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So here's the picture.

you have two guys who want to make Ley Line Walkers. allirght, roll 'em.

so they do.one guy gets lucky on the first roll and gets an IQ of 23

the other guy...not so luckey. IQ of 10, the bare minimum for the class.

the rest of the attributes is fair to good.

but here's what got me when I found myself GMing the above situation.

the Genious Ley Line walker, was in no way, shape or form any better at magic than the guy with purely average intelligence.

ummm, that didn't seem right

so I made a houserule. Any spellcaster with an extrodinary IQ can compare his IQ to the ME chart (like how you determine preception bonuses) and get that number in bonus spells from level 1d6 (he has to roll for that) or a lower level than what you rolled.

Yes, I have playtested it, I found it didn't unbalance the game any, and gave a genious the edge he deserved.

but it's not fair to only reward mages, so I came up with some other ones.

in each case IQ is compared to ME for bonus like preception is determined:

Men of Magic: as above

Scholors and Adventurers: Gets extra secondary skills equal to bonus number, in addition to the IQ % bonus

Men of Arms: Get that number in permant bonus to combat moves, (Strike, parry, roll with punch, ect.) and is divided however they choose. for instance, a guy with IQ of 21 has +3 so he can have +1 strike, parry, and dodge, or +3 to pull punch, or however he wants to divide it.

Master Psychic classes (PCC's or however you call them). get the bonus number in extra lesser psionic powers from healing, physical, or senstive. what catagory they are picked from is determined by the most relevant to their overall class. a Psi-Stalker would get extra sesitive powers, a Kinetic like Burster or Zapper gets extra physical powers. only the Mind Melter can take extras from all three. for any new psychic class that comes out, GM use discretion.

So what do you think? Questions, comments, Flames and Praise are all welcome

Interesting.

Not sure if I would use it in my groups (although I might play test it) but it does appear to be a solid idea.



~ Josh

C.R.A.F.T. wrote:Extra skills and abilities is like a smarter person able to take more electives in college.

You mean the financial aid students get screwed?

Tinker Dragoon wrote:

C.R.A.F.T. wrote:Extra skills and abilities is like a smarter person able to take more electives in college.

You mean the financial aid students get screwed?

That is sadly true.

But still hilarious.

~ Josh

Looks pretty good to me, I'll give it a go

Interesting idea.

Just to be difficult, how would you handle a character who qualified for more then one bonus, like a dog boy vagabond? (would get bonus secondary skills because he's a scholar & adventurer class and bonus sensitive powers because he's a master psi.)

Kalinda wrote:Interesting idea.

Just to be difficult, how would you handle a character who qualified for more then one bonus, like a dog boy vagabond? (would get bonus secondary skills because he's a scholar & adventurer class and bonus sensitive powers because he's a master psi.)

not technically legal, sinse you can only have 1 OCC. however I say you have whatever one he is primarily.

KanedaMuyo wrote:

Nekira Sudacne wrote:

Kalinda wrote:Interesting idea.

Just to be difficult, how would you handle a character who qualified for more then one bonus, like a dog boy vagabond? (would get bonus secondary skills because he's a scholar & adventurer class and bonus sensitive powers because he's a master psi.)

not technically legal, sinse you can only have 1 OCC. however I say you have whatever one he is primarily.

Technically its an OOC and a RCC.

and RCC's can't take OCC's and keep their RCC. so in that case the primary one would be the one used.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:

Kalinda wrote:Interesting idea.

Just to be difficult, how would you handle a character who qualified for more then one bonus, like a dog boy vagabond? (would get bonus secondary skills because he's a scholar & adventurer class and bonus sensitive powers because he's a master psi.)

not technically legal, since you can only have 1 OCC. however I say you have whatever one he is primarily.

Actually it is book legal according to the rules for freeborn dog boys in Lone Star. (Page 39.) A freeborn gets all his psi powers, but can choose just about any OCC. Dog boys aren't an RCC according to RUE, basically they're now treated as a race with some physical bonuses and innate psi abilities.

From RUE page 148:

We were a bit sloppy in the early days being consistent as to which characters were OCCs and which were RCCs. The dog boy was originally classified as an RCC (so were psychics), but sticking with the definition of an RCC (a character who is so defined by it's genetic makeup that it cannot select other occupations, it is what it is.), a dog boy would be an OCC.

