Forums of the Megaverse®

Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

Vampire Kingdoms Revised pp 19-20 states a couple of times that MDC beings can't be turned into vampires. Viable converts, broadly, have to be intelligent, SDC, mortal, humanoids composed of flesh and blood and not subject to extensive mechanical, genetic, or chemical alteration.

Curbludgeon wrote:Vampire Kingdoms Revised pp 19-20 states a couple of times that MDC beings can't be turned into vampires. Viable converts, broadly, have to be intelligent, SDC, mortal, mammalian humanoids composed of flesh and blood and not subject to extensive mechanical, genetic, or chemical alteration.

If you are talking about being converted by a master or secondary the answer is clearly no. I believe there are examples of MDC creatures, maybe even a godling, becoming a master vampire or some such thing by a Vampire Intelligence. Not sure where that is but I seem to recall an NPC somewhere that fell into that category.

Warshield73 wrote:If you are talking about being converted by a master or secondary the answer is clearly no. I believe there are examples of MDC creatures, maybe even a godling, becoming a master vampire or some such thing by a Vampire Intelligence. Not sure where that is but I seem to recall an NPC somewhere that fell into that category.

Kingu, the Chosen(Pantheons of the Megaverse)...Demon of the Babylonian Gods of Darkness. Summoning ritual was used by Tiamat to bind a vampire intelligence to him.
Not a true case of vampire conversion of a megadamage being, but that might be the NPC you're thinking of?

taalismn wrote:

Warshield73 wrote:If you are talking about being converted by a master or secondary the answer is clearly no. I believe there are examples of MDC creatures, maybe even a godling, becoming a master vampire or some such thing by a Vampire Intelligence. Not sure where that is but I seem to recall an NPC somewhere that fell into that category.

Kingu, the Chosen(Pantheons of the Megaverse)...Demon of the Babylonian Gods of Darkness. Summoning ritual was used by Tiamat to bind a vampire intelligence to him.
Not a true case of vampire conversion of a megadamage being, but that might be the NPC you're thinking of?

I spent a little time in Pantheons tonight and he is not the one I was thinking of but I can't find the NPC I was thinking of. Might be in a Rifter or maybe I am just misremembering.

Warshield must have quoted me before I removed the word mammalian. It looks like the species explicitly listed in Rifts sources, at least, as being potential secondary vampire converts are all mammals. I've seen the Simvan sometimes presented as being more reptilian, but the rest are pretty clear.

It's interesting to compare this to the requirements for the Blood Priest OCC in WB28:Arzno. The class is intended for characters usually looking to become Master Vampires after a period as what are effectively Witches to the Vampire Intelligence. The book states: "Any sentient, mortal being - human, mutant or D-Bee - can become a Blood Priest, though most are at least humanoid... Note: Creatures of magic, vampires and supernatural beings (except for sub-demons) cannot become a Blood Priest." This does leave a lot of options for a variety of wacky blood priests whom can't themselves become vampires. A Gargoyle Mage would make a great one, and imagine if they first learned Mystic Herbology from a Blood Druid.

I could also see an argument for beings whom are unable to be converted to vampires in a MDC dimension, but could become eligible in an SDC dimension. I haven't dug up any potentially relevant quotes from The Western Empire, Dragons & Gods, Nightbane, or wherever else.

Curbludgeon wrote:Warshield must have quoted me before I removed the word mammalian. It looks like the species explicitly listed in Rifts sources, at least, as being potential secondary vampire converts are all mammals. I've seen the Simvan sometimes presented as being more reptilian, but the rest are pretty clear.

It's interesting to compare this to the requirements for the Blood Priest OCC in WB28:Arzno. The class is intended for characters usually looking to become Master Vampires after a period as what are effectively Witches to the Vampire Intelligence. The book states: "Any sentient, mortal being - human, mutant or D-Bee - can become a Blood Priest, though most are at least humanoid... Note: Creatures of magic, vampires and supernatural beings (except for sub-demons) cannot become a Blood Priest." This does leave a lot of options for a variety of wacky blood priests whom can't themselves become vampires. A Gargoyle Mage would make a great one, and imagine if they first learned Mystic Herbology from a Blood Druid.

I could also see an argument for beings whom are unable to be converted to vampires in a MDC dimension, but could become eligible in an SDC dimension. I haven't dug up any potentially relevant quotes from The Western Empire, Dragons & Gods, Nightbane, or wherever else.

umm..... I think Davy Jones has non mammal vampires. Rifts Lemuria(sp). He is also a vampire that is not affected by water like the others.

Curbludgeon wrote:Vampire Kingdoms Revised pp 19-20 states a couple of times that MDC beings can't be turned into vampires. Viable converts, broadly, have to be intelligent, SDC, mortal, humanoids composed of flesh and blood and not subject to extensive mechanical, genetic, or chemical alteration.

Would be tremendously nice if the world had MDC.

Why all this debate every time this comes up? This has been asked, answered, and the official answers are published in multiple books.

