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My hope is that man will turn away from the idea that animals need human intelligence in the first place.
I find science to be amazing and wonderous, and yet it is also a dangerous playground, where the question "Why am I doing this" is never asked enough, nor satisfactorily answered.

Erick Wujcik wrote:Which altered/mutant animal will first achieve human sentience?

What exactly do you mean by "human sentience"? And how would we judge it, when and if that happened?

The Webster's dictionary I have defines 'sentient' as: "Possessing the power of feeling or perception". I feel that all animals are already sentient.

So, the question then is what is "human sentience"?

Is it just the ability to communicate with other humans? Well, years ago Koko the gorilla began using sign language to communicate with people, and I think I've heard that other primates have learned to do the same, and they didn't need to be mutated or geneticly altered for them to be able to that.

Sentinel wrote:My hope is that man will turn away from the idea that animals need human intelligence in the first place.
I find science to be amazing and wonderous, and yet it is also a dangerous playground, where the question "Why am I doing this" is never asked enough, nor satisfactorily answered.

They're doing it because they're SCIENTISTS! what else do you need.

And animals need human intelligence (and opposable digits.) so they can kick our butts for all the stuff we've put them through. only fair really...

Rali wrote:

Erick Wujcik wrote:Which altered/mutant animal will first achieve human sentience?

What exactly do you mean by "human sentience"? And how would we judge it, when and if that happened?

The Webster's dictionary I have defines 'sentient' as: "Possessing the power of feeling or perception". I feel that all animals are already sentient.

So, the question then is what is "human sentience"?

Is it just the ability to communicate with other humans? Well, years ago Koko the gorilla began using sign language to communicate with people, and I think I've heard that other primates have learned to do the same, and they didn't need to be mutated or geneticly altered for them to be able to that.

and those SL using Primates have shown themselves to be as smart as any human alive (smarter than most humans actually), just with thought processes Alien to ours.

I went with other...I want my cat to be able to express her jealousy of my wife more vocally. It would take cat fight to a whole new level.

Wow, example number three with the mice sounds like it has some very creepy real-life parallels to the book "Flowers for Algernon". So much so that it almost sounds as if it could be the basis for a sequel if it wasn't actually taking place in reality.

KillingMachine wrote:Wow, example number three with the mice sounds like it has some very creepy real-life parallels to the book "Flowers for Algernon". So much so that it almost sounds as if it could be the basis for a sequel if it wasn't actually taking place in reality.

If you breed mice with 100% human brain tissue, will they not still be mice? Or, would you consider them human's in mice bodies?

If we created a mouse with 100% human brain tissue, and a larynx that enabled it to "speak", or paws that allowed it to write or perform sign language so that it could communicate with humans, how would we treat it?

At what point do we draw the line of distinction?

Considering this gives one some insight into how the Empire of Humanity must view the rise of anthropomorphs (mutant animals) in the world around it, and why they fight to regain what they see as being rightfully thiers.

IMO, if we do continue down this path of animal mutation/experimentation I hope that the scientific community, and the world at large, can view the resulting beings/animals/anthos/??? with respect for being what they are and not just experimental by-products that can be destroyed or put on public display when there usefulness is over.

Rali wrote:

KillingMachine wrote:Wow, example number three with the mice sounds like it has some very creepy real-life parallels to the book "Flowers for Algernon". So much so that it almost sounds as if it could be the basis for a sequel if it wasn't actually taking place in reality.

If you breed mice with 100% human brain tissue, will they not still be mice? Or, would you consider them human's in mice bodies?

If we created a mouse with 100% human brain tissue, and a larynx that enabled it to "speak", or paws that allowed it to write or perform sign language so that it could communicate with humans, how would we treat it?

At what point do we draw the line of distinction?

If you make a cow that has a lot of human DNA, at which point does eating a burger become cannibalism?

If you breed mice with 100% human brain tissue, will they not still be mice? Or, would you consider them human's in mice bodies?

If we created a mouse with 100% human brain tissue, and a larynx that enabled it to "speak", or paws that allowed it to write or perform sign language so that it could communicate with humans, how would we treat it?

At what point do we draw the line of distinction?

well, current theories on intellegence indicate that to have certain levels of higher thought require a brain of a certain mass, and of a certain body to brain mass ratio.

it is unlikely that mice born with human brain tissue will have those levels (then again, science has been wrong before.)


one of the problems with questions like this is that to determain an answer, it has to have been done. Hypotheticals can be argued to death, but when your facing living proof its becomes much more immediate and connected.

gordyzx9r wrote:I went with other...I want my cat to be able to express her jealousy of my wife more vocally. It would take cat fight to a whole new level.

I would rather not have my dog be able to either verbalize it's desire for food nor be able to just get the food for itself.

Sentinel wrote:

gordyzx9r wrote:I went with other...I want my cat to be able to express her jealousy of my wife more vocally. It would take cat fight to a whole new level.

I would rather not have my dog be able to either verbalize it's desire for food nor be able to just get the food for itself.

I wish my cat would...

Cat, "Mur, mur... Meow!"
Me, "Huh, What?"
Cat, "MEOW!!"
Me, "What do you want?!"
Cat, "MEEEOOOWWWW!!!" <Translated, "Stupid furless one, I want to play!">
Me, "Stupid cat. Go take a nap!"
Cat proptly attacks my ankle out of frustration.