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So, I have a very touchy dilemma. Is there a spell, ritual, circle, etc that can be used or modified that can affect a large population into forcing them into a hallucinatory dream like state temporarily?

Example. My villain needs to get across a city with an entourage undetected and enter a portal (center of town) undetected. Unfortunately this portal is guarded and directly in the center of town and is only activated by the ruling Lord and Council. He has access to it but it's a pretty noticeable thing, even at night, to activate and enter.

Trying to figure out a believable way for the players to be in an odd dream.like state for a few hours, as well as everyone else really. For a few reasons.

1) To allow their quarry to get past them into the next state of his plan unmolested. They know he is coming here but doesn't know how long they have beat him to the punch. He could already Be in the city and they are unaware.

2) A few players have some issues that need to be resolved. Two of them have switched minds, one has multiple personalities, and one is in need of having a conversation with his Deity undisturbed. I figured these issues could be resolved in a dream state, almost matrix style environment where anything goes. And it doesn't have to be for the better. But I'm stuck on how to get them there and it be believable.

I never was one to read and understand any of the Summoner or Diabolist craft and I've played the game for almost 18 years. So any help here is appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Off the top of my head, I don't think there is.

That does not prohibit your from just writing one up for your NPC to use.

Unfortunately I have a player who has a photographic memory and would complain about non-cannon material. Advice accepted but definitely will probably end up having to create something.

Kevin McIntyre wrote:Unfortunately I have a player who has a photographic memory and would complain about non-cannon material. Advice accepted but definitely will probably end up having to create something.

Then make it via the spell creation rules in the Through the Glass Darkly book.


on the lighter side….
Or remind the player on the 1st rule of RPGs. "The GM is always right"

Rule #2 "if the GM is wrong, see Rule #1."

Peace.

Through the Glass Darkly might be your best bet. The only Circle Spell I can think of is Insanity (Power type in PF2E), but you have to get the target(s) into the circle for it to work. There might be some other spells in Rifts/PF that could work small scale (Curse of the World Bizare for instance, or Hallucination, or Apparition).

Though you could just use Defic Curse to cause a disease outbreak (see Dragons & Gods, one of the curse options is for a disease), or just use some other method to cause a distraction (which is what the villain is looking for, doesn't help with the PCs...). Don't rule out "spiked" food and drink (Faerie Food has an example, plus Herbalore ((sp?)) sections in PF2E), though that could get expensive for an entire city. Magic Powders & Fumes also exist (see PF2E magic items section) that all include examples of hallucinogenic results.

ShadowLogan wrote:Through the Glass Darkly might be your best bet. The only Circle Spell I can think of is Insanity (Power type in PF2E), but you have to get the target(s) into the circle for it to work.
…snip

If I am not wrong, I think that magic circles don't have a defined size, so someone could just draw the circle around the town w/o entering it. thou the char would need the resources to draw it that big. but if it is a part of a long term planing it could be done.

Use holistic medicine to create a hallucinogen and spike the town water supply. (Dark Priest, evil druid, evil healer etc)
look up St. Anthony's Fire (happened naturallyish)
Maybe a spirit summoned from the dreamstream did it. (Summoner)
There are literally thousands of different types of magic so a
Wand of make the good guys sleep whilst the bad guys escape.
Remnants from the time of a thousand magics will always be there for a dm as im pretty sure Kevin designed it to be that way, you need a McGuffin, hey it came from the time of a thousand magics.

Yin Sloth Jungles (page 114) has the Mad Stone.
Everyone with in 6 miles slowly goes insane.

The fact that the stone exists demonstrates that it should be possible to make a six mile area of delusion...

Combine this with the book Through the Glass Darkly and you should be in business

OP,

It sounds like you have a Summoner/Diabolist villain? How good are they at what they do?

Is it essential that they access that particular portal or would you be averse if they find their way to the destination via other means? Where does this portal go?

For your desired dream state for those particular players I suggest looking at Nightbane: Between The Shadows and the various dream spells/powers that can achieve exactly that effect. An option would be to have your Summoner utilize the Summon Spirits Circle (PF2ED, pg 148) to summon Astral or Dream creatures capable of doing any hostile dream manipulation you want done on their behalf. This could be combined with basic sleep magic/effects or drugs to put people to sleep and then have the creature pull them into the controlled dream state from the Dream Stream once they are there. That could be done in a variety of different ways. A decent Summoner could also have summoning slots to fillout with something(s) that could manage the sleep effects.

