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So in Rifts we have had enhanced exoskeletons back to at least WB 5, and I have a couple of quesitons as to how you play them in your games.

1) How do you separate them? As in what makes an exoskeleton vs a PA or EBA?

For me EBA doesn't give bonuses, Exoskeletons give bonuses, but do not require a piloting skill, Light PA requires the piloting skill to operate. Weight and even protection isn't really the deciding factor for me because there is such overlap.

2) How are they powered? Light PA is usually nuke powered, but what about exoskeletons and EBA?

I don't recall this being addressed in the books, but I may have missed it. For me EBA has a solar panel and/or some form of kinetic energy colletion that powers on board radios etc, along with a built in battery. That way EBA more or less is maintence free as far as energy goes. Exoskeletons for me have a similar system, but also need an e-clip or similar to power them for a few days, or maybe even a week at a time.

3) How long do they take to get on?

I am fairly certain one, or multiple books talk about pieces of this, so there is probably some as written rules that I'm ignoring here. That being said, I go with non environmental BA being quick, say 30 seconds,
EBA maybe 60 seconds, light Exos 2 minutes, full PA 5 minutes, and then things like Flanker suits being special cases.

RockJock wrote:1) How do you separate them? As in what makes an exoskeleton vs a PA or EBA?
For me EBA doesn't give bonuses, Exoskeletons give bonuses, but do not require a piloting skill, Light PA requires the piloting skill to operate. Weight and even protection isn't really the deciding factor for me because there is such overlap.

Same as this.

RockJock wrote:2) How are they powered? Light PA is usually nuke powered, but what about exoskeletons and EBA?
I don't recall this being addressed in the books, but I may have missed it. For me EBA has a solar panel and/or some form of kinetic energy colletion that powers on board radios etc, along with a built in battery. That way EBA more or less is maintence free as far as energy goes. Exoskeletons for me have a similar system, but also need an e-clip or similar to power them for a few days, or maybe even a week at a time.

PA could also be Solid Oxide or battery powered (WB33 pg 102)

Exos can be batteries or fitted for eclips in emergencies.

EBA is unclear. However, for the sake of gameplay, I've typically house-ruled that EBA uses kinetic energy capture to recharge a battery. IRL there is a knee brace out there that can charge a cell phone for a 30 minute call after walking for just 1 minute, which is about 15% conversion efficiency. As a point of comparison, assuming an eclip is 18 MJ (you may house rule another amount, but this is my house rule), it would take ~40 hours of continuous moderate full body activity to charge the eclip, assuming 2x knee braces and 2x arm braces. So, kinetic capture would be sufficient to recharge a built-in battery to power all the gizmos of EBA. Solar would not be as effective an energy source for a number of reasons, but could be added as an emergency trickle charger.

Non-EBA powered components like a watch, helmet light or HUD probably powered individually by micro-batteries, maybe supplemented with small solar panels for trickle charging.

Note: I generally assume the same kinetic capture system is included in any Exo or PA that relies on batteries, but I don't adjust the stats as listed, assuming that it is already factored into the suit's power consumption.

RockJock wrote:3) How long do they take to get on?
I am fairly certain one, or multiple books talk about pieces of this, so there is probably some as written rules that I'm ignoring here. That being said, I go with non environmental BA being quick, say 30 seconds,
EBA maybe 60 seconds, light Exos 2 minutes, full PA 5 minutes, and then things like Flanker suits being special cases.

EBA (WB5 pg 34): 1 minute for trained users, 1d4+1 minutes for untrained users
Previous discussion that includes PA etc.

1. Altered Attributes indicate Exo-Skeleton or Power Armor (ie PS +9 or PS of 10 in a give category for example), with Power Armor involving power armor skills (pilot, RC:B/E).

2. PA is typically equipped with a long lasting power supply measured in years, Exo-Skeletons use a high energy density "batteries" (or Eclips) that last hours. I'm not sure what powers EBA, but I assume it is low draw to be considered something you can ignore most of the time.

3. The old RMB had an example of someone suiting up in a SAMAS PA, and I would assume it would be similar for EBA/BA/ES unless something indicates the PA "suitup" would be different.

I agree with the prior distinctions made between EBA, exoskeletons, & (Light) PA.

Power system-wise, Rifts Mercenaries introduced the first non-nuclear-powered PA suits, which talked about using high-density batteries (apparently with more energy storage than e-Clips, as it talked about the CAI-50 Challenger having once been "jury-rigged" to run on e-Clips). And we're talking super high-density...per CB1, 1 E-Clip has as much energy storage as 1,000 car batteries, & probably at most are maybe 1-2lbs/0.5-0.9kg each. In contrast, the battery packs in WB33 are roughly 31lbs/14kg each. Unfortunately, while EBAs are probably just powered by an e-Clip (which probably lasts for days or longer, given the assumed minimum power draw), it probably takes a lot more power for exoskeletons to run.

the difference between EBA and an exoskeleton seems to be the addition of the forcefeedback movement amplification systems.

the difference between an exoskeleton and a full power armor seems to be that PA have more sensors and computer aided displays, targeting systems, and so on, which is what gives the suit its extra combat bonuses and why it requires special training.

Thanks for the feedback all, as well as the page references.

Thanks for bringing up the Solid Oxide. I put them in more or less the same long lasting powersource category as Nukes, just with some additional limitations, and a cheaper price.

The e-clip/battery for exoskeletons makes the most sense to me, but like many things in Rifts there is very little consistancy between models. Having something like a Triax T-11 being e-clip powered for multiple days per clip makes sense to me, just doesn't have book info backing it up.

I know I read it (I want to say coalition war campaign) that EBA is powered by either compact batteries (same tech as eclips) but smaller and will power the armor under normal use for somewhere between ~3 days to a week or so. some EBA also has ports to plug in an eclip.

exoskeletons like the triax T11, or the coalition C6-EX seem to be powered by eclips or equivalant batteries. typically for similar periods as the EBA IE 3 days to a week or so

powered armor suits that require power armor training skills to use seem to be nuke powered (fission or RTG [Radio Thermal Generator] typically several year life span, some "cheaper" versions run on electric batteries (of some type like the solid oxide) or eclips/canister eclips but are usually on the cheap/lousy side if not nuke/solid oxide powered.

RockJock wrote:So in Rifts we have had enhanced exoskeletons back to at least WB 5, and I have a couple of quesitons as to how you play them in your games.

1) How do you separate them? As in what makes an exoskeleton vs a PA or EBA?

For me EBA doesn't give bonuses, Exoskeletons give bonuses, but do not require a piloting skill, Light PA requires the piloting skill to operate. Weight and even protection isn't really the deciding factor for me because there is such overlap.

Only quibble is EBA might have some bonuses due to optics and such, but I know what you mean.

2) How are they powered? Light PA is usually nuke powered, but what about exoskeletons and EBA?

I don't recall this being addressed in the books, but I may have missed it. For me EBA has a solar panel and/or some form of kinetic energy colletion that powers on board radios etc, along with a built in battery. That way EBA more or less is maintence free as far as energy goes. Exoskeletons for me have a similar system, but also need an e-clip or similar to power them for a few days, or maybe even a week at a time.

I tend towards most things using very efficient RTGs, with long half-lives.

Thanks Ogre, and yes, I meant the physical bonuses vs optics or what not.

Dashi, that is kinda where I am. I "think" I read something similar, but not sure where or when.