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I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Doesnt Mutants in Orbit have space boom guns? Would that not answer this?
(I dont have the book in my office).

13eowulf wrote:

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Doesnt Mutants in Orbit have space boom guns? Would that not answer this?
(I dont have the book in my office).

I think he's wondering if the round (or whatever) would simply maintain its velocity in a vacuum forever. The real life answer I think is "yes, it would." Thus if it hit something far beyond its listed range, and no other force acted upon it after being fired, it would do the same damage.

I think "effective range" would probably be about the same (for game purposes at least) because targets move, etc. and the greater the distance, the smaller the chance of the target still being where it was when the gun was fired.

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Officially by the Rules, no.

While others are correct about the velocity, the boom gun does not fire a single projectile but rather 200 (plus the casing) that does the listed damage. Those sub-projectiles will disperse over time resulting in reduced damage. The result is that if you fire at something beyond effective range, the longer between firing and impact the less damage it will do (though if the target is big enough...).

In space, no-one can hear you BOOM.


(Yes, I said it. We all were thinking it. Never tempt a skutch. Here Endeth the Lesson.)

ShadowLogan wrote:

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Officially by the Rules, no.

While others are correct about the velocity, the boom gun does not fire a single projectile but rather 200 (plus the casing) that does the listed damage. Those sub-projectiles will disperse over time resulting in reduced damage. The result is that if you fire at something beyond effective range, the longer between firing and impact the less damage it will do (though if the target is big enough...).

Ok, here's a different question for you. Just how far would it have to travel before it's dispersed too far out to be effective?

honestly given its range, most of us have been assuming it is a selective fused munition rather than a literal shotgun.. that the 200 rods are contained in a shell that gets fuzed right before firing (using range data from that laser targeter above the barrel) so that the shell bursts a few instants before it hits the target, so that the target gets the maximum impact from the hit.

similar to the airburst ammunition in the XM25 CDTE.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjqu4hBFWFA

Since Boomguns run off of SCIENCE! and not science the answer is RAW they can be fired at normal range at normal rolls, at 30% farther than normal range at a strike penalty, and no farther... because reasons. If this answer doesn't satisfy you, then you of course can change it to suit you how ever you wish to make things work out 'right' for your particular game.

dragonfett wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Officially by the Rules, no.

While others are correct about the velocity, the boom gun does not fire a single projectile but rather 200 (plus the casing) that does the listed damage. Those sub-projectiles will disperse over time resulting in reduced damage. The result is that if you fire at something beyond effective range, the longer between firing and impact the less damage it will do (though if the target is big enough...).

Ok, here's a different question for you. Just how far would it have to travel before it's dispersed too far out to be effective?

off hand I don't know. Several minutes at minimum I would suspect.

dragonfett wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:

dragonfett wrote:I just thought of a question and I was wondering, would the round from Boom Gun still deliver the same amount of damage to targets (or, more precisely, anything that they hit) beyond its range?

Officially by the Rules, no.

While others are correct about the velocity, the boom gun does not fire a single projectile but rather 200 (plus the casing) that does the listed damage. Those sub-projectiles will disperse over time resulting in reduced damage. The result is that if you fire at something beyond effective range, the longer between firing and impact the less damage it will do (though if the target is big enough...).

Ok, here's a different question for you. Just how far would it have to travel before it's dispersed too far out to be effective?

Depends.... Granted, in vacuum, the rods will disperse. BUT, they keep going so there they travel, and some poor bastard runs in to them sometime... eek!

without air to create turbulence though, they'll disperse slower.

Can you imagine if Rifts followed real world physics? I can see the newsflash now.




As for the Boom Gun itself, it never made much sense to me. It’s an example of an author who, through no real fault of his own, got hooked on an idea, didn’t really understand how armor penetration worked, and wrote at a time where fact checking was much more difficult. Flechette rounds are only useful for anti-personnel or area denial work, not anti-armor. A single projectile of a given mass will always have superior anti-armor capabilities compared to a swarm of lighter projectiles totaling the same mass. Of course that’s assuming the same materials, the same velocity, etc. In the real world the only place I can think of flechettes being used are applications where the concern isn’t the amount of damage done or armor penetrated, but if you can hit the target at all. Anti-personnel, anti-aircraft, and, theoretically at least, anti-spacecraft. And all those applications sacrifice hitting power for a spread area of effect.

But hey, it’s Rifts. Have fun, go Boom!

Is there anything in the rules prohibiting the interpretation that the penalty is per 30% (accumulative) and not one-time 130% cap on range?

Axelmania wrote:Is there anything in the rules prohibiting the interpretation that the penalty is per 30% (accumulative) and not one-time 130% cap on range?

"One may attempt a shot that is as much as 30% farther than the Maximum Effective Range of any given weapon, but..."
Since it says "as much as" that is a fixed quantity.
To be stackable it would be "for each 30% beyond" or some other such wording.

Isn't that -4 per 20ft or whatever repeating rate still in the GM guide though? I'd apply that after the 30%, unless RUE explicitly ruled it out.

Axelmania wrote:Isn't that -4 per 20ft or whatever repeating rate still in the GM guide though? I'd apply that after the 30%, unless RUE explicitly ruled it out.

Since RUE rewrote the entire section it was edplicitly ruled out yes.
That is what "this is now the rules on how you strike" means.
When there are no conflicting rules then old material might be relevant... but when the entire section in question was totally rewritten then yes, it was, wait for it, rewritten.

This is why we know that the new rules are the current ones and the old rules are not.
No one in the publishing industry for example goes through and writes a list saying "okay, we are revoking all these rules" first. They just say "new edition, here are the new rules"
Which is how it works.

Thus we do not have to have the book say "we are revoking the rule that says you only need a 5 to hit a stationary target at 60' 12 or higher if a called shot"
because, the new "ranged combat rules" tell us *all* the rules that apply to ranged combat... including that you always need an 8 to hit and that called shots are not a 12.

This is also why you can't use the old dodge rules in addition to the new ones and just shop around for the best rule.
Well, I mean you *can* if your GM is wanting to house rule it.

Rewrote or... supplemented? "Now only" or "Now also"?

you would need a +114 strike bonus to be allowed to even make the roll! (unless your GM allows you to roll on things that have no possible way of occuring on the theory that 5% of the time you can perform the impossible)

This is why we have One Life One Shot One Hit One Kill.

Give a sniper a couple years and you can shoot things pretty far.

In space, nobody can hear you BOOM!

Vrykolas2k wrote:In space, nobody can hear you BOOM!

Look up-thread, I beat you too it.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hLpgxry542M

Nuf said.

Well ok not nuff,

That said I’ve long treated the boom gun as having three different loads available, a standard solid slug and a shotgun type loading, and a longer range canister proximity/programmable fused variant which was the original standard load, with the solid slugs and the pure canister load being what what was held in the secondary drums.

I actually have several loads I need to find back, I will post that later in the gm section.

Drakenred®™© wrote:https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hLpgxry542M

Nuf said.

I love Mass Effect.

I will say that this is what is missing from Rifts in general is the single projectile rail or coil guns like we see in games like Halo.

Thats how I treat the boom gun, it was designed as a Anti tank weapon, the standard round was a single unit slug, but the 200 pin shot round is a semi smart round that is designed to separate in flight for anything not a tank, and what ended up being the standard for it

BookWyrm wrote:In space, no-one can hear you BOOM.

No, but they can see you dealing with exciting new recoil problems

Rallan wrote:

BookWyrm wrote:In space, no-one can hear you BOOM.

No, but they can see you dealing with exciting new recoil problems

Not for long.