixed. Back on Earth things would remain the same until after the rain of death.

The problem with this is when you have an ultra-nationalist come to power in the country they are from and they all decide to take off with the mecha to that country and not come back.

Chris0013 wrote:The problem with this is when you have an ultra-nationalist come to power in the country they are from and they all decide to take off with the mecha to that country and not come back.

I agree there is that problem. But you'd still have the same problem even if squadrons were manned by individuals from several nation-states. What's to stop one pilot from flying off? It's happened before.

I highly doubt the production of mecha was limited to just Macros Island. Every major nation-state who provided troops to the UEDF probably had a factory or two to churn out mecha. IIRC in Macross the ARMD platforms were crewed entirely by individuals from one nation-state, to include the air wing.

Chris0013 wrote:The problem with this is when you have an ultra-nationalist come to power in the country they are from and they all decide to take off with the mecha to that country and not come back.

They don't really talk about the multinational nature of the UEDF in Robotech.

I think it's likely that they were probably every bit as mixed in terms of nationality as they were in the original Macross. The Macross's bridge crew was Italian, American, Japanese(-Australian), Russian (from South Asia), Finnish... and the one named relief operator is British. The named members of the SVF-1 Skulls include two from America (Roy and Millard), two from Japan (Hikaru and Hayao), two from Germany (Max and Bruce), one from Finland (Eddie), and of course one from space (Milia)... with a possible former Russian or Bulgarian ace (D.D.) as well. The UN Forces troops were gleaned from the brightest and best of each of the UN Government's member nations, and pretty thoroughly mixed at all levels.

The Southern Cross Army in Super Dimension Cavalry Southern Cross was also pretty thoroughly multinational/multiethnic, though they'd been one or two generations removed from Earth's nations (by way of nuclear holocaust and space colonization), and were predominantly of European extraction (lots of French, with some Polish, Icelandic, and German thrown in).

I suppose if you want people in a newly (or semi-recently) formed post-national government to get used to each other, the easiest way to go about it is to not give them any choice BUT to mingle.

jedi078 wrote:IIRC in Macross the ARMD platforms were crewed entirely by individuals from one nation-state, to include the air wing.

In Macross? No. Pretty sure that's not the case in Robotech either.