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Two things;
First, anyone know why Rurga's personal army is called the Army of Darkness? Seems odd for such a nice and holy type of person to name their forces in such a way.
And is it just me, or does some of the equipment used by this pantheion just suck? Vlaa (Rurga's sword), deals a little extra damage (4D6 + something), and can cast blinding flash. . . Dispite her being around 30th level, and oh yea, a GOD! Her back up weapon deals 2D6 (I think), and it's only power is returns when thrown, a pretty common ability. Panath's weapon deals almost no damage, and has a crummy ability.

Cinos

Uhh ... are you looking at the right page? I have Vlaa at 6D6 double damage against demons and undead; Coal at 4D6 and returns to weilder (not bad for something you found on the battlefield); and Zelg at 3D6+3 ... All of which are +24 from her PS bonus.

I have Vlaa at 6D6 double damage against demons and undead

Sorry, my bad, I'm working off memory on the damages. Even still, that is not all that much, for something a god walks around with at any rate. Your average runic weapon is still better.

Cinos

True, but why would the god want to complement their already great powers with great weapons, making them that much better (look at Algors weapon, it's pretty nice).

Cinos

All of the deity weapon damages are screwy. I was somewhat disappointed with Dragons and Gods in that it actually gave stats to the Gods... mortals won't be able to tangle with even Chantico, much less Rurga or Od, IMG.

MrNexx wrote:All of the deity weapon damages are screwy. I was somewhat disappointed with Dragons and Gods in that it actually gave stats to the Gods... mortals won't be able to tangle with even Chantico, much less Rurga or Od, IMG.

Palladium's gods have always been fairly mortal though. Actually most gods are - gamers seem to love untouchable gods, but I've rarely seen them done that way in game books.

Keep in mind that the Pantheon of Rurga is an small faith, only regonized on a handfull of worlds.

Cinos wrote:Two things;
First, anyone know why Rurga's personal army is called the Army of Darkness? Seems odd for such a nice and holy type of person to name their forces in such a way.

Well, they DID mount an assault to recover the Necronomicon from some big-chinned wise-ass. He didn't die in the graveyard before he got it like they'd hoped.

I see the problem with the damage. 6d6 for the sword isn't all that great when you can have a PC or NPC with a Enchanted sword doing as much or more. A giant dwarven sword can do 4d6+4, 4d6+6 if you use Black Iron, and that is with absolutely no enchantments.

As for her being a minor god, that is true, but look at the Wild Lords. They have more powerful weapons, and they are barely gods at the moment.

Yea, Rugra's pathon is really pathetically weak as gods go.

they still kick most mortals assess six ways to sunday

I'm not disputing HER power, just that of her weapons, like RockJock pointed out, it's fairly easy for a non-magical weapon to near the same damage levels as her weapons (ignoring P.S bonuses). And I agree that almost any mortal going toe to toe with Rurga, Cirga or Panath would get turned into red goop (even if the god just waited them out, falling back on massive S.D.C and Deific Regeneration).

Cinos

Ruga using her fist is only slightly less dangerous there her using her giant rune sword. A tree limb does as much damage. That is the part that doesn't make sense.

So Thoth hasn't made her a custom rune weapon. Big deal. She has relied on what she could find in her path to godhood; besides, once you bond with a weapon, you're much less likely to use another -- even if it is more badass.

besides, once you bond with a weapon, you're much less likely to use another -- even if it is more badass.

While this is true, there are limits to it. Would you drive a 1970 Oldsmobile that is rusted, or a Jag (Or what ever car you like) that's just off the line?

Cinos

The closest you could get, using canon conventional weapons, would be a giant-sized Voulge, doing 5D6. That's a lot, of course, but it has some major disadvantages compared to Vlaa

The point however, is that you take that giant-sized voulge that hits for 5D6, then put some enchantments on it so its so much more (You could easly put Double Damage to demons and cast blinding flash on it without even making it runic).

Cinos

A rune weapon being sentient can be a significant advantage... if it has some powers to weild on its own. Your sentient rune sword with spellcasting capability can cast spells even as its being smacked into things. The psychic sword can do things on its own. The sword with priest powers can heal you when you take damage. A sentient sword without these powers can't do much except give you advice... and an IQ of 20 isn't that impressive when you've got Deific Intelligence.

Cinos wrote:True, but why would the god want to complement their already great powers with great weapons, making them that much better (look at Algors weapon, it's pretty nice).

