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Or do you usually try to save and convert them?

One of my players had his character make it through Juicer Detoxification & become a headhunter. He played a few more times but then quit gaming.

I've retired a lot of Juicers. Just need enough missiles.

i've always felt that retiring a juicer is the duty of a GM, myself.

Orin J. wrote:i've always felt that retiring a juicer is the duty of a GM, myself.

Making choices for a character is the duty of the person playing it. The GM should not be retiring/making choices for PCs.

Honestly, I greatly increase the amount of time they get. Five+<random> years is ridiculously goofy, especially for a class that isn't nearly as powerful or over-the-top as oodles of other classes.

Knowing you're going to die before you reach middle-age is just as germane to the roleplaying aspect of the class as "you're going to die any second now" is, but keeps the character more playable for longer campaigns. It's still going to make people think twice before undergoing the procedure, and only the desperate, ignorant, or those who already expect to die young would really go for it under most circumstances. And yes, that includes prisoners with life sentences agreeing to it in order to get out early, too.

The fact that they're gung-ho about battle also means most of them are going to die well before the drugs have a chance to do it, too. It's not like most juicers manage to make it to the end of their 5+ year life expectancy as is.

Crimson Dynamo wrote:Honestly, I greatly increase the amount of time they get. Five+<random> years is ridiculously goofy, especially for a class that isn't nearly as powerful or over-the-top as oodles of other classes.

Knowing you're going to die before you reach middle-age is just as germane to the roleplaying aspect of the class as "you're going to die any second now" is, but keeps the character more playable for longer campaigns. It's still going to make people think twice before undergoing the procedure, and only the desperate, ignorant, or those who already expect to die young would really go for it under most circumstances. And yes, that includes prisoners with life sentences agreeing to it in order to get out early, too.

The fact that they're gung-ho about battle also means most of them are going to die well before the drugs have a chance to do it, too. It's not like most juicers manage to make it to the end of their 5+ year life expectancy as is.

I think it is more about the stress on the body than how OP they are. Given how rare it is in games i have played for a juicer to reach burn out, it is clearly a RP plot device and not a limit that players often have to deal with.

Yes, I know. Which is what I both said and directly inferred.

Dying early at ~45 due to the "stress on the body" is just as narratively reflective of the process as dying in five years. One just keeps them playable in long campaigns while retaining exactly the same flavor, the other does not. The point about being OP had to do with the discussion from a metagaming point of view, as it's equally as silly to give them such a crippling drawback when they don't warrant it compared to other character options.

Crimson Dynamo wrote:Yes, I know. Which is what I both said and directly inferred.

Dying early at ~45 due to the "stress on the body" is just as narratively reflective of the process as dying in five years. One just keeps them playable in long campaigns while retaining exactly the same flavor, the other does not. The point about being OP had to do with the discussion from a metagaming point of view, as it's equally as silly to give them such a crippling drawback when they don't warrant it compared to other character options.

But having them die in a little over 5 years from drug over dose makes it sound more significant than letting them live for 20 years. Also say the character got juiced at 44 setting a age of death means he dies in a year.
The time is long enough to show pressure but not to short as to remove them from most campaigns.

I have only had a few players choose to run juicers, most who are looking for an augmented human go borg, and most of those players only played a few weeks or months so never got a chance.

I had one juicer PC who decided to detox at I think 3 and a half after the juicer uprising and I believe he went headhunter.

I also had a juicer from Rifts Earth in a Phase World game in college. The game only last about 8 months real world but it went something like 8 or 9 years in game. Instead of detoxing that character used a salvage stasis pod putting himself in stasis for the weeks or months of travel time so at the end of the game he was still some time from last call, or would have been except I believe he was killed towards the end.

I do agree that last call and detox are usually a narrative device but I think it really adds to the OCC and I love how that made way for the Juicer Uprising.

I had a Mega-Juicer get hit with an Age Spell and go BOOM that brought about the "Last Call." effect. Hung on to the demon mage and went boom taking him with me.