Setting aside the obviously ineligible, ie plant people and mineral aliens, people without blood or bodies, and beings with strange biology, the remainder should be easily sorted by using a "super or not" test.

Only non-special, non-super, mortal beings can become vampires. MDC is a super power, so no MDC.

it's a simple test, ask "is this a mortal being or do they have super powers?" and your answer comes.

Elf: Mortal.
Dragon: Super.
Demon: Super.
Human: Mortal.
Orc: Mortal.
Godling: Super.
Titan: Super
MDC mortal D-Bee with only tough skin and no other powers at all: Super.
D-bee with no other powers, but whose race can shapechange into ducks: Super

Bring super is the line. If your potential vampire is "superhuman" they're disqualified from vampirism.



I blame min-maxing and munchkinism. Why be a wimpy vampire when you could be a larger, stronger, winged vampire with superpowers and hydrokinesis?

Candy wrote:

ITWastrel wrote:Why be a wimpy vampire when you could be a larger, stronger, winged vampire with superpowers and hydrokinesis?

I don't know if wings would be all that useful (you can fly as a bat anyway) since it would interfere with a disguise.

Makes me wonder about winged d-bees like Gromeks in the CB though

If you where a larger stronger vampire immune to sdc weapons and can control water why would you need to hide?

To the original question? Doubt it. Not even factoring in MDC and all that. Demi-gods are devine beings. Vampires are damaged by devine energy (holy symbols, holy weapons, holy water, etc). So most likely any vampire trying would end up feeling like they just ate a super charged Carolina Reaper and need to spend some time regenerating their face.

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

Fenris2020 wrote:

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

shouldn't that attempt be pretty far up on the darwin awards opportunities list? IE stupid things to do that are likely to make you dead

guardiandashi wrote:

Fenris2020 wrote:

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

shouldn't that attempt be pretty far up on the darwin awards opportunities list? IE stupid things to do that are likely to make you dead

Are primordial manifestations of evil that are not subject to the forces of evolution eligible for a Darwin award?

guardiandashi wrote:

Fenris2020 wrote:

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

shouldn't that attempt be pretty far up on the darwin awards opportunities list? IE stupid things to do that are likely to make you dead

Are primordial manifestations of evil that are not subject to the forces of evolution eligible for a Darwin award?

Warshield73 wrote:

guardiandashi wrote:

Fenris2020 wrote:

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

shouldn't that attempt be pretty far up on the darwin awards opportunities list? IE stupid things to do that are likely to make you dead

Are primordial manifestations of evil that are not subject to the forces of evolution eligible for a Darwin award?

as a reality check, no not really, but its something that is begging for a darwin award, or getting a "sign"
as in giving them a sign that says "hi, I'm Stupid"

guardiandashi wrote:

Warshield73 wrote:

guardiandashi wrote:

Fenris2020 wrote:

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

shouldn't that attempt be pretty far up on the darwin awards opportunities list? IE stupid things to do that are likely to make you dead

Are primordial manifestations of evil that are not subject to the forces of evolution eligible for a Darwin award?

as a reality check, no not really, but its something that is begging for a darwin award, or getting a "sign"
as in giving them a sign that says "hi, I'm Stupid"

Yes, the sign works better but not sure I want to be the one presenting it.

Warshield73 wrote:
Yes, the sign works better but not sure I want to be the one presenting it.

I had a character that was giving them out as a running gag in a campaign. The character was a green dragon (ala D&D ) but was from a "house / country" where the character was the head of a R&D program for a battletech inspired campaign. the character had developed new long range plasma cannons that were a kind of hybrid plasma ejector / particle beam cannon, that effectively fired a semi-stable plasma torpedo (think plasma energy artillery that upon striking anything "solid" would release the payload in a plasma explosion that detonated on what it hit, and "splashed" IE detonated back in the direction the shot came from )
the character had also helped develop a new generation of mecha and had enough of the plans in her head that she could build the tools needed to build the tools and parts to build them (in a limited quantity) on rifts earth.

so umm ya the character could get away with handing them out.

Warshield73 wrote:

guardiandashi wrote:
as a reality check, no not really, but its something that is begging for a darwin award, or getting a "sign"
as in giving them a sign that says "hi, I'm Stupid"

Yes, the sign works better but not sure I want to be the one presenting it.

I have a npc that could be the one presenting it. Think of a TW version of DR Bradford (think that is the head of loanstar) with access to most types of science gene splicer tech and high level spells. He is insane and lacks Dr. Bradford scruples (the fact that compared to him Bradford has them should tell you something). In fact I think I will had a ray gun to place that sign on people to the list of gear he sells.

A demigod could be born part vampire, so to speak, if their deific parent was Vald-Tegor (Dragons & Gods), a Vampire Intelligence that became a god.

Candy wrote:

Curbludgeon wrote:Vampire Kingdoms Revised pp 19-20 states a couple of times that MDC beings can't be turned into vampires.

