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never heard of it. sounds alot like a GM creation to me.

have these players played under other GM's before?

I don't think it's called Blacksteel but there is something like it in the Palladium Fantasy world, I think in the Northern Hinterlands book?

Not familiar with Blacksteel. Have them show you where it is in the book and if they can't, then say no. Heck, even if they can show you where it is, you might still want to say no because of the doubled MDC. Maybe raise the price so they can't afford it.

"When you ask the dealer about getting it made with blacksteel, you can see the $ signs in his eyes. 'Well sure, we can make it from blacksteel, but there's been a shortage of it the last few years, the one place it can be mined has dried up so everything made out of it these days is from recycled materials. There's a limited quantity of it on the planet, you see, so the price is much higher than it used to be.' "

Maybe they're talking about Darkmetal?

This is from D&D below:

Blacksteel armor: blacksteel armor is the equivalent of +1 shadow mithral armor. A blacksteel chain shirt costs 5,850gp. A blacksteel suit of full chainmail costs 8,900gp.

Maybe this is where they are getting it from.

There's a Blacksteel Throwing Dagger in World of Warcraft but no mention of Blacksteel Armor.

I still say put it on them to prove it exists. When they can't tell them not to pull that kinda stuff in your game anymore. If they want something they need to know where it is in the books before asking for it. No reasonable GM is going to blindly approve of something that doubles the amount of damage a character can take.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:I don't think it's called Blacksteel but there is something like it in the Palladium Fantasy world, I think in the Northern Hinterlands book?

Yeah check out Black Iron in the Northern Hinterlands book. Sorry don't have the page number handy.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Yeah check out Black Iron in the Northern Hinterlands book. Sorry don't have the page number handy.

If that is what the players are talking about, then there's no reason you would have to allow it in your game, obviously. But something else to consider is maybe it doesn't have the expected properties in Rifts Earth. Maybe it doubles the SDC of an item in the Palladium world, but on Rifts Earth? It's still SDC.

"RAWR, my new Super SAMAS armor is made out of Black Iron."
The SAMAS gets hit by a random laser pistol shot, the pilot's HUD display lights up like a christmas tree.

Page 56 Northern Hinterlands.

Black Iron doubles the SDC of armor and increases the AR by one. Black Iron edge bladed weapons gain +2 to damage and stay sharp 10 times longer.

But nothing in Rifts about this or Blacksteel.

zalen wrote:I keep having players that are supposedly more knowledgable about rifts than me wanting their armour or vehicle made out of something called BLACKSTEEL. They say its from The Palladium universe and it has also been found in magic rich areas of Rifts earth. What in the world is it exactly, and what is the rules and write up for it. All i know is that it double the MDC of the item for Twice the cost.

Please someone tell me they are not lying to me as i CANNOT find any mention of BLACKSTEEL.

I think they're thinking of black iron and not quite understanding it.

In such cases rather than tell the GM something exists, they should point it out in the book.

Natasha wrote:I think they're thinking of black iron and not quite understanding it.

Or they understood it just fine and were hoping to twist it to their advantage in this game but not pointing it out in the book.

I've known players to do that in my games. I usually let it fly and make it backfire bigtime.

LostOne wrote:

Natasha wrote:I think they're thinking of black iron and not quite understanding it.

Or they understood it just fine and were hoping to twist it to their advantage in this game but not pointing it out in the book.

Well yea there's that.

Phalanx wrote:You could make a "snipe hunt"-style quest out of this. Have them come across someone who offers to fabricate "Blacksteel" items for them, but insist that they obtain the raw materials for him or her. They then have to go on a scavenger hunt for all the crazy ingredients the armorer claims to need to smelt the steel. When they're done, the armorer provides them with beautiful "Blacksteel" items... that are made from standard MDC metals with a polycarbonate layer that provides an exotic black sheen.

I love it.

Of course then the armorer is likely to have pissed off customers coming back once they realize the ruse. It would be better to make the material out of sturdy construction quality SDC metal. Hopefully they'll all get killed in their first fight and the armorer has nothing to worry about.

Well I chortled, I admit, but I'd tell them they're full of bullpucky and carry on with gaming.

Yeah I wold allow them to have it acting all ignorant and such. Then after a couple of seesion their Blacksteel Armor Intelligence awakens.

As the GM laughs manically

Maybe the Blacksteel is supernatural in nature and wearing it for a long time weakens the mind against things like possession, psychic powers, etc.

Rules abuse Muncking style. From memory so a little wrong sorry.