In any case, I would also say that you would only get one set of bonuses, although I might let the player choose which one, representing which side of the character's abilities they focused on.

Kalinda wrote:

Nekira Sudacne wrote:

Kalinda wrote:Interesting idea.

Just to be difficult, how would you handle a character who qualified for more then one bonus, like a dog boy vagabond? (would get bonus secondary skills because he's a scholar & adventurer class and bonus sensitive powers because he's a master psi.)

not technically legal, since you can only have 1 OCC. however I say you have whatever one he is primarily.

Actually it is book legal according to the rules for freeborn dog boys in Lone Star. (Page 39.) A freeborn gets all his psi powers, but can choose just about any OCC. Dog boys aren't an RCC according to RUE, basically they're now treated as a race with some physical bonuses and innate psi abilities.

From RUE page 148:

We were a bit sloppy in the early days being consistent as to which characters were OCCs and which were RCCs. The dog boy was originally classified as an RCC (so were psychics), but sticking with the definition of an RCC (a character who is so defined by it's genetic makeup that it cannot select other occupations, it is what it is.), a dog boy would be an OCC.

In any case, I would also say that you would only get one set of bonuses, although I might let the player choose which one, representing which side of the character's abilities they focused on.

I stand corrected,asI didn't have UR.


anyway then, sinse it can only be assumed that a dog boy took an OCC because of an intrest in that feild then it can only be assumed that's what they focused on,and thus their IQ bonus goes into whatever OCC they took. only hte "standard" Dog Boy class that's trained to focus on their psionic powers can take the bonus to IQ in extra psionic.

that's how i'd say it works for any OCC/RCC combination

Sounds like a reasonable way of doing it.

Shadowmagic wrote:Even if you just apply IQ where you should, you still get a good bonus to your skills. Getting spells has more to do with opportunity, or money than IQ(this isn't D & D). Your skills RELATED to Magic may give you a significant advantage

Ley Line Walkers have masters, they have guilds and libraries to study in, they have to learn the words and gestures to cast them...how is it NOT IQ related? only the mystic and the various mystic subclasses can ligitmatly be said not to be related to IQ

Psi powers develop in time, not because of IQ. Most Psi classes have poor skills selections because of their focus on the powerful Psionics they perfect instead. There are a few Psi classes that contradict this but, their lvl of Psi mastery doesn't usually rate into the Super category.

what makes you say the develop "in time"? I don't recall reading anything to that effect. it's a process where you have to master your own mind.

Combat and IQ don't necessarily have anything to do with each other, except when skill rolls like Detect Ambush and such come into play. How many monsters are there in PB that have low IQs but, ridiculous combat abilites? Alot. As far as using combat oriented skills strategically, that applies with a high IQ.

exsactly. a smarter person is more likely to notice a subtle opening, recognise a feint, and thus give them an edge.

try to find someone who's physically able but very stupid. even when they do learn the moves they'll have trouble applying the right one when out in a real fight and not in the dojo or arena

As far as getting more skills because of high IQ, that's the only place I agree. IQ is a hard one to use because it doesn't generate many tangibe effects. In roleplaying, we often give Genius characters more insight and make it more obvious when they might be able to do something significant. If an unimaginative player uses a Genius character, it pretty much goes to waste without some prompting at times

I always dispair because it's the dumbest person in most of my groups that always roll the highest IQ

Try adapting the HU/N&SS education table.

As for the use of OCCs with a PCC...I personally have no problem with it, provided you follow the "rules" PB has laid out for it...depending on your source material, it ranges from freezing your current level, "paying" 2000(?)XPs and advancing in your new OCC. To the same but having to pay 2x the XPs to advance in the new OCC. In either case, you have to find (and/or pay) someone to train you in the new OCC.

It's been a while since I had to look it up (almost a year now), but the one thing in common is you can't go back, if you do, you loose the new OCC.

I like this idea
I will definitely be implementing this in one way or another

Nekira Sudacne wrote:So here's the picture.

you have two guys who want to make Ley Line Walkers. allirght, roll 'em.

so they do.one guy gets lucky on the first roll and gets an IQ of 23

the other guy...not so luckey. IQ of 10, the bare minimum for the class.

the rest of the attributes is fair to good.

but here's what got me when I found myself GMing the above situation.

the Genious Ley Line walker, was in no way, shape or form any better at magic than the guy with purely average intelligence.

ummm, that didn't seem right

so I made a houserule. Any spellcaster with an extrodinary IQ can compare his IQ to the ME chart (like how you determine preception bonuses) and get that number in bonus spells from level 1d6 (he has to roll for that) or a lower level than what you rolled.

