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Well you still get the OCC's base SDC. Five is a bonus.

gadrin wrote:yeah, but not all OCCs offer it.

the Temporal Warrior does, or it's really a bonus, but Mind Melter doesn't and there are plenty of others.

I always thought it was an RCC thang.

Yes they do.
Rifts Main Book pg. 9
Practioners of Magic/Scholars and Adventurers 4D6
Psychics 3D6
Men of Arms 1D4x10

I would consider a Temporal Warrior more of a Man of Arms then Practioner of Magic for SDC purposes.

gadrin wrote:

Dr. Doom III wrote:I think those are just for humans, right ? otherwise every race is identical and the other RCCs in the various books wouldn't have it listed.

The Juicer/Crazy and others have a nice SDC bonus.

I was really hoping 5 was a misprint

No they are for OCCs.
Human or not.

The SDC base is for ANY SDC based race...unless it specifically states in the RCC/Race description that the RCC/Race has it's own SDC base, and I don't think I've seen one yet that does...unless you count vampires...

Dr. Doom III wrote:

gadrin wrote:

Dr. Doom III wrote:I think those are just for humans, right ? otherwise every race is identical and the other RCCs in the various books wouldn't have it listed.

The Juicer/Crazy and others have a nice SDC bonus.

I was really hoping 5 was a misprint

No they are for OCCs.
Human or not.

I don't know about that, Doom.
I'd say to go with whatever SDC base was larger, not add them together.
So a changeling's 5 SDC would only count if his OCC SDC base was lower (4 ones on 4d6, for example).
Otherwise things get wierd, because humans have no base SDC; they only get the SDC base from their OCC. This would put most every other race at an advantage over us for no real reason.

Killer Cyborg wrote:I don't know about that, Doom.

No worries. I do.

gadrin wrote:the only RCCs really in the main book are humans and Dragons.

there's really no mention of elves and d-bees (that's CB1).

there's also no mention of adding RCC + OCC SDC together.

First off, humans, elves, changelings, wolfen, and the like are Races, not Racial Character Classes.

Secondly, every main book lists base S.D.C. by class, not race.

Thirdly, in the PF2e main book it is specifically noted in the race entries that the racial S.D.C. is a bonus to that of their O.C.C./P.C.C.

gadrin wrote:don't have PF so...

you think they'd list this stuff in each main book, or have a PDF on their website, done by a real PB employee.

If you do then you don't know Palladium very well.

The SDC figure listed with the assorted races is as a BONUS to any OCC chosen...unless it's an RCC, in which case it is all that there is.

So, is that a good answer?

All psychic classes are technically PCCs, not RCCs...however, Psi-Stalkers and Mind Bleedersfor two are "technically" an RCC as well. (Although they are close enough to their "basic" race that they can breed with them, and the genetics are - in the case of the stalker - dominant...from my reading anyway... )

In the case of non-RCC versions of the class, they receive the SDC listed (if any) for the RCC, plus the 3D6 for psychics, plus their race, plus any physical skills. For an "RCC" version, they receive the default SDC ("0") in the case of "human" off shoots, plus any for the RCC itself (if none, they receive the 3D6 for psychics), plus any bonuses for skills.

It's one of those things that is easy to do/use, but hard to explain without being in front of the person and showing them...

gadrin wrote:Changeling in CB1 says:

5 SDC plus OCC and physical skills.

so for a Changeling Mind Bleeder: 5 + 3D6 for psychics + any physical skills SDC bonuses ???

even though the Mind Bleeder RCC isn't specifically an "OCC"

Yes.

Mindbleeders are a bad example since Palladium can decide if they are D-bees or psychics.

gadrin wrote:Killer Cyborg's right, though.

Humans get no base SDC (unless they're defined in a conversion book or something.)

Remember the "Psionics: Standard same as humans." I don't think that was defined any place either.

That also kinda points to the Rifts Main RPG as the "blueprint for humans".

No.
No one gets "base" SDC.
Some get bonus SDC. Humans are not one of them.

gadrin wrote:let me ask you this: do you consider step #4 Psionics; to be the "standard same as humans" portion of psionics for other races, like the Star Elf or Zebuloid ?

Unless it says otherwise yes.

gadrin wrote:HU2e says "base" for each of the character types. I realize this isn't a racial deal but for each category. HU does mention that all aliens have a "base" SDC of 20.

True, but those are essentially OCCs and RCCs.

As for Rifts, DOOM is correct, kinda, that the R/OCC types are given SDC as a "supplement" to hit points, implying that it is a "bonus" opposed to a "base."

As for Nightbane, PF, BTS, etc...you'd have to check them individually.