BlackSteal fullplate. 180 S.D.C. X 2. 360 S.D.C. AR 19.
Added anymagic power.
Come to rifts earth.
S.D.C. converts to M.D.C. since it is magically enhanced

Since M.D.C. full armor does have AR. Mystic Knight has an example. They have some petty cheap armor with alot M.D.C. Make sure you get the mend the broken so don't have to find more to repair it.
Though this is one is a little out their for me I would say it had the AR of 19 which would make it suck, but where muncking right so why not.

Though not a great abuse of different construction minerals. My fav is white dragon blood(Dragon God Blood) that makes anyweapon penetre any armor. Which magicly enhance makes M.D.C. damage on RIFTS earth. WHich means my arrows/weapon would kill a S.D.C. human in a SAMAS suit in one hit.

Though is this something they want or have like equipment from other GM. If the later is harder to this but I would give them experimental suits of living metal from RIFTS Mercs old it black and they should not know the difference I would think intell it reg I guess. One where it demons take control of them after they kill so many people.

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

I say give it to them, but keep it SDC on Rifts Earth. Then their next batch of PCs will be satisfied with Chipwell suits.

A snipe hunt is a hazing prank or practical joke in which a victim is told they are going to 'hunt snipe' in an area where they are guaranteed not to be, and are then left there. They are usually given a cloth sack and told to wait in the woods with it and the others will drive the snipes to the one 'left holding the bag'. After a few yells and hollers, the would be snipe drivers leave in their trucks and cars and go home. Leaving the person out in the woods still holding the bag. That's the way it's done in the part of KY I grew up in.

And no, I never fell for it.

Rules abuse Muncking style. From memory so a little wrong sorry.

BlackSteal fullplate. 180 S.D.C. X 2. 360 S.D.C. AR 19.
Added anymagic power.
Come to rifts earth.
S.D.C. converts to M.D.C. since it is magically enhanced

Since M.D.C. full armor does have AR. Mystic Knight has an example. They have some petty cheap armor with alot M.D.C. Make sure you get the mend the broken so don't have to find more to repair it.
Though this is one is a little out their for me I would say it had the AR of 19 which would make it suck, but where muncking right so why not.

Though not a great abuse of different construction minerals. My fav is white dragon blood(Dragon God Blood) that makes anyweapon penetre any armor. Which magicly enhance makes M.D.C. damage on RIFTS earth. WHich means my arrows/weapon would kill a S.D.C. human in a SAMAS suit in one hit.

Though is this something they want or have like equipment from other GM. If the later is harder to this but I would give them experimental suits of living metal from RIFTS Mercs old it black and they should not know the difference I would think intell it reg I guess. One where it demons take control of them after they kill so many people.

Yeah after reading this page...think if a Magebane got hold of a suit of that armor only it wasn't magically enchanted. He'd have a suit of armor with 720 MDC when it's empowered. And if he got his hands on a weapon with white dragon blood he'd be one badass mofo.

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since you took mercy upon me.

Fixed that for ya.

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since I was hungry.

Fixed that for ya.

Fixed that fixing for you.

Ding.

No, that's dirty laundry not dirty pool unless you wash your laundry in his pool then that is dirty pool.

So, to tie all this together we are now talking about a NASA rocket scientist who isn't believed by some whose no business it is that is washing his Blacksteel Armor at the house he games at because he lives in the barracks and was told he could?

Am I up to speed now?

bigbobsr6000 wrote:No, that's dirty laundry not dirty pool unless you wash your laundry in his pool then that is dirty pool.

So, to tie all this together we are now talking about a NASA rocket scientist who isn't believed by some whose no business it is that is washing his Blacksteel Armor at the house he games at because he lives in the barracks and was told he could?

Am I up to speed now?

Oh yea and I dare you to say that 10 times fast.

bigbobsr6000 wrote:A snipe hunt is a hazing prank or practical joke in which a victim is told they are going to 'hunt snipe' in an area where they are guaranteed not to be, and are then left there. They are usually given a cloth sack and told to wait in the woods with it and the others will drive the snipes to the one 'left holding the bag'. After a few yells and hollers, the would be snipe drivers leave in their trucks and cars and go home. Leaving the person out in the woods still holding the bag. That's the way it's done in the part of KY I grew up in.

And no, I never fell for it.

Y'all were tame. We scouted out ant hills to leave people in.

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since I look good in pink nighties.

Fixed that for ya.

Fixed that fixing for you.

Ding.

