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Well, I was wondering how much the paucity of fairy wings would limit what would otherwise be a quantum leap forward in transportation in the Palladium world. A Network of teleportation circles would revolutionize travel. I know the upfront cost would be steep, 300 PPE per circle, but instantaneous, 100% accurate travel for just about any size of item is a game changer. Kingdoms should have the resources to create the network of circles, as would large guilds or organizations. The limiting reagent is those damn fairy wings. I suppose you could summon fairies, but that's rather macabre. Of course, I don't think there is any NICE way to acquire fairy wings.

Secondary question when you use a circle to summon fairy folk, how many appear at a time?

-Vek
"Can you conjure fairies?"

faery wings and demon bone for permanence so more than one set of wings is needed per circle. You would think they would be across strategic places in the world but nope.
(more proof the world is only 3 days old hehe)

and to how many I would say 1 as there are ones that summon more critters and specifically say how many if more than 1.

I don't see faeries as being intrinsically good, and in fact, I would categorize much of their behavior as objectively evil and cruel. The narration would have you think that they're sweet, charming, and innocent, when they're really thieving vandals who frequently abuse and bully people for laughs. The "spoiled child throwing a tantrum" explanation for faeries turning nasty provides no morally justifiable basis for their cruelty or carelessly deadly pranks. Under circumstances that are completely within the character of their general description in Monsters and Animals, killing a faerie could be completely justifiable.

It seems strange to me that in every people-faerie conflict shown in the game, the people are the villains.

I play tat titanias faeries tend to be good and Mabs cruel and evil, Titanians wont maim or kill but will play jokes, nabs will pull your arms off and burn them to use in magic spells or for fun. Humans tend to be shown as the villian because they are going into the natives land and burning them out, which isnt very nice when you think about it and the faeries fight back.
However killing or maiming an intelligent being, even if evil, just for the purpose of making a teleport circle isn't good.

Has it ever been clarified whether the way permanence wards make components indestructible might somehow interfere with circles that require burning (a kind of destruction) of a component to work?

I think it might have been in a rifter, but with teleport id just make it open the portal and keep it open forever, and if the circle make closed the portal it would take more fairy wings to open it again.

kiralon wrote:faery wings and demon bone for permanence so more than one set of wings is needed per circle. You would think they would be across strategic places in the world but nope.
(more proof the world is only 3 days old hehe)

and to how many I would say 1 as there are ones that summon more critters and specifically say how many if more than 1.

Actually.
As per Old Ones (both editions)
Simply making the circle permanent doesn't absolve the need for the wings.
You need to burn the wings to trigger the circle in the Old Ones Complex.

Circle of Travel.
Level 15 spell from Rifts, but we know that it is found in Hades and thus should be available to PF.
30 PPE to reactivate the circle and a range of 800 miles/level

yeah I was thinking of mystic portal from first ed.
The circle is a one off teleport.

eliakon wrote:Circle of Travel.
Level 15 spell from Rifts, but we know that it is found in Hades and thus should be available to PF.
30 PPE to reactivate the circle and a range of 800 miles/level

That opens a rift rather than direct teleportation though. Perhaps a minor point of interest if you have a means of managing the inevitable poltergeist.

Axelmania wrote:

eliakon wrote:Circle of Travel.
Level 15 spell from Rifts, but we know that it is found in Hades and thus should be available to PF.
30 PPE to reactivate the circle and a range of 800 miles/level

That opens a rift rather than direct teleportation though. Perhaps a minor point of interest if you have a means of managing the inevitable poltergeist.

so put the entire circle inside a permanent CoP.
You can open a portal to the astral to flush it out every so often.

Assuming that "something may slip through" doesn't just apply to the spell Dimensional Portal but to all forms of portals (a very shaky and logically tenuous claim) then you could simply put a Protection Circle around you area and 'flush it out' to the Astral every so often.

eliakon wrote:so put the entire circle inside a permanent CoP.
You can open a portal to the astral to flush it out every so often.

Yeah I know, I brought up the "Protection Circle: Simple" solution on an earlier Rifts thread about that.