Cinos

For the same reason Doctor Doom carries a pistol sidearm.
One, it's stylish.
Two, some enemies just don't merit Deific powers.

I think the point people are making is that a character could create an overall more impressive weapon with ordinary alchemy than what Rurga have. Of course, many have argued before that you can often make mundane magical weapons that are generally superior to lesser rune weapons anyway. When you think about it, the mechanical power of the vast majority of rune weapons is greatly out of sync with the flavor text of what they're supposed to be. The only time most of them demonstrate immense power is in the curses. And it's not like being sentient or intelligent really makes them better weapons.

Bingo.

Two, some enemies just don't merit Deific powers

Yes, but Dr. Doom has other weapons he can turn on, this is the high point of Rurga's weaponry. Dr. Doom would be much less of a threat if that pistol was the top of his weaponry.

Cinos

Greetings and Salutations. Just thought I'd add an extra thought. Though it's true this her weapons are not all powerful, and it's not hard to make a weapon close in power through normal magical means of an alchemist (though even a giant-sized voulge with additional damage -6D6-, Demon Slayer -Double to demons-, and Blinding Flash spell -third limit-, and still lacking a few of the rune weapons abilities if you really want to figure it out) it can be about more than that. Rurga is a warrior. Sometimes you just have a favorite weapon regardless of its power. And even if she can make a more powerful weapon or finds another one, that doesn't mean she would just suddenly replace it. It's quite possible this is a weapon from her early days and she just never wanted to replace it even though she's had a chance and weapons far more powerful.

Another thing to consider is that this is a pantheon that encourages followers not to abandon their old gods. I'm guessing she'd feel the same about her weaponry. Though I suppose it is true that a more powerful weapon may be a secondary weapon in this case. This is one of the more weaker arguments, but just another thing to consider.

Now there is constant mention of Rurga being a warrior, we all know that part of it. Maybe she is the type of actually prefer on her skill as opposed to just power alone. Nearly anyone can be a force to be reckoned with if they're wielding a weapon that inflicts 1D6x1000 points of damage, but that doesn't make them anymore of a warrior. Also she has a strong sense of honor. It's already been admitted that this is not the most powerful of weapons and that a close combat equivalent can even be made with alchemy. This may suit her better as, to her, it may be dishonorable to use a weapon that has a weapon than what her typical opponent is armed with. All right, just some thoughts about it. Maybe it helped, maybe I just sounded like an idiot (sometimes I can do both at once). Farewell and safe journeys.

You know, I don't think its clear enough. Rurga is a very weak god. Period. She is pretty much on par with a regular, old fashioned, adult dragon ... with worshippers on 4 worlds. Big deal.

Vlaa is her favorite weapon. Not her most effective. There is nothing to say that she doesn't have a horde of other, more powerful weapons laying around should she choose to use one. She simple preferes to use Vlaa. A millenium of commeraderie means a lot. Try telling your best friend -- that you have known for a few thousand years -- that you are going to lock them in a box in your basement for eternity because you found somebody who can pump more iron or do long division faster. I doubt it would go over well.

The Immortal ME wrote:You know, I don't think its clear enough. Rurga is a very weak god. Period. She is pretty much on par with a regular, old fashioned, adult dragon ... with worshippers on 4 worlds. Big deal.

Vlaa is her favorite weapon. Not her most effective. There is nothing to say that she doesn't have a horde of other, more powerful weapons laying around should she choose to use one. She simple preferes to use Vlaa. A millenium of commeraderie means a lot. Try telling your best friend -- that you have known for a few thousand years -- that you are going to lock them in a box in your basement for eternity because you found somebody who can pump more iron or do long division faster. I doubt it would go over well.

She should've picked a better friend way back when then.

Sarcasm aside, your point is well taken...she's still alive after all, it can't be doing that poorly in her hands.

Cinos wrote:

besides, once you bond with a weapon, you're much less likely to use another -- even if it is more badass.

While this is true, there are limits to it. Would you drive a 1970 Oldsmobile that is rusted, or a Jag (Or what ever car you like) that's just off the line?

Cinos

Comparison dosn't apply.

your Oldsmobile isn't sentiant. your oldsmobile hasn't always been there though though think and thin fighting forces of evil suffient to topple nations. you don't have a spirtual bond with an oldsmobile.