Dong.

you know, people always disbeleive me when i tell them snipe's are real.

apparently the practical joke is far more well known today than the Genus Gallinago

I believe it is in Dragon's and God's. The Dragon Gods' blood turns into metal when it cools. I haven't read the section in something of a year or longer, so perhaps someone can look it up for us and let everyone know it that is where you get black steel.

I would if I had my books, but that is a different issue.

Misfit KotLD wrote:In other words, they're full of it.

They are most definitely full of it.....unless it was in a Rifter somewhere -I finally possess ALL of the Rifts Books, and I assure you that it doesn't exist.

There is the possibility that they're speaking of Styphon's Black Blood Armor, which is invulnerable to all but magic, but to get it they have to go find the Dragon himself.......in the Palladium Dimension on another plane where the Dragon-Gods exist.

(Oh, yeah, almost forgot: IF they want to try and get the stuff, and you want to allow them to try, it costs 80,000 GOLD pieces...per pound. And isn't each GP worth a whole buttload of Credits, and doesn't it take a whole bunch of poundage to make a decent suit of armor??)

Shiva7 wrote:I believe it is in Dragon's and God's. The Dragon Gods' blood turns into metal when it cools. I haven't read the section in something of a year or longer, so perhaps someone can look it up for us and let everyone know it that is where you get black steel.

I would if I had my books, but that is a different issue.

You are correct. I immediately thought of it too. It's the blood of Styphon the Black. Page 227. Black Metal in it's solid state is invulnerable to everything but magic, is lightweight. As armor it has double the normal sdc. A pound of the materail sells for 80,000 gold.

Alejandro wrote:

The Beast wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since I look good in pink nighties.

Fixed that for ya.

Fixed that fixing for you.

Ding.

Dong.

Where's the dead witch?

Which witch, the wicked witch?
(Holy quotes within quotes, Batman!)

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since I lived in the barracks.

I know I told you that it was cool. It's still fun to bring up though

The quots within the quots of misfit was so halarious Me an my girl laughed so hard cause I used to do the same exact thing back in the early 90's at Bragg .. lmfao


-Lenwen.

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

GreenGhost wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Natasha wrote:

Misfit KotLD wrote:Sorry, couldn't help it.

Hah. I don't believe you.

We didn't ask you.

Changes nothing

Natasha- ask him what he brings to a game; character sheet, pens & pencils, books and laundry

That's dirty pool, you said I could since I lived in the barracks.

I know I told you that it was cool. It's still fun to bring up though

I know. Damn thick skulled jarheads...

You know it as good as me

Lenwen wrote:The quots within the quots of misfit was so halarious Me an my girl laughed so hard cause I used to do the same exact thing back in the early 90's at Bragg .. lmfao


-Lenwen.

My father retired at Bragg. We lived in Fayetteville for a few years.

Mark Hall wrote:Y'all were tame. We scouted out ant hills to leave people in.

We didn't do anthills, but we did tie one guy to his cot and put him beside the latrine all night. We also considered taking one little cretin down to the lake tied to his cot, and then setting him adrift in a canoe. I had to stop that one, though. There would have been a chance for him to drown, which would have looked bad to the Eagle Board...

I did convince a couple of younger guys to go snipe fishing at 4:00 A.M. though. They got me up intent on going, but I told them to go on without me and I'd catch up. I'm not sure how long they stayed down there before realizing I wasn't showing up.

Warwolf wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:Y'all were tame. We scouted out ant hills to leave people in.

We didn't do anthills, but we did tie one guy to his cot and put him beside the latrine all night. We also considered taking one little cretin down to the lake tied to his cot, and then setting him adrift in a canoe. I had to stop that one, though. There would have been a chance for him to drown, which would have looked bad to the Eagle Board...

I did convince a couple of younger guys to go snipe fishing at 4:00 A.M. though. They got me up intent on going, but I told them to go on without me and I'd catch up. I'm not sure how long they stayed down there before realizing I wasn't showing up.

Did I neglect to mention the guy we ran up the flagpole?

Not his underwear. Him.

Duct tape a person in a port-a-potty.

At night, pickup the farmers outhouse and move it back just behind the hole in the ground. Then wait for said farmer to have a call of nature at night and SSPPLLLOOOOOSSSHHHH!

Put a Volkswagon inside the lobby of the university center.

Disassemble a farm tractor and re-assemble on top of the barn.




OR SO I HAVE HEARD PEOPLE DO.