Of course mechanically I'm not entirely sure if these are as good as keeping supernaturals in as they are at keeping them out.

eliakon wrote:Assuming that "something may slip through" doesn't just apply to the spell Dimensional Portal but to all forms of portals (a very shaky and logically tenuous claim)

Not as shaky/tenuous as thinknig it only applies to the spell

eliakon wrote:you could simply put a Protection Circle around you area and 'flush it out' to the Astral every so often.

Trying to figure out the mechanics of how "flushing" would work, using something like Banish to corral them into another rift?

Axelmania wrote:

eliakon wrote:so put the entire circle inside a permanent CoP.
You can open a portal to the astral to flush it out every so often.

Yeah I know, I brought up the "Protection Circle: Simple" solution on an earlier Rifts thread about that.

Of course mechanically I'm not entirely sure if these are as good as keeping supernaturals in as they are at keeping them out.

It works 100% perfectly.
"can not cross" means "can not cross"
Which is why they mention several places summoning things into circles!

Axelmania wrote:

eliakon wrote:Assuming that "something may slip through" doesn't just apply to the spell Dimensional Portal but to all forms of portals (a very shaky and logically tenuous claim)

Not as shaky/tenuous as thinknig it only applies to the spell

No, actually it is. See you are taking a limitation of one specific spell, and claiming that it is an unstated weakness to ALL spells. That is pretty shaky. There is nothing in any book to support this claim other than your assertion that this one spells unique weakness (which is not even universal to all versions of the spell!) must actually be a secret limitation upon every other spell of its class… but that they don't actually tell us that its a limit.

Axelmania wrote:

eliakon wrote:you could simply put a Protection Circle around you area and 'flush it out' to the Astral every so often.

Trying to figure out the mechanics of how "flushing" would work, using something like Banish to corral them into another rift?

Step 1) cast astral portal on the edge of the circle area
Since you will want a Superior Protection Circle to be the one around your area, the entities will do anything to be out of 'line of sight' of the circle... and thus will flee through the portal.
Step 2) Area is now flushed.

I think I need to match up with what text you're looking at to read verb "cross" from.

PF2p137 for example has

"preventing something or some force from entering"
"cannot enter the circle"

Pg 207-208 has:

"cannot come any closer, nor enter"

The concept of enter/exit wouldn't really matter if all you were talking about was an inability to cross a circle perimeter, those verbs imply a certain direction.

eliakon wrote:you are taking a limitation of one specific spell, and claiming that it is an unstated weakness to ALL spells.

"all forms of dimensional portals" is not "all spells", but rather "all spells which create dimensioanl portals" and also include dimensional portals formed by things other than spells.

eliakon wrote:That is pretty shaky. There is nothing in any book to support this claim other than your assertion that this one spells unique weakness (which is not even universal to all versions of the spell!) must actually be a secret limitation upon every other spell of its class… but that they don't actually tell us that its a limit.

This has nothing to do with the spell text, rather with the poltergeist description.

If the next PF supplement introduced a being "which enters the world half the time a dimensional portal is opened", it would also have nothing to do with the 15th level spell, and everything to do with its own description.

eliakon wrote:Step 1) cast astral portal on the edge of the circle area
Since you will want a Superior Protection Circle to be the one around your area, the entities will do anything to be out of 'line of sight' of the circle... and thus will flee through the portal.
Step 2) Area is now flushed.

Even if you assume entities will flee in a directly straight line away from a circle, you'd need a pretty big portal so that directly away from the center of your circle through the monster is through the path of that opening.

And if the portal is warded by a circle, then it can't enter.
Because that would be an impermissible move.
After all to enter the world via the portal would require it to move closer to the CoP, and they can't and are required to move away from them.
A greater being would need to make its save to cross the portal threshold otherwise it would break the 'no closer than 20 feet to the circle' rule as well.

Right, that's an approach I've thought of before regarding an already-active circle around a portal which hasn't been entered through yet. I just mean if you activate it after they already entered the portal and are already within the circle.