Then you have your dream sequence adventure scenario. It also allows for crossover of people into a communal dreamscape, in theory, if that is something that interests you.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:Through the Glass Darkly might be your best bet. The only Circle Spell I can think of is Insanity (Power type in PF2E), but you have to get the target(s) into the circle for it to work.
…snip

If I am not wrong, I think that magic circles don't have a defined size, so someone could just draw the circle around the town w/o entering it. thou the char would need the resources to draw it that big. but if it is a part of a long term planing it could be done.

You aren't wrong, at least in a general sense, but when I paged/skimed through the section yesterday there was a radius limit of some type. I just could not remember the specifics (I had to re-write the post x3 yesterday from scratch), I just looked it up and reviewed it to be sure. Yes the Radius of the Circle is undefined, but there appears to be a height limit for "passing through it" that I mistook for the radius limit (of 20ft) while skimming.

Dark wrote:OP,

It sounds like you have a Summoner/Diabolist villain? How good are they at what they do?

Is it essential that they access that particular portal or would you be averse if they find their way to the destination via other means? Where does this portal go?

For your desired dream state for those particular players I suggest looking at Nightbane: Between The Shadows and the various dream spells/powers that can achieve exactly that effect. An option would be to have your Summoner utilize the Summon Spirits Circle (PF2ED, pg 148) to summon Astral or Dream creatures capable of doing any hostile dream manipulation you want done on their behalf. This could be combined with basic sleep magic/effects or drugs to put people to sleep and then have the creature pull them into the controlled dream state from the Dream Stream once they are there. That could be done in a variety of different ways. A decent Summoner could also have summoning slots to fillout with something(s) that could manage the sleep effects.

Then you have your dream sequence adventure scenario. It also allows for crossover of people into a communal dreamscape, in theory, if that is something that interests you.

He actually isn't a summoner. I'm using my world and Palladium Fantasy rules. A mix of Palladium pantheon and my own. He is more of a pseudo necromancer... trying to bring a Deity to Godhood. A Half-God so to speak, which is where he gets his powers and abilities from. But he is not shy from using other people to get what he desires. He has two witch body guards. A wizard/necromancer in training which will undoubtedly somehow and some time eventually become a Lich if his master has anything to do with it. The place they are going is shut off from the rest of the world by the Gods due to a portal to a Demon realm so the only way to get in is this portal in this town. Attempting to siphon the energy from the portal, sacrifice a few thousand people etc, to hopefully give his Deity enough juice to full status. This is all the very short explanation by the way so it loses some in translation.

I really like the idea of using the Nightbane stuff. Ill check it out. It is something none of us have ever ventured into.

Technically even if the objective is in another dimension inside a Demon Realm or the like there are spells and circles that can provide transportation to/from such things. Though if you are ruling the place to have been blocked from access by divine intervention or the like that is your call.

You could also have them move into the catacombs/sewers/underlevel of the city and attempt to use that to access the nexus or the like that the Portal is built on or controls (theoretically) and draw energy from / manipulate the dimension convergence directly... forcing the heroes to come to them in a situation where they are ready for them.

I don't have it handy, nor do I have it memorized, but my inclination would be to look at the Illusionist from Old Ones. While non-standard, I could see him perhaps having a Raksasha minion with developed Illusionist powers that might let you manage it.

all wizards have the cloud of slumber spell. you could just have him use a custom variant of it that requires more ppe for a much larger area of effect. For me personally as a Gm i would use this as a rough draft

level: 8-10 spell
range: 1d4 mile radius,
duration: 30 minutes per level of the caster
saving throw: 14, caster is immune but defenders must roll each 30 minute increment while in the aoe
P.P.E: 200

I can imagine a rolling billowing cloud, fog-like in consistency.It rolls forward in a wave at a speed appropriate to cover the random range rolled by the end of the first interval. As this cloud envelops people they get groggy sluggish and unresponsive as there body attempts to fight off the magical influence. Eventually those of even the strongest mental fortitude succumb to the desire to sleep falling where they stand. Confused onlookers rush to help only to collapse next to those already asleep and the ones smart enough to start running in a panic stricken state crying out with nameless fear being overtaken by the speed of the clouds movement. Once it reaches the party it should be quite entertaining to watch as some of them fail there saves initially while others do not.

Not a spell or ritual. Use the drug fansolin. Found in the main Palladium fantasy book pg 266.