During one field exercise I called down to one commo shelter, told him to listen but stay quiet for a minute, patched two other commo shelters together, rang them, then stayed silent as they argued over which one of them called the other for a good three minutes.

The Beast wrote:During one field exercise I called down to one commo shelter, told him to listen but stay quiet for a minute, patched two other commo shelters together, rang them, then stayed silent as they argued over which one of them called the other for a good three minutes.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

-Lenwen.

My First Sargeant said he didn't see any of the roveing guard at night, but they were there as I was SOG. The next day he told me the same thing. That night I ordered the soldiers on guard to "Trip" over the 1st Sgt tent ropes on each round and make a noise like "Oh, S**t." or "Didn't see that." The next morning the red baggy eyed 1st Sgt stated "I better not see another demostration of guards on duty." I said, "Why whatever are you referring to, 1st Sgt?" He just grunted. He never questioned my guards being on duty when I was SOG for the duration of my assignment with his unit again.

Misfit KotLD wrote:

The Beast wrote:During one field exercise I called down to one commo shelter, told him to listen but stay quiet for a minute, patched two other commo shelters together, rang them, then stayed silent as they argued over which one of them called the other for a good three minutes.

A radio tech friend of mine called up the admin tent and told the admin chief he was testing the lines. In order to do this, he needed the admin chief to hang up, remove the dust boots from the terminals, and place his fingers on the metal posts. Man that SSgt was pissed when Cole rang that line while his fingers were on it. Man he was pissed.

zalen wrote: Do you have players that use the gleering loophole in all rifts character classes, EG: ANCIENT WEAPON OF CHOICE......How do you deal with things like that????

I think I just expect my players to use a modicum of common sense - or I enforce it.

zalen wrote:Do you have players that use the gleering loophole in all rifts character classes, EG: ANCIENT WEAPON OF CHOICE, ENERGY WEAPON OF CHOICE, or WEAPON OF CHOICE PER WP CHARACTER HAS.
My players do all the time, and due to the fact that there are no rules to the contrary they all go for Swords of Atlantis and sell them in character creation so they can UBER spend. How do you deal with things like that????

I tell them "No." The GM has absolute total control over what he allows into his game. When it says "Choice of weapon" it really means "Choice of weapon the GM will allow."

If they argue then I swat them on the nose with a newspaper like a bad puppy, or spray them with a water sprayer like a bad cat. Because they're not showing much intelligence if they don't think the GM can veto anything, or make their lives hell in the game.

If I was feeling evil and viscious then I would let them have the rune weapon but they have to sell it in game. They'll NEVER find someone who can afford to pay full price, they'll have to settle with far less (no more than 5-6 figures), but when they go to complete the transaction the rune weapon gets stubborn, it doesn't like the person buying it, it zaps them as if they were the wrong alignment. Then the next time the player tries to use it it zaps him too for trying to get rid of it.

Or it'll turn out that the character found the weapon. Legitimately found or stolen, it doesn't matter, somewhere out there is probably a powerful person who lost it and still thinks it belongs to him. Someday someone big and powerful like an Overlord in Splynn society or a Godling will come looking for it and expect it to be handed over for free, after all, it belongs to him.

Or they'll find another buyer who wants it and happens to be a crime lord or leader of an evil faction (like the Federation of Magic) and he'll doublecross the group (with his army of wizards/warriors/whatever backing him up) keeping the money and the rune weapon.

Or they'll find a buyer, but it's too late, the weapon is linked to the player. The new owner is actually a badguy with a personal vendetta against the group and he uses the link between the rune weapon and player as a means to mind control the player and cause havok.

Plenty of ways to deal with it in game, however, the easiest way is to tell the player "No." If they don't like it, fine, they don't have to play.

Anyone know if there is a rule zero type rule anywhere in the GMG or RMB for this kid to point out to difficult players?

zalen wrote:
Oh another question: Do you have players that use the gleering loophole in all rifts character classes, EG: ANCIENT WEAPON OF CHOICE, ENERGY WEAPON OF CHOICE, or WEAPON OF CHOICE PER WP CHARACTER HAS.
My players do all the time, and due to the fact that there are no rules to the contrary they all go for Swords of Atlantis and sell them in character creation so they can UBER spend. How do you deal with things like that????

Never, but then my players and I have all been together for 20 years now so we all know what is and isn't allowed during character creation. Most other players I know, and I believe the way it was intended, is that they will select weapons that would be commonly available to their region. So CS characters start with CS weapons and not Japan or Russian weapons for example.