They might be exceptions to this...

people made of plant matter, silicon, and most Mega-Damage beings, cannot become a vampire via the Slow Kill.

We are told that "D-Bees with M.D.C. bodies" cannot, so maybe non-D-Bees with MDC bodies could be changed?

I'd say there's at least a good argument that MDC humans who are not supernatural could be turned.
A N&S character with Wrist Hardening has (dumbly enough) 4 MDC, for example, even though they're a normal, non-supernatural being.
The human inhabitants of Wormwood are MDC beings, even though they are not (iirc) supernatural.
HU characters with certain super powers are MDC beings, even though they're not supernatural.
That kind of thing.

pblackcrow wrote:Could a vampire turn a demigod who is the son of a sun god?

No.

IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

There are only 2 ways I can think of that a Demigod might become a Vampire:
-Mortification (LotD#2 pg68) Curse, one option turns one into the undead
-via Necromancy (BoM pg199) "Return from the Grave" as it turns the mage into a Vampire

Candy wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

The emphasis I see here is "most" which implies that some unknown minority supernatural creatures could be transformed.

In this situation I am fairly certain that "most" is narrative wiggle room for a particularly malicious GM to create something truly horribly to slap around unruly players. I myself would never do such a thing (waiting to see if lightning strikes) but I have heard of such GMs.

I'm intrigued by the idea of the vampire demigod character now.

Assuming the goal is to make up a PC of the Godling/Cosmo-Knight/Mega-hero power level, what could we use as reasons and what stats would we use as a guide?

Reasons for Kingu fell out to [/i]Resurrection Side Effects[/i].

Someone here mentioned Born a Vampire.

I like Papa was a God, Mama was a Hot Vampire - Zeus Edition.
A rousing tale of Hera's jealous use of a fertility potion on her hubby, who was secretly Tuppin' not only the beautiful vampire hunter, but also the beautiful vampire. Given the godly power of the fertility potion, Hera expected a dozen new demigods to be born overnight. A dozen new miseries for her philandering husband. Hera never suspected a vampire mistress, or that the curse would be so effective. If she had, she would have doubled the dose.

As for stats, I'll have to think a bit.

Candy wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

The emphasis I see here is "most" which implies that some unknown minority supernatural creatures could be transformed.

It allows for exceptions to the rule and we all know if you look long enough you will find an exception in PB.
I would think an argument could be made that the Miku in Lemura pg 155 are such an exception. Natural MDC and SN ps.

Candy wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

The emphasis I see here is "most" which implies that some unknown minority supernatural creatures could be transformed.

While I won't go as far as to say I think its wiggle room as others have suggested, I would think that the exceptions would be called out in the individual CoM/SN entries and not left wide open such as it is.

ShadowLogan wrote:

Candy wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

The emphasis I see here is "most" which implies that some unknown minority supernatural creatures could be transformed.

While I won't go as far as to say I think its wiggle room as others have suggested, I would think that the exceptions would be called out in the individual CoM/SN entries and not left wide open such as it is.

I would agree with that mindset.

Blue_Lion wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:

Candy wrote:

ShadowLogan wrote:IINM a Demigod qualifies as a Supernatural or Creature of Magic was established back in the original Vampire Kingdoms (Rifts WB1o pg20 top of the page left column, easy to miss, I do not know about Revised or the PF SBs). It states "Borgs and most supernatural or magic creatures, like dragons, can NOT be transformed into vampires. However, they can be killed by them." (emphasis in original text).

The emphasis I see here is "most" which implies that some unknown minority supernatural creatures could be transformed.

While I won't go as far as to say I think its wiggle room as others have suggested, I would think that the exceptions would be called out in the individual CoM/SN entries and not left wide open such as it is.

I would agree with that mindset.

I think I might have found further support (at least for pre-WB1r) coming from WB21 on pg61-2 when discussing the Vampire Kingdoms and the Liberation Underground (looking specifically at the last paragraph on pg62 dealing with the VK):
-"Although vampires prefer the tase of human blood, they are perfectly capable of feeding on just about any intelligent non-supernatural being, including Kydians and Kittani."
-"In fact, the vampires in Atlantis have added about twenty Kydians and a dozen Altaraians to their ranks" (the Kydians are SDC/HP, unless converted to a Power Lord, Altaraians are the Blind Warrior Women).
-"D-Bees that are converted will have all attributes, abilities, and vulnerabilities of the undead with all attributes re-rolled, even if they were better than those of the vampire to begin with." (this bit makes me think even if it was possible, which it isn't, to do a SN/CoM that it might actually be counter productive)
-"Most T-Men can be turned into vampires despite their magical powers. However, while they retain their magic tattoos, they lose the ability to use them. The only Tatooed Men who cannot be turned into vampires are the Undead Slayers because they are considered to be supernatural creatures." (I found this last bit interesting because I thought the T-Men was now essentially a SN/CoM)