Rurga does with Vlaa

Nekira Sudacne wrote:your Oldsmobile isn't sentiant. your oldsmobile hasn't always been there though though think and thin fighting forces of evil suffient to topple nations. you don't have a spirtual bond with an oldsmobile.

My truck got totalled last weekend.

You're driving the wrong kind of car, I think.

MrNexx wrote:

Nekira Sudacne wrote:your Oldsmobile isn't sentiant. your oldsmobile hasn't always been there though though think and thin fighting forces of evil suffient to topple nations. you don't have a spirtual bond with an oldsmobile.

My truck got totalled last weekend.

You're driving the wrong kind of car, I think.

you totaled it running it into a demon lord just in time to stop it's evil plot to ruin the world after making a spiritual bond with your truck that allowed it to drive itself with just your thoughts??

Nekira Sudacne wrote:you totaled it running it into a demon lord just in time to stop it's evil plot to ruin the world after making a spiritual bond with your truck that allowed it to drive itself with just your thoughts??

No, my wife totalled it running a stop light.

Still, if you don't have a spiritual bond with your vehicle, you're driving the wrong kind. I knew when my truck was cranky. I knew when it actually needed maintenence, and when it just wanted attention. Sometimes, my truck just wanted to hear "Come on, pretty lady, just get me a couple more miles and I'll fill your tank tomorrow." And she'd do it.

your Oldsmobile isn't sentiant. your oldsmobile hasn't always been there though though think and thin fighting forces of evil suffient to topple nations. you don't have a spirtual bond with an oldsmobile.

Rurga does with Vlaa

However, I don't really think Rurga would let some 'petty' thing like friendship get in the way of effectivness. Sure, I'm sure she'd keep Vlaa around, but lets remember, Rurga stop being a warrior goddess for 3 years, and even set Vlaa aside for a peaceful life as a wife, until she KILLED HER HUSBAND FOR A TWIST OF WORDS. Someone willing to kill her own lover in cold blood over a technicality of words is someone willing to retire an old friend in favor of a more powerful one.

Cinos

Cinos wrote:

your Oldsmobile isn't sentiant. your oldsmobile hasn't always been there though though think and thin fighting forces of evil suffient to topple nations. you don't have a spirtual bond with an oldsmobile.

Rurga does with Vlaa

However, I don't really think Rurga would let some 'petty' thing like friendship get in the way of effectivness. Sure, I'm sure she'd keep Vlaa around, but lets remember, Rurga stop being a warrior goddess for 3 years, and even set Vlaa aside for a peaceful life as a wife, until she KILLED HER HUSBAND FOR A TWIST OF WORDS. Someone willing to kill her own lover in cold blood over a technicality of words is someone willing to retire an old friend in favor of a more powerful one.

Cinos

You realize, being like that, she probably told the scentiant sword at some point "I shall always keep you by my side"

and thus, is going to do that no matter what the cost of keeping that minor statement is.

You realize, being like that, she probably told the scentiant sword at some point "I shall always keep you by my side"

and thus, is going to do that no matter what the cost of keeping that minor statement is.

It's no more likely that she said the same thing to her husband.

Cinos

Plus when you're already a god, Style > Substance.

I think that my orginal intent of this post got messed up somewhere along the line, and I'm just now realizing it (Shame on me for getting caught up in the argument).
What we where argueing was wether or not Rurga would keep Vlaa or trade it in for a bigger gun, but my orginal intent of the post was that Vlaa simply should be bigger in and of it's self, along with many other things with that panthion, like Panath's daggers, his REALLY suck, or some of Cirga's weapons (though he has some ok things).

Cinos

The daggers appear to mundane items capable of delivering a wide variety of poisons (and who knows what Panath has in his arsenal that way). Besides a pair of non-magical daggers can go here and there without being magically detected, so that may have a lot to do with their being carried.

It lists one of Panaths posions with the daggers. It sucks just as badly. You'd think he'd keep a pair of the daggers he GIVES to his greater followers (now those are daggers!). Besides, he could always keep a pair of non-magical daggers around when he needs them (Besides, you don't think a god might be easly detectable when senseing magic?).
And looking though the Rurga panthion last night, I read the bit of the Ta'Palladia again, the one under Rurga's discription. Saying that during the third year of her mariage, she was ready to bury Vlaa in the ground, clearly setting a pressadance that she is willing to part with the weapon.

Cinos