Yes, I have playtested it, I found it didn't unbalance the game any, and gave a genious the edge he deserved.

but it's not fair to only reward mages, so I came up with some other ones.

in each case IQ is compared to ME for bonus like preception is determined:

Men of Magic: as above

Scholors and Adventurers: Gets extra secondary skills equal to bonus number, in addition to the IQ % bonus

Men of Arms: Get that number in permant bonus to combat moves, (Strike, parry, roll with punch, ect.) and is divided however they choose. for instance, a guy with IQ of 21 has +3 so he can have +1 strike, parry, and dodge, or +3 to pull punch, or however he wants to divide it.

Master Psychic classes (PCC's or however you call them). get the bonus number in extra lesser psionic powers from healing, physical, or senstive. what catagory they are picked from is determined by the most relevant to their overall class. a Psi-Stalker would get extra sesitive powers, a Kinetic like Burster or Zapper gets extra physical powers. only the Mind Melter can take extras from all three. for any new psychic class that comes out, GM use discretion.

So what do you think? Questions, comments, Flames and Praise are all welcome

Yeah and MA not PE should determine PPE while ME not PE should determine ISP. After all it is the way a mage can wrap their mind around the universe that gives them their abilities if not MA then ME also but it is the mind not the body, while the psychic forces his will of mind upon the universe.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:So here's the picture.

you have two guys who want to make Ley Line Walkers. allirght, roll 'em.

so they do.one guy gets lucky on the first roll and gets an IQ of 23

the other guy...not so luckey. IQ of 10, the bare minimum for the class.

the rest of the attributes is fair to good.

but here's what got me when I found myself GMing the above situation.

the Genious Ley Line walker, was in no way, shape or form any better at magic than the guy with purely average intelligence.

ummm, that didn't seem right

This is another reason why I use the PPE Channeling rules with the Principles of Magic skill found in Through the Glass Darkly. The one with the higher IQ will master his craft faster.

Speaking of book worms, that's the only way the Book police will be able to Sneak around empty Libraries and catch library violators ... by Sneaking past everything, including Security cameras!

I agree with the basic concept,but try this instead:reward Men of Arms for high PP,and reward Psychics for high ME rolls.I suggest that you limit these granted bonuses to "natural" rolls only,not high stats granted by skills or augmentation.

Captain Shiva wrote:I agree with the basic concept,but try this instead:reward Men of Arms for high PP,and reward Psychics for high ME rolls.I suggest that you limit these granted bonuses to "natural" rolls only,not high stats granted by skills or augmentation.

that would defeat the idea of making IQ useful as an attribute to psychics or fighters

I don't quite understand why you think being smart should aid in those situations.Physical combat is a matter of action more than thought,and will,best expressed in game terms as ME,should most logically govern psionics.

Not a bad house rule. I can certainly see the reasoning behind it. I have a suggestion for something a little different with regards to the mages though. Instead of having the "genius" mage start off with more spells why not increase his starting spell power?

Raw intelligence or IQ is not the same thing as the ability to memorize information. That being the case someone with a so called "Photographic" memory could retain vast quanties of data (spells in this case) but not have the intelligence to make the fullest use of it.

Just a different way of looking at it. I like the parts of your house rule dealing with the other classes.

While I understand your reasoning behind it, I am against this idea.

This puts too much of a gap between the player who just happened to roll well on his IQ and the player who didn't.

It further punishes the player who rolled average to poor on his IQ, which is not his fault, while rewards the player who happened to get lucky.

"Hey pal, not only did you roll badly on your IQ, but...you suck!!!"

Not a good idea.

IQ already has a reward for high stats: A bonus percentage to all skills taken by the player.

If you wanted to give a slight nudge to the player who has the higher IQ, what I suggest is to perhaps allow him to learn new spells, or perform other research at a slightly quicker pace. I believe Through The Looking Glass Darkly suggests this as well.

The problem with putting too much emphasis on stats is that the players will suddenly become alot more conscious of whether or not they have low stats. And they